The order of fossils in the geological column

[PsychoSarah]

That kind of "magic" is diabolical mimicry for "miracles."

That's why context is so important.

You bring up another point.

Those who call it magic usually are prone to interpret things in such fashion.

The Rapture is considered our "blessed hope" ...

Titus 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

Unless, of course, some psychonaut wants to turn it into something it isn't.

Our blessed hope doesn't equate to rapture, it is very vague, none of it suggests that Christians will be completely exempt from the pain and suffering of the antichrist coming to power at all.

 

[AV1611VET]

Our blessed hope doesn't equate to rapture,

Really?

it is very vague,

Please don't spread this around, but it is a secret code term for "Rapture."

The Bible even refers to the Rapture as a "mystery"...

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1 Corinthians 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

Remember: "mum"'s" the word!

none of it suggests that Christians will be completely exempt from the pain and suffering of the antichrist coming to power at all.

Those saved during the Tribulation ... called "Tribulation saints" ... will indeed be subject to the angst of the Antichrist.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Really?

Please don't spread this around, but it is a secret code term for "Rapture."

The Bible even refers to the Rapture as a "mystery"...

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1 Corinthians 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

Remember: "mum"'s" the word!

Those saved during the Tribulation ... called "Tribulation saints" ... will indeed be subject to the angst of the Antichrist.

It is a mystery, there you go, you have no idea what will happen then.

 

[AV1611VET]

It is a mystery, there you go, you have no idea what will happen then.

Well I'm glad you're here to keep me from getting away with thinking I do!

After all, I might fool someone and lead them astray ... eh?

 

[PsychoSarah]

Well I'm glad you're here to keep me from getting away with thinking I do!

After all, I might fool someone and lead them astray ... eh?

Well, jumping to conclusions about it might cause some future disappointment.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

It existed in the past, yes. That's why the number 40 pops up so much in measures of time. It is basically like saying something "took a reality long time" when the number 40 is used to measure that time.

"Forty days", often stated with "and forty nights" appears to be a real time span. To assign an indeterminate period of time wherever the phrase is used would be inappropriate and confusing.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Then your model is physically impossible.

One, For the sea floor to rise uniformly without flattening out would mean that all the continents would rise right along with them and there would be no flood.

The sea floors aren't separate from the continents, they are part of them. Look at the below picture, it is a diagram of how the continental plates fit together.

For the Atlantic sea floor to "rise up" as you claim, the North American Plate, The Eurasian Plate, The African Plate, and the South American Plate would all have to rise up. Ignoring for the moment that physically this isn't possible, as they rose up, North America, South America, Europe, Asia, and Africa would "rise up" right along with them and there would be no flood.

Two, the Bible does not describe a gentle flood. You have to ignore everything the Bible says about the flood to come to that conclusion. That's why I keep saying you are ignoring both science and the Bible when it comes to your flood model. It fits neither the evidence we have nor the descriptions of the event.

Could you please answer my question about why the flood has to be global. Since you have already acknowledged that for your model to be possible, we have to take some of the language of Genesis 7 and 8 as "poetic license," why can the flood being a global event not be taken as poetic license as well?

The continents would not sink as you are proposing. They are attached to the sea floor that you have rising up. They have to be flooded before they can start to sink. There is no way for them to sink, nor would there be any reason for them to. They would not be flooded by any water.

I 'plead' for the same forces that (against all known geological mechanisms, see link) lifted up the Colorado Plateau, particularly the "hot upwelling of the asthenosphere" theory, which, if applied to the flood, would cause the ocean floor to rise forming a large shallow dome which would slowly spill the sea onto the land.

The enigmatic rise of the Colorado Plateau

 

[Queller]

I 'plead' for the same forces that (against all known geological mechanisms, see link) lifted up the Colorado Plateau, particularly the "hot upwelling of the asthenosphere" theory, which, if applied to the flood, would cause the ocean floor to rise forming a large shallow dome which would slowly spill the sea onto the land.

The enigmatic rise of the Colorado Plateau

From your link;

"The region is last known to have been at sea level in Late Cretaceous time,"

The "Late Cretaceous time" being referred to was approximately 66-76 million years ago. That means that regardless of what the mechanism was that lifted the Colorado Plateau to its current height of ~2 km above sea level, it took ~70 million years to do so. That's a rate of 1 cm of uplift every 350 years or so (by my post it note calculations). While I'll grant you that is gentle (in a geological sense) it doesn't help your scenario at all. You only have one year of time to work with.

Also, the Colorado Plateau has area of 130,000 sq. miles. The earth has a LAND surface area of 57.5 million sq. miles. so whatever force you want to "special plead" to, it has to many orders of magnitude more powerful than whatever uplifted the Colorado Plateau.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

From your link;

"The region is last known to have been at sea level in Late Cretaceous time,"

The "Late Cretaceous time" being referred to was approximately 66-76 million years ago. That means that regardless of what the mechanism was that lifted the Colorado Plateau to its current height of ~2 km above sea level, it took ~70 million years to do so. That's a rate of 1 cm of uplift every 350 years or so (by my post it note calculations). While I'll grant you that is gentle (in a geological sense) it doesn't help your scenario at all. You only have one year of time to work with.

Also, the Colorado Plateau has area of 130,000 sq. miles. The earth has a LAND surface area of 57.5 million sq. miles. so whatever force you want to "special plead" to, it has to many orders of magnitude more powerful than whatever uplifted the Colorado Plateau.

I'm pleading for the mechanism, not the time scale. Also, the uplift of the plateau apart from the rest of the north American plate contradicts your position that the whole thing must rise or fall as one plate. I like the theory that a 'hot spot' was responsible for the uplift of the plateau. I plead for a larger hot spot under the ocean tailor-made to produce the flood.

 

[dad]

I'm pleading for the mechanism, not the time scale. ...

You need to fit things supposed to be related to the flood with when Noah lived. Since he was a contemporary with Abraham, it isn't very mystical.

 

[dad]

Our blessed hope doesn't equate to rapture, it is very vague, none of it suggests that Christians will be completely exempt from the pain and suffering of the antichrist coming to power at all.

Let's try to get your bible interpretation skills tested then. So being taken up to get a new body and be with Jesus in the air doesn't constitute a blessed hope? Interesting. Somehow we are supposed to allow that the blessed hope involves being under the devil man reign of terror!? Some blessedness! Some hope!

 

[TLK Valentine]

Really?

Please don't spread this around, but it is a secret code term for "Rapture."

The Bible even refers to the Rapture as a "mystery"...

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1 Corinthians 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

Can't be much of a mystery when every true believer and his cousin thinks they've got it all sussed out.

 

[AV1611VET]

Can't be much of a mystery when every true believer and his cousin thinks they've got it all sussed out.

Any related to you?

If so, maybe that's where they got it?

 

[HitchSlap]

Let's try to get your bible interpretation skills tested then. So being taken up to get a new body and be with Jesus in the air doesn't constitute a blessed hope? Interesting. Somehow we are supposed to allow that the blessed hope involves being under the devil man reign of terror!? Some blessedness! Some hope!

Googled >>> "devil man reign of terrror"

 

[PsychoSarah]

Let's try to get your bible interpretation skills tested then. So being taken up to get a new body and be with Jesus in the air doesn't constitute a blessed hope? Interesting. Somehow we are supposed to allow that the blessed hope involves being under the devil man reign of terror!? Some blessedness! Some hope!

Getting a new body and going into the air? Sounds like turning into birds to me. Who said that new body would be human, and personally I like my body the way it is, I would be freaked out if I couldn't recognize myself anymore.

 

[dad]

Getting a new body and going into the air? Sounds like turning into birds to me.

Welcome to the hope of ages.

Who said that new body would be human, and personally I like my body the way it is, I would be freaked out if I couldn't recognize myself anymore.

Jesus said. He said we would be like Him, and we know what His risen body was like. We recognized Him. Our new body makes superman look like a mosquito.

 

[Armoured]

Getting a new body and going into the air? Sounds like turning into birds to me.

Or clams, according to some.

 

[dad]

Googled >>> "devil man reign of terrror"

 

[PsychoSarah]

Welcome to the hope of ages.



Jesus said. He said we would be like Him, and we know what His risen body was like. We recognized Him. Our new body makes superman look like a mosquito.

The hope of ages is us flying? You do realize many humans are afraid of heights, right?

 

[AV1611VET]

The hope of ages is us flying? You do realize many humans are afraid of heights, right?

I think one of the byproducts of the Rapture will be a removal of our phobias.

No more pain, no more sorrow, no more sickness, no glasses, no canes, no meds (including Thalidomide), no child abuse, no deadbeat dads being venerated as "enlightened," and ... are you ready for this?

No clipboards or pocket protectors!

I'm sure you get the picture.