The "holy place" Abomination of Desolation

jgr

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No-one in the first century or centuries that follow are "the" Antichrist, whether you make it a capital A or a small a.

The names of other anointeds than Jesus were known long before Jesus. Saul was an anointed. David was an anointed. Solomon was an anointed.

Even them leading up to Jesus's birth did not know what the messiah's name would be. The angel informed Mary call him - Jesus.

The Jews who do not believe Jesus is "the" messiah, are looking for another as "the" messiah - and guess what? They don't know his name either. Of the person who will be "the" Antichrist.
John didn't provide us with any information that would enable us to distinguish "the Antichrist" from any other antichrist, then or now. Therefore, he didn't believe in "the Antichrist" himself, otherwise he would have alerted us as to how to recognize him amongst the many existing antichrists (far more now than in John's day, by virtue of population increase).

John could certainly also have given us the name of "the Antichrist" as well, if "the Antichrist" were to be a singular future figure. That he didn't give us the name is further evidence that "the Antichrist" is in fact just "an antichrist", an indistinguishable one amongst the multitude who deny and reject Christ.
 
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Douggg

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There have been several Jews who were named as the Messiah.

Shabbetai Tsvi

Jacob Frank

Rabbi Schneerson, who died during modern times.



.
I had watched that same video before. The commentator Henry Abramson is excellent. What none of those three did was to actually be anointed the King of Israel - to be the Antichrist. And mostly they had some of the philosophy that matched a lot of what the Jews are looking for in the messiah. But one other thing none of those three did was that none fought the battles of God in defending Israel in some manner.

The other half to consider is - what makes the person the (7th King) of the Roman Empire of the Julio Claudian bloodline.

The person in question fits a very unique specific profile. There are two tracks - (1) what does it take to be the King of Israel perceived messiah (2) what does it take for the person to become the 7th King of the Roman Empire, killed, and come back alive as the 8th King of the Roman Empire.
 
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Douggg

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John didn't provide us with any information that would enable us to distinguish "the Antichrist" from any other antichrist, then or now. Therefore, he didn't believe in "the Antichrist" himself, otherwise he would have alerted us as to how to recognize him amongst the many existing antichrists (far more now than in John's day, by virtue of population increase).
18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come,

How did them John was speaking to - had already heard that antichrist shall come? From whom would they had gotten that information from?




John could certainly also have given us the name of "the Antichrist" as well, if "the Antichrist" were to be a singular future figure.
John didn't know his name.

A person could just as easily argue if the Pope/Papacy were the Antichrist - then John would have simply said the head of the Church at Rome will be the Antichrist that you have heard is coming.
 
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jgr

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18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come,

How did them John was speaking to - had already heard that antichrist shall come? From whom would they had gotten that information from?

From what we know today as 2 Thessalonians 2.

John didn't know his name.

John almost certainly did know his name (which you've inadvertently but correctly identified as the Roman papacy), but he intentionally refrained from disclosing it for the same reason Paul did -- to avoid attracting the unwanted attention of the Roman authorities for daring to imply the collapse of the imperial Roman empire.

John then reiterates what Paul had first declared many years earlier -- the spirit of antichrist was already present in the form of many antichrists; Paul had said that the mystery of lawlessness was already at work in his day.
 
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Douggg

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John almost certainly did know his name (which you've inadvertently but correctly identified as the Roman papacy),
Pope/Papacy is not a personal name.
From what we know today as 2 Thessalonians 2.

Jesus speaking in John 5:43 came before before 1John2:18 - that's how they knew antichrist was coming - to be the King of Israel embraced by the Jews instead of Jesus.

Anti - Christ. Instead of and against - Christ - Jesus, the rightful King of Israel who came in His Father's name. Again, in John.

John 12:
13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

The pope is not qualified to be the King of Israel...coming in his own name, someone that God did not send to be their king.
 
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thesunisout

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And was the temple destroyed? And is it still destroyed today?

Those who follow the false futurist teaching have to imaging a new temple to be built so it can be destroyed again.

Was the temple destroyed in AD 70? y/n
Did the people of the prince (Titus) who was to come destroy it? y/n

The great error of futurists is that they take a wonderful prophecy of the coming and work of our Saviour to be about some future infidel. A very gross and dangerous error.

To establish amillennialist doctrine you have to go through some incredible contortions. I didn't know that interpreting the prince who is to come as the Antichrist messed with amillennialist beliefs, but I suppose that just about anything that the scripture tells us is yet to come is a threat to your position. Our duty as Christians is to believe what we read, not read what we believe. If the scripture says future, and your favorite doctrine says past, it's time to throw your doctrine away and believe Gods word.
 
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mark kennedy

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I can see how a person might think Anticus Epiphany sacrificing a pig and defining the Temple seems like a fulfilment. But the Mount of Olives discourse clearly indicates a future time of fulfillment. Daniel certainly has a lot of predictive prophecy already fulfilled. Babylon, Medo Persia, Greece and Rome all predicted in concise detail. That still leave details yet to have been fulfilled, the abomination of desolation being a central one.
 
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BABerean2

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I can see how a person might think Anticus Epiphany sacrificing a pig and defining the Temple seems like a fulfilment. But the Mount of Olives discourse clearly indicates a future time of fulfillment. Daniel certainly has a lot of predictive prophecy already fulfilled. Babylon, Medo Persia, Greece and Rome all predicted in concise detail. That still leave details yet to have been fulfilled, the abomination of desolation being a central one.

Joh 10:22 And it was at Jerusalem the feast of the dedication, and it was winter.

....................................................................................

Olivet Timing Revealed by Luke’s Gospel:

Compare Luke's Gospel to that of Matthew if you want to understand the timing.


Jesus Foretells Destruction of the Temple (These subtitles are found in e-Sword.)


Luk 21:5  Then, as some spoke of the temple, how it was adorned with beautiful stones and donations, He said, 

Luk 21:6  "These things which you see—the days will come in which not one stone shall be left upon another that shall not be thrown down." 

(Mat 24:2  And Jesus said to them, "Do you not see all these things? Assuredly, I say to you, not one stone shall be left here upon another, that shall not be thrown down." )





Luk 21:7  So they asked Him, saying, "Teacher, but when will these things be? And what sign will there be when these things are about to take place?" 

(Mat 24:3  Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?")

( Mar 13:3  Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives opposite the temple, Peter, James, John, and Andrew asked Him privately, 

Mar 13:4  "Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign when all these things will be fulfilled?") 





Luk 21:8  And He said: "Take heed that you not be deceived. For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am He,' and, 'The time has drawn near.' Therefore do not go after them. 

(Mat 24:5  For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many. )



Luk 21:9  But when you hear of wars and commotions, do not be terrified; for these things must come to pass first, but the end will not come immediately."

(Mat 24:6  And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.) 



Jesus Foretells Wars and Persecution



Luk 21:10  Then He said to them, "Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. 

(Mat 24:7  For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. )



Luk 21:11  And there will be great earthquakes in various places, and famines and pestilences; and there will be fearful sights and great signs from heaven. 

(Mat 24:7  For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. )



Luk 21:12  But before all these things, they will lay their hands on you and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues and prisons. You will be brought before kings and rulers for My name's sake. 

(Mat 24:9  "Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.)
 (Read Acts 22:19-20, where Paul reveals that he fulfilled this text.)



Luk 21:13  But it will turn out for you as an occasion for testimony. 

Luk 21:14  Therefore settle it in your hearts not to meditate beforehand on what you will answer; 

Luk 21:15  for I will give you a mouth and wisdom which all your adversaries will not be able to contradict or resist. 

Luk 21:16  You will be betrayed even by parents and brothers, relatives and friends; and they will put some of you to death. 

Luk 21:17  And you will be hated by all for My name's sake. 

(Mat 24:10  And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. )



Luk 21:18  But not a hair of your head shall be lost. 

Luk 21:19  By your patience possess your souls. 

(Mat 24:13  But he who endures to the end shall be saved.) 



Jesus Foretells Destruction of Jerusalem



Luk 21:20  "But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation is near. (See also Luke 19:41-44)

(Mat 24:15  "Therefore when you see the 'ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever reads, let him understand), 



Luk 21:21  Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her. 

(Mat 24:16  "then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.) 



Luk 21:22  For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 

Luk 21:23  But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people. 

(Mat 24:19  But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! ) (See Luke 23:27-31 where Jesus warned the women weeping for Him.)



Luk 21:24  And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. 
(Almost all Bible scholars agree that the first part of the verse above is about 70 AD. At the end of the verse we find a period of time known as “the times of the Gentiles”. In the verses that follow we find the future Second Coming of Christ.)


The Coming of the Son of Man



Luk 21:25  "And there will be signs in the sun, in the moon, and in the stars; and on the earth distress of nations, with perplexity, the sea and the waves roaring; 

(Mat 24:29  "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.) 



Luk 21:26  men's hearts failing them from fear and the expectation of those things which are coming on the earth, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 

Luk 21:27  Then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 

(Mat 24:30  Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.) 



Luk 21:28  Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near." 

(Mat 24:33  So you also, when you see all these things, know that it is near—at the doors!)

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::



From "Antiquities of the Jews" by Josephus, Book 12, chapter 7

"6. When therefore the generals of Antiochus's armies had been beaten so often, Judas assembled the people together, and told them, that after these many victories which God had given them, they ought to go up to Jerusalem, and purify the temple, and offer the appointed sacrifices. But as soon as he, with the whole multitude, was come to Jerusalem, and found the temple deserted, and its gates burnt down, and plants growing in the temple of their own accord, on account of its desertion, he and those that were with him began to lament, and were quite confounded at the sight of the temple; so he chose out some of his soldiers, and gave them order to fight against those guards that were in the citadel, until he should have purified the temple. When therefore he had carefully purged it, and had brought in new vessels, the candlestick, the table [of shew-bread], and the altar [of incense], which were made of gold, he hung up the veils at the gates, and added doors to them. He also took down the altar [of burnt-offering], and built a new one of stones that he gathered together, and not of such as were hewn with iron tools. So on the five and twentieth day of the month Casleu, which the Macedonians call Apeliens, they lighted the lamps that were on the candlestick, and offered incense upon the altar [of incense], and laid the loaves upon the table [of shew-bread], and offered burnt-offerings upon the new altar [of burnt-offering]. Now it so fell out, that these things were done on the very same day on which their Divine worship had fallen off, and was reduced to a profane and common use, after three years' time; for so it was, that the temple was made desolate by Antiochus, and so continued for three years. This desolation happened to the temple in the hundred forty and fifth year, on the twenty-fifth day of the month Apeliens, and on the hundred fifty and third olympiad: but it was dedicated anew, on the same day, the twenty-fifth of the month Apeliens, on the hundred and forty-eighth year, and on the hundred and fifty-fourth olympiad. And this desolation came to pass according to the prophecy of Daniel, which was given four hundred and eight years before; for he declared that the Macedonians would dissolve that worship [for some time].

7. Now Judas celebrated the festival of the restoration of the sacrifices of the temple for eight days, and omitted no sort of pleasures thereon; but he feasted them upon very rich and splendid sacrifices; and he honored God, and delighted them by hymns and psalms. Nay, they were so very glad at the revival of their customs, when, after a long time of intermission, they unexpectedly had regained the freedom of their worship, that they made it a law for their posterity, that they should keep a festival, on account of the restoration of their temple worship, for eight days. And from that time to this we celebrate this festival, and call it Lights. I suppose the reason was, because this liberty beyond our hopes appeared to us; and that thence was the name given to that festival. Judas also rebuilt the walls round about the city, and reared towers of great height against the incursions of enemies, and set guards therein. He also fortified the city Bethsura, that it might serve as a citadel against any distresses that might come from our enemies. "


Josephus confirms above the understanding of the Jews of his time, who knew that Daniel had predicted the events of 167 BC, by Antiochus Epiphanes.
Josephus confirms it as a historical fact.


John 10:22 is a reference to the celebration of Hanukkah each year by the Jews of Jesus time.


The Book of Matthew was addressed mainly to a Jewish audience. Jesus was telling the Jews of His time that something similar to 167 BC would happen during 70 AD. Not only did Antiochus desecrate the temple, but he also attacked the city killing thousands of Jews and stopped the temple sacrifices. The temple sacrifices would also stop in 70 AD, due to the destruction of the temple. Based on John 10:22, the Jews were well aware of this historical fulfillment of Daniel’s prophecy. Luke’s Gospel was written to more of a Gentile audience, so he spelled it out for them.


Matthew 24:15-16 and Luke 21:20-21 are clearly parallel accounts, because we have the exact same warning to flee from Judea to the mountains in the second verse of each Gospel.


:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
 
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jgr

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Pope/Papacy is not a personal name.
Every pope who occupies the office has his own individual personal name. However, John at no time had anything to say regarding antichrist's personal name.

Jesus speaking in John 5:43 came before before 1John2:18 - that's how they knew antichrist was coming - to be the King of Israel embraced by the Jews instead of Jesus.

John 5:43 has nothing to do with antichrist. Christ was addressing the Jews who were seeking to kill him (verse 18), and hypothesizing (if another shall come) regarding their perverse nature and behavior. They would have been elated if they'd believed that He was predicting a coming individual who would seek to oppose or usurp Him. But He wasn't.

John's audience in 1 John 2:18 was NT believers long after Christ had left this earth.
 
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Eloy Craft

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18

A person could just as easily argue if the Pope/Papacy were the Antichrist - then John would have simply said the head of the Church at Rome will be the Antichrist that you have heard is coming.
no,that would be letting the enemy know You know his plans. Not good.
 
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Douggg

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John's audience in 1 John 2:18 was NT believers long after Christ had left this earth.
Exacty. But John in the gospel of John contains what Jesus said witnessed by John years earlier. What John told them in 1 John (probably to Christians at Ephesus) is what Jesus talked about years before and written down in John 5. You can set John 5 side to side with 1John - and the relationship is obvious.

Years back, I noticed the connection when I read through the preceding verses in John 5 that precede the John 5:43 verse which is commonly used to support the concept of an Antichrist person coming.

1. The another the Jews would accept instead of him as their King of Israel. John 5:43

2. The relation between the Father and Son - that to deny is antichrist in nature, John 5:23-25

3. Denial that Christ came in the flesh - that is antichrist is nature, John 5:37-38
 
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Douggg

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no,that would be letting the enemy know You know his plans. Not good.
Eloy, I think the name of the Antichrist is not directly stated by John is that John at that time did not know the person's name. Maybe in Revelation, John was given the name of the person, when he is in the role of the beast, but was not allowed to give the person's name, but to allude to it - to them who are wise. When 666 becomes the law then the connection between 666 and the person's name will be obvious.

It may be possible to make the connection his name with 666 when the person becomes the little horn, in the initial stages of the roles he is in - before the last of his stages which is the beast.

The point I was making to jgr was that he had written that John almost assuredly knew the name of the Antichrist - which I challenged his rationale. That was the only point I was trying to make.

John in 1John2 saying that there were already antichrists is kinda like calling them who were doing antichrist traits as being 'antichristians". They were acting in the footsteps of what the coming Antichrist would be like and do.

The Pope is not the Antichrist. He simply is not qualified. The Antichrist person will be a Jew, for one reason in Isaiah 14, when God in disdain for the person likens him to an abominable branch (a comparison to Jesus the righteous branch) who destroys his land and his people.
 
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Marilyn C

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What did Jesus mean by the hagia? He did not specifically say Temple. It is presumed that the desecration will occur when the Antichrist ( Beast) initiates Beast worship in the holy place and or worshiping an animated graven image of the Beast. Then he institutes the mark of the Beast.

Hi CassiusCritzer,

Now these are my thoughts based on what I read in God`s word.

After the Russian war and God delivers Israel, then they will spend 7 months cleansing the land of bodies & bones. (Ez. 39:12). The after 10 more days they will begin sacrificing again. They are already preparing the red heifer and priests to perform this. This will be done probably in a set up tabernacle near Jericho. Then near the middle of the trib, the Global leader and the false (world) prophet will set up an image of himself, in Israel`s temple, which is in King George street in Jerusalem.

It is then that the people of Israel realise that this so called `Peace Maker` is against God, and thus they become persecuted.

regards, Marilyn.
 
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Eloy Craft

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The point I was making to jgr was that he had written that John almost assuredly knew the name of the Antichrist - which I challenged his rationale. That was the only point I was trying to make.
Please catch me up. Is it knowledge of a personal name you are discussing, like, Yachmire VinZonderhosen or Allen Smith or something along those lines?
 
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Douggg

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Please catch me up. Is it knowledge of a personal name you are discussing, like, Yachmire VinZonderhosen or Allen Smith or something along those lines?
No, the name of the Antichrist was going off on a tangent. The base issue Eloy is that jgr and others sharing his view have a theology taken basically from what the reformers advanced in their day was that the Pope/Papacy was the Antichrist.

And going with Reform theology is the notion that the Church has become Israel.

So if persons like me assert that the Antichrist becomes the King of Israel messiah (thought to be) for a short while - that "eschatology" shatters the Reform "theology" view that the Church has become Israel - because in the Reform theology view Israel the nation no longer is viewed by God as having any legitimacy.

In just about all the threads in this forum - what you see in the conflicting posts, Reform "theology", it's followers are defending it - (1) that the Pope is the Antichrist (2) that the Church has become Israel.

So when dispensationalists (I am not one btw) came along and focused on the prophecies regarding Israel in the end times - Reform "theology" followers - attack them, using the charge of 2p2p - saying the dispensationalists are violating the principle of salvation of one way to be saved - and that is through Christ - because the dispensationalist are claiming (according to Reform theology) 2 people 2 paths (to salvation) in that God specifically continues to deal with Israel.

It doesn't help dispensationalists that John Hagee comes out and make some stupid claims regarding Israel and Jesus. But he is not the norm. As the overwhelming majority of dispenationalists say there is only one way to be saved, and that is through the shed blood of Jesus Christ, our Lord and Saviour.

Anyway - at the base of the issue is a "theology" coming out of the Reform movement mostly - although it has been rightfully pointed out that the Pope/Papacy as the Antichrist - preceded the movement and lead in part into it. The "theology" germinated the "eschatology" development of them holding the historist view and the Pope/Papacy is the Antichrist; also some in the futurist eschatology camp hold the Pope/Papacy is the Antichrist, as well.

So the interpretation of passages like in 1John2:18 and 2Thesalonians2 are always interpreted in a manner by reform theology followers - many in England hold the view - as always supporting the Pope/Papacy is the Antichrist and that God is done with natural Israel. That's what going on why jgr cannot accept the reality of Israel's existence and that the Antichrist will not be the Pope/Papacy - in the arguments going back and forth in this thread. Bab2 is also in jgr's camp.

What the forum needs is two new tags as optional for threads - to keep the discussions from "always" reverting to the same fundamental battle of reform theology defending itself. (1) the Church has become Israel (2) the Church has not become Israel.

It is not apparent to most participants here of what is actually at the core of why people get so upset in these threads, frustrating to both sides. So that's the heads up and catch up. Reform theology defending itself - of holding the base theological position that the Pope/Papacy is the Antichrist and that the Church has become Israel.
 
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Eloy Craft

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No, the name of the Antichrist was going off on a tangent. The base issue Eloy is that jgr and others sharing his view have a theology taken basically from what the reformers advanced in their day was that the Pope/Papacy was the Antichrist.

And going with Reform theology is the notion that the Church has become Israel.

So if persons like me assert that the Antichrist becomes the King of Israel messiah (thought to be) for a short while - that "eschatology" shatters the Reform "theology" view that the Church has become Israel - because in the Reform theology view Israel the nation no longer is viewed by God as having any legitimacy.

In just about all the threads in this forum - what you see in the conflicting posts, Reform "theology", it's followers are defending it - (1) that the Pope is the Antichrist (2) that the Church has become Israel.

So when dispensationalists (I am not one btw) came along and focused on the prophecies regarding Israel in the end times - Reform "theology" followers - attack them, using the charge of 2p2p - saying the dispensationalists are violating the principle of salvation of one way to be saved - and that is through Christ - because the dispensationalist are claiming (according to Reform theology) 2 people 2 paths (to salvation) in that God specifically continues to deal with Israel.

It doesn't help dispensationalists that John Hagee comes out and make some stupid claims regarding Israel and Jesus. But he is not the norm. As the overwhelming majority of dispenationalists say there is only one way to be saved, and that is through the shed blood of Jesus Christ, our Lord and Saviour.

Anyway - at the base of the issue is a "theology" coming out of the Reform movement mostly - although it has been rightfully pointed out that the Pope/Papacy as the Antichrist - preceded the movement and lead in part into it. The "theology" germinated the "eschatology" development of them holding the historist view and the Pope/Papacy is the Antichrist; also some in the futurist eschatology camp hold the Pope/Papacy is the Antichrist, as well.

So the interpretation of passages like in 1John2:18 and 2Thesalonians2 are always interpreted in a manner by reform theology followers - many in England hold the view - as always supporting the Pope/Papacy is the Antichrist and that God is done with natural Israel. That's what going on why jgr cannot accept the reality of Israel's existence and that the Antichrist will not be the Pope/Papacy - in the arguments going back and forth in this thread. Bab2 is also in jgr's camp.

What the forum needs is two new tags as optional for threads - to keep the discussions from "always" reverting to the same fundamental battle of reform theology defending itself. (1) the Church has become Israel (2) the Church has not become Israel.

It is not apparent to most participants here of what is actually at the core of why people get so upset in these threads, frustrating to both sides. So that's the heads up and catch up. Reform theology defending itself - of holding the base theological position that the Pope/Papacy is the Antichrist and that the Church has become Israel.
Thank you so much Douggg. I'm grateful to you because you educated me 'and' caught me up with the discussion.:smiley:
 
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DennisTate

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Something has been on my thoughts for the last few years. I am a devout evangelical Christian and I have known Jesus practically my whole life. My earliest memories are praying to Jesus as my Lord and Savior. I have never ever turned away like others. I felt and feel an overwhelming love for Jesus and never doubted. Because of this I greatly enjoy studying the Bible.

Matthew 24 discusses a timeline of what must happen before the Abomination of Desolation. I do not want to argue because people have very firm ideas. What I pray is we can have an enlightened discussion can take place where led by the Holy Spirit, new ideas that are Biblicaly correct and supported by Scriptures will lead us into Truth.

I'm just an old man. I make no claims about being smarter than anyone else nor being more faithful. I have no pride about such things. And I want to discuss this amiably and with other devout Christians not with scoffers and atheists.

What did Jesus mean by the hagia? He did not specifically say Temple. It is presumed that the desecration will occur when the Antichrist ( Beast) initiates Beast worship in the holy place and or worshiping an animated graven image of the Beast. Then he institutes the mark of the Beast.

Now if we look at the Temple of Solomon, within it was a Veiled off area, and in the 1st Temple, the Ark of the Covenant was within and within that was the Tablets of the Ten Commandements. Animal sacrifices were made since the Presence of YHWH was within. At Yom Kippur, the high priest would go inside with blood to atone for the 12 Tribes of Israel and speak aloud the Name of God (YHWH) and offer up incense as a prayer.

When Jesus died on the cross, and said "It is finished" then the Veil was torn and by theology the Presence of YHWH left. According to tradition, this veil was four inches thick so it is not an accident.

In Hebrews 9 -10, Jesus has created a new covenant and is the perfect sacrifice of the Son of God while simultaneously the great high priest. And his body is the passage through the veil of the Most Holy Place.

Now after the Babylonian captivity and upon returning to Jerusalem, they rebuilt a 2nd Temple but had lost the Ark of the Covenant. Today the Ethiopian Orthodox Patriarch claim to have it. Regardless, the 2nd Temple did not have it, only a raised area.

Even if the Jews rebuilt a 3rd Temple, they do not have the Ark of the Covenant. And even IF they acquired it, the Presence of YHWH is not within. Leviticus 10 has a warning to even kindle unauthorized fire in a censer ie an incense burner specifically for YHWH. Two of Aaron's sons died trying that.

Note that some Jews claim that the Ark might be below ground where the Temple Mount is said to be. That is why some Orthodox Jews will not go there as they fear stepping upon,where the Ark might be.

If God's Presence is not within a new Holy of Holies, it cannot be profaned as it is not sanctified. And reinstituting animal sacrifice is unnecessary according to Hebrew 9 and 10. Therefore I doubt that the Abomination of Desolation means the 3rd Temple. I even doubt the 3rd Temple could be made holy. It could only be declared sacred by men.

In Matthew 24 Jesus says where the body (carcass) the eagles or some versions say vultures will gather.

What holy place today had a body? The Church of the Holy Sepulchre for within is the Tomb from which Jesus was resurrected. What if the Antichrist profanes the Tomb of Christ? You should know that after Saladin seized Jerusalem, a later caliph ruined a part of the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, and for over seven hundred years the damage existed and was not repaired until 2017.

Each year an annual event occurs where fire appears inside the Tomb of Jesus and the Patriarch ignites the Paschal Candle which represents the resurrection of Jesus Christ. And when this happens, some believers candles also ignite. I make no claims as to the authenticity. Strange bursts of lights have been captured on video as well.

What if the Tomb of Jesus is actually within the Church of the Holy Sepulchre and that is the holy place where the Abomination of Desolation takes place?

Revelation points to a Temple that is measured by the two witnesses, but it doesn't say what that is.

Thank you for critiquing what I wrote. I am not making any claims. Just pointing out my thoughts.


I think that you will enjoy the statements by Grant R. Jeffrey Ph. D. regarding the
relationship between the first century Messianic Jewish community and the Levites who
served in the Temple.... while it still stood.

His comments on how this could be a type of what happens when Ezekiel chapters 40 to 48 are fulfilled are intriguing indeed.......


"The Sacrificial System Will Continue

One of the most perplexing ideas to students of Scripture is the idea that God intends that the annual feasts, along with animal sacrifice, will continue into the Millennium. Many Christians who have studied the prophetic portions of Zechariah 14, Isaiah 66, and Ezekiel 40 - 48, which clearly describe these Millennial worship ordinations, are confused by the idea. They ask, "Didn't the sacrifice of Christ eliminate animal sacrifices forever?"

............"Only the complete sacrifice of Jesus could ever totally atone for our sins. However, God clearly demanded the sacrifices from Adam to Christ. Those sacrifices were acts of obedience to the direct command of God, as well as acknowledgements of one's own personal sinfulness and need for God's forgiveness. Animal sacrifices covered the sins of the people temporarily until the prophesied Messiah would come and offer Himself once and for all as the necessary atonement for sin. If animal sacrifice can never atone for sin, why would God allow Israel to resume such sacrifice in the Third Temple, prior to Armageddon, and then demand that Israel continue such sacrifice in the Millennium? There are two reasons why I believe this is true."

First, the early Jewish - Christian Church continued to offer sacrifices in the first century.".......



.......Second, New Testament writers used the legal sacrificial system to illustrate very important points concerning Christ's sacrifice on the Cross.......

..... These examples of the way early Jewish believers used God's law to teach great love when He sacrificed His only Son on the cross will be repeated during the Millennium." (Grant R. Jeffrey, Messiah, War in the Middle East and the Road to Armageddon, page 317, 318 and 319)

I also think you will be interested in this new discussion and poll:


Is a Jerusalem Third Temple needed before Zechariah 14 can happen?
 
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