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Featured "The DAY of the LORD": What is it?

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Ron Gurley, May 17, 2018.

  1. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    You are saying Christians are appointed to God's wrath?

    We are not appointed to God's wrath - it is right in the text. It is not talking about testing our faith.

    Now look at verse 10 - whether we wake or sleep, we should liver together with him. Did Paul not just get through talking about the resurrection of the dead and the catching up of the living?

    Where is Jesus during the 7 years? It says - we should live together with him - right in the text. Paul is saying that the rapture/resurrection happens before the Day of the Lord - that comes like a thief in the night, sudden destruction.

    !Thessalonians5:
    9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

    10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

    11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2018
  2. keras

    keras Writer of Bible prophecy studies.

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    The truth is that the Lord will protect His people during His Day of wrath. Isaiah 41:14, Isaiah 43:2, Psalms 9:10, Psalms 31:23-24, Nahum 1:7, 1 Corinthians 10:13, +

    As for what that Day will be:
    The following seventy three Bible verses describe the forthcoming Day of the Lords vengeance and wrath, which will take the form of a Coronal Mass Ejection: an explosion of the suns surface. This is the next prophesied event, the fulfilment of Psalms 83 and the Sixth Seal of Revelation. Note that in three quarters of these verses, it categorically states how it is the Lord who instigates this fire judgement.

    Deuteronomy 32:22 For fire is set ablaze by My anger, it burns to the depths of Sheol, it devours the increase of the earth, its flames reach into the mountains.

    2 Samuel 22:9-10 He parted the heavens, with smoke, devouring fire and searing heat.

    Job 18:5 The tents of the evildoer are burned and brimstone destroys them.

    Psalms 11:6 He will rain down burning coals and brimstone upon the godless peoples.

    Psalms 18:7-15 The earth quaked as the Lord came in devouring fire. He covered Himself in

    Psalms 21:8-9 You burn up Your enemies, like a fiery furnace, You consume them. [darkness

    Psalms 29:7 The Lord’s shout strikes with flaming fire.

    Psalms 37:20 Evil people will die, they will be incinerated and go up in smoke.

    Psalms 50:3 Our God is coming, a consuming fire runs ahead of Him and around Him a storm rages

    Psalms 66:12 You allowed men to rule us, we passed through fire, now we live in safety.

    Psalms 83:14-15 As fire rages through a forest, as flames on the hills – terrify them with storms.

    Psalms 97:3-4 Fire goes before Him, all around it burns up His enemies, the whole earth sees and trembles.
    Psalms 140:10 May the Lord throw my enemies into the fire.

    Psalms 144:5-6 Lord, part the heavens and come down, cause volcanoes and flashes of fire.

    Isaiah 1:31 The deeds of the unrighteous will be as a spark, all will burn together with no one to put out the fire.

    Isaiah 4:4 At that time the Sovereign Lord will cleanse Jerusalem with a judgement of fire.

    Isaiah 9:18-19 For evil burned and went up in smoke, the Land was scorched and the people were fuel for the fire.

    Isaiah 10:17 The Light of Israel will become a fire, it will burn and consume His enemies in a day

    Isaiah 13:13 The heavens and the earth will shake on the Day the Lord vents His blazing anger.

    Isaiah 24:1-4 Be warned: the Lord is about to strip the earth and scatter its inhabitants. The earth will dry and wither up.

    Isaiah 26:11 You, O Lord are ready to act, but people don’t see it. Let the fire reserved for Your enemies consume them.

    Isaiah 29:6 Punishment will come from the Lord, with thunder, earthquakes, storms and consuming flames of fire.

    Isaiah 30:26-28 On that Day, the sun will shine seven times brighter. The Lord comes in anger, His tongue a devouring fire, to sieve the nations.

    Isaiah 31:9 They will surrender their stronghold to the Lord, the One whose fire blazes in Zion.

    Isaiah 47:14 Astrologers and divinators will be as stubble as the fire burns them up.

    Isaiah 50:11 Look: all you who start a fire, that is what you will receive from Me.

    Isaiah 62:1 For Zion’s sake, I will not remain quiet. Her deliverance comes, burning like a torch.

    Isaiah 66:15-16 The Lord comes in fire, like a whirlwind, bringing retribution in His furious anger. He will judge with fire and many will be slain by Him.

    Jeremiah 4:4 Dedicate yourself to the Lord, if not, My anger will blaze up in flaming fire.

    Jeremiah 5:14 ...those people will be like firewood, that My fiery judgement will burn up.

    Jeremiah 6:29 The fiery bellows of judgement burn fiercely to refine My people.

    Jeremiah 7:20 The Lord says: My raging fury will be poured out, it will burn un extinguished.

    Jeremiah 11:16 You were a beautiful tree, but I will set you on fire, a mighty blaze.

    Jeremiah 15:14...For My anger is like a fire that will flare up against you.

    Jeremiah 17:27 ...if you disobey, I will set Jerusalem on fire, no one will be able to put it out.

    Jeremiah 21:12-14 Dispense justice or the fire of My fury will blaze up and burn unquenched.

    Jeremiah 48:45 Flames will burst out and burn the people of Moab.

    Jeremiah 49:2 The time is coming when Ammon will be burnt to ashes.

    Jeremiah 49:27 I shall set fire to Damascus, it will burn up that city. [around.

    Jeremiah 50:32 Babylon will fall, I will set fire to your towns, it will burn up everything

    Lamentations 2:3 In His fierce anger, He withdraws His protecting hand and He blazes in Judah as a raging fire.

    Ezekiel 15:6-8 ...the residents of Jerusalem will be as fuel for the fire. I will make their Land desolate.

    Ezekiel 19:14 Fire bursts forth in the vine, [Israel] burning up its shoots. It has no strong branch anymore, no scepter for those who bear rule.

    Ezekiel 20:47-48 I will start a fire in the Land, flames that will scorch all the area. All will see that it is I, the Lord who has set it ablaze.

    Ezekiel 21:15 My sword of wrath, ready to kill – flashing like lightning.

    Ezekiel 21:28 A sword is drawn for slaughter against the Ammonites – flashing like lightning.

    Ezekiel 22:20 As metal is smelted in a furnace, so I will deal with you, Israel.

    Ezekiel 30:16 I will set Egypt on fire.

    Hosea 8:14 Israel and Judah have forgotten their Maker – I will send fire upon them.

    Joel 1:19-20 To You, Lord, I cry out, for fire has consumed the pastures and trees of the Land.

    Joel 2:3 It comes in devastating fire, as a leaping flame, leaving behind a desolate waste.

    Joel 2:30-31 On the great and terrible Day of the Lord, the sky and the earth will show blood, fire and smoke.

    Amos 1:4 Therefore, I shall send fire on Damascus [Syria]

    Amos 1:7 Therefore, I shall send fire on Philistia. [Palestine]

    Amos 1:10 Therefore, I shall send fire on Tyre. [Lebanon]

    Amos 1:12 Therefore, I shall send fire on Edom. [the ungodly nations]

    Amos 1:14 Therefore, I shall send fire on Ammon. [Jordan]

    Amos 2:2 Therefore, I shall send fire on Moab. [Southern Jordan]

    Amos 2:5 Therefore, I shall send fire on Judah and Jerusalem. [The Jewish State of Israel]

    Micah 1:3 No one can withstand His fierce anger, His wrath is like a volcanic fire.

    Zephaniah 1:18 ..the whole land will be consumed by His fiery wrath, destruction comes to all the earth. He will make a sudden and terrifying end to all who live in the Land.

    Zephaniah 2:2 Prepare yourselves before the Lord’s burning anger comes upon you.

    Zephaniah 3:8 Wait for Me, for the Day that I accuse you and pour out My burning anger, the whole earth will be consumed by the fire of My wrath.

    Haggai 2:21-22 I shall shake the heavens and the earth and break the powers of the heathen.

    Zechariah 12:6 On that Day, Judah will be as a torch that will burn up the surrounding nations.

    Zechariah 13:9 I shall pass the remaining third through the fire and refine them.

    Malachi 3:2-3 Who can endure that Day? He is like refiners fire, testing and purifying.

    Malachi 4:1 The Day comes; burning like a furnace. That Day will burn up all evildoers.
    Matthew 3:12 ...the chaff, He will burn up in an inextinguishable fire.

    2 Peter 3:7 The present heaven and earth are reserved for fire, on the Day of judgement. 1 Corinthians 3:13Every persons works will be revealed by fire.The destruction of the ungodly.

    Hebrews 8:26-27 For if we deliberately persist in sin after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there remains only the terrifying expectation of a fierce fire that will consume God’s enemies.

    Revelation 14:18 Then the angel who has authority over fire called out; Now is the time to reap the earth. The harvest is ripe to be gathered into the great winepress of God.
     
  3. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    The truth is that Christians are not appointed to wrath. In all of those passages you gave, none of them address the resurrection/rapture of them who sleep in Christ and them who are alive in Christ at that time, and taken to be with the Lord before the Day of the Lord begins.

    Paul was giving the word of the Lord, that wherefore we are to comfort one another. You are not going to erase the resurrection/rapture of 1Thessalonians4 from the bible, with listing ALL of the rest of the verses in the bible. 1Thessalonians4 and 5 stands like a rock and is not moveable.

    9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

    10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

    11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.
    ________________________________________________________

    Does Paul say anything about a catastrophic solar event in 1Thessalonians5 or 2Thessalonians2 leading into the Day of the Lord? No, he doesn't.

    He says...

    1. The unsaved will be saying "Peace and Safety.
    2. There will be a falling away from Christianity.
    3. The person will go into the temple, sit, claim to be God.

    no, catastrophic solar event.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2018
  4. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Correct.

    And the Greek words for "wrath" and "tribulation" are not the same word.

    At least part of the tribulation period is the wrath of Satan.

    Rev 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time

    .
     
  5. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Paul in 1Thessalonians5 is associating wrath with the beginning of the Day of the Lord.
     
  6. LastSeven

    LastSeven Amil Supporter

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    A day is not a thousand years. When Peter made that analogy in 2 Peter 3 he was simply making the point that time is not an issue for God, as it is for men. He was preaching patience. He was not saying a day in prophecy lasts 1000 years.
     
  7. LastSeven

    LastSeven Amil Supporter

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    Same day. When we're resurrected we go straight to the throne, then inherit the new earth. All the same day.
     
  8. LastSeven

    LastSeven Amil Supporter

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    Yes, that's because God's wrath is the lake of fire into which people are thrown after the resurrection. All of that takes place on the last day, which is the day of the Lord.
     
  9. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You're not understanding 1 Thess.5 properly per God's Word as a whole.

    Paul was actually pulling from the OT prophets about the "day of the Lord". That's where he got the idea of the "day of the Lord" coming "as a thief in the night" and the "sudden destruction" upon the wicked (i.e., God's cup of wrath poured out on the last day of this world). It's also where he got the idea of their travailing as a woman with child.


    Our Lord Jesus warning His Church on the 6th Vial:

    Rev 16:15-17
    15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.


    16 And He gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.

    17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
    KJV


    Our Lord Jesus showed He will come "as a thief", which connects to the same time Paul and Peter taught about the time of the "day of the Lord". And in 2 Peter 3:10-11, Peter showed the "day of the Lord" event will burn man's works off this earth.

    So if Jesus is still warning His Church on earth on the 6th Vial timing that He comes "as a thief", then that means we aren't gathered to Him until that "day of the Lord".

    And that is Paul's actual point in 1 Thess.5, i.e., that we, Christ's Church, on that day, are not appointed to God's cup of wrath that He will pour out upon the earth on that same day of Christ's coming.
     
  10. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    How long do you think the 1000 years are in Revelation 20? I think they are 1000 years long - and that is the Day of the Lord overall - and the specific Day of the Lord Paul was speaking of is the sudden destruction coming on the unsaved.
     
  11. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    I think he was getting what to say from Jesus. Continuing what he was revealing about the resurrection/rapture in 1Thessalonians4:15-18.
     
  12. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member Supporter

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    In 1 Thess.4, Paul was giving the 'how' of Christ's coming and gathering of His Church.

    In 1 Thess.5, Paul was giving the 'when' of Christ's coming. And he was teaching directly from the OT prophets.

    2 Peter 3:1-2
    3:1 This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:
    2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

    KJV

    Thusly, what the OT prophets taught about the end of this world also aligns with what our Lord Jesus and His Apostles taught. One cannot try to separate them like he tried to do.
     
  13. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Not the come as a thief in Revelation 16 for the rapture/resurrection because the world will not be saying "peace and safety" at that time. The Day of the Lord will have already begun, and they will be near the end of the great tribulation. Come as a thief in Revelation 16 to execute judgement on the wicked.
     
  14. LastSeven

    LastSeven Amil Supporter

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    I think the thousand years of Revelation are symbolic for a length of time to completion. That is not the day of the Lord. The day of the Lord has no end, because the Lord himself has no end.
     
  15. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    In 1Thessalonians4:15-18, Paul was revealing something not known before, that of the resurrection/rapture. In 1Thessalonians5, he continues to say when. Before the Day of the Lord begins.

    Paul states three criteria for the Day of the Lord to begin.

    1. The unsaved world will be saying "peace and safety" 1Thessalonians5:1-3

    2. There will be a falling away from Christianity. 2Thessalonians 2:3-4

    3. The person will go into the temple, sit, claim to be God. 2Thessalonians2:3-4

    Paul is not saying anything in 1Thessalonians5 about Jesus's return. Paul was speaking about the Day of the Lord, beginning suddenly and unexpectedly like a thief, bringing destruction on the unsaved, that they shall not escape.

    Paul was not extracting by his own thoughts from the old testament prophets. Paul was saying what Jesus was telling him.... he is saying he is speaking on Jesus's behalf.

    15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

    Jesus was telling Paul what to say. It is in regards to what Jesus said in Luke 21:34-36.

    34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

    35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.

    36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2018
  16. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member Supporter

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    When the "day of the Lord" begins, it will burn man's works off the earth; that per Apostle Peter in 2 Peter 3:10. And Peter said that event will come "as a thief in the night". You cannot have a tribulation still existing on earth when that "day of the Lord" event happens. God's consuming fire will take of that.

    When our Lord Jesus said He comes "as a thief", that is the same timing He was referring to, i.e., the "day of the Lord". His coming to gather His Church is not until the 7th Vial, 7th Trumpet, 6th Seal.
     
  17. Ronald

    Ronald Exhortations Supporter

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    If we have a young earth, 6,000 years, which I'm an adherent to, and a day is like 1,000 years and 1,000 years like a day, then the 7th day would be the day of the LORD. What does that mean? The whole 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom, starting with the Great Tribulation period + the Millennial Kingdom and then the destruction of the first earth and first heaven as read in in 2 Pet. 3:10.
    The other six thousands years (days) were not His. When Jesus comes, He will take back the earth as we see in Rev. 11:15, "The kingdoms of the world have become the kingdoms of our Lord ..." Also at that time (the 7th Trumpet), the rapture occurs. The dead are judged and the servants receive rewards (vs.18); the Temple in heaven is opened (vs. 19); the 7 bowls of wrath are released.
    But this time forward, may be the day (1,000 years) of the Lord.
    There are two judgments, one prior to the Millennial Kingdom and one at the end of it. They are both equally considered Judgment Day. 2 Pet.3:10 would occur at the end and many of the other verses you posted could equally be divided as well between both events. To think that the GT would not be the Day of the Lord would be a mistake, yet the earth isn't totally destroyed at that time. Is it one day? No. Is it 1260 days? No
    Since this is not our day, which would imply 24 hours, in our time domain, we need to shift our perspective when it says the Day of the LORD, which is like 1,000 years. ???
     
  18. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Peter did not say when the Day of the Lord "begins" that the earth and the works therein will be burn up. Peter said "in which". It is at the last - but in which - of the Day of the Lord.

    The Day of the Lord is a thousand years long. At the end of the thousand years, in Revelation 20:11, heaven and earth are taken away.

    Differently from what Peter was saying, the sudden destruction that comes on them saying peace and safety is right at the onset of the Day of the Lord. Most of Revelation is about that destruction, the plagues, the trumpets, the seals, the vials.

    The beginning of the Day of the Lord will be like a thief, sudden and unexpected.

    7th vial, 7th trumpet, 6th seal are well into after the Day of the Lord has begun.

    Paul states three criteria for the Day of the Lord to begin.

    1. The unsaved world will be saying "peace and safety" 1Thessalonians5:1-3

    2. There will be a falling away from Christianity. 2Thessalonians 2:3-4

    3. The person will go into the temple, sit, claim to be God. 2Thessalonians2:3-4

    Davy, it is a matter of figuring out why the unsaved world will be saying "Peace and safety". Why there will be a falling away from Christianity at that same time. And who goes into the temple, sits, claims to be God, as the trigger for the Day of the Lord beginning.

    It is false messianic age, false messiah, and betrayal by the false messiah. The only reason there will even be a temple for the person to sit in - will because a false messiah age beginning.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2018
  19. Ron Gurley

    Ron Gurley What U See is What U Get!

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    7 But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire,
    kept for "the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men." = "the DAY of the LORD"
     
  20. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Ron, the whole of the Day of the Lord is not for judgment and destruction. A lot of things take place during the Day of the Lord. It is more than a 24 hour period. But a thousand years long.
     
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