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Colter

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I believe the flood story was local and had nothing to do with God or judgment. Noah built his home in "houseboat fashion" as he was aware of the periotic floods of the rejoin. He would put his animals on the porch at night just in case. People mocked him, but one day a flood came and destroyed everyone in the area but Noah, his family and animals.

When the Hebrew priest were rewriting their history in Babylon, they used and expanded this local flood legend to drown the whole world in its wickedness because they were unable to trace their bloodlines back to Adam and Eve whom they assumed were the first humans.

The flood is a ridiculous exaggeration that prejudices people from faith in Jesus.
 
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Nihilist Virus

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Good point. It would be strange for God to compell (or allow?) the New Testament writers to reference the Flood as an actual event if it never happened.
 
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Nihilist Virus

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Since you have this story being written in Babylon, do you think it's based on the Epic of Gilgamesh?
 
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Nihilist Virus

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Ok, just to clarifiy, you hold that each of the first six days of creation were 1000 years, that the earth is 13000 years old, but that the Flood did not actually occur?
 
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joshua 1 9

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Ok, just to clarifiy, you hold that each of the first six days of creation were 1000 years, that the earth is 13000 years old, but that the Flood did not actually occur?
Of course the flood happened. From our perspective it was a local flood that involved a biodiverse ecosystem, not the whole biosphere. At the time the eco system that Noah was a part of was his whole world. Basicly what was on the Ark was domesticated plants and animals. I have studied the history of the domesticated of plants and animals in the middle east for over 50 years now. So I know that science and the Bible agree 100% and there is no conflict or contradictions between the two. Science is based on the natural record and that is in agreement with the Bible that represents the written recorded history of mankind.

Gerold Schroeder says there are 32 verses on Genesis Chapter one. In the library of MIT and Harvard University there are hundreds of thousands of books that talk about what we learn in those 32 verses. A Hebrew word is very powerful and most of the Hebrew words in the Bible would require a whole book to explain. People usually ask me questions that would take a whole book to properly answer, yet as they say we have to keep it short and simple.

I have no problem with YEC and I also accept OEC. I just do not try to explain OEC, I leave that up to people like Gerold Schroeder because he is the one with the Phd so he knows a lot more about the subject then I do. Bishop Usshers book is very accurate for the last 6,000 years. He says nothing about what happened before that point in time because he knew nothing about it. Then people like Darby came along to help us try to make sense of the world before the recorded history that we read in the Bible. As we began to discover the natural record in nature and use that to help us better understand the Bible and man's recorded history.
 
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Albion

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I voted 1C, but I don't feel comfortable with calling it a "local" flood. A "regional" one, still in contrast to worldwide, would be more accurate. In part that's because local floods in that region were common (and continued to be so until modern times). This one had to be special in scope and severity.

As for the second part, I'd be inclined to answer that everyone was killed, except that I agree with -57 that there were none who were innocent (as the OP wanted to say). That's indicated right in the OT account of the Flood.
 
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Colter

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Since you have this story being written in Babylon, do you think it's based on the Epic of Gilgamesh?
No, I think it was a man named Noah. It would have been a known legend for it to have been accepted in the priests new records of the Israelites.
 
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joshua 1 9

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Local floods don't cover mountains.
Study up on the straits of hormuz. I believe that was a land damn at one time holding back the water. This area is indeed surrounded by mountains.

 
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Vicomte13

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So its might make right? when man does it its despicable, but if God does it, its all fine and dandy yea? Ok then....
Yes, that is exactly correct. God is Nature, among other things, and the theist's God knows what he is doing and why. The Pantheist's God doesn't know anything, because It is impersonal Nature, but either way the results are the same: everything dies, and God does it all.

The difference between God doing it and man doing it is that Christian's God knows what comes next and has disposition all authority over the spirits that leave the body at death. Man knows nothing about any of that, and if he accepts the revelations about it and does know, then he also knows that God forbade him from killing.

The Pantheist's God knows nothing and kills without a will - universal death is just the way it is, and you may as well recriminate against a tree stump as against the Pantheist's God OR the real God, which is the Christian's God.

Since the recriminations against God are completely unavailing, I guess the next best thing is to lash out at your fellow humans who speak about it, because you might be able to hurt them for telling you the truth.
 
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JD16

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Atheist do not think that the flood even happen, and it does not bother them that others who believe does so. Lashing out at your fellow humans for speaking what they think is true would be ridiculous, as the Atheist do not even believing in a supreme deity to begin with. To us Atheist, if a disaster happens, its just nature at work, no need to invoke the supernatural
 
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thesunisout

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Ok... sure, you advocate a plain reading. But when Jesus tells several different people on several different occasions to sell all they have and give to the poor, suddenly exegesis is a complicated, delicate art.

No, I am advocating for you to personally study the scriptures to see if these things are so. I advocate for you to pray and ask Jesus Christ to teach you what the word is saying.
 
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No, I am advocating for you to personally study the scriptures to see if these things are so. I advocate for you to pray and ask Jesus Christ to teach you what the word is saying.

What happens when your Jesus Christ contradicts someone else's Jesus Christ?
 
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marineimaging

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The flood story happened as depicted. Exactly. There were no innocent beings. The why and how was not necessary to explain. God created all, God could choose to erase all. Or not. Life in heaven is my goal. Why worry about children who are going to heaven. Every person who was old enough to be a sinner was a sinner except Noah. Every person who was not yet at the age of knowing the difference between right and wrong was not a sinner and is in Heaven. That is so simple to understand. Why do you make it so hard? Unless you want to confuse non-believers.
 
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section9+1

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As far as innocent people dying in the ancient flood, innocent people die every day. It's unfortunate, but unchangeable. With or without God, innocent people die. So I don't feel to distraught about what happened back then. If you want an education in innocent deaths, visit a cemetery older than 70 years. It's the way of things. We think some great wrong has occurred when an innocent dies, but it is normal. With God there is at least hope. Without him there is nothing.
 
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