THE LORD'S DAY IS THE SABBATH DAY NOT SUNDAY!

[Pyong Ping]

Do you obey all 613 commandments...

Show me a single verse in scripture which says "613 commandments". I'll wait. (ps. you only refer to OT, what of the NT?)

 

[Pyong Ping]

If you are not a Christian, yes, your heart is wicked. But you kinda skipped the part about him giving us a new heart to replace our heart of stone.

No, you 'skipped' the rest of my response.

 

[Pyong Ping]

Conveniently, the labeling system they have devised allows them to toss out any laws they don't like and so that ALL the law doesn't really mean all of it.

No. A Christian is to obey all of God's Law. I stated that here - https://www.christianforums.com/thr...h-day-not-sunday.8075418/page-8#post-73011986

 

[bekkilyn]

Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

How do you know that what is 'written' upon the heart is true?

Jesus said:

John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.​

That which is to be written upon the heart is God's Law:

Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.​

Where may those laws be found written in God's word, to confirm that which is written upon the heart?

The 7th day the sabbath is written upon my Heart by the Holy Ghost. That it is not written upon yours, tells me something about you and your heart. You have your own law, apart from God's Law.

The Holy Spirit is true and is our "law".

 

[bekkilyn]

Obedience to God's law is not legalism. It is the outworking of Love in response to God's saving grace in the gift of His Son.

What you have is disobedience, and il-legalism (which is real 'legalism').

If you believe that following law is going to be what saves you, then you are rejecting Jesus' saving grace.

 

[bekkilyn]

No. A Christian is to obey all of God's Law. I stated that here - https://www.christianforums.com/thr...h-day-not-sunday.8075418/page-8#post-73011986

Well I hope your clothing isn't made of of two different types of materials, as one example. Since there is no Temple, there would be no animal sacrifices since those were only allowed in the Temple, but the rest of the law would need to be diligently followed.

 

[Loren T.]

Show me a single verse in scripture which says "613 commandments". I'll wait. (ps. you only refer to OT, what of the NT?)

Galatians 4:10 Romans 8:2 read
Read Leviticus for starters. Do you keep all the laws found there? If not, you can not claim to keep God s law.

 

[BNR32FAN]

With God all things are possible. Stop making excuses for your known refusal to obey. Your boss would not accept such lame excuses, what makes you think God will?

“Stop making excuses for your known refusal to obey“ and yet I go to worship on Sunday? Why would I refuse to obey God and yet go to church on Sunday? That makes no sense at all. Perhaps you should read Romans 14.

“Accept other believers who are weak in faith, and don’t argue with them about what they think is right or wrong. For instance, one person believes it’s all right to eat anything. But another believer with a sensitive conscience will eat only vegetables. Those who feel free to eat anything must not look down on those who don’t. And those who don’t eat certain foods must not condemn those who do, for God has accepted them. Who are you to condemn someone else’s servants? Their own master will judge whether they stand or fall. And with the Lord’s help, they will stand and receive his approval. In the same way, some think one day is more holy than another day, while others think every day is alike. You should each be fully convinced that whichever day you choose is acceptable. Those who worship the Lord on a special day do it to honor him. Those who eat any kind of food do so to honor the Lord, since they give thanks to God before eating. And those who refuse to eat certain foods also want to please the Lord and give thanks to God. For we don’t live for ourselves or die for ourselves. If we live, it’s to honor the Lord. And if we die, it’s to honor the Lord. So whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. Christ died and rose again for this very purpose—to be Lord both of the living and of the dead. So why do you condemn another believer? Why do you look down on another believer? Remember, we will all stand before the judgment seat of God. For the Scriptures say, “‘As surely as I live,’ says the Lord, ‘every knee will bend to me, and every tongue will declare allegiance to God. Yes, each of us will give a personal account to God. So let’s stop condemning each other. Decide instead to live in such a way that you will not cause another believer to stumble and fall. I know and am convinced on the authority of the Lord Jesus that no food, in and of itself, is wrong to eat. But if someone believes it is wrong, then for that person it is wrong. And if another believer is distressed by what you eat, you are not acting in love if you eat it. Don’t let your eating ruin someone for whom Christ died. Then you will not be criticized for doing something you believe is good. For the Kingdom of God is not a matter of what we eat or drink, but of living a life of goodness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. If you serve Christ with this attitude, you will please God, and others will approve of you, too. So then, let us aim for harmony in the church and try to build each other up.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14:1-19

 

[BNR32FAN]

Conveniently, the labeling system they have devised allows them to toss out any laws they don't like and so that ALL the law doesn't really mean all of it.

Let’s pray for them that they will understand.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Rabinical and Talmudic nonsense. No such number in scripture exists.

However, Jesus said:

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Luke 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.​

No such number exists in scripture? Every one of these 613 commandments are written in the scriptures. Please research the 613 commandments and ask your SDA preacher why you don’t keep these commandments of God.

 

[Pyong Ping]

No such number exists in scripture?

Correct. You just proved it again. You did not cite a single scripture which says such a thing. What you did do, was obfuscate, again.

Every one of these 613 commandments are written in the scriptures.

Who did the original counting, and why did they divide them that way, and who says that is the standard as opposed to anothers counting and numeration? Rabbincal and talmudic, just as I said, and you simply stole the idea and gave no credit to its orginators.

Please research the 613 commandments and ask your SDA preacher why you don’t keep these commandments of God.

I am an "SDA 'preacher'" (not a pastor), by the grace of God, and no such number exists in scripture. It is a man-made non-scriptural numeration, and has multiple divisions depending upon the rabbi one talks to.

 

[Pyong Ping]

Let’s pray for them that they will understand.

Proverbs 28:9 He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

Psalms 66:18 If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:

 

[Pyong Ping]

Galatians 4:10 Romans 8:2 read
Read Leviticus for starters. Do you keep all the laws found there? If not, you can not claim to keep God s law.

I have read those passages on numerous occasions. Keep reading:

Romans 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.​

Galatians 4:10 deals with type, not antitype - 1 Corinthians 5:8

All of God's laws are to be kept in the power of God's grace. I have said this on numerous occasions now, and cited the scripture for it.

A Christian is to tithe. A Christian is not to eat blood, fat, things that died of themselves, unclean animals, alcohol, etc. A Christian is to be kept clean, healthy, and so on.

Peter cites this in his own epistle, straight from Leviticus and Deuteronomy:

Leviticus 20:7 Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the LORD your God.

Deuteronomy 23:14 For the LORD thy God walketh in the midst of thy camp, to deliver thee, and to give up thine enemies before thee; therefore shall thy camp be holy: that he see no unclean thing in thee, and turn away from thee.

1 Peter 1:15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;

1 Peter 1:16 Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.​

They are to be kept in the Christian dispensation:

Jesus said:

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Luke 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.​

 

[Pyong Ping]

The Holy Spirit is true and is our "law".

So say LDS, and the spiritualist, etc. They know it is 'right' 'cause they just 'feel' it is 'right'. Rubber-ruler.

The Holy Ghost, points to the word of God:

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.​

 

[Pyong Ping]

Well I hope your clothing isn't made of of two different types of materials, as one example.

Do you even know why it says that?

Since there is no Temple

Not true.

John 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

Revelation 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.

Hebrews 13:10 We have an altar, whereof they have no right to eat which serve the tabernacle.

Psalms 11:4 The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD'S throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.

Revelation 3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

Revelation 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

Revelation 14:17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

Revelation 15:5 And after that I looked, and, behold, the temple of the tabernacle of the testimony in heaven was opened:

Revelation 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

1 Peter 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Of which Jesus Christ is the chief corner stone.

there would be no animal sacrifices since those were only allowed in the Temple

Type and Anti-type, for we have the True Temple and the True Sacrifice and the True High Priest (Christ Jesus).

but the rest of the law would need to be diligently followed.

Indeed. Not as the Type, but in the Anti-type.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Correct. You just proved it again. You did not cite a single scripture which says such a thing. What you did do, was obfuscate, again.

Who did the original counting, and why did they divide them that way, and who says that is the standard as opposed to anothers counting and numeration? Rabbincal and talmudic, just as I said, and you simply stole the idea and gave no credit to its orginators.

I am an "SDA 'preacher'" (not a pastor), by the grace of God, and no such number exists in scripture. It is a man-made non-scriptural numeration, and has multiple divisions depending upon the rabbi one talks to.

I couldn’t copy & paste all 613. But I’ll ask my question again and please answer this time. Do SDA members write their own Torah scroll and if not why?

 

[Pyong Ping]

“Stop making excuses for your known refusal to obey“ and yet I go to worship on Sunday? Why would I refuse to obey God and yet go to church on Sunday? That makes no sense at all. Perhaps you should read Romans 14....

Read it hundreds of times by now, since it is the 'go to' text for anti-nomians. It is their law-lessness proof-text (though Peter warned you, 2 Peter 3:16), and you have abused it (as the women of Judges 19:25), and you have wrested their teats (Ezekiel 23:3,21) twisted (2 Peter 3:16), which should have given forth milk (1 Peter 2:2), but now sour milk (Hosea 4:18).

Romans 14 is to be read in connection with its parallel passages in 1 Corinthians 8-10. The 'days' under consideration deal with eating/drinking and not eating/drinking.

The immediate context of Romans 14, deals with "man esteemeth" (see vs 5, and Luke 16:15) among men, within the allowance of God's Law. Paul is not teaching anyone to sin (see Romans 14:13 and connect to 1 John 3:4) in Romans 14, but teaches the opposite of it, see vs 13:

Romans 14:13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.​

Go back and Read Romans 13, just before Romans 14, which quotes the second table of God's Law, which deals with man to man:

Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Romans 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Romans 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

Romans 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.

Romans 13:13 Let us walk honestly, as in the day; not in rioting and drunkenness, not in chambering and wantonness, not in strife and envying.

Romans 13:14 But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.​

Paul describes the "lusts of the flesh" elsewhere:

Ephesians 2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

Ephesians 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

Ephesians 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.​

Again:

Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

Galatians 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

Galatians 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.​

A person can gather together on any day (even 'first [day] of the week'), as the Jews did before Jesus and as Jews and Christians did after Jesus came. Yet any day which is not the 7th day is not the Sabbath of the Lord and doesn't count as sabbath keeping. The matter is in that you are teaching that transgression of the 4th commandment (Exodus 20:8-11) in its specific words, is not sin, and can be safely ignored, when Jesus himself spoke against that very thing, and Peter warned you of the material in Paul to be careful with it.

 

[Pyong Ping]

I couldn’t copy & paste all 613. ....

Again, why did you divide that way, and who said it was the standard of division and why is that right, by what standard? Where did you get the division from?

 

[BNR32FAN]

Read it hundreds of times by now, since it is the 'go to' text for anti-nomians. It is their law-lessness proof-text (though Peter warned you, 2 Peter 3:16), and you have abused it (as the women of Judges 19:25), and you have wrested their teats (Ezekiel 23:3,21) twisted (2 Peter 3:16), which should have given forth milk (1 Peter 2:2), but now sour milk (Hosea 4:18).

Romans 14 is to be read in connection with its parallel passages in 1 Corinthians 8-10.

The immediate context of Romans 14, deals with "man esteemeth" (see vs 5, and Luke 16:15) among men, within the allowance of God's Law. Paul is not teaching anyone to sin (see Romans 14:13 and connect to 1 John 3:4) in Romans 14, but teaches the opposite of it, see vs 13:

Romans 14:13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.​

Go back and Read Romans 13, just before Romans 14, which quotes the second table of God's Law, which deals with man to man:

Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Romans 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Romans 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

Romans 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.

Romans 13:13 Let us walk honestly, as in the day; not in rioting and drunkenness, not in chambering and wantonness, not in strife and envying.

Romans 13:14 But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.​

Paul describes the "lusts of the flesh" elsewhere:

Ephesians 2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

Ephesians 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

Ephesians 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.​

Again:

Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

Galatians 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

Galatians 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.​

A person can gather together on any day (even 'first [day] of the week'), as the Jews did before Jesus and as Jews and Christians did after Jesus came. The matter is in that you are teaching that transgression of the 4th commandment (Exodus 20:8-11) in its specific words, is not sin, and can be safely ignored, when Jesus himself spoke against that very thing, and Peter warned you of the material in Paul to be careful with it.

Wow God bless you for devoting yourself to serving Him. But that’s a lot of jumping around in scriptures to make those connections. Do you think the Romans knew they were supposed to jump around in the scriptures like that in order to understand what Paul meant? No there is no indication anywhere in Paul’s letter to Rome mentioning anything like that. Paul wrote very directly and very plainly. His writings do not need a secret decoder ring or any other type of deciphering apparatus to understand. Do you still sacrifice a goat every year for Passover? If not why? God commanded it must be observed forever.

“So don’t let anyone condemn you for what you eat or drink, or for not celebrating certain holy days or new moon ceremonies or Sabbaths. For these rules are only shadows of the reality yet to come. And Christ himself is that reality.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2:16-17‬

 

[BNR32FAN]

Again, why did you divide that way, and who said it was the standard of division and why is that right, by what standard? Where did you get the division from?

Why did I divide what? Why do you keep dodging my question? Have you personally written your own copy of the Torah and if not why?