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The Demise of Evolution

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by lasthero, Dec 15, 2019.

  1. Ophiolite

    Ophiolite Recalcitrant Procrastinating Ape

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    Curiously, those who have devoted years to assimilating the works of tens of thousands of researchers are somewhat indifferent to the fatuous viewpoints of those who couldn't be bothered to put in the effort.
     
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  2. driewerf

    driewerf a day at the Zoo

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    Let me see
    1) when "evolutionary science" rejects design it destroys it's credibility, but when you reject the ToE it destroys...
    2) In the post you quoted I explained what I had expected. Evidence. but you deleted that in your answer.
    I also asked where you get your knowledge from. Since you know more about the ToE than anyone else you need to have gained some knowledge somehow. Your reply doesn't cover any of these points.
     
  3. Astrophile

    Astrophile Newbie

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    Do you understand how living things evolve, and how natural selection produces the appearance of design?
     
  4. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    What is the "appearance of design"? If it quacks like a duck...
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2020
  5. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    So evolution is true...somewhere in the universe. o_O
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2020
  6. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Regular Member

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    There may have been quite a few creationists that have honestly and fearlessly looked at the evidence. Those people simply accept it and move on. We are dealing with those that cannot do that here.
     
  7. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Regular Member

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    I am very sure that you do not understand the concept of evidence. If you did you would realize that there is no scientific evidence for ID.
     
  8. Speedwell

    Speedwell Well-Known Member

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    It depends on what you mean by "design." a word with more than one meaning. In this case, do you mean "design" as intentionality? Or "design" as a functional arrangement of components?
     
  9. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    Intelligent design is obvious. No need to prove it in a laboratory.
     
  10. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    Both.
     
  11. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Regular Member

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    Sorry, but that is a losing argument. In fact it tells us the opposite is true. For example I could say that "gravity is obvious" but only because I can support that claim. I can name several tests for the concept.

    And this tells us that you do not understand even the basics of science. Which is why I so often offer to politely go over the basics with those that lack this understanding.
     
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  12. pitabread

    pitabread Well-Known Member

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    This is a contradiction.
     
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  13. driewerf

    driewerf a day at the Zoo

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    This is not an answer.
    The Intelligent Design proponents claim that ID is a theory. Let's be charitable for the moment and not dispute that claim. Anyway, "design" is not evidence.
    You claimed that you holded the ToE against some evidence and it didn't compute. So against what evidence did you hold the ToE? As I wrote earlier, I expect some data; the result of an experiment, a DNA sequence, an anatomical feature, anything. But "Design" will not do.
     
  14. driewerf

    driewerf a day at the Zoo

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    "Appearance" is just the superficial outlook. The Sun appears to move across the sky. But in reality the motion is due to the rotation of the Earth. It took the effort to look beyond the superficial appearance to find that out.
    The continents appear to be fixed, but beyond the superficial appearance they move due to plate tectonics.

    Look at this youtube video


    Apparantly coins can vanish from a closed fist or appear out of thin air. Go through tables etc. But that's appearance. With a closer look this turns out not to be the case.

    So you wrote correctly; there is an appearance of design. But scientists have been looking and are looking beyond the appearance. They probe reality if what appears to be really is that or way or if something else is going on. This requires knowledge, discipline, stamina, critical thinking. This requires tools and techniques like telescopes, microscopes, seismographs, Geiger counters, electrophoresis, X-ray crystallography, particle accelerators and so on.

    So if you chose to limit yourself to the world of the superficial outlook, the appearance, that's fine. That's your choice. But don't tell me that that is all there is. I and we have seen beyond the veil.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2020
  15. Warden_of_the_Storm

    Warden_of_the_Storm Well-Known Member

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    Not what he's saying at all, and you know it.
     
  16. Speedwell

    Speedwell Well-Known Member

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    Good, because design as intentionally cannot be demonstrated from design as functional arrangement of components.
     
  17. Lazarus Long

    Lazarus Long Member

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    Yeah just look at the watch sitting on the rock, it's obvious that the watch is designed when compared to the rock.
     
  18. Kylie

    Kylie Defeater of Illogic

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    In what way is it obvious?

    Tell me, what characteristics do we ONLY find in designed things that we NEVER find in things that weren't designed?
     
  19. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    Or maybe it's the one element that evolutionists can't face. If design is acknowledged there must be a designer.
     
  20. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    But that's the way I spun it.
     
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