The 10 Commandments are done away!

[JohnRabbit]

The don'ts of the Ten Commandments do absolutely nothing to help you know how to do what you need to: in order to be insulated and kept from violating the good.

interesting, because paul disagrees with you!

Romans 7:7(NKJV)
7What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.”

the "don'ts" of the Ten Commandments told paul what sin is!

i think that helped him to know what he needed to do!

 

[Bob S]

you just prove you don't understand God's law!

the question is why don't you?

You have no idea what I understand about the law. I know the law was not about love and your quotes do not prove me wrong. I know that the law was used to condemn Israel. I know that the law ended when God finally cut off Israel from the "if" promise. If you obey I will..... I know they continuously disobeyed and God and were cut off from the covenant at the death of Jesus. Yes, I know it took another 70 years before the Temple was finally destroyed and the Jews scattered over the Earth, but it did happen. I know I am not under ritual laws given only to Israel including the defunct Sabbath law from the defunct 10 commandments. I know moral laws concerning our relationship with the God Head and moral laws concerning our relationship with ourselves and others are forever. I also know that 9 of the ten are dealing with morality and I also know that those 9 are not an exhaustive list of morality. I pray that you too might know all of this.

Something else you might want to know and put a feather in your cap, all of the 10 commandments could have been fulfilled out of duty not love. Therefore the 10 commandments were not about love if they could have been fulfilled with an obligation of duty. Either way we have all failed and only by the shed blood of Jesus covering where we fail do we continue to look perfect in the eyes of the Father.

Jesus says that the weightier matters of the law are justice, mercy, and faith - mark 23:23.

but you probably don't believe that either because you don't see the "words" in the commandments!

Oh the word "probably" is so soothing. It is just a semi attack and I suppose I should thank you for not attacking me full fledged.

one day all will recognize that God's law expresses His way - isaiah 2:3!

I hope and pray that is the case, but brainwashing is a terrible thing. I know because I was once where you are now.

Read this and contemplate its meaning.
Heb8:13 By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.

What do you think the following verse means for the followers of Christ? Are you one who thumps that the law cannot change? Do you believe we are still under the old covenant only warmed over? Would that be a change in the law? I pray your heart will crack a little so that you will allow a little light into you soul.

Hebrews 7:12
For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

 

[Bob S]

I'm certain that Jesus actually meant that he came to raise the standard of righteousness as in to fill up a cup to the brim.

Hebrews 7:12
For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

Does raising the standards mean changing the law?

 

[2 know him]

interesting, because paul disagrees with you!

Romans 7:7(NKJV)
7What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.”

the "don'ts" of the Ten Commandments told paul what sin is!

i think that helped him to know what he needed to do!

No one is saying the law of sin, I am saying the law doesn't help you know how to live right.

Paul himself said the laws the ministration of condemnation: although Paul means nothing to me.

Let's stick to Jesus the author of our faith.

 

[2 know him]

Hebrews 7:12
For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

Does raising the standards mean changing the law?

The law is not all bad, the Pharisees tried to use it in order to judge themselves aand claim righteousness for themselves: because they saw that they didn't violate the law.

Jesus's teachings are not against much of the law. The law is very expansive and has some very good principles, it is just that it doesn't help you to know you shouldn't do something if you don't know how not to do it.

Jesus's teachings are not against Thou shalt not kill they just go on to explain how not to kill. Yes Jesus raised the standards and created a new law of higher standards and that is exactly what the rest of the text after Matthew 5:17 go on to show. when you look at the rest of the text in light of the explanation of the word in the Greek translated fulfill but which really means to fill completely, as in to raise the standard, it clearly aligns itself with the text properly.

 

[2 know him]

Hebrews 7:12
For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

Does raising the standards mean changing the law?

Raising the standards absolutely does mean changing the law.

Not only does he raise the standards though, he does away with much of the law. for example: if a person was caught in adultery they were to be stoned to death. Jesus changed the law.

Jesus stated it's not what goes into a man that defiles a man but that which comes out of a man's heart and changed the dietary laws.

Jesus said nothing about the Sabbath and thus we have no Sabbath laws. we do have principles though which govern the way that we treat each other, that is, we are obligated to love our neighbors with equality, or that is to say "as ourselves" and so we have an obligation not to take advantage of them, to exploit them, but rather to care for them and not only to care for them, but to care for them and ensure that we treat them with equality, or as total equals, so those who have businesses and take more for themselves than they pay their employees are in violation of the teachings of Christ.

Yes we have new laws in Christ: new higher standards.

 

[disciple1]

The law is not all bad, the Pharisees tried to use it in order to judge themselves aand claim righteousness for themselves: because they saw that they didn't violate the law.

Jesus's teachings are not against much of the law. The law is very expansive and has some very good principles, it is just that it doesn't help you to know you shouldn't do something if you don't know how not to do it.

Jesus's teachings are not against Thou shalt not kill they just go on to explain how not to kill. Yes Jesus raised the standards and created a new law of higher standards and that is exactly what the rest of the text after Matthew 5:17 go on to show. when you look at the rest of the text in light of the explanation of the word in the Greek translated fulfill but which really means to fill completely, as in to raise the standard, it clearly aligns itself with the text properly.

I like what Jesus said in John chapter 7 verse 19 Has not Moses given you the law yet not one of you keeps it. And they did try very hard to keep it. And Jesus also said your righteousness would have to surpass that of the teachers of the law.
If you preach the law your condemning your self because you don't keep it.
It says in James chapter 2 verse 10 If anyone keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.
I like what it says in Galatians chapter 5 verse 14 the entire law is summed up in a single command love your neighbor as yourself.
James chapter 2 verse 13 Judgement without mercy will be shown anyone who hasn't been merciful mercy triumphs over judgement.
AND NOT ONE OF YOU KEEPS THE LAW!

 

[YSam44]

No one is saying the law of sin, I am saying the law doesn't help you know how to live right.

Paul himself said the laws the ministration of condemnation: although Paul means nothing to me.

Let's stick to Jesus the author of our faith.

Moses did not fill up the cup, he left the cup half empty and really left it empty: because he never showed us how to do the things that were expected of us; he didn't show us that in order to live right before God you had to have a right heart and that in order to have a right heart you had to practice Mercy compassion forgiveness and Grace.

The don'ts of the Ten Commandments do absolutely nothing to help you know how to do what you need to: in order to be insulated and kept from violating the good. As has already been said Moses gave absolutely nothing to the Gentile Christian and truth be known he did absolutely no good to help the children of Israel be and maintain righteousness: all this is found in Christ and Christ alone and by this I mean in his teachings.

Really?

By faith Moses, when he was grown up, srefused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter,25 tchoosing rather to be mistreated with the people of God than to enjoyuthe fleeting pleasures of sin. 26 vHe considered the reproach of Christ greater wealth than the treasures of Egypt, for he was looking to wthe reward. 27 xleft Egypt, ynot being afraid of the anger of the king, for he endured zas seeing him who is invisible. 28 ahe kept the Passover and sprinkled the blood, so that the Destroyer of the firstborn might not touch them.

29 bthe people crossed the Red Sea as on dry land, but the Egyptians, when they attempted to do the same, were drowned.

Hebrews 11 shows us otherwise.... By faith Moses considered the reproach of Christ greater wealth than the treasures of Egypt.... So what do you mean that Moses never showed us how to do the things that were expected of us? Moses was the instrument that God used to give His laws to Israel, right? I think also it was Moses that pleaded with God for the preservation of Israel. - remember His hot displeasure?

Mercy and compassion are both found in the law? the weightier matters... Do you not see this?

 

[Cribstyl]

interesting, because paul disagrees with you!

Romans 7:7(NKJV)
7What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.”

the "don'ts" of the Ten Commandments told paul what sin is!

i think that helped him to know what he needed to do!

What is Paul saying Rabbit??? BY isolating that text you're saying opposite...... He 's saying we're not under the law.
Rom 7:4 So, my dear brothers and sisters, this is the point: You died to the power of the law when you died with Christ. And now you are united with the one who was raised from the dead. As a result, we can produce a harvest of good deeds for God.
Rom 7:5 When we were controlled by our old nature,
Rom 7:6 But now we have been released from the law, for we died to it and are no longer captive to its power. Now we can serve God, not in the old way of obeying the letter of the law, but in the new way of living in the Spirit.

 

[Bob S]

The law is not all bad, the Pharisees tried to use it in order to judge themselves aand claim righteousness for themselves: because they saw that they didn't violate the law.

Jesus's teachings are not against much of the law. The law is very expansive and has some very good principles, it is just that it doesn't help you to know you shouldn't do something if you don't know how not to do it.

Jesus's teachings are not against Thou shalt not kill they just go on to explain how not to kill. Yes Jesus raised the standards and created a new law of higher standards and that is exactly what the rest of the text after Matthew 5:17 go on to show. when you look at the rest of the text in light of the explanation of the word in the Greek translated fulfill but which really means to fill completely, as in to raise the standard, it clearly aligns itself with the text properly.

Morality is forever. Anything in the Torah that pertained to morality is now in the Royal Law of Love. That is a very simple truth and it does not mean that we are under Torah. We are not under ritual laws given to Israel found in Torah. No other nation was ever asked to abide by the ritual laws of Israel, not then and not now.

Those who believe we have to observe the ritual weekly Sabbath given only to Israel are denying the work Jesus did for all mankind on the Cross.

 

[2 know him]

Morality is forever. Anything in the Torah that pertained to morality is now in the Royal Law of Love. That is a very simple truth and it does not mean that we are under Torah. We are not under ritual laws given to Israel found in Torah. No other nation was ever asked to abide by the ritual laws of Israel, not then and not now.

Those who believe we have to observe the ritual weekly Sabbath given only to Israel are denying the work Jesus did for all mankind on the Cross.

The death of Jesus on the cross was the sacrifice of the covenant, but the teachings of Christ are the Covenant and that which should be the main focus of every follower of Jesus.

When Moses gave the old covenant he sacrificed animals, but it is not the sacrifice of the covenant that one should be focused upon but rather the words of the covenant: the old and the new covenant are the same in that regard.

 

[bbbbbbb]

The death of Jesus on the cross was the sacrifice of the covenant, but the teachings of Christ are the Covenant and that which should be the main focus of every follower of Jesus.

When Moses gave the old covenant he sacrificed animals, but it is not the sacrifice of the covenant that one should be focused upon but rather the words of the covenant: the old and the new covenant are the same in that regard.

If that is true, why did Jesus command His followers to remember Him in the breaking of bread? That is entirely focused on the sacrifice of the covenant,

 

[2 know him]

If that is true, why did Jesus command His followers to remember Him in the breaking of bread? That is entirely focused on the sacrifice of the covenant,

No one is saying the sacrifice wasn't important it is just that the sacrifice is not the message or focus of Christ.

The last thing Jesus said before ascending to heaven, was to go into all the word and make disciples (those disciplined in the teachings of a master) of all nations...teaching them to observe all I have commanded you. Jesus is the king and his words are suppose to be the laws that govern all true Christians lives. THE SACRIFICE IS NOT THE FOCUS: OBESIENCE TO THE TEACHINGS OF CHRIST IS TO BE THE REAL FOCUS OF ANY REAL FOLLOWER OF CHRIST.

 

[bbbbbbb]

No one is saying the sacrifice wasn't important it is just that the sacrifice is not the message or focus of Christ.

The last thing Jesus said before ascending to heaven, was to go into all the word and make disciples (those disciplined in the teachings of a master) of all nations...teaching them to observe all I have commanded you. Jesus is the king and his words are suppose to be the laws that govern all true Christians lives. THE SACRIFICE IS NOT THE FOCUS: OBESIENCE TO THE TEACHINGS OF CHRIST IS TO BE THE REAL FOCUS OF ANY REAL FOLLOWER OF CHRIST.

Exactly. Jesus commanded His disciples to go into all the world and make disciples, teaching them to observe all He commanded them to do. His commandments are centered on baptism (a direct symbol of His death, burial, and resurrection) and the breaking of bread (a direct symbol of His sacrificial death). If that is not the focus, what is?

 

[2 know him]

Exactly. Jesus commanded His disciples to go into all the world and make disciples, teaching them to observe all He commanded them to do. His commandments are centered on baptism (a direct symbol of His death, burial, and resurrection) and the breaking of bread (a direct symbol of His sacrificial death). If that is not the focus, what is?

His commandments are the teachings of the gospel of the kingdom and they are all his teachings.

John the Baptist baptised before Jesus and baptism was about making a public proclamation of laying down a person's life to be clean: by a commitment to following the one who was baptising. Baptism had nothing to do with Jesus' death, it had to do with Jesus's teachings and life, Paul came along and made the focus of baptism about Jesus death, but that is not the meaning the early church (prior to Paul) had of baptism.

The teachings of Christ on loving your enemies, laying up your treasures in heaven and not on earth, forgiveness etc. are the commandments of Christ that are the main focus of Christianity.

 

[Bob S]

the teachings of Christ are the Covenant and that which should be the main focus of every follower of Jesus.

I really do not understand. Jesus taught the old covenant, but that doesn't mean it is the new covenant. Jesus taught the OC because Israel was under the OC, the new was yet to be ratified by Jesus blood.

When Moses gave the old covenant he sacrificed animals, but it is not the sacrifice of the covenant that one should be focused upon but rather the words of the covenant: the old and the new covenant are the same in that regard.

Torah was the "words of the OC. What are the "words" of the new covenant?

 

[disciple1]

The death of Jesus on the cross was the sacrifice of the covenant, but the teachings of Christ are the Covenant and that which should be the main focus of every follower of Jesus.

When Moses gave the old covenant he sacrificed animals, but it is not the sacrifice of the covenant that one should be focused upon but rather the words of the covenant: the old and the new covenant are the same in that regard.

the old and the new covenant are the same in that regard.

This is it.
1 Peter chapter 4
8 Above all, love each other deeply, because love covers over a multitude of sins.
Jeremiah chapter 22
16 He defended the cause of the poor and needy,
and so all went well.
Is that not what it means to know me?”
declares the Lord.

 

[2 know him]

I really do not understand. Jesus taught the old covenant, but that doesn't mean it is the new covenant. Jesus taught the OC because Israel was under the OC, the new was yet to be ratified by Jesus blood.


Torah was the "words of the OC. What are the "words" of the new covenant?

Jesus did not teach the old covenant: If I say love your enemies am I teaching the New covenant? Did you know Buddha stated to love your enemies? So did Jesus teach Buddhism? Some of Jesus' teachings are the same as Buddha's that does not make Jesus a Buddhist: as many of Jesus' teachings are against the teachings of Buddhism; in the same way many of Jesus teachings are against the old covenant BUT NOT ALL, it still doesn't make Jesus' teachings any less a totally new covenant. A covenant is a contract and contracts may have similarities but it is the differences that make them unique. Jesus didn't teach against all of the old covenant, but he definitely did teach against some of it.

The blood is not the covenant, it is a seal that ratifies the document, just like a signature does today in the use of contracts, but the covenant is in the teachings of Jesus.

 

[disciple1]

Jesus did not teach the old covenant: If I say love your enemies am I teaching the New covenant? Did you know Buddha stated to love your enemies? So did Jesus teach Buddhism? Some of Jesus' teachings are the same as Buddha's that does not make Jesus a Buddhist: as many of Jesus' teachings are against the teachings of Buddhism; in the same way many of Jesus teachings are against the old covenant BUT NOT ALL, it still doesn't make Jesus' teachings any less a totally new covenant. A covenant is a contract and contracts may have similarities but it is the differences that make them unique. Jesus didn't teach against all of the old covenant, but he definitely did teach against some of it.

The blood is not the covenant, it is a seal that ratifies the document, just like a signature does today in the use of contracts, but the covenant is in the teachings of Jesus.

Jesus was born under law, I believe we're under law until we know the truth, that comes by studying the bible.
Galatians chapter 4
4 What I am saying is that as long as an heir is underage, he is no different from a slave, although he owns the whole estate. 2 The heir is subject to guardians and trustees until the time set by his father. 3 So also, when we were underage, we were in slavery under the elemental spiritual forces[a] of the world. 4 But when the set time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, 5 to redeem those under the law, that we might receive adoption to sonship.[b] 6 Because you are his sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, “Abba,[c] Father.” 7 So you are no longer a slave, but God’s child; and since you are his child, God has made you also an heir.

 

[Bob S]

Jesus did not teach the old covenant:

Hmmm! Are you just trying to be obstinate?

The blood is not the covenant,

Who has said it is?