The Ancient Roman Empire, Colonialism, and the End Times

anoymous51

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Most Bible prophecy scholars agree that in order to understand the book of Revelations, a person has to be able to comprehend the book of Daniel. Daniel and Revelations are basically the same book. One is in the Old Testament and the other is in the New Testament.

When the prophet Daniel interpreted King Nebuchadnezzar's dream, he basically gave him an outline of the rest of human history. The prophet showed the king a stature. The various kingdoms of time would represent the different body parts of the figure.

Let's discuss the four kingdoms of time.


The first one is the Babylonian Empire headed by Nebuchadnezzar himself from 605 BC to 562 BC. The animal symbol of Babylon was the lion, and the mineral symbol was gold. Babylon was the head of the statue.

The second empire was the collective Medo-Persians. The Mede kingdom was located in what is today known as northwestern Iran. It began in 678 BC with Deices as the ruler and ended in 549 BC with Astyages. That same year, King Cyrus conquered the Mede Dynasty which became the Persian Empire. Its mineral symbolization was silver. It's animal representation was a bear. The kingdom came to an end in 330 BC. Medo Persia represents the folded arms and chest of the statue.

Greece was the third empire (and the first one of Western civilization) formed by Alexandra the Great. It lasted 350 years from 776 BC to 323 BC. The Greek Empire ruled most of the known world from Greece to India. The leopard and bronze were the symbols of the Greek Empire. This kingdom is the stomach and thighs of the figure.
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And finally, the Rome conquered and absorbed most of the surrounding cultures establishing the Roman Empire from 625 BC to AD 476. It was formally christened in 27 BC when Augustas Ceasar declared himself the first emperor of Rome in 31 AD. Known as the fourth beast, its animalistic representation is a beast with iron teeth and ten horns. The ten horns are symbolic of ten kingdoms that will arise out of Rome. Rome represents the legs and feet of the statue in the dream. The toes of iron and clay allude to a future revival or continuation of the empire.

The Roman Empire controlled a significant part of world at that time including southern, central and western Europe (including Britian), North Africa, and much of the Middel East (including Israel or Palestine). The headquarters, of course, was in Rome, Italy.

Jesus Christ was born into Rome's vast world kingdom in the city of Bethlehem.

Eventually, the empire became so large that emperor Diocletian had to divide it up into western and eastern branches in the 200 BCs. The Eastern Roman Empire consisted of the southeastern Europe, the Middle East, and eastern North Africa. The Western Roman Empire was made up of western North Africa, southern and western Europe.

Although many historians think that the Roman Empire officially came to an end in AD 475, many biblical scholars think that it either continued or that it will be revived at a certain point during the end times. The Seventh Day Adventist think that the old pagan Rome evolved into papal Rome, thus establishing The Roman Catholic Church. Many mainstream Protestant believe that the establishment of the European Union or EU is the beginning of a future revival of the Roman Empire.

There have been several attempts to reestablish a revived Roman Empire. In 800 AD, Pope Leo III crowned Charlemagne Emperor of the Romans. He was able to unite western and central Europe for the first time since the original Roman Empire fell over three centuries earlier. In order to accomplish this, they fought holy wars in the name of Christian proselytization. Whereas the original dynasty was Latin based, this reincarnation was Germanic (Frankish). This officially became known as the Holy Roman Empire and would last until 1806. After the that empire fell, Napolean Bonaparte would try to establish his own version of the Roman Empire by conquering most of Europe. This would become known as the French Empire. It would last only 11 from 1804=1815. Then, in the 20th century, Adolf Hitler started World War II by invading and occupying most of Europe (including Russia) in his attempt to build a Germanic European kingdom. It was known as the Third Reich (1933-1945). Really, Hitler was a more genocidal version of Emperor Charlemagne. Many believe that European Union is the beginning of a revived Roman Empire. The original concept was to build a United States of Europe to rival America and combat Russia at the beginning of the Cold War.



While some think that the Roman Empire will be revived as a future version of the EU and others think that it continued on in a different form, I take a midway position. My humble interpretation is that the spirit (not necessarily the letter) of the old Roman Empire continued through white European colonialism. During the 500 years of conquest, give or take between 1402 to 1960, the biggest colonizers were Spain/Portugal (Hispania), France (Gaul), and England (Britannica). All of which were part of the Rome's empire as shown by the names in parathesis that they were referred to at that time. Spain/Portugal, better knowns as the Iberians, started their exploration around the coast of Africa in the early 1400's This marked the "age of discovery." Later, in 1492, when Christopher Colombis "discovered" the New World, the Iberians turned their attention towards the largely unknown lands. They settled what is known today as Central and South America, a few of the Carribean islands. These countries today span from Mexico to Brazil to Argentina. They also include Caribbean islands of Cuba, Puerto Rico, and the Dominican Republic side of Hispaniola. California, Texas, the southwestern part of the US, and even Florida were a part of the Spanish colonies. This is illustrated in the architecture of homes and building in these states. Cowboys, ranches, and rodeos originated from Hispanics not Anglos. The Portuguese mostly conquered Brazil and a few coastal African countries such as Angola and Cape Verde islands.

But the Iberian empire would be eclipsed and even replaced by the much greater British Empire. Originally, Britian sent John Cabot (their version of Christopher Colombus) in 1497, just five years after the Italian explorer himself. This was later followed by Humphrey Gilbert and Walter Raleigh almost a century later. These overseas colonial attempts were unsuccessful. Actually, the first successful English attempt of colonization was on the British Isles themselves when they permanently settled Ireland in the 16th century. Then, in the 17th century, joint stock companies (the predecessors to today's big corporations) like the East Indies Company started investing in North American and the Caribbean islands. It would be merchant businesses like these that would finance a group of persecuted Christian purist followers known as the Pilgrims to come to North America to practice their religion according to the dictates of conscience. The first winter of these settlers was very rough, many died. But with the help of Indians such as Squanto and Massasoit they would eventually survive. And, as they say, the rest is history. Those pilgrims would go on to build thirteen coastal colonies. Eventually, those thirteen colonies would declare their independence on July 4, 1776, completely from Britian to become what is now known as the United States of America. From there, England would go on the colonize most of the area to the north which would become Canada. Further British overseas adventures would include Australia and New Zealand in the Pacific, African countries such as South Africa, Nigeria, Kenya, Zimbabwe, Zambia, Sierra Leone, Egypt, among others. They took over the whole country of India as well as the Palenstine (today Israel) area of the Middle East. Most of these countries, with the exception of America and India, are still commonwealths of Britian. These include Canada and Australia. I would personally have to say that the British Empire controlled more of the world real estate mass than the old Roman Empire did.


The French also had a sizeable colonial empire but lost much of it to the British in the New world. This includes a large area of the land west of the land between the British colonies on the America and Canada coasts and the far western portions of those countries. They would lose much of it in America with the Louisiana Purchase in 1803 under President Thomas Jefferson. They would also lose much of Canada during The Seven Years' War (1756-1763) to Great Britian in the Treaty of Paris of 1763. Today, Québec is the only French speaking province in Canada. In the Caribbean, they would add Haiti and Martinique to their empire. African colonies would include Niger, Cameroon, Algeria, Morocco, Chad, Tunisia, Gabon, Togo-Benin, Burkina Faso, Seychelles, and others. In the Pacific, some of their territories were French Polynesia, Papa New Guinea, New Caledonia, and Vietnam.

Other European countries such as Germany, Belgium, and Italy also had colonies but to a much smaller extent. mostly in Africa.

I was also tempted to name Russia imperialistic ambitions in establishing the Soviet Union, but Gog and Magog were never a part of the Roman Empire.

There are many aspects of Roman and even Greek culture in America, Western Civilization and the world in general. Our political structure of an executive, judicial, and legislative branch comes from the Romans, as well as the concept behind the Declaration of Independence. Accesso, the whole concept of owning private property and land rights that Americans treasure so much comes from Rome. Ancient Rome and Athens were the first examples of state capitalism. International trade built up the economies of both civilizations just as it made America a global superpower. Other honorary contributions from both ancient Greek and Roman civilizations are sewage/flushing toilets, roads, central heating, concrete, and even fast food!! These are innovations and discoveries that people all over the world enjoy and take advantage of.

There are so many similarities between ancient Rome and America to the point where the Seventh Day Adventist identify America as being the second beast of Revelations.

As a result of centuries of colonialism, most of the world is acquainted with Western culture and customs. English is the most widely spoken language in the world. It is spoken by 1.5 billion speakers. Clothing fashions from designers in New York and Paris are popular in non-Western countries. Christianity, thanks to European and American missionaries in the 19th and 20th centuries, has spread globally. The European standard of beauty is dominant in many non-white countries. American, and to a lesser extent, European and Latin American TV shows and movies are translated in foreign languages and distributed all over the world.

I guess what I am getting at on this post is that during the last days, the book of Revelations predicts that there will be a revived Roman Empire (probably in the form of the EU) that will someday control the whole world. However, there are some that think that this will be the United Nations. Still, others think that it is the papacy. The leader of this global order will be known as the Antichrist.

If so, much of our planet has embraced cultural European homogony as a result of colonialism, would it not be easy to join a European controlled global empire just before Christ comes back?
 

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I guess what I am getting at on this post is that during the last days, the book of Revelations predicts that there will be a revived Roman Empire (probably in the form of the EU) that will someday control the whole world. However, there are some that think that this will be the United Nations. Still, others think that it is the papacy. The leader of this global order will be known as the Antichrist.

If so, much of our planet has embraced cultural European homogony as a result of colonialism, would it not be easy to join a European controlled global empire just before Christ comes back?

What do you think about it?
 
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keras

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much of our planet has embraced cultural European homogony as a result of colonialism, would it not be easy to join a European controlled global empire just before Christ comes back?
Just as the Bible Prophets say will happen. Daniel 7:23, Revelation 13:1-8
But we Christian peoples will; not be a part of the world Government. We will live in our own country, in peace and prosperity. Isaiah 62:1-5
Proved by how the leader of the World Govt comes to us and makes a 7 year peace treaty. Daniel 9:27
 
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Marilyn C

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Most Bible prophecy scholars agree that in order to understand the book of Revelations, a person has to be able to comprehend the book of Daniel. Daniel and Revelations are basically the same book. One is in the Old Testament and the other is in the New Testament.

When the prophet Daniel interpreted King Nebuchadnezzar's dream, he basically gave him an outline of the rest of human history. The prophet showed the king a stature. The various kingdoms of time would represent the different body parts of the figure.

Let's discuss the four kingdoms of time.


The first one is the Babylonian Empire headed by Nebuchadnezzar himself from 605 BC to 562 BC. The animal symbol of Babylon was the lion, and the mineral symbol was gold. Babylon was the head of the statue.

The second empire was the collective Medo-Persians. The Mede kingdom was located in what is today known as northwestern Iran. It began in 678 BC with Deices as the ruler and ended in 549 BC with Astyages. That same year, King Cyrus conquered the Mede Dynasty which became the Persian Empire. Its mineral symbolization was silver. It's animal representation was a bear. The kingdom came to an end in 330 BC. Medo Persia represents the folded arms and chest of the statue.

Greece was the third empire (and the first one of Western civilization) formed by Alexandra the Great. It lasted 350 years from 776 BC to 323 BC. The Greek Empire ruled most of the known world from Greece to India. The leopard and bronze were the symbols of the Greek Empire. This kingdom is the stomach and thighs of the figure.
f
And finally, the Rome conquered and absorbed most of the surrounding cultures establishing the Roman Empire from 625 BC to AD 476. It was formally christened in 27 BC when Augustas Ceasar declared himself the first emperor of Rome in 31 AD. Known as the fourth beast, its animalistic representation is a beast with iron teeth and ten horns. The ten horns are symbolic of ten kingdoms that will arise out of Rome. Rome represents the legs and feet of the statue in the dream. The toes of iron and clay allude to a future revival or continuation of the empire.

The Roman Empire controlled a significant part of world at that time including southern, central and western Europe (including Britian), North Africa, and much of the Middel East (including Israel or Palestine). The headquarters, of course, was in Rome, Italy.

Jesus Christ was born into Rome's vast world kingdom in the city of Bethlehem.

Eventually, the empire became so large that emperor Diocletian had to divide it up into western and eastern branches in the 200 BCs. The Eastern Roman Empire consisted of the southeastern Europe, the Middle East, and eastern North Africa. The Western Roman Empire was made up of western North Africa, southern and western Europe.

Although many historians think that the Roman Empire officially came to an end in AD 475, many biblical scholars think that it either continued or that it will be revived at a certain point during the end times. The Seventh Day Adventist think that the old pagan Rome evolved into papal Rome, thus establishing The Roman Catholic Church. Many mainstream Protestant believe that the establishment of the European Union or EU is the beginning of a future revival of the Roman Empire.

There have been several attempts to reestablish a revived Roman Empire. In 800 AD, Pope Leo III crowned Charlemagne Emperor of the Romans. He was able to unite western and central Europe for the first time since the original Roman Empire fell over three centuries earlier. In order to accomplish this, they fought holy wars in the name of Christian proselytization. Whereas the original dynasty was Latin based, this reincarnation was Germanic (Frankish). This officially became known as the Holy Roman Empire and would last until 1806. After the that empire fell, Napolean Bonaparte would try to establish his own version of the Roman Empire by conquering most of Europe. This would become known as the French Empire. It would last only 11 from 1804=1815. Then, in the 20th century, Adolf Hitler started World War II by invading and occupying most of Europe (including Russia) in his attempt to build a Germanic European kingdom. It was known as the Third Reich (1933-1945). Really, Hitler was a more genocidal version of Emperor Charlemagne. Many believe that European Union is the beginning of a revived Roman Empire. The original concept was to build a United States of Europe to rival America and combat Russia at the beginning of the Cold War.



While some think that the Roman Empire will be revived as a future version of the EU and others think that it continued on in a different form, I take a midway position. My humble interpretation is that the spirit (not necessarily the letter) of the old Roman Empire continued through white European colonialism. During the 500 years of conquest, give or take between 1402 to 1960, the biggest colonizers were Spain/Portugal (Hispania), France (Gaul), and England (Britannica). All of which were part of the Rome's empire as shown by the names in parathesis that they were referred to at that time. Spain/Portugal, better knowns as the Iberians, started their exploration around the coast of Africa in the early 1400's This marked the "age of discovery." Later, in 1492, when Christopher Colombis "discovered" the New World, the Iberians turned their attention towards the largely unknown lands. They settled what is known today as Central and South America, a few of the Carribean islands. These countries today span from Mexico to Brazil to Argentina. They also include Caribbean islands of Cuba, Puerto Rico, and the Dominican Republic side of Hispaniola. California, Texas, the southwestern part of the US, and even Florida were a part of the Spanish colonies. This is illustrated in the architecture of homes and building in these states. Cowboys, ranches, and rodeos originated from Hispanics not Anglos. The Portuguese mostly conquered Brazil and a few coastal African countries such as Angola and Cape Verde islands.

But the Iberian empire would be eclipsed and even replaced by the much greater British Empire. Originally, Britian sent John Cabot (their version of Christopher Colombus) in 1497, just five years after the Italian explorer himself. This was later followed by Humphrey Gilbert and Walter Raleigh almost a century later. These overseas colonial attempts were unsuccessful. Actually, the first successful English attempt of colonization was on the British Isles themselves when they permanently settled Ireland in the 16th century. Then, in the 17th century, joint stock companies (the predecessors to today's big corporations) like the East Indies Company started investing in North American and the Caribbean islands. It would be merchant businesses like these that would finance a group of persecuted Christian purist followers known as the Pilgrims to come to North America to practice their religion according to the dictates of conscience. The first winter of these settlers was very rough, many died. But with the help of Indians such as Squanto and Massasoit they would eventually survive. And, as they say, the rest is history. Those pilgrims would go on to build thirteen coastal colonies. Eventually, those thirteen colonies would declare their independence on July 4, 1776, completely from Britian to become what is now known as the United States of America. From there, England would go on the colonize most of the area to the north which would become Canada. Further British overseas adventures would include Australia and New Zealand in the Pacific, African countries such as South Africa, Nigeria, Kenya, Zimbabwe, Zambia, Sierra Leone, Egypt, among others. They took over the whole country of India as well as the Palenstine (today Israel) area of the Middle East. Most of these countries, with the exception of America and India, are still commonwealths of Britian. These include Canada and Australia. I would personally have to say that the British Empire controlled more of the world real estate mass than the old Roman Empire did.


The French also had a sizeable colonial empire but lost much of it to the British in the New world. This includes a large area of the land west of the land between the British colonies on the America and Canada coasts and the far western portions of those countries. They would lose much of it in America with the Louisiana Purchase in 1803 under President Thomas Jefferson. They would also lose much of Canada during The Seven Years' War (1756-1763) to Great Britian in the Treaty of Paris of 1763. Today, Québec is the only French speaking province in Canada. In the Caribbean, they would add Haiti and Martinique to their empire. African colonies would include Niger, Cameroon, Algeria, Morocco, Chad, Tunisia, Gabon, Togo-Benin, Burkina Faso, Seychelles, and others. In the Pacific, some of their territories were French Polynesia, Papa New Guinea, New Caledonia, and Vietnam.

Other European countries such as Germany, Belgium, and Italy also had colonies but to a much smaller extent. mostly in Africa.

I was also tempted to name Russia imperialistic ambitions in establishing the Soviet Union, but Gog and Magog were never a part of the Roman Empire.

There are many aspects of Roman and even Greek culture in America, Western Civilization and the world in general. Our political structure of an executive, judicial, and legislative branch comes from the Romans, as well as the concept behind the Declaration of Independence. Accesso, the whole concept of owning private property and land rights that Americans treasure so much comes from Rome. Ancient Rome and Athens were the first examples of state capitalism. International trade built up the economies of both civilizations just as it made America a global superpower. Other honorary contributions from both ancient Greek and Roman civilizations are sewage/flushing toilets, roads, central heating, concrete, and even fast food!! These are innovations and discoveries that people all over the world enjoy and take advantage of.

There are so many similarities between ancient Rome and America to the point where the Seventh Day Adventist identify America as being the second beast of Revelations.

As a result of centuries of colonialism, most of the world is acquainted with Western culture and customs. English is the most widely spoken language in the world. It is spoken by 1.5 billion speakers. Clothing fashions from designers in New York and Paris are popular in non-Western countries. Christianity, thanks to European and American missionaries in the 19th and 20th centuries, has spread globally. The European standard of beauty is dominant in many non-white countries. American, and to a lesser extent, European and Latin American TV shows and movies are translated in foreign languages and distributed all over the world.

I guess what I am getting at on this post is that during the last days, the book of Revelations predicts that there will be a revived Roman Empire (probably in the form of the EU) that will someday control the whole world. However, there are some that think that this will be the United Nations. Still, others think that it is the papacy. The leader of this global order will be known as the Antichrist.

If so, much of our planet has embraced cultural European homogony as a result of colonialism, would it not be easy to join a European controlled global empire just before Christ comes back?
Hi anoymous,

Actually, there are FIVE (5) body parts to the Great Image standing in Babylon. The first four governments have ALL been judged as God revealed (eg. Dan. 5: 26 - 29) Even Rome`s government is no more. Of course the land of the earth is still here and people are still multiplying, however there are DIFFERENT GOVERNMENTS today.

Now, NO ONE sees the EU as a `terrifying beastly power,` (Dan. 7: 7) However, there is one emerging that reveals its cruelty even now across the world - torturing, raping, killing, beheading. And we all know who they are!
 
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Trivalee

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Hi anoymous,

Now, NO ONE sees the EU as a `terrifying beastly power,` (Dan. 7: 7) However, there is one emerging that reveals its cruelty even now across the world - torturing, raping, killing, beheading. And we all know who they are!
I don't know, please tell me. You started out with a 'singular' "however, there is one emerging...And ended up with "plural', and we all know who they are...

Would you like to shed some light on who this entity(ies) might be?
 
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Marilyn C

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I don't know, please tell me. You started out with a 'singular' "however, there is one emerging...And ended up with "plural', and we all know who they are...

Would you like to shed some light on who this entity(ies) might be?
Hi Trivalee,

Thank you for asking. And yes, good spot, I did start with singular and ended with plural. The singular will be the Islamic Federation brought together under the A/C, (future) and the `they` who are torturing, raping, killing, beheading are the violent Muslims in many countries. We see how they are brutally operating and when their `Messiah ` comes they will be the most `terrifying ` force this world has ever seen.

Past behaviour can often indicate future behaviour.
 
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Hi Trivalee,

Thank you for asking. And yes, good spot, I did start with singular and ended with plural. The singular will be the Islamic Federation brought together under the A/C, (future) and the `they` who are torturing, raping, killing, beheading are the violent Muslims in many countries. We see how they are brutally operating and when their `Messiah ` comes they will be the most `terrifying ` force this world has ever seen.

Past behaviour can often indicate future behaviour.
I see. Thanks for clarifying. But there's no evidence that the Beast/AC will be the Muslim messiah. Undoubtedly, the AC will seek to pass himself off as God and many (nominal Christians and Muslims) will believe him, but many conservative Muslims will reject him and invoke his wrath and thus be persecuted like Christians.

I take nothing away from the anarchy and bloodshed they leave in their wake in name of their god, but based solely on scripture, I'm afraid there's no support for your speculation.
 
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Marilyn C

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I see. Thanks for clarifying. But there's no evidence that the Beast/AC will be the Muslim messiah. Undoubtedly, the AC will seek to pass himself off as God and many (nominal Christians and Muslims) will believe him, but many conservative Muslims will reject him and invoke his wrath and thus be persecuted like Christians.

I take nothing away from the anarchy and bloodshed they leave in their wake in name of their god, but based solely on scripture, I'm afraid there's no support for your speculation.
We know from scripture where the anti-Christ will arise & what his nationality is. We are also told that he is an Assyrian. Now this is a nationality even today. Andre Agassi, the famous tennis player is of Assyrian descent.


Details of the anti-Christ –


His nationality – Assyrian. (Isa. 31: 8 Micah 5: 5)

The region he comes from – the Ancient Assyrian Empire. (Dan. 11: 35 – 43)

Leader of Ancient Assyrian region - Iraq, Syria & Jordan. (Dan. 7: 8)

Leader of Islamic Federation – 10 kings of Islam. (Dan. 7: 8, Rev. 17: 12)

He rules the world – (Rev. 16: 13 & 14, 19: 19)

 
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Trivalee

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We know from scripture where the anti-Christ will arise & what his nationality is. We are also told that he is an Assyrian. Now this is a nationality even today. Andre Agassi, the famous tennis player is of Assyrian descent.


Details of the anti-Christ –


His nationality – Assyrian. (Isa. 31: 8 Micah 5: 5)

The region he comes from – the Ancient Assyrian Empire. (Dan. 11: 35 – 43)

Leader of Ancient Assyrian region - Iraq, Syria & Jordan. (Dan. 7: 8)

Leader of Islamic Federation – 10 kings of Islam. (Dan. 7: 8, Rev. 17: 12)

He rules the world – (Rev. 16: 13 & 14, 19: 19)
Isaiah 31:8 Then shall the Assyrian fall with the sword, not of a mighty man; and the sword, not of a mean man, shall devour him: but he shall flee from the sword, and his young men shall be discomfited.

9 And he shall pass over to his strong hold for fear, and his princes shall be afraid of the ensign, saith the Lord, whose fire is in Zion, and his furnace in Jerusalem.

Micah 5:5 And this man shall be the peace when the Assyrian shall come into our land: and when he shall tread in our palaces, then shall we raise against him seven shepherds and eight principal men. Notice the following:

  • In Isaiah 31:8 -9, the scripture says your Assyrian AC will flee from the sword, (from the battle) out of fear, leaving his soldiers confused and dejected.
  • Micah 5:5 says the Jews will appoint seven rulers to watch over them and eight princes to lead them.
We know the AC will mobilize his army against Jerusalem. If the outcome of this battle corroborates what Isaiah and Micah said, then your Assyrian is the AC but if not, he's not the Beast.

Zech 14:2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle, and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished, and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

In Rev 19:20. And the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who did mighty miracles on behalf of the beast—miracles that deceived all who had accepted the mark of the beast and who worshipped his statue. Both the beast and his false prophet were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur.
  • The 'nations' denote the AC's army (Rev 16:13-14 & 16). Jerusalem will fall to the Beast, the property of the Jews will be looted, their women raped, half of the population driven out of the city, etc. My tuppence on this is that the Lord will allow it to happen to show the stubborn intransigent Jews that they cannot save themselves without him (their Messiah). Remember that at the beginning of the great tribulation, believing Jews would have heeded the call to flee to the wilderness of Petra (Rev 12:6 & 14) where they are succoured by the Lord until his return in glory.
  • Rev 19:20 shows the end of the AC after Armageddon. Your Assyrian in Isaiah fled the battle, but Rev 19 says he was captured and taken alive into the lake of fire and brimstone.
  • Micah says the Assyrian will match into the city and trample their palaces and in response, the Jews will raise some rulers and princes to lead them. This is obviously not the case because as we see, the Jews capitulated.
Hopefully, you will agree that your Assyrian is not our bad guy.
 
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Marilyn C

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  • The 'nations' denote the AC's army (Rev 16:13-14 & 16). Jerusalem will fall to the Beast, the property of the Jews will be looted, their women raped, half of the population driven out of the city, etc. My tuppence on this is that the Lord will allow it to happen to show the stubborn intransigent Jews that they cannot save themselves without him (their Messiah). Remember that at the beginning of the great tribulation, believing Jews would have heeded the call to flee to the wilderness of Petra (Rev 12:6 & 14) where they are succoured by the Lord until his return in glory.
  • Rev 19:20 shows the end of the AC after Armageddon. Your Assyrian in Isaiah fled the battle, but Rev 19 says he was captured and taken alive into the lake of fire and brimstone.
  • Micah says the Assyrian will match into the city and trample their palaces and in response, the Jews will raise some rulers and princes to lead them. This is obviously not the case because as we see, the Jews capitulated.
Hopefully, you will agree that your Assyrian is not our bad guy.
In Isa. 31: 4 - 8 we see the timing is when the `Lord of hosts will come down to fight for Mount Zion and for its hill. Like birds flying about so will the Lord of hosts defend Jerusalem. Defending, He will also deliver it; passing over, He will preserve it.`

Micah 5: 5b & 6. The Assyrian (A/C) does `tread in our palaces,` and Israel when delivered will raise up shepherds and princely men who will deal with what is left.
 
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Trivalee

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In Isa. 31: 4 - 8 we see the timing is when the `Lord of hosts will come down to fight for Mount Zion and for its hill. Like birds flying about so will the Lord of hosts defend Jerusalem. Defending, He will also deliver it; passing over, He will preserve it.`

Micah 5: 5b & 6. The Assyrian (A/C) does `tread in our palaces,` and Israel when delivered will raise up shepherds and princely men who will deal with what is left.
I don't know the extent of your knowledge of eschatology because Isaiah 31:4-8 and Micah 5:5b &6 clearly don't fit the scenario after the Messiah returns! After the Lord returns and defeats the AC's army and casts him and the False prophet into the lake of fire (Rev 19:19-20), next follows the millennial kingdom where the Lord reigns from Jerusalem. So, where do you get "Israel raising up shepherds and princely men to deal with what's left?"
 
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Marilyn C

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I don't know the extent of your knowledge of eschatology because Isaiah 31:4-8 and Micah 5:5b &6 clearly don't fit the scenario after the Messiah returns! After the Lord returns and defeats the AC's army and casts him and the False prophet into the lake of fire (Rev 19:19-20), next follows the millennial kingdom where the Lord reigns from Jerusalem. So, where do you get "Israel raising up shepherds and princely men to deal with what's left?"
Let`s see what God`s word says -

` I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come and see my glory.....they shall bring all your brethren for an offering to the Lord out of all the nations, on horses and in chariots and in litters, on mules and on camels, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, ` says the Lord....and I will also take some of them for priests and Levites, ` says the Lord.` (Isa. 66: 18 - 21)

God will enable some in Israel to rule over the nations, judge & teach them God`s ways. (Micah 4: 1 - 3)
 
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Trivalee

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Let`s see what God`s word says -

` I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come and see my glory.....they shall bring all your brethren for an offering to the Lord out of all the nations, on horses and in chariots and in litters, on mules and on camels, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, ` says the Lord....and I will also take some of them for priests and Levites, ` says the Lord.` (Isa. 66: 18 - 21)

God will enable some in Israel to rule over the nations, judge & teach them God`s ways. (Micah 4: 1 - 3)
You seem to be one of those believers (scholars?) that approach scripture with their minds fixated and closed. Any interpretation of a text or doctrine that does not agree with their assumption is discarded without consideration. The Bible never said that God will "enable some in Israel to rule over the nations..." You just twisted what the Bible said; I'm not sure whether you did it wilfully or out of ignorance.

This is what the scripture actually said:

Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

Jesus said this in his letter to the church in Thyatira in Asia Minor (modern-day Turkey). It is noteworthy that most churches in the 1st century outside Judea were predominantly Gentiles (non-Jews), as Jewish believers were using the synagogues scattered throughout the Roman empire. What is significant in this passage (Rev 2:26) is that "he that overcomes" [corroborated in Matt 24:13] refers to any believer (Jew or Gentile) that remains faithful to the Lord until his return in glory.

Contrary to your view, the power given to the faithful over the nations is not based on ethnicity, but on righteousness to the Lord and it's not exclusive to Israel.
 
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Marilyn C

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You seem to be one of those believers (scholars?) that approach scripture with their minds fixated and closed. Any interpretation of a text or doctrine that does not agree with their assumption is discarded without consideration. The Bible never said that God will "enable some in Israel to rule over the nations..." You just twisted what the Bible said; I'm not sure whether you did it wilfully or out of ignorance.

This is what the scripture actually said:

Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

Jesus said this in his letter to the church in Thyatira in Asia Minor (modern-day Turkey). It is noteworthy that most churches in the 1st century outside Judea were predominantly Gentiles (non-Jews), as Jewish believers were using the synagogues scattered throughout the Roman empire. What is significant in this passage (Rev 2:26) is that "he that overcomes" [corroborated in Matt 24:13] refers to any believer (Jew or Gentile) that remains faithful to the Lord until his return in glory.

Contrary to your view, the power given to the faithful over the nations is not based on ethnicity, but on righteousness to the Lord and it's not exclusive to Israel.
That scripture (Rev. 2: 26) was given to the Body of Christ NOT to Israel.

Matt. 24: 13 is referring to those left in Israel. Remember that Jesus did NOT reveal the Body of Christ and its purpose till He gave it to the apostle Paul.

When Jesus came on earth to Israel, He confirmed the promises to the Fathers. (Rom. 15: 8)
 
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Trivalee

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That scripture (Rev. 2: 26) was given to the Body of Christ NOT to Israel.

Matt. 24: 13 is referring to those left in Israel. Remember that Jesus did NOT reveal the Body of Christ and its purpose till He gave it to the apostle Paul.

When Jesus came on earth to Israel, He confirmed the promises to the Fathers. (Rom. 15: 8)
I'm not sure what your point is. My position is that Rev 2:26 was given to the CHURCH, I never said it was meant for Israel.

Matt 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. If this text refers to Israel alone, then everything Jesus Christ said from Matthew to John must be limited to Israel. So you are wrong! Matt 24:13 applies to every Christian, Jew or Gentile.

Rom 15:8 is a confirmation that Jesus fulfilled the promise made to the fathers of Israel - namely, that God will raise a prophet unto Israel from among them of whom they should harken, see Deut 18:5; Acts 7:15. It's unfortunate you didn't intimate what these promises were, but I have given my view, so either concur or rebut with your own take.
 
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keras

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When Jesus came on earth to Israel, He confirmed the promises to the Fathers. (Rom. 15: 8)
Those Promises apply to the true Israelites of God, not to a bunch of people who claim to be Israel.

Who is the real House of Israel?
A study of the first two chapters of Hosea shows us that Israel was to be cast off and divorced from God. They were to be scattered (“Jezreel”); they were to have no mercy (“Lo-ruhamah”); and they were to be no longer God’s people (“Lo-ammi”). But at the same time, God promised that they would be regathered under one Head (Jesus Christ) and come out of captivity. A decreed period; Ezekiel 4:4-6.

In fact, God told them He would “betroth thee unto Me in righteousness” (Hosea 2:19). The prophecy culminates with a Hebrew play on words. The name “Jezreel” means “God scatters,” but it also means “God sows.” (One must scatter the seed in order to sow it in the field.) Thus, at first the name prophesies that Israel was to be scattered; but ultimately it shows God’s Purpose—to sow Israel in the earth in order to multiply her as the sand of the sea, so as God remains faithful to His promise to Abraham.

Hosea 2:23 And I will sow her unto Me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not My people, Thou art My people; and they shall say, Thou art My God.

In other words, even though God did indeed cast off His people Israel, scattering them in the nations by the hand of the Assyrians, God’s ultimate Purpose was to sow them in the earth, so that they would multiply and fulfill the promise to Abraham. Furthermore, Hosea prophesied that; in the very place (of their captivity) where it is said that they are not God’s people (Israel), they would be Christians known as; “the Sons of the living God." Hosea 1:10, Romans 9:24-26

The problem is that most Christians try to make the Jews fulfill these prophesies, when the House of Judah, is fact, fulfilling an entirely different set of prophecies. God in His great mercy has allowed them nearly 2000 years to change their hearts to Him and to accept Jesus as Messiah.

If people realized that the Jews are to fulfill the prophecies of the House of Judah, instead of those dealing with the lost House of Israel, they would not have made this mistake. The Jews were certainly “cast off” in 586 BC and again in 70-135 A.D., even as Israel was cast off during 745-712 B.C.—but the difference is that the prophets uniformly prophesy good things for lost Israel even during the time of their captivity; while severe judgments were pronounced upon Jerusalem and the Jewish people.

Note that Ezekiel 21:14 tells of 3 Judgements. The next one, to come; will be by the Hand of the Lord Himself. Ezekiel 21:1-7

In Jeremiah 18:1-10, God says that the House of Israel was marred in the Potter’s hand, so God was going to beat down the wet clay and remake it into a vessel fit for His use. Then beginning in verse 11, God begins to prophesy about Jerusalem and Judah. First comes an indictment for their sins, and then in Jeremiah 19:1-15 we see that Jeremiah was to take an old earthen vessel (as opposed to wet clay that was pliable), he was to go to the city dump and smash the earthen vessel there, saying: Even so will I break this people and this city, as one breaks a potter’s vessel, that cannot be made whole again, and they shall bury them in Tophet, till there be no place to bury. Thus will I do unto this place, says the Lord, and to the inhabitants thereof, and even make this city as Tophet.

God’s choice of an allegory to suit each House is amazing!
An old clay vessel, once broken, cannot be remade into another vessel. Only wet, pliable clay can be used to remake a vessel. The House of Israel is like the pliable clay; but the House of Judah will be smashed and never again be built into a vessel of honour.

At the end of the first Temple era, God departed from it and Ezekiel saw the glory depart. Ezekiel 10:4-19 It has never returned to the Temple. Even when Zerubbabel rebuilt the Temple in 515 B.C., the glory did not return to it when they dedicated it to God. The work was good and was allowed by God, but the site itself was cursed.

This is consistent with the New Testament prophecies regarding the cursed fig tree, Matt. 21:21 the parable of the vineyard, Matt. 21:43-44 and the parable of the citizens who hated Him and would not allow Him to reign over them. Luke 19:27

The point is, these peoples must still be around to fulfill these distinct prophecies for Israel and for the cursed fig tree. The lost House of Israel must exist to be remade into another vessel and Judah must exist to be virtually wiped out. Isaiah 22:14

The problem comes when people think that the smashed vessel is going to be rebuilt into a vessel fit for God’s use, and when those same people wrongly think that the original House of Israel is lost forever and the Jews are the only Israel.



Plainly, the Christian peoples are the House of Israel, the Overcomers for God, as Jacob was. Jesus came to save the House of Israel, Matthew 15:24, who must be the Christian peoples; or Jesus failed in His mission.

The Jews will never change and Bible prophecy says they will be Judged and punished and only a remnant will survive. Romans 9:27, Isaiah 6:11-13, Zephaniah 1:1-18, +
 
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Marilyn C

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I'm not sure what your point is. My position is that Rev 2:26 was given to the CHURCH, I never said it was meant for Israel.

Matt 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. If this text refers to Israel alone, then everything Jesus Christ said from Matthew to John must be limited to Israel. So you are wrong! Matt 24:13 applies to every Christian, Jew or Gentile.

Rom 15:8 is a confirmation that Jesus fulfilled the promise made to the fathers of Israel - namely, that God will raise a prophet unto Israel from among them of whom they should harken, see Deut 18:5; Acts 7:15. It's unfortunate you didn't intimate what these promises were, but I have given my view, so either concur or rebut with your own take.
Remember that the Body of Christ revelation was NOT given by the Lord till He ascended and gave it to the Apostle Paul. (Eph. 3: 5) Matt. 24: 13 does NOT apply to the Body of Christ.

The promise to Israel are - That God would make Israel the rule over the nations of the earth, (Dan. 7: 26 & 27, Zech. 14: 16, Joel 3: 2 etc) And yes, that God would raise up a Prophet (Deut. 18: 15, Acts 7: 37). It is through the Lord that promises to Israel will be fulfilled and promises to the Body of Christ will be fulfilled.

So, do you know what the promises to the Body of Christ are? Care to share if you do know?

Marilyn.
 
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5thKingdom

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Let's discuss the four kingdoms of time.
The first one is the Babylonian Empire

No, that is completely incorrect

The second empire was the collective Medo-Persians.

No, that is completely incorrect again

Greece was the third empire

No, again that is wrong.


Here is a FIRST understanding you must have BEFORE you pretend to understand historical fulfillment of Daniel's Four Beasts/Kingdoms.
The Bible PROMISES that understanding of Daniel's prophecies would remain "closed-up" and "sealed" to all the Saints
until the Last Saints "shall understand" during a specific period of history called the "Time-of-the-End",
this period of history is also called the "Season and Time"... more on that later.


Dan 12:4
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, EVEN TO THE TIME-OF-THE-END:
many shall run to and fro, and
[closed-up and sealed] knowledge shall be increased [to the Last Saints].


Dan 12:8-10
And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?
And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed TILL THE TIME-OF-THE-END.
Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand;
but the wise
[Last Saints] shall understand.


Here we have a primary understanding about Daniel's prophecies... even HE did not understand their historical fulfillment.
In fact, the Bible PROMISES that the historical fulfillment of Daniel's prophecies would remain "closed-up" and "sealed"
until a specific period of history called the "Time-of-the-End".


Since YOUR "interpretation" of the fulfillment of Daniel's prophecies is VERY OLD (from the Reformation)
we can know for certain that your "interpretation" is not Biblical... because it was developed long ago,
way before the "Time-of-the-End", which is a specific period of history (as I show below).


Bottom Line:
ANY "interpretation" and EVERY "interpretation" of the meaning of Daniel's prophecies MUST be incorrect...
if they were developed BEFORE a specific period history named the "Time-of-the-End".
That fact cannot be refuted from Scripture... It can only be denied by "feelings".


And finally, the Rome....

Nope, that is wrong and the Bible establishes that error in one (1) verse.
The Bible PROMISES that AFTER Daniel's 4th Beast is destroyed in the "Burning Flame"
people would continue to live on earth for a period named the "Season and Time" (same as "Time-of-the-End".


Dan 7:11-12
I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the [Little] Horn spake:
I beheld even till the
[Fourth] Beast was slain, and his body destroyed, AND GIVEN TO THE BURNING FLAME.
As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time.




While this was not taught or understood by Saints living during the (2nd) Jewish Kingdom/Beast,
and while this was never taught or understood by Saints living in the (3rd) Christian Kingdom/Beast,
the Bible speaks (in many places) about a period AFTER the destruction of the Fourth/Revelation Beast,
during a time specifically named the “Season and Time”. The Gospel of the Last Saints includes this Truth.


The Old Testament is very clear, there is a “Season and Time” on earth after the destruction of the Fourth Beast
(Revelation Beast), in which the previous Beasts continue to exist on earth, just without “dominion” (authority/rule).
The Bible teaches a “Season and Time” on earth after people of the Fourth Kingdom are “given to the Burning Flame”.
Remembering the end of Daniel’s Fourth Beast is the SAME EVENT as the end of the Revelation Beast, we should
be able to find parallel passages about this end-time event in the New Testament – and that is exactly what we find:


Rev 19:20
And the [Revelation] Beast was taken, and with him the False Prophet [the Anti-Christ]
that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the Mark of the Beast,
and them that worshipped his Image. These both were cast alive into a Lake of Fire burning with brimstone.



You don’t need to be a Bible scholar to see Daniel’s Fourth Beast being “given to the Burning Flame
is the same event as the Revelation Beast being “cast alive into the Lake of Fire”. In both cases it represents
the end of the Fourth “Kingdom” on earth. In both cases it represents the end of the Great Tribulation “Kingdom
and the end of Satan’s “Little Season”. In both cases it represents the people of the Fourth Kingdom being “cast alive
into the eternal torment Most people think of as “Hell”.


And that causes a problem for the (3rd) Christian Kingdom Gospel. Christian eschatology doesn’t teach about
people living on earth for a “Season and Timeafter Daniel’s Fourth Beast (the Revelation Beast) is destroyed.
The Christian Gospel does not even include a Fourth “Kingdom of Heaven” after the Church Age is completed.
The Christian Gospel cannot harmonize some people living on earth after others have been “cast alive” into the
Burning Flame” or the “Lake of Fire”. This Biblical Truth remained “closed-up” and “sealed” until the Last Saints.


Christian Saints were never meant to understand the historical fulfillment of “Time of the End” events [Acts 1:7].
Just as the Jewish Saints were never meant to understand the end of their “Kingdom”, so also, Christian Saints
were never meant to understand the end of their “Kingdom of Heaven”. The Jewish Gospel and Christian Gospel
did not understand Daniel’s Fourth “Kingdom/Beast”. Those Truths remained “sealed” until the “Time of the End”.


The “Season and Time” on earth after destruction of the Fourth/Revelation Beast (after Satan’s “Little Season”),
is the same period Daniel’s prophecy calls the “Time of the End” when the Last Saints “shall understand”.
During this time people live on earth (without dominion) after others are “given to the Burning Flame”.


When the Fourth Beast is viewed as the Roman Empire, the European Union or any other physical/political Kingdom,
there's NO WAY to harmonize an eschatological doctrine that Daniel's "remaining" Kingdoms continue to exist on
earth for a “Season and Timeafter the people living Daniel’s Fourth Kingdom have been "cast alive" into Hell.


Daniel's Four Beasts are not physical/political Kingdoms (governments), they can only be spiritual Kingdoms.
And Daniel 7:11-12 immediately destroys all Christian eschatology since it reveals people are living on earth
for a “Season and Timeafter people living in the Fourth Kingdom are “cast alive into the Lake of Fire”.


Obviously, the Babylonian Empire, Persian Empire and Greek Empire do not continue to exist on earth,
without dominion, [Dan 7:11-12] after the people of the Roman Empire have been “given to the Burning Flame
or “cast alive into the Lake of Fire”. Daniel’s Kingdoms/Beasts are spiritual (not physical/political) Kingdoms.
And the “Season and Time” or “Time of the End” on earth occurs after the destruction of Daniel’s Fourth Beast,
but before the end of the world. I will save THAT Biblical mystery for another time.


Bottom Line:
If you want to preach Daniel's Four Beasts represent (Biblically) Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome...
then you must be prepared to explain how people continue to exist on earth for a "Season and Time"
(or a "Time-of-the-End") AFTER the end of the Roman Empire when people are "given to the Burning Flame"
and "cast alive into the Lake of Fire"... and that is an impossible explanation.


The ten horns are symbolic of ten kingdoms that will arise out of Rome.

Nope,


The Last "wheat and tares" on earth are represented as being
(1) the "Ten Virgins" of Matthew 25:1-13
(2) the "Ten Horns" and "Ten Kings" of Daniel 7
(3) the "Ten Horns" and "Ten Kings" of Revelation 17
(4) the "Ten Toes" and Ten "Kings" of Dan 2:44


Notice:
The Ten Toes and Ten Kings of Daniel 2 are toes of IRON (shown as "wise virgins" in Matthew 25)
and toes of CLAY (shown as "foolish virgins" in Matthew 25)... this is called "harmony of Scripture".


Dan 2:44
And in the days of these [Ten] Kings shall the God of heaven set up a Kingdom, which shall never be destroyed:
and the Kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these
[four] Kingdoms,
and it shall stand for ever.



In other words:
We know absolutely that the PEOPLE called the "Ten Virgins" in Matthew 25:1-13
are the SAME PEOPLE called the Ten "Kings/Horns" in BOTH Daniel 7 and Revelation 17...
and the SAMEPEOPLE called the Ten "Toes/Kings" in Daniel 2... we can know this absolutely
because (in each case) they are the people LIVING ON EARTH when the Lord Returns in Glory.


Now... since I anticipate skepticism, let me point out that I have already established [Dan 2:44]
that the Ten "Toes/Kings" of Daniel 2 are living on earth when the Lord Returns.
Now I (or rather the Scripture) will establish the same for the "Ten Virgins"
and for the Ten "Kings/Horns" in BOTH Daniel 7 and Revelation 17


THEN... if you do not want to accept what is presented,
you are denying Scripture and NOT my "interpretation".


Mat 25:10
And while they [foolish virgins] went to buy, the Bridegroom [Jesus] Came;
and they that were ready [the wise virgins] went in with him TO THE MARRIAGE:
AND THE DOOR WAS SHUT.



Here we see the "Wise Virgins" went in with Jesus "to the marriage"... and "the door was shut"
I will just assume the reader understands the significance of those words and I will expect
that is all the proof needed to establish the "Ten Virgins" are living at the Lord's Return.


Dan 7:11
I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the [Little] Horn spake:
I beheld even till the [Fourth] Beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the Burning Flame.



Dan 7:21-22
I beheld, and the same [Little] Horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;
Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High;
and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.



Here we see the Ten "Kings/Horns" are RULED by the "Little Horn" until the "Ancient of Days Came".
I will just assume the reader understands the significance of those words and I will expect that
is all the proof needed to establish the Ten "Kings/Horns" (also call the "Saints") are still
living on earth when the Lord Returns.


Rev 17:12-13
And the Ten Horns which thou sawest are Ten Kings, which have received no kingdom as yet;
[when John wrote the prophecy] but [they] receive power as Kings one hour with the [Revelation] Beast.
These [Ten "Kings/Horns"] have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the [Revelation] Beast.


Rev 17:17

For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their [Fourth] Kingdom unto the [Revelation] Beast,
until the words of God shall be fulfilled.


So we have seen in Scripture:
The Ten "Toes/Kings" of Daniel 2 includes the Last Saints on earth.
The Ten "Kings/Horns" of Daniel 7 includes the Last Saints on earth.
The Ten "Kings/Horns" of Revelation 17 includes the Last Saints on earth.
And the "Ten Virgins" of Matthew 25 includes the Last Saints on earth.


And we have seen how Scripture PROMISES
these Biblical mysteries would remain "closed-up" and "sealed" to all Jewish Saints and all Christian Saints...
until finally the Last Saints "shall understand" these prophecies during a period specifically name the "Time-of-the-End",
which occurs AFTER the Fourth Beast/Kingdom is "given to the Burning Flame" and "cast alive into the Lake of Fire"...
and yet... people continue to live on earth for a "Season and Time" (or "Time-of-the-End") AFTER the people
of the Fourth Kingdom are cast into Hell.


Notice:
This understanding of Daniel's prophecies was never preached during the Reformation or since...
This is NEW information - an increased understanding of the Gospel - exactly as God promised to Daniel


Dan 12:4
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the Time-of-the-End:
many [ten "virgins/kings/horns/toes"] shall run to and fro, and [sealed] knowledge shall be increased.



In my next post I will explain WHO the Four "Beasts/Kings" represent in history.
Since that information was never preached during the Jewish Kingdom or Christian Kingdom.
That information has ONLY been preached by the Last Saints during a period named the "Time-of-the-End"...
the period in which we are currently living.

.
 
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Trivalee

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Remember that the Body of Christ revelation was NOT given by the Lord till He ascended and gave it to the Apostle Paul. (Eph. 3: 5) Matt. 24: 13 does NOT apply to the Body of Christ.

The promise to Israel are - That God would make Israel the rule over the nations of the earth, (Dan. 7: 26 & 27, Zech. 14: 16, Joel 3: 2 etc) And yes, that God would raise up a Prophet (Deut. 18: 15, Acts 7: 37). It is through the Lord that promises to Israel will be fulfilled and promises to the Body of Christ will be fulfilled.

So, do you know what the promises to the Body of Christ are? Care to share if you do know?

Marilyn.
You need to work on your eschatology to enable you to differentiate between Israel and the church. The true church loosely referred to, as the "saints" is made up of Jew and Gentile believers. The fact you didn't understand that "the people of the saints of the most High" in Dan 7:27 denotes the complete body of Christ (Jew and Gentile) during the millennial kingdom, shows your limited grasp of scripture.
 
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5thKingdom

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You need to work on your eschatology to enable you to differentiate between Israel and the church. The true church loosely referred to, as the "saints" is made up of Jew and Gentile believers. The fact you didn't understand that "the people of the saints of the most High" in Dan 7:27 denotes the complete body of Christ (Jew and Gentile) during the millennial kingdom, shows your limited grasp of scripture.


Incorrect.

The "people of the Saints of the most High" [Dan 7:27]
represent the Last Saints on earth... they are PART of the "Ten Horns" and "Ten Kings" in Daniel 7,
they are PART of the "Ten Horns" and "Ten Kings" in Revelation 17, they are PART of the "Ten Toes" and "Ten Kings"
in Daniel 2 and they are PART of the "Ten Virgins" in Mat 25.


They do NOT represent the complete Body of Christ.
Instead they represent the Last "wheat and tares" on earth - including the Saints that are alive when the Lord Returns:


Example #1


In Daniel 2 we see the Fourth Kingdom/Beast consists exclusively of the "Ten Toes" and "Ten Kings"
that are alive at the time of the Lord's Return. They do NOT include the entire "Body of Christ",
they ONLY include the Last "wheat and tares" on earth (which includes the Last Saints).


Dan 2:44
And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed:
and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms,
and it shall stand for ever.


Example #2


In Matthew 25 we see the Great Tribulation “Kingdom of Heaven” consists exclusively of the “Ten Virgins
that “went forth” from their (3rd) Christian Kingdom churches – into the (4th) Great Tribulation Kingdom,
following the man commonly called the Anti-Christ. The “Ten Virgins” are the “wheat and tares
that God “harvested” at the end of the Great Commission – at the “End of the Age”.
The Gospel of the Bible includes the Last Saints of the Fourth “Kingdom”.


They do NOT include the entire "Body of Christ"... they only include the last "wheat and tares" on earth.



Mat 25:1-2
Then shall the [4th Great Tribulation] Kingdom of Heaven be likened unto TEN VIRGINS,
which took their lamps [their Gospel], and went forth [from the 3rd Kingdom into the 4th Kingdom]
to meet the Bridegroom [preaching the Lord’s Return]. And five of them were wise [saved wheat],
and five were foolish [unsaved tares].


The Great Tribulation “Kingdom of Heaven” did NOT include those people who never “went forth
from their (3rd) Christian Kingdom churches and the Great Tribulation certainly did not include people
OUTSIDE of the Christian Kingdom. The Great Tribulation was exclusive to the “Ten Virgins”.


The Gospel teaches this same reality when the “Ten Virgins” are shown as Ten “Kings” and Ten “Horns
in Daniel’s prophecies AND in Revelation prophecies. We are fortunate the Bible gives us several
different perspectives of the last “wheat and tares” on earth, because it allows us to harmonize
different passages to increase our understanding about the same people – and same events.


Example #3


In Daniel 7 we see the Fourth “Kingdom/Beast” on earth consists exclusively of the Ten “Kings/Horns
under the rule of the “Little Horn”. The Fourth Kingdom did not include anyone besides the Ten “Kings/Horns”,
which represented the “Ten Virgins” consisting of both saved “wheat” and unsaved “tares” following Biblical doctrines
at the “End of the Age” (at the end of the Great Commission) and the beginning of the Fourth Beast – which must arise.



They do NOT include the entire "Body of Christ"... they only include the last "wheat and tares" on earth.


Dan 7:8
I considered the [ten] Horns, and, behold, there came up among them another Little Horn, before whom
there were three of the first Horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this [Little] Horn were eyes
like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.



Dan 7:21-22
I beheld, and the same [Little] Horn made war with the Saints, and prevailed against them;
Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the Saints of the most High;
and the time came that the Saints possessed the kingdom.



Dan 7:24-25
And the Ten Horns out of this Kingdom are Ten Kings that shall arise: and another [Little Horn]
shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three Kings. And he
shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think
to change times and laws: and they [the Last Saints] shall be given into his hand until a time and times
and the dividing of time [for 3.5 times].



Example #4


Again, in Revelation 17, we see the 7-Headed Revelation Beast consists exclusively of Ten “Kings/Horns”.
Saint John tells us the Ten “Horns” are the same people as the Ten “Kings” (they are the “Ten Virgins”).
These last “wheat and tares” had not received their “Kingdom” at the time of John’s prophecies, but,
they “receive power as Kings” when the Revelation Beast arises.


They do NOT include the entire "Body of Christ"... they only include the last "wheat and tares" on earth.


Notice the Ten “Kings/Horns”, the last “wheat and tares” on earth – “give their power and strength unto the Beast”.
Saints in the Christian Kingdom “lived and reigned with Christ” [Rev 20:4] but Saints in the Fourth Kingdom
give their power and strength to the Beast”. That is the difference between the Great Commission
and the Great Tribulation “Kingdom of Heaven”.


Rev 17:12-13
And the Ten Horns which thou sawest are Ten Kings, which have received no kingdom as yet;
but receive power as Kings one hour with the [Revelation] Beast. These have one mind,
and shall give their power and strength unto the Beast.



Saints in the (3rd) Christian “Kingdom of Heaven” [Mat 13, in 7 verses] never “give their Kingdom to the Beast”.
It’s the Saints in the (4th) Great Tribulation “Kingdom of Heaven” [Mat 25:1] that “give their Kingdom to the Beast”.
That is the difference between the Great Commission of the Christian Kingdom – and the Great Tribulation
of the Last Saints in the Fourth “Kingdom”.


Of course the question becomes WHY would the Last Saints “give their Kingdom to the Beast”?
And the answer is simple: God “put it in their hearts” to do so. It was the Providence of God that the Last Saints
be RULED by Satan and his Anti-Christ “until the Words of God shall be fulfilled”.


Rev 17:17
For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their Kingdom unto the Beast,
until the words of God shall be fulfilled.



I hope these examples are enough to allow you to "see" that the Ten "virgins/kings/horns/toes"
do NOT include the entire "Body of Christ"... instead, the are exclusive to the last "wheat and tares" on earth,
those people who are alive when the Lord Returns to establish His eternal "Kingdom".


Jim
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