Testing Spirits

[Minister Monardo]

"No one can say that Yahshua is Master, except by the Ruach Ha'Kodesh."

First WHO He is, then what He does.
John 3:7. Do not marvel that I said to you, You must be born again.
The modern evangelical message puts the cart before the horse so to speak. Preaching that if the sinner accepts Jesus as their Lord, they are saved. However, they must be born again from above to truly make that profession, and commit themselves to serve Him "with their spirit" as their Master, not just repeat a dictated "sinner's prayer".
Romans 1:9. For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of His Son,
that without ceasing I make mention of you always in my prayers.
The Holy Spirit must convict the heart of the sinner. This only occurs when WHO
Yeshua is has been preached.
John 16:8, 9. And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: of sin, because they do not believe in Me.
John 3:16. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever
believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
John 20:31. But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Messiah,
the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.
Hence, my essay under "controversial" theology(??) 'Preach the Son of God'.
So, here it is, more meat and potatoes:
1 John 5:
1 Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and
everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him.
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not
burdensome.
4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.
5 Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?

If I know every Law and keep every observance but have not the love of Christ in my heart,
I am nothing. This is the only confidence to stand in that day.
1 John 4:17. Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness
in the day of judgment.
You like to quote here:
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments
are not burdensome.
Verse 2 is also very supportive of your positions. I would insist on including this:
John 15:12. This is My commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you.
Now I will prove that Yeshua was "magnifying the Law, and making it honorable" [Isaiah 42:21.]
when He was teaching here.
This occurs after the resurrection and before the ascension.
Luke 24:45. Then opened He their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures.
Clearly, the message of the New Testament is that no one can rightly comprehend, much less fulfill the Law, without the Holy Spirit. What happened just prior to the ascension?
John 20:22. And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them,
Receive the Holy Spirit.
They could not begin their public ministry until after Pentecost, but they were able to comprehend the scriptures after the resurrection, with just a breath! Hence, "his commandments are not burdensome."
Without the Holy Spirit, The Law became a burden, because they did not have the Love of God in their heart, or a Love for the Truth. The obvious exception: King David, the Lord's Anointed! Only few others.
There is much to be agreed upon. I am very thorough and specific.
I walk at in liberty, because I Love His precepts.
Psalm 119:45. And I will walk at liberty: for I seek thy precepts.

 

[HARK!]

No, the text says that she had a spirit of divination. She would not have been considered demon possessed, on the contrary, she would have been wrongly believed to speak for God. 'divine-ation'.
Which is why she was a source of income for a masters, being sought out. Not to disagree, she had an unclean spirit, but speaking to how she was perceived by others.

Here is what a literal translation says on the subject:

(CLV) Ac 16:16
Now it occurred, at our going to prayer, a certain maid, having a python spirit, meets us, who afforded a vast income to her masters, divining.

 

[Minister Monardo]

If so, do you believe that someone could lie, and say that Yahshua rules their life; while in fact they are serving another master?

They can and they do, because they are deceived by a false Gospel.
Keyword here: Abide [G3306] meno. the centerpiece of John's teaching, especially Gospel chapter 15, also used 18X in First John. The question that hangs over the believer, are you crucified with Christ?Have you put to death the flesh? There seems to be an easier way, that leads to spiritual death,
to a withered branch.

 

[Minister Monardo]

Here is what a literal translation says on the subject:

(CLV) Ac 16:16
Now it occurred, at our going to prayer, a certain maid, having a python spirit, meets us, who afforded a vast income to her masters, divining.

I remember a short booklet years ago called the python spirit. A lot of modern day prophets claim to be able "to give us a word". Sounds a lot like divination. Or maybe the Jungle Book...'trust in me'...

 

[HARK!]

I have often wondered if that omission was deliberate, because God used it once to test His people to see if they are obedient or not.

“God said to Moses: ‘See here, I will rain down for them food from heaven, and the people will go out and collect a daily portion every day. Thus I will test them, whether they will follow My law or not'” (Exodus 16:5).

God knowing beginning to the end, knowing that while the world gave nods of acknowledgement of the wisdom of the other nine in one form or fashion, there is a rebellion on one that is so pervasive that its replacement is implemented without a command from God directing people regarding this foundational change to God's kingdom. Amazing it is accepted as gospel and God's directive is brushed aside as not applicable. Yet Revelation clearly, with a loud commanding voice cries out and directs the listeners, to the pointed reason of application still being valid.

Revelation 14:7
Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Even more incredible is the statement that it is a key issue in the courts of Heaven.

What omission would that be? If it is the first portion of the Decalogue; it would seem so.

The second portion concerns loving your associate. Yahshua closed that portion of his statement with those very words, the second greatest commandment.

The man said that he was obedient in that way. I believe that Yahshua knew that he was obedient in that way; and Yahshua didn't correct him on his testimony.

Yahshua skipped over the first portion of the Decalogue, which is all about loving YHWH; and he didn't mention the foremost precept, to love YHWH with everything you have.

Then Yahshua tells him to sell his possessions and follow him. I think that this would have been an expression of coming out of the world, and trusting in YHWH.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

So you're saying that we use our instincts to test a, would be, deceptive spirit; but when our instincts might fail us; we rely on a spirit to free us of the deception of our instincts?

This seems like circular reasoning to me.

I hope one day it will become more clear for you.
Be blessed

 

[Minister Monardo]

I hope one day it will become more clear for you.
Be blessed

Hebrews 5:14. But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

 

[DamianWarS]

So this is about "testing the spirits"?

Yes, keep reading the post you commented on

 

[HARK!]

Jews are part of Israel!

(CLV) 2Ki 17:18
So Yahweh showed Himself exceedingly angered with Israel and put them away, out of His presence. None remained but the tribe of Judah by itself alone.

They are descendants. of the twelve sons of Jacob. and as Hebrews is quoting from Jer. 31 which prophesied the New Covenant

(CLV) Ro 9:6
Now it is not such as that the word of God has lapsed, for not all those out of Israel, these are Israel;

(CLV) Ro 9:7
neither that Abraham's seed are all children, but "In Isaac shall your seed be called."

(CLV) Ro 9:8
That is, that the children of the flesh, not these are the children of God, but the children of the promise is He reckoning for the seed.

(CLV) Jn 8:39
They answered and say to Him, "Our father is Abraham." Jesus answered them, "If you are children of Abraham, did you ever do the works of Abraham?

That question sounds legaistic.

Covenant let us look:

Let's do that!

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

Hmmm.. two houses I wonder where he gets that.

Maybe he recognized that Israel had long been carried off into captivity when he wrote this.

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

No mention of Judah here, just Israel. The same is repeated in Hebrews. It's almost like YHWH wants us all to be one, like he intended with his people from the beginning.

Jesus did not recognize the division of Israel into Israel and Judah! Israel is all 12 tribes.

Please expand on this. What verse are you quoting?

Is it this one?


(CLV) Mt 15:24
Now He, [Yahshua] answering, said, "I was not commissioned except for the lost sheep of the house of Israel."

No Jew; no Pagan Greek, goyim, gentiles, of the nations; just Israel, one with YHWH in Yahshua.

 

[HARK!]

Well then you are unpleasing to teh God of Israel, for He does not accept our good works as a basis for our righteousness!

(CLV) Mt 5:20
For I am saying to you that, if ever your righteousness should not be superabounding more than that of the scribes and Pharisees, by no means may you be entering into the kingdom of the heavens.

What is righteousness?

Definition of righteous

1 : acting in accord with divine or moral law : free from guilt or sin
Definition of RIGHTEOUS


1 John 3:7
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

(CLV) Gn 15:6
Now Abram believed on Elohim, and He reckoned it to him for righteousness

(CLV) Gn 26:5
inasmuch as your father Abraham hearkened to My voice and kept My charge, My instructions, My statutes and My laws.

(CLV) Ja 2:22
You are observing that faith worked together with his works, and by works was faith perfected.

(CLV) Ja 2:23
And fulfilled was the scripture which is saying, Now "Abraham believes God, and it is reckoned to him for righteousness," and he was called "the friend of God."

(CLV) Ja 2:24
You see that by works a man is being justified, and not by faith only.

 

[Zao is life]

This verse doesn't say that the law and the prophets are demolished by these two laws.

If it did; Yahshua would have contradicted himself.


"You should not infer that I came to demolish the law or the prophets. I came not to demolish, but to fulfill.

By the way, both of those laws come straight from the Torah.



(CLV) Mt 22:36
"Teacher, what is the great precept in the law?"

(CLV) Mt 22:37
Now He averred to him, "You shall be loving the Lord your God with your whole heart, and with your whole soul, and with your whole comprehension.

(CLV) Mt 22:38
This is the great and foremost precept.

(CLV) Mt 22:39
Yet the second is like it: `You shall be loving your associate as yourself.'

(CLV) Mt 22:40
On these two precepts is hanging the whole law and the prophets."

(CLV) Dt 6:5
So you will love YHWH your Elohim with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your intensity.

(CLV) Lv 19:18
You shall not avenge nor shall you be resentful against the sons of your people. You will love your associate as yourself: I am YHWH.

You shall write these words on you heart and put them in your mind (Deuteronomy 11:18-20)

I will put My law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; (Jeremiah 31:33).

The difference between the Law given through Moses and the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus lies firstly in who does the writing of God's Law upon the heart.

If you have died, you have died to the law given through Moses. Those in Christ have died with Christ. Now they live with Christ. It's a new creation, all things have become new. The New Covenant in Christ is not according to that first covenant.

But the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. Romans 8:2

But now we having been set free from the Law, having died to that in which we were held, so that we serve in newness of spirit and not in oldness of the letter. (Romans 7:6).

It's a new creation. If you're hanging onto the Torah given through Moses, you are hanging onto the old earth. You want Egypt, not the promised land:

Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Hagar. For this Hagar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all. Galatians 4:24-26

 

[visionary]

You shall write these words on you heart and put them in your mind (Deuteronomy 11:18-20)

I will put My law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; (Jeremiah 31:33).

The difference between the Law given through Moses and the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus lies firstly in who does the writing of God's Law upon the heart.

If you have died, you have died to the law given through Moses. Those in Christ have died with Christ. Now they live with Christ. It's a new creation, all things have become new. The New Covenant in Christ is not according to that first covenant.

But the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. Romans 8:2

But now we having been set free from the Law, having died to that in which we were held, so that we serve in newness of spirit and not in oldness of the letter. (Romans 7:6).

It's a new creation. If you're hanging onto the Torah given through Moses, you are hanging onto the old earth. You want Egypt, not the promised land:

Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Hagar. For this Hagar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all. Galatians 4:24-26

Ever have the Word of God lift off the page as you were studying and take on new meaning, that is the newness of spirit.

 

[Scott Husted]

Then Yahshua tells him to sell his possessions and follow him. I think that this would have been an expression of coming out of the world, and trusting in YHWH.

I see it as bringing him to a desolation of soul, a denying of himself, or there would be no picking up of a cross to follow Him.

They were words that brought him to an intended place in himself.

 

[visionary]

I see it as bringing him to a desolation of soul, a denying of himself, or there would be no picking up of a cross to follow Him.

They were words that brought him to an intended place in himself.

Truly understanding that all those "prized possessions" are but rags to the Lord of Lords. Opening up the eyes so that he saw, that which he thought lifted him up was taking him down in reality.

 

[Scott Husted]

Truly understanding that all those "prized possessions" are but rags to the Lord of Lords. Opening up the eyes so that he saw, that which he thought lifted him up was taking him down in reality.

His disposition after those words He spoke to him was exactly where He wanted him to be ...

To know filthy rags is reflective of the desolation of soul ...

 

[visionary]

His disposition after those words He spoke to him was exactly where He wanted him to be ...

To know filthy rags is reflective of the desolation of soul ...

Yep, and from there God can work with him if he is but willing. Riches have been a major block for many a lost soul from being with God.

 

[Zao is life]

I eat bacon cuz I'm not under the law

I eat bacon because it tastes nice.

Also because in Christ we all died to the dietary laws given through Moses, and in Christ all things are made new, there is a new creation.

 

[BobRyan]

can I request that we stay at circumcision as it is a valid point to the OP and unspecific question at hand.

So this is about "testing the spirits"?

Yes, keep reading the post you commented on

did that

so can I request that we stay at circumcision as it is a valid point to the OP and unspecific question at hand. If you want it more specific we may discuss the hypothetical of a spirit saying "don't physically cut off the foreskin of your child" and now how can this be tested?

1. Deuteronomy 10:16
   So circumcise your heart, and stiffen your neck no longer.
   
2. Deuteronomy 30:6
   “Moreover the Lord your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your descendants, to love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, so that you may live.
   
3. Jeremiah 4:4
   “Circumcise yourselves to the Lord And remove the foreskins of your heart, Men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem, Or else My wrath will go forth like fire And burn with none to quench it, Because of the evil of your deeds.”

there is no "instead of " for Israel to whom it was given.

Are you asking how we "test the spirit" speaking to Moses or Jeremiah???

OR are you asking "how" we can know via sola-scriptura "testing the spirits" that Paul is correct in Romans 2 when comparing his writing to the scriptures known in his day?

Rom 2
25 For indeed circumcision is of value if you practice the Law; but if you are a transgressor of the Law, your circumcision has become uncircumcision. 26 So if the uncircumcised man keeps the requirements of the Law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision? 27 And he who is physically uncircumcised, if he keeps the Law, will he not judge you who though having the letter of the Law and circumcision are a transgressor of the Law? 28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh. 29 But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.


How do you view your question to relate to the topic of this thread??

 

[HARK!]

Romans 10:4
For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Here is what a literal translation says on the subject:

(CLV) Ro 10:4
For Christ is the consummation of law for righteousness to everyone who is believing.

(CLV) Ro 10:5
For Moses is writing of the righteousness which is of law, that a man who does the same shall be living in it.

Well this takes on a different meaning when viewed in context; doesn't it?

From the same letter:

(CLV) Ro 3:31
Are we, then, nullifying law through faith? May it not be coming to that! Nay, we are sustaining law.

Surely Paul wasn't a schizophrenic, contradicting himself.

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of the law to fall.

Surely Paul wasn't a heretic, contradicting Messiah.

Context is key my friend. Context is key!

 

[HARK!]

We are speaking of teh distinctions between physical Israel which is comprised of all children of Abraham I saac and Jacob (the children of promise to Abraham) and spiritual Israel which Paul called the Israel of God! These are the righteous Israelis of all generations!

When the mixed multitude entered covenant at Sinai; did they become part of Israel?