The oceans are getting hotter = more heatwaves

[Hans Blaster]

This is a legacy of that president of yours who refers to serial liars as cereal liars.

Are you trying to get blocked?

 

[sjastro]

Are you trying to get blocked?

Being blocked for making factual statements?
Here is a famous example.

This might be Trump's legacy by introducing new words into the English language.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Trump is but a minor blip in the failures of my government to address climate change going back to when Trump was a mere professional football owner destroying his own league with bad business ideas.

 

[sjastro]

Trump is but a minor blip in the failures of my government to address climate change going back to when Trump was a mere professional football owner destroying his own league with bad business ideas.

In Australia we had a conservative government for a decade which had a Harry Potter approach to cutting greenhouse emissions by doing nothing and the Paris targets would be comfortably met.

 

[eclipsenow]

In Australia we had a conservative government for a decade which had a Harry Potter approach to cutting greenhouse emissions by doing nothing and the Paris targets would be comfortably met.

Exactly. But economics is taking over. Wind and solar with pumped hydro are cheaper than coal - and that's before counting coal's health costs (which double the price) let alone climate change.

 

[eleos1954]

People remember media hype, not the state of the actual science. Have you read a summary of climate science from the 1970's? The science was that the majority of papers predicted warming. Indeed, the warming power of CO2 was confirmed by Eunice Foote in 1856. Only 10% of papers in the 1970's predicted cooling, and of them, lead authors soon retracted their work. It was all a misunderstanding about how much the sulfur in coal reflected the sunlight away. It's still valid science, and we might use "Solar Radiation Management" by flying dust up 20km to reflect a tiny amount of sunlight to cool the earth. But the math was complex - and the lead author soon admitted he got it wrong. But the media went CRAZY with it - and did not reflect what the majority of papers were saying. So NO - climate science did NOT as a majority predict cooling in the 1970s! That's just factually incorrect.
What were climate scientists predicting in the 1970s?

Please get back to us that you now know this - as it is a matter of conscience now for you not to repeat this myth again now that you know it is not true.

Indeed, so many predicted warming that movies like Soylent Green showed global warming. The Bell Telephone company reflected the state of the science catastrophic warming way back in 1958!

They do really know. The physics of how CO2 traps heat can be proved in any decent physics lab - not that I'm a physicist but I've asked them and seen videos demonstrating how they do it and read the history of climate science.

Also, it's ALWAYS been climate science. The media term used for pop culture shifted from global warming to "climate change" shifted under the George W Bush administration when the speech writer was told to look for a less threatening term, because Dubbya had too many mates in the oil industry and couldn't upset them. So the term "climate change" became fashionable. But global warming is still as good as any lay person description. But the scientific papers are written within the realm of climate sciences.
Get it? There's the scientific academic terminology, and the popular press.
See - even the popular term "Ice Age" is wrong. It's a glacial period, and we're now in an interglacial period.

Technically, from a true climate science point of view, we're in an Ice Age now. Why? Because there's some ice on the planet! Scientific nomenclatures can be quite different from popular ones - and it has nothing to do with whether or not the scientific enterprise is some kind of scam!


Yes the climate has changed in the DEEP past - and the climate scientists mostly know why. Continental drift, asteroid impacts, volcanism, Milankovitch "wobbles" in the earth's orbit and rotation and tilt, and since the dinosaur era - the sun getting 2% warmer. ALL play an impact!


Climate is global temperatures as measured across decades. Weather is what happens today and tomorrow. Climate impacts the weather much like weighting dice - but is not direct control. Or imagine it this way. Weather is a toddler making waves in the bath - the weather is the waves in the water. Climate change is someone left the tap on. Soon that bath will overflow and maybe drown the toddler!


Someone left the tap on. We keep mining and burning fossil fuels and adding CO2 to the atmosphere. We can measure what CO2 does in a lab. Even Mythbusters have done this! Good luck to any conspiracy theories trying to lie about what CO2 does. This next test can be replicated in any physics lab on the planet!

Do a little maths - and the CO2 is trapping 4 Hiroshima bombs worth of heat every second - but spread out across the entire planet. The basic physics of how CO2 traps heat is known.


Oh no! The world's governments are going to legislate we have to move to local renewable energy that our own nations produce - meaning we have more domestic control over our energy prices! Oh no! We won't be buying gas off the Russians and Middle East any more - people who don't like western democracies very much.
Oh no! The cheapest power we've ever produced in a MORE stable grid! Oh no! Filling up your electric car from solar panels on your roof = free motoring. How terrible!



I believe the bible and believe the Lord will return one day. But I'm Amil - and the theologians I read show a lot of that Anti-Christ language is actually to do with Rome and really ANY dictator that sets itself up against God's people in any age - from Ancient Rome to modern China and North Korea. Not one all-controlling figure - but many. Not a prediction about a future timetable - but a message about general themes and situations for all God's people across all ages. Otherwise we may as well cut Revelation out of our bibles until the last 7 years or whatever.



Yeah, nah. You didn't listen to the John Dickson podcasts or read his article. Nah. I'm not going to listen to someone who cannot recognise what type of literary genre Genesis is in the first place. You're reading a Shakespeare sonnet as an engineering manual. Stop it.

no ... I am reading the Word of God .... the days in Genesis uses the word YOM .... and YOM is always used to designate 1 day .... in the 10 God says to remember the Sabbath day pointing back to creation. It would be impossible to remember and keep the Sabbath day unless
it was .... in fact ... one day .... the 7th

sure there have been many anti-christs' .... the book of Revelation refers to a specific anti-christ that will appear .... will fornicate with All the kings of the earth and present himself as God (a apostate religious system) .... and also another power that will be an image to that power. Also states all the earth (including non christians) will follow this religious power (wondered after the beast)

Revelation 13

And I saw one of his heads as though it had been smitten unto death; and his death-stroke was healed: and the whole earth wondered after the beast;

ecumenism
There is no other religious entity that seeks to work with all of humanity (whole world) other than the papacy. The papacy seeks to "unite the world" .... and rule over it .... Rome never changes ..... they put forth "flowery words" and deceive many. It's a deception. They are on board with all the is involved with the New World Order agenda.

What has the Pope said about peace?

Only the peace that comes from a fraternal and disinterested love can help us overcome personal, societal and global crises. “Our greatest and yet most fragile treasure is our shared humanity as brothers and sisters, children of God. None of us can be saved alone.”Dec 16, 2022

1 Thessalonians 5:3
King James Version​

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

The papacy promotes humanism

hu·man·ism
noun

1. an outlook or system of thought attaching prime importance to human rather than divine or supernatural matters. Humanist beliefs stress the potential value and goodness of human beings, emphasize common human needs, and seek solely rational ways of solving human problems.
   
   • a Renaissance cultural movement which turned away from medieval scholasticism and revived interest in ancient Greek and Roman thought.noun: Humanism
     
     
   • (among some contemporary writers) a system of thought criticized as being centered on the notion of the rational, autonomous self and ignoring the unintegrated and conditioned nature of the individual.

Jesus said He did not come to unite ... but to divide ... nor to bring peace.

Luke 12:51 Jesus said, “Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division. From now on there will be five in one family divided against each other, three against two and two against three.” In Matthew 10:34 Jesus states, “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to earth.

 

[Hans Blaster]

no ... I am reading the Word of God .... the days in Genesis uses the word YOM .... and YOM is always used to designate 1 day .... in the 10 God says to remember the Sabbath day pointing back to creation. It would be impossible to remember and keep the Sabbath day unless
it was .... in fact ... one day .... the 7th

sure there have been many anti-christs' .... the book of Revelation refers to a specific anti-christ that will appear .... will fornicate with All the kings of the earth and present himself as God (a apostate religious system) .... and also another power that will be an image to that power. Also states all the earth (including non christians) will follow this religious power (wondered after the beast)

Revelation 13

And I saw one of his heads as though it had been smitten unto death; and his death-stroke was healed: and the whole earth wondered after the beast;

ecumenism
There is no other religious entity that seeks to work with all of humanity (whole world) other than the papacy. The papacy seeks to "unite the world" .... and rule over it .... Rome never changes ..... they put forth "flowery words" and deceive many. It's a deception. They are on board with all the is involved with the New World Order agenda.

What has the Pope said about peace?

Only the peace that comes from a fraternal and disinterested love can help us overcome personal, societal and global crises. “Our greatest and yet most fragile treasure is our shared humanity as brothers and sisters, children of God. None of us can be saved alone.”Dec 16, 2022

1 Thessalonians 5:3​

King James Version​

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

The papacy promotes humanism

hu·man·ism
noun

1. an outlook or system of thought attaching prime importance to human rather than divine or supernatural matters. Humanist beliefs stress the potential value and goodness of human beings, emphasize common human needs, and seek solely rational ways of solving human problems.
   • a Renaissance cultural movement which turned away from medieval scholasticism and revived interest in ancient Greek and Roman thought.noun: Humanism
     
   • (among some contemporary writers) a system of thought criticized as being centered on the notion of the rational, autonomous self and ignoring the unintegrated and conditioned nature of the individual.

Jesus said He did not come to unite ... but to divide ... nor to bring peace.

Luke 12:51 Jesus said, “Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division. From now on there will be five in one family divided against each other, three against two and two against three.” In Matthew 10:34 Jesus states, “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to earth.

None of this has anything to do with global warming, sea surface temperatures, or "Physical & Life Sciences". Please stay on topic.

 

[eclipsenow]

no ... I am reading the Word of God .... the days in Genesis uses the word YOM .... and YOM is always used to designate 1 day .... in the 10 God says to remember the Sabbath day pointing back to creation. It would be impossible to remember and keep the Sabbath day unless
it was .... in fact ... one day .... the 7th

"Light" always means light, but Romeo didn't actually mean Juliet was a source of photons.
Look - I tried to discuss this with you - but this is a science forum and NOT the creation vs evolution forum.
Please take your Creationism and Eschatology to the appropriate forums.
We're done here.

 

[eleos1954]

Message to all 1.3 billion Roman Catholics, you're not Christian for recognizing an anti-Christ as your spiritual leader.
(The index finger is feeling a bit itchy for hitting the report button......)

Didn't see the elephant in the room?
The figures are not that impressive since 2020 was a COVID year where economic growth and industrial production declined resulting in lower emissions.
Fast forward to 2021 and 2022 and America's emissions increased over 2020 levels as economic growth rebounded.

You must be one significant individual for using yourself as a barometer for scientific knowledge and understanding.
It doesn't work that way as scientists know far more than you do, its their profession.
Scientists drill ice cores in Greenland and Antarctica to depths were the snow was initially deposited millions of years ago.
Inside these ice cores are bubbles of trapped air from which CO₂ levels can be measured at the time when the deposition occurred.

I don't claim to be a scientist .... I believe what the Word of God says ..... and yes there will be adverse climate activity according to His Word .... but the final end (end of the earth) will be by Him .... no matter what mankind attempts to put in place.

Without God .... the only other "plausible" belief is evolution .... science has to hold to that no matter what .... so they theorize on dates and other things using models.

 

[Hans Blaster]

I don't claim to be a scientist .... I believe what the Word of God says ..... and yes there will be adverse climate activity according to His Word .... but the final end (end of the earth) will be by Him .... no matter what mankind attempts to put in place.

If "God" is using increased CO2 to bring about the end of the world, then we mere humans have the power to stop that because it is *our* CO2 that is doing it. If this is not the case, then CO2-induced warming is *not* the divinely induced end of the world so your religion's end of the world dogmas are not related to the climate fight.

Without God .... the only other "plausible" belief is evolution .... science has to hold to that no matter what .... so they theorize on dates and other things using models.

Evolution is not relevant to climate science. Climate science is not a sub-branch of biology.

 

[eclipsenow]

If "God" is using increased CO2 to bring about the end of the world, then we mere humans have the power to stop that because it is *our* CO2 that is doing it. If this is not the case, then CO2-induced warming is *not* the divinely induced end of the world so your religion's end of the world dogmas are not related to the climate fight.

Evolution is not relevant to climate science. Climate science is not a sub-branch of biology.

It's the sheer ages in climate science that troubles YECs

 

[Hans Blaster]

It's the sheer ages in climate science that troubles YECs

I really don't think so. (There is a thread about this somewhere around here...) The data needed to set up the historical changes tied to the current trend only covers the last hundred years or so. It's also the only data that is detailed enough to initialize a climate model.

For the YEC/climate denial overlap seems to be entirely about using the anti-science tendencies of YEC to reject science that challenges their ideological position. Here's were the "evolution is fake/lie" business is used for "climate science is a lie" by the fossil fuel industry.

 

[AV1611VET]

I really don't think so. (There is a thread about this somewhere around here...) The data needed to set up the historical changes tied to the current trend only covers the last hundred years or so. It's also the only data that is detailed enough to initialize a climate model.

Is this the thread?

It's a classic between Thaumaturgy and Glenn Morton.

The Holocene Deniers

 

[eclipsenow]

I really don't think so. (There is a thread about this somewhere around here...) The data needed to set up the historical changes tied to the current trend only covers the last hundred years or so. It's also the only data that is detailed enough to initialize a climate model.

For the YEC/climate denial overlap seems to be entirely about using the anti-science tendencies of YEC to reject science that challenges their ideological position. Here's were the "evolution is fake/lie" business is used for "climate science is a lie" by the fossil fuel industry.

But doesn't the deep climate history also illustrate the urgency? The dramatic changes that have occurred in the past? EG: That even though Milankovitch cycles triggered the ice ages, the outcome shows that CO2 trapped plunged us into a 40% deeper glacial period, and the CO2 released as the ice sheets retreated accounted for 40% of the warming?

I mean, lots of life went extinct in the past super-greenhouses. And they were generally slower events, giving life more time to move to the poles or up mountain tops where it is cooler, and NOT trapped by millions of km's of human agriculture as life is now, and NOT over-fished by industrial sized trawlers. And the biggest one? The sun was 2% cooler! If that's how serious the super-greenhouses were back then, what would it be like now with a warmer sun and us on the scene?

 

[Hans Blaster]

Is this the thread?

It's a classic between Thaumaturgy and Glenn Morton.

The Holocene Deniers

No, from this century, or rather from this year. No necromancy is needed.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Recent, rapid ocean warming ahead of El Niño alarms scientists​

This month, the global sea surface hit a new record high temperature. It has never warmed this much, this quickly.
Scientists don't fully understand why this has happened.
But they worry that, combined with other weather events, the world's temperature could reach a concerning new level by the end of next year.

 

[Halbhh]

Makes me wonder if some nations like India and China with the cheap oil (from Russia) and their own cheap coal might be accelerating their CO2 emissions a lot lately.

Daily CO2
Apr. 24, 2023 423.96 ppm
Apr. 24, 2022420.51 ppm
1 Year Change3.45 ppm (0.82%)

Daily CO2

Continual updates of daily CO2 levels recorded at the Mauna Loa Observatory in Hawaii. The page features NOAA MLO data and charts with charts and links for Scripps MLO data.

www.co2.earth

I need to look at a longer term graph tho, as daily readings might not indicate well.

Hmmm....

2021	416.45
2020	414.24
2019	411.66
2018	408.72

Atmospheric CO2 ppm by year 1959-2024| Statista

The average global atmospheric CO₂ concentration has increased by almost 20 percent since 1990, and set a record high in 2022.

www.statista.com

Ah, that's not so encouraging, that context. We might be having a larger than normal increase over the last 12 months....

Global Monitoring Laboratory - Carbon Cycle Greenhouse Gases

The Global Monitoring Laboratory conducts research on greenhouse gas and carbon cycle feedbacks, changes in clouds, aerosols, and surface radiation, and recovery of stratospheric ozone.

gml.noaa.gov

 

[Halbhh]

More:

The Global Monitoring Division of NOAA/Earth System Research Laboratory has measured carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases for several decades at a globally distributed network of air sampling sites. This graph shows monthly mean abundance of carbon dioxide globally averaged over marine surface sites. (Image credit: NOAA Global Monitoring Laboratory

This graph shows the globally-averaged, monthly mean atmospheric methane abundance determined from marine surface sites since the inception of NOAA measurements starting in 1983. (Image credit: NOAA Global Monitoring Laboratory)

Greenhouse gases continued to increase rapidly in 2022

Carbon dioxide, methane and nitrous oxide rise further into uncharted levels

www.noaa.gov

But I'm wondering if there is even a bigger increase than analyzed yet as the post before this one suggests might be happening.

Recent, rapid ocean warming ahead of El Niño alarms scientists​

This month, the global sea surface hit a new record high temperature. It has never warmed this much, this quickly.
Scientists don't fully understand why this has happened.
But they worry that, combined with other weather events, the world's temperature could reach a concerning new level by the end of next year.

 

[eclipsenow]

It's scary - as even the climate scientists are starting to admit the deep sea physics is proving more difficult than they thought. EG: We used to think the East Coast of Australia would be mostly El Nino and burnt to a crisp. Now it seems we're going to be flooded more and more often, and drowning in mould! There are some truly weird mysteries coming from ocean data.

 

[ruthiesea]

Oceans have always fluctuated in heat. Ice age come to mind?

Changes such as ice ages and warming are measured in thousand or millions of years. The temperature change in the last 10 years is unprecedented.