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Featured The Major Discrepancy Between Ezekiel and Johns New Jerusalem.

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Daniel Martinovich, Nov 25, 2017.

  1. Daniel Martinovich

    Daniel Martinovich Friend Supporter

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    So what do you dispensationalist who fancy yourselves as literalists think of the horrendous discrepancies in Ezekiel's and John's visions of the New Jerusalem? Since you believe this to be a timeline of future prophetic events that both clearly come after the Gog and Magog prophecy. You can't possibly say these are different prophecies. Yet in Ezekiel's vision the New Jerusalem is 1.5 miles squared and in Johns vision it is 144 miles cubed. Essentially Ezekiel sees the New Jerusalem about the same size as it was and John see's a city that if you put 10 foot stories in it could hold hundreds of billions of people as it could contain 1.5 billion square miles of floor space. The land area of the earth is only approx. 58 million square miles. That quite a discrepancy if you take this literally. Note* Gingerbeer pointed out my calculations on the size of Revelations New Jerusalem were wrong based on its not 144 miles cubed but 1400 miles cubed. Sorry. If there were 12 foot stories in that it would give it 1.2 Trillion square miles of floor space. Which is about 21,000 times the land are of the earth.Then there are other things like the number of the trees' precisely what are they for etc etc.

    So what are you to do with this? Did God change his mind on the scope and size of the city somewhere down the line? Did more people get saved than he anticipated so he decided to make a new dispensation? Does God like the idea of mega churches better than small intimate churches so he decided to go mega? Was ancient Israel all he had in mind at the time but then decided to branch out to the gentile nations? Or is it as the secularists say. This is positive proof that God did not write the Bible because we have a contradiction as big as the east is from the west? O wait I know. The Jews both the believers and unbelievers get the little city as promised to Abraham and the church gets the mega city. Come on now think. There can be only one reasonable and logical answer to this dilemma. Any takers?
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2017
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  2. ~Cassia~

    ~Cassia~ In Christ our Hope of Glory Supporter

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    The lay out in Ezekial is like how the French farming communities are laid out that stem out from the Prince's land iirc That seems to be earthly whereas the New Jerusalem is the size of 1/2 of Canada squared. One could speculate that it never touches the earth because scripture doesn't specify.
     
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  3. Winken

    Winken Jonah !!! Supporter

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    The "dilemma" is in your personal calculations. Jerusalem in the 1,000 year reign will be 2.0 million square miles. Israel will encompass the entirety of the Middle East. Now as to the New Jerusalem:

    Images for dimensions of the new jerusalem
    upload_2017-11-25_21-20-2.jpeg
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    upload_2017-11-25_21-20-2.jpeg upload_2017-11-25_21-20-2.jpeg upload_2017-11-25_21-20-2.jpeg upload_2017-11-25_21-20-2.jpeg upload_2017-11-25_21-20-2.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2017
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  4. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2017
  5. iwbswiaihl

    iwbswiaihl Newbie

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    By no means is what I say written in stone, but it looks like Ezekiel's vision is for the millennium rein of Jesus and the New Jerusalem is talking about the city coming down from God on the new earth that will be created for all eternity. The trees it says in Eze 47:12 Along the bank of the river, on this side and that, will grow all kinds of trees used for food; their leaves will not wither, and their fruit will not fail. They will bear fruit every month, because their water flows from the sanctuary. Their fruit will be for food, and their leaves for medicine(healing).” I take your last paragraph as I heard growing up as a child in the late 40's and early 50's as tomfoolery(all in jest) so to speak.:scratch:
     
  6. keras

    keras Writer of Bible prophecy studies.

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    They are two different Jerusalem's.
    Ezekiel 40-48, Jerusalem and all of the holy Land is established soon after the entire Middle East area is cleared and cleansed by the great and terrible Day of the Lord's wrath. Zephaniah 1:14-18, Ezekiel 30:1-5, +
    This Jerusalem, complete with a new Temple, will exist when Gog attacks the Lord's people, every faithful Christian, then living in peace and prosperity, as God always intended His people to be; His witnesses, Isaiah 43:10, and His Light to the nations. Isaiah 49:8

    John's vision, Revelation 21-22 is the new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven, after the Millennium, the Jerusalem of Eternity.
     
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  7. Daniel Martinovich

    Daniel Martinovich Friend Supporter

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    In Ezikials vision the New Jerusalem is 1.5 miles squared. The New Jerusalem 144 miles cubed. Don’t try to insert other prophecies in this to muddy the waters. Both visions occur after the vision of Gog and Magog. Both have the river if the water if life and the tree if life. It’s a prophecy of the same thing.
    Note* Gingerbeer pointed out my calculations on the size of Revelations New Jerusalem were wrong based on its not 144 miles cubed but 1400 miles cubed. Sorry. If there were 12 foot stories in that it would give it 1.2 Trillion square miles of floor space. Which is about 21,000 times the land are of the earth.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2017
  8. Daniel Martinovich

    Daniel Martinovich Friend Supporter

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    Both visions occur after the visions of Gog and Magog. Both visions have the river of the water of life and both visions have the tree of life. Both visions are a prophecy of the same thing. The answer is obvious but dispensationalist teachings make the obvious difficult to see.
     
  9. Daniel Martinovich

    Daniel Martinovich Friend Supporter

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    How are they two different Jerusalem’s when both visions occur after the visions of Gog and Magog? Both visions have the river of the water of life and the tree of life. They are the same prophecy.
     
  10. Daniel Martinovich

    Daniel Martinovich Friend Supporter

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    How can that be when both visions occur after the visions of Gog and Magog and both visions have the river of the water of life and the tree of life? The answer is so easy but your making itto complicated to see it.
     
  11. keras

    keras Writer of Bible prophecy studies.

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    It would be helpful for you to provide Bible references.
    I just re-read Ezekiel 47:1-12 and Revelation 22:1-5 and they are plainly describing two different situations. Ezekiel's during the Millennium, when the Dead sea will be made fresh and Revelation, in Eternity; where the Tree of Life, Revelation 21:6-7, will be available to all whose names are found in the Book of Life.
     
  12. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2017
  13. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2017
  14. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2017
  15. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2017
  16. Truth7t7

    Truth7t7 Newbie

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    Ezekiel 47:12 & Revelation 22:1-5 are the same place in the eternal kingdom, river and tree of life present, fruit every month, leaves of the tree for healing/medicine.

    You dont need to consider dimensions, it clearly teaches the future eternal kingdom, no further questions needed :)
     
  17. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Remember that Abraham offering Isaac was but a shadow of Calvary.

    Look at the text above for the shadows and then look in the New Testament for the fulfillment.

    Christ said on the road to Emmaus that the whole Old Testament is about Him.


    In Galatians 3:16-29 it is revealed that we are the children of Abraham and inherit the promise through Christ.

    Our inheritance is also revealed in Hebrews 11:15-16.
    It is the same thing Abraham is now looking for.


    .
     
  18. Truth7t7

    Truth7t7 Newbie

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    Ezekiel 47:12 & Revelation 22:1-5 are exactly the same place, "The Eternal Kingdom"!

    The river and tree of life are present, fruit every month from the tree, leaves of the tree for healing/medicine, 100% exactly the same place :)

    Will you deny the biblical truth presented, to hold onto the teaching of a earthly millennial kingdom thats found no place in the scripture :)
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2017
  19. Daniel Martinovich

    Daniel Martinovich Friend Supporter

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    I would say both are prophesying about the same things rather than prophesying about the same place.
     
  20. Truth7t7

    Truth7t7 Newbie

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    I'm glad you see the same things on both passages of scripture, because they are the river and tree of life in Ezekiel 47:12 & Revelation 22:1-5 :)

    And if you see the same, they are the same place, "The Eternal Kingdom" :)
     
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