the name of Mohammad in the Old testament

[Mediaeval]

for us we believe that through jesus and following him there is the salvation and through jesus Christ ALLAH has revealed his love power and mercy yet we cannot believe in jesus being a god...god is god ..and jesus is the servant of god

One day we will be more in agreement: “God also hath highly exalted Him, and given Him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.” Philippians 2:9-11

 

[Muslim-UK]

While Judaism since Christ has rejected the Trinity, it is from ancient Judaism that the revelation exists. The first Christians were Jews who preached this to the Gentiles. While the Holy Spirit is not revealed in Daniel 7, the Father & Son are clearly so. In the book of Enoch chapter 46 a vision of the Trinity is clearly revealed (see: Chapter 46 | Book of Enoch ); a small portion of another section of Enoch is quoted in the NT letter of St. Jude & Enoch is part of the Ethiopian Orthodox Bible. The original preacher of the religion of Islam seems to accuse the Jews of assigning a second person to God (see: Surah At-Tawbah [9:30] ).

I looked through all your references and didn't see any hint of Trinity which is defined as follows:

The GOD head consists of three "Persons" who have the exact same essence of deity. All Three being co equal, co eternal and co existing. <<<Where is this found in the Bible?

The Gospel of St. Luke is considered synoptic with the Gospels of Sts. Matthew & Mark both Jewish in origin (the Gospel of Mark is from the preaching of the Apostle St. Peter). Since Luke heard St. Paul & Mark heard Peter, they are in agreement and the linkage of the book of Acts is consistent.

Gospel of Luke and Acts are written by the same non eyewitness. Mark was a non eyewitness too and doesn't even record a resurrection. Scholars say it was written first, with Matthew, Luke and John all copying from it.
These 4 Gospels with their errors and contradictions are all that you have, so have to be defended come what may. Totally understandable, but doesn't make it truth.

While the Gospel of St. John seems to differ from the synoptic Gospels, especially re the timing of the crucifixion, this is a more deeply theological Gospel written near the end of the apostle's life. That the crucifixion of the Lord is on the day of Preparation 24 hours prior to Passover (vs. the synoptic account of Passover) does not change revelation of God offering Himself for our salvation.

Again even if John recorded the Crucifixion weeks apart from the Synoptics, you would still accept it as it makes up so much of Christian doctrine. Most rational people look at the change of days and wonder if each writer isn't just presented their own theology and understanding. Mark has a unwilling Jesus pbuh facing the crucifixion, unable to carry his own cross, but when you reach John, he's presented as the 'lamb of God' come willingly die for our sins.

The foundations of our faith are for more sound than that of another which calls ours false:
Sunni-Shia Conflict

How does the political conflict undermine our faith? Both groups affirm the 5 pillars of the faith, both agree Muhammad pbuh was the last and final Messenger of GOD and agree GOD alone is to be worshipped, without any partners.

 

[4x4toy]

Who was Ishmael's Father Abram or Abraham , Who was Isaac's ? What's the significance ? But I'm not even convinced Muhammed is from Ishmael,
how far can Muslims track Muhammed's genealogy ? 3, 4, 5 generations maybe ..

 

[Muslim-UK]

Who was Ishmael's Father Abram or Abraham , Who was Isaac's ? What's the significance ? But I'm not even convinced Muhammed is from Ishmael,
how far can Muslims track Muhammed's genealogy ? 3, 4, 5 generations maybe ..

Genealogies can't exactly be verified, certainly not when they span Thousands of years, but Science does tell us Arabs and Jews are very closely related, almost indistinguishable http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2000/10/jews-and-arabs-share-recent-ancestry

 

[4x4toy]

Genealogies can't exactly be verified, certainly not when they span Thousands of years, but Science does tell us Arabs and Jews are very closely related, almost indistinguishable http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2000/10/jews-and-arabs-share-recent-ancestry

I agree .. Ishmael and Isaac are brothers .. All the prophets are Jewish, Jesus is Gods Word become flesh, his only begotten Son . Muhammed curses the Jews .. The God of Abraham does not lie, yet the god of Islam instructs al Taqiyya .. Jesus was born, lived his life, then died according to ancient prophecy to show us as a man how to live towards each other and God but also as God with us, then he even resurrected from the dead to prove to us life after death by the blood of Gods spotless Lamb of sacrifice Jesus .. When Jesus uttered "it is finished" with his dying breath on the cross, it was finished with no more need for another prophet or prophesy to fulfill ..
False religions are a dime a dozen with some so called Christion religions included . The devil comes to kill, steal and destroy disguised as an angel of light .. But there are signs that follow true believers of God and with personal testimony of Jesus .. Former Muslim and Jewish preachers converted to Jesus are some of the most powerful preachers I've ever listened to . And you know this ..

 

[Muslim-UK]

I agree .. Ishmael and Isaac are brothers .. All the prophets are Jewish, Jesus is Gods Word become flesh, his only begotten Son . Muhammed curses the Jews .. The God of Abraham does not lie, yet the god of Islam instructs al Taqiyya .. Jesus was born, lived his life, then died according to ancient prophecy to show us as a man how to live towards each other and God but also as God with us, then he even resurrected from the dead to prove to us life after death by the blood of Gods spotless Lamb of sacrifice Jesus .. When Jesus uttered "it is finished" with his dying breath on the cross, it was finished with no more need for another prophet or prophesy to fulfill ..
False religions are a dime a dozen with some so called Christion religions included . The devil comes to kill, steal and destroy disguised as an angel of light .. But there are signs that follow true believers of God and with personal testimony of Jesus .. Former Muslim and Jewish preachers converted to Jesus are some of the most powerful preachers I've ever listened to . And you know this ..

Ok this is similar to the usual response I come across from people who, in my humble opinion are far and disconnected from GOD. I will address your post and be coming back to it soon, but let's first establish if my initial assessment is correct or not.

If Jesus pbuh appeared to you in a vision and told you he had a message from GOD the Father, would you listen to what he had to say?

Jesus pbuh tells you he had much to say in the First Century, but his followers were weak and not ready. He says some of what he did command was not written down, and subsequently lost. He did send a comforter, but most of his followers in the West didn't understand, so they didn't get the message.

He tells you to do the following and gives reasons why, (some are self explanatory):
Just read through and answer the question at the end. Thanks

Worship GOD alone for He alone is good.
Pray at set times to connect with GOD in obedience to keep a strong connection with Him.
Make personal prayers whenever you have free time, driving along, walking, before and after meals etc in order to remember GOD often.
Show kindness to women, children and the elderly.
Keep good relations with your family and neighbours.
Obey your parents no matter what, unless they order you to sin.

Help your wife around the home, go out and be the breadwinner if possible, if she chooses to work, allow her to spend her earnings on what she wants, but you must pay the bills, provide the food and pay for the roof over your head. If she wants to contribute of her own free will, then that's fine.

Treat your children equally, don't make promises that you won't be honouring.
Do good works for the community, even if it be removing debris from the rd that has the potential to cause damage.

Forgive those who wrong you, show compassion to the traveller, and those less fortunate than you. Always repay your debts, and keep your promises.

Dress a certain why to distinguish yourself from those who don't believe.
Have your wife cover her hair and beauty when out in public to protect herself from unwanted attention.

You are to lower your gaze when your eyes fall upon a woman displaying her beauty. You may look briefly purely to appreciate the creative ability of GOD, but that's it.

Stop drinking alcohol because it impairs ones ability to pray and makes one prone to drinking to excess, leading to many problems. Health, anger, fights etc
Don't eat meat from swine as the animal is considered unclean.
Eat only meat which has the name of GOD pronounced over it when slaughtered.
Don't engage in usury as it leads to debt in favour of the lender, ie the rich.

Make your home a clean place where GOD is remembered, depriving the Devil of a home.
Learn prayers of protection from evil eye and the whispers of the Devil.

Do not go to excesses in matters of faith, for example don't stay home praying all day, and thus neglecting to visit fiends, family, doing things around the home, taking children out etc

Do things for the sake of GOD and not to earn favour with men.

Would you look at the above and accept this was from GOD or reject it and if so why?

 

[4x4toy]

Ok this is similar to the usual response I come across from people who, in my humble opinion are far and disconnected from GOD. I will address your post and be coming back to it soon, but let's first establish if my initial assessment is correct or not.

If Jesus pbuh appeared to you in a vision and told you he had a message from GOD the Father, would you listen to what he had to say?

Jesus pbuh tells you he had much to say in the First Century, but his followers were weak and not ready. He says some of what he did command was not written down, and subsequently lost. He did send a comforter, but most of his followers in the West didn't understand, so they didn't get the message.

He tells you to do the following and gives reasons why, (some are self explanatory):
Just read through and answer the question at the end. Thanks

Worship GOD alone for He alone is good.
Pray at set times to connect with GOD in obedience to keep a strong connection with Him.
Make personal prayers whenever you have free time, driving along, walking, before and after meals etc in order to remember GOD often.
Show kindness to women, children and the elderly.
Keep good relations with your family and neighbours.
Obey your parents no matter what, unless they order you to sin.

Help your wife around the home, go out and be the breadwinner if possible, if she chooses to work, allow her to spend her earnings on what she wants, but you must pay the bills, provide the food and pay for the roof over your head. If she wants to contribute of her own free will, then that's fine.

Treat your children equally, don't make promises that you won't be honouring.
Do good works for the community, even if it be removing debris from the rd that has the potential to cause damage.

Forgive those who wrong you, show compassion to the traveller, and those less fortunate than you. Always repay your debts, and keep your promises.

Dress a certain why to distinguish yourself from those who don't believe.
Have your wife cover her hair and beauty when out in public to protect herself from unwanted attention.

You are to lower your gaze when your eyes fall upon a woman displaying her beauty. You may look briefly purely to appreciate the creative ability of GOD, but that's it.

Stop drinking alcohol because it impairs ones ability to pray and makes one prone to drinking to excess, leading to many problems. Health, anger, fights etc
Don't eat meat from swine as the animal is considered unclean.
Eat only meat which has the name of GOD pronounced over it when slaughtered.
Don't engage in usury as it leads to debt in favour of the lender, ie the rich.

Make your home a clean place where GOD is remembered, depriving the Devil of a home.
Learn prayers of protection from evil eye and the whispers of the Devil.

Do not go to excesses in matters of faith, for example don't stay home praying all day, and thus neglecting to visit fiends, family, doing things around the home, taking children out etc

Do things for the sake of GOD and not to earn favour with men.

Would you look at the above and accept this was from GOD or reject it and if so why?

You can't earn your way to heaven through works or law, I may respect those things but God sees blood or sin, what great sin did Adam commit , simply eating fruit that God forbade which in comparison to us today is nothing compared to what we commit, one sin and Adam lost fellowship, it's not how good you are, it's how good you ain't .. The whole Bible is about restoring our relationship to God and only faith in Jesus that we can be covered by the Blood of the Lamb Jesus . Born again of the Spirit by turning to Jesus . No other man could do this except the sinless one and only God with us who is Jesus . You must vainly follow law when God offers freedom from law and bondage to sin, and if I sin my faith in Jesus restores me ... I'm proud to announce I can enjoy a delicious bacon and tomato sandwich .. And receive forgiveness of sin daily that you also perform EVEN IF ONLY IN YOUR HEART.. Now if I experience healing , words of knowledge , visions , tongues and other gifts of the Spirit in Jesus name then the kingdom of God has come with Jesus resurrection forward and just waiting for End time judgment .. Just like the blood of the Passover lamb in Egypt , God's only criteria in judgment will be whether or not you are covered by the blood of Jesus and sealed/born again by the Holy Spirit . Search the scriptures ..

 

[Muslim-UK]

You can't earn your way to heaven through works or law, I may respect those things but God sees blood or sin, what great sin did Adam commit , simply eating fruit that God forbade which in comparison to us today is nothing compared to what we commit, one sin and Adam lost fellowship, it's not how good you are, it's how good you ain't .. The whole Bible is about restoring our relationship to God and only faith in Jesus that we can be covered by the Blood of the Lamb Jesus . Born again of the Spirit by turning to Jesus . No other man could do this except the sinless one and only God with us who is Jesus . You must vainly follow law when God offers freedom from law and bondage to sin, and if I sin my faith in Jesus restores me ... I'm proud to announce I can enjoy a delicious bacon and tomato sandwich .. And receive forgiveness of sin daily that you also perform EVEN IF ONLY IN YOUR HEART.. Now if I experience healing , words of knowledge , visions , tongues and other gifts of the Spirit in Jesus name then the kingdom of God has come with Jesus resurrection forward and just waiting for End time judgment .. Just like the blood of the Passover lamb in Egypt , God's only criteria in judgment will be whether or not you are covered by the blood of Jesus and sealed/born again by the Holy Spirit . Search the scriptures ..

Ok so you can respect those things, but ultimately reject it for it differs to your Scripture.

So the question now is, are the things I put forward from a source of good or evil. If evil, why? and remember the commandments above related to the Devil.

 

[4x4toy]

Ok so you can respect those things, but ultimately reject it for it differs to your Scripture.

So the question now is, are the things I put forward from a source of good or evil. If evil, why? and remember the commandments above related to the Devil.

If following rules give you a false sense of security keeping you from God then you have been lied to and evil has did its job .. You must be Born again, didn't Muhammed tell you that ? No ?

 

[Lukaris]

Ok this is similar to the usual response I come across from people who, in my humble opinion are far and disconnected from GOD. I will address your post and be coming back to it soon, but let's first establish if my initial assessment is correct or not.

If Jesus pbuh appeared to you in a vision and told you he had a message from GOD the Father, would you listen to what he had to say?

Jesus pbuh tells you he had much to say in the First Century, but his followers were weak and not ready. He says some of what he did command was not written down, and subsequently lost. He did send a comforter, but most of his followers in the West didn't understand, so they didn't get the message.

He tells you to do the following and gives reasons why, (some are self explanatory):
Just read through and answer the question at the end. Thanks

Worship GOD alone for He alone is good.
Pray at set times to connect with GOD in obedience to keep a strong connection with Him.
Make personal prayers whenever you have free time, driving along, walking, before and after meals etc in order to remember GOD often.
Show kindness to women, children and the elderly.
Keep good relations with your family and neighbours.
Obey your parents no matter what, unless they order you to sin.

Help your wife around the home, go out and be the breadwinner if possible, if she chooses to work, allow her to spend her earnings on what she wants, but you must pay the bills, provide the food and pay for the roof over your head. If she wants to contribute of her own free will, then that's fine.

Treat your children equally, don't make promises that you won't be honouring.
Do good works for the community, even if it be removing debris from the rd that has the potential to cause damage.

Forgive those who wrong you, show compassion to the traveller, and those less fortunate than you. Always repay your debts, and keep your promises.

Dress a certain why to distinguish yourself from those who don't believe.
Have your wife cover her hair and beauty when out in public to protect herself from unwanted attention.

You are to lower your gaze when your eyes fall upon a woman displaying her beauty. You may look briefly purely to appreciate the creative ability of GOD, but that's it.

Stop drinking alcohol because it impairs ones ability to pray and makes one prone to drinking to excess, leading to many problems. Health, anger, fights etc
Don't eat meat from swine as the animal is considered unclean.
Eat only meat which has the name of GOD pronounced over it when slaughtered.
Don't engage in usury as it leads to debt in favour of the lender, ie the rich.

Make your home a clean place where GOD is remembered, depriving the Devil of a home.
Learn prayers of protection from evil eye and the whispers of the Devil.

Do not go to excesses in matters of faith, for example don't stay home praying all day, and thus neglecting to visit fiends, family, doing things around the home, taking children out etc

Do things for the sake of GOD and not to earn favour with men.

Would you look at the above and accept this was from GOD or reject it and if so why?

THis is basic Christian living which has been known all along. THIS is on the gospel & the
New Testament. I will try to respond further but I only have my I phone during the work day & things like quotes, cuts, & pastes are hard for me

 

[Lukaris]

I also want to mention that the Trinity was implicitly revealed by the Lord especially in the Godpel of John. In John 15:26 the Holy Spirit is referred to as a distinct person. We believe this is God speaking to us and not an interpolatipn; we do not deny God or we are unbelievers.

 

[Lukaris]

THis is basic Christian living which has been known all along. THIS is on the gospel & the
New Testament. I will try to respond further but I only have my I phone during the work day & things like quotes, cuts, & pastes are hard for me

Not meaning to reply to myself but the only exception in my basic previous endorsement to what you said is the dietary aspect.

 

[Muslim-UK]

If following rules give you a false sense of security keeping you from God then you have been lied to and evil has did its job .. You must be Born again, didn't Muhammed tell you that ? No ?

So the message Jesus pbuh taught all his Disciples was you must be born again, and this is the central theme in the NT?

Starting in the Gospel of Mark, (the first of the to be written) I don't see that message?
Mark 12:32-34: A man said that to love God and one's neighbour is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices. Jesus replied in Verse 34 "...You are not far from the kingdom of God." This implies that if one loves God and humanity, then they are close to salvation.

What does this love of GOD entail.....

Mark 9:42-48: Jesus recommends that if one's hand or foot or eye cause them to commit a sinful act, then they should cut off the offending member. Verse 47 says: "...It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell..."

Mark 10:17-21: And as he was setting out on his journey, a man ran up and knelt before him and asked him, “Good Teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” 18 And Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone. 19 You know the commandments: ‘Do not murder, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor your father and mother.’” 20 And he said to him, “Teacher, all these I have kept from my youth.” 21 And Jesus, looking at him, loved him, and said to him, “You lack one thing: go, sell all that you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow me.”

No mention of you must be born again :/
Here we see you have to obey GOD, do good works and keep the commandments and should your eye or hand sin, then it's better that you gouge it out.

So Jesus pbuh is in agreement with what I posted, but you claim it is evil.

 

[Muslim-UK]

I also want to mention that the Trinity was implicitly revealed by the Lord especially in the Godpel of John. In John 15:26 the Holy Spirit is referred to as a distinct person. We believe this is God speaking to us and not an interpolatipn; we do not deny God or we are unbelievers.

John 15:26 “But when the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, he will bear witness about me.

You explained Trinity as: "God is one God of three coexistent & coeternal Persons in the Father, Son, & Holy Spirit."

I don't see that explained anywhere in the above verse. All I see is Jesus talking about GOD sending 'the Spirit of truth' which another term for a Prophet of God.

 

[Mediaeval]

You show love by telling your chosen people, the Jews that in the future, you will be coming down yourself to die for their sins. Telling them GOD is not a man, and never changes isn't loving. Telling them for Thousands of years to pray for forgiveness and sending them one Prophet after another to affirm GOD is ONE, before changing his mind in the year 33 AD is not very loving. Jesus pbuh not beating around the bush or explaining things have now changed is not loving. He had plenty of opportunities to make matters clear:

Mark 10:16 And He took the children in His arms, placed His hands on them, and blessed them. 17 As Jesus started on His way, a man ran up and knelt before Him. "Good Teacher, he asked, "what must I do to inherit eternal life?" 18 “Why do you call Me good?” Jesus replied, “No one is good except God alone.…"

What he should and could have said was, "look it's very simple, the old way was that you made sacrifices for minor sins and prayed to the Father for forgiveness, but the people continued to sin and move further away from Heaven, so He has sent me, His Divine Son and together with the Holy Spirit we three are ONE. I have come to willingly to offer a perfect sin sacrifice for the atonement for the whole World, after this, he who accepts my blood on the cross will be saved by grace alone and have eternal life."

But of course he didn't.

Ignoratio elenchi. The length of your response does not hide the fact that you avoided answering the actual questions: "Which shows more love? To sacrifice yourself for someone? Or to send somebody else while you sit and watch?" The obvious answer to these questions both shows the superiority of the Biblical concept of a loving, self-sacrificing God and exposes the inferiority of non-Biblical concepts of God.

 

[Mediaeval]

Can't find the source. I can tell you, Muhammad pbuh also said it was a act of worship to free a slave. The first caller to prayer was a freed slave.

Muhammad not only owned slaves, but he considered black slaves to be worth less than non-black ones:

 

[4x4toy]

So the message Jesus pbuh taught all his Disciples was you must be born again, and this is the central theme in the NT?

Starting in the Gospel of Mark, (the first of the to be written) I don't see that message?
Mark 12:32-34: A man said that to love God and one's neighbour is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices. Jesus replied in Verse 34 "...You are not far from the kingdom of God." This implies that if one loves God and humanity, then they are close to salvation.

What does this love of GOD entail.....

Mark 9:42-48: Jesus recommends that if one's hand or foot or eye cause them to commit a sinful act, then they should cut off the offending member. Verse 47 says: "...It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell..."

Mark 10:17-21: And as he was setting out on his journey, a man ran up and knelt before him and asked him, “Good Teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” 18 And Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone. 19 You know the commandments: ‘Do not murder, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor your father and mother.’” 20 And he said to him, “Teacher, all these I have kept from my youth.” 21 And Jesus, looking at him, loved him, and said to him, “You lack one thing: go, sell all that you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow me.”

No mention of you must be born again :/
Here we see you have to obey GOD, do good works and keep the commandments and should your eye or hand sin, then it's better that you gouge it out.

So Jesus pbuh is in agreement with what I posted, but you claim it is evil.

I don't think you're trying, clearly Jesus taught you must be born again of water and Spirit . what spirit are you born of ? How does Islam save you from death and hell ?

 

[Muslim-UK]

I don't think you're trying, clearly Jesus taught you must be born again of water and Spirit . what spirit are you born of ? How does Islam save you from death and hell ?

I'm looking for the, 'You must be born again' theme to run throughout the NT, but it's not there in Mark's Gospel. Perhaps Jesus pbuh didn't teach it to him for some reason?

 

[4x4toy]

I'm looking for the, 'You must be born again' theme to run throughout the NT, but it's not there in Mark's Gospel. Perhaps Jesus pbuh didn't teach it to him for some reason?

How many times must God tell you ?

 

[Muslim-UK]

Ignoratio elenchi. The length of your response does not hide the fact that you avoided answering the actual questions: "Which shows more love? To sacrifice yourself for someone? Or to send somebody else while you sit and watch?" The obvious answer to these questions both shows the superiority of the Biblical concept of a loving, self-sacrificing God and exposes the inferiority of non-Biblical concepts of God.

Firstly, In Gospel of Mark, GOD sat and watched whilst a unwilling Jesus pbuh faced the cross.

Secondly, How is suffering for 6 hours in return for immortality considered a sacrifice?
If you offered someone £1,000,000 or the chance to never age, never get ill, never die for all eternity. They would instantly agree to suffer 6 hours, hell people would suffer 24 hours if need be; you would be insane not to and could work and earn several Millions over a never ending life!