Space suits... the "nail" in the coffin?

Halbhh

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Really? That's your evidence?

So, if you lived on an Island and looked across the water to the dry land and saw that all the hills had cows on them... and you had cows.... then, the world only has cows?

If God created all things, which I fully believe that He did.... can you state with 100%, bet your life on it, that the earth is a ball because God made all the planets as spheres?

If you are going to convince me of a ball earth... that will not work. There is too much room for error.. I would certainly not bet my life on that one.

By 'bet my life' do you mean your eternal Life you can have if you have faith in Christ Jesus and follow Him?

Life of that kind is given you only if if you have faith in Jesus as your Savior, the very son of God, who came and died for your sins, that you might be forgiven, and who rose again!, Hallelujah!, and will come again, and who will judge all mankind. Prepare and hold fast to His words in the gospels (and read and listen to His words in the gospels), and follow what He says, and you can have total confidence, just as He Himself said.
 
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JacksBratt

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Hi jacksbratt,

I tend to want to see evidence when such preposterous claims are made. As another poster has said, the U.S. is not the only nation that claims to have sent people into space with a space suit on. Are we to believe then that this is some worldwide conspiracy to fool the public? Seems like an awfully lot of money wasted and then one would have to ask, for what purpose? Is there something that someone or some organization is gaining by getting the people of the world to believe that we've gone into space...but we haven't?

Yes, I full well believe that this is a world wide conspiracy... that we have went to the moon, or space.

This is a phenomenal amount of money taken from the US in taxes.....What proof do you have that it is all spent on the hoax. I fully believe that they do spend a lot of money on the mask but much of it is going to other projects without public knowledge.

They have to perpetuate the hoax. I believe that when they went to Antarctica for Operation High Jump and Operation Deep Freeze.. they found out something about this planet and they are hiding it from us.

Is it the Flat earth... jury is still out on that one.. but... they found something and the space race and space program is a deterrent... IMO.


I think what the guy posting the video may not understand is how space suits are made. It is true that if you fill a balloon with air and carry it out of our atmosphere into the vacuum of space, that the balloon will burst. But the balloon structure has nothing built within it to keep it from continually stretching out from the pressure of the air inside. If you take that same balloon and make it out of a rubber coated fabric, then the balloon will not burst until the pressure exceeds the strength of the fabric. There are a lot of fabrics that can withstand considerable air pressure.

I think what he is asking is to prove it. Prove that the suits work in a vacuum. It should not be that hard. I don't think he is saying that they will burst.. He is just saying that they would not work, be functional, keep them cool, keep them from cooking, and not look like sumo wrestler suits...

Similarly, if you make a space suit with 'belts' as a part of the structure, just as we do with tires, then the suit will maintain it's shape pretty well even though the air pressure inside of it is pushing out against the vacuum of space. A tire is a perfect example. If all a tire was composed of is some formed piece of rubber, well, when you put 45psi of pressure in that tire the rubber will stretch, but if you make that tire with cord in the sidewall, then the tire will not stretch when inflated. And 45 psi is just the safe running pressure for tires. You can actually put about 200 psi of pressure in a tire before it will actually blow. All that time the tire will not distend its shape much. The pressure will merely continue to build against the cord strength of the reinforced rubber until the cords rupture and the tire blows.

Trust me, a space suit doesn't have to hold in 200 psi. So, if the people who make space suits incorporate a body shape of rubberized fabric with cord reinforcement, then when the pressure outside the suit is less than the pressure inside the suit, the suit will not blow until that pressure greatly exceeds normal air pressure. Reinforced rubber has been around a lot longer than 1960. So, while the space suits of today look a lot sleeker and more modern and do a lot more things than the suit of the 60's, the basic internal structure of the suit is likely a lot the same.

I'm quite confident that when scientists first conceived of the idea of a space suit, they knew that they had to plan for the internal pressure needing to be restricted in some way. Its not like they didn't have weather balloons until 1960 and hadn't seen what happens to them as they get further out of the atmosphere.

So, for me, the basic concept of what this video is trying to uphold is flawed by his own lack of understanding as to how space suits are made. Here, just for laughs, is a short tutorial on how space suits are made. Note that it mentions that a couple of the layers are designed to allow the suit to keep its shape in changing pressure situations.

Again, I don't think the suit would need to burst to prove his point.
 
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USincognito

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They have to perpetuate the hoax. I believe that when they went to Antarctica for Operation High Jump and Operation Deep Freeze.. they found out something about this planet and they are hiding it from us.

Who is "they" and why are they hiding it from "us"?
 
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JacksBratt

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That simply isn't true, most globe earth evidence comes from a vast number of other sources going back about 2300 years. NASA evidence is merely the icing on the cake.

The "evidence" from the last 2300 years is also used as "evidence" by FE'ers.

Most of the visual and foundational base data for most people... is NASA.



That is a dramatic claim for which there is zero evidence. Zero evidence seems quite typical of your posts.

Well, it's easy for them to prove... simple.
 
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JacksBratt

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By 'bet my life' do you mean your eternal Life you can have if you have faith in Christ Jesus and follow Him?

Life of that kind is given you only if if you have faith in Jesus as your Savior, the very son of God, who came and died for your sins, that you might be forgiven, and who rose again!, Hallelujah!, and will come again, and who will judge all mankind. Prepare and hold fast to His words in the gospels (and read and listen to His words in the gospels), and follow what He says, and you can have total confidence, just as He Himself said.
Yes, I am a believer in Christ..

You know what I mean when I said what I did.... No need to deflect. How confident are you in that methodology of proof? You know "the planets are spheres therefore we are"?
 
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JacksBratt

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Who is "they" and why are they hiding it from "us"?
They... is the military, the government and NASA, who is controlled by the government.

They are hiding it from you so that they can perpetuate their fake alien invasions and such which are coming in the end times.

I have said before that there are going to be things in the media that numb us to the events of Satan that are to come.

We already have all the super heroes of the "Avengers". One of which is a demi god. We have movies about aliens. Movies about meteors. Movies about invasions from other planets. We have people saying that they have been abducted and have had sex experiments done on them. Fetuses removed and harvested. Eggs and sperm harvested.

All of this aligns with the coming end times.

I just saw a movie.."Beyond Skyline" It has a mass alien abduction (Satan's fake rapture). Harvesting of Brains. Harvesting of babies, DNA alterations, Alien human hybridization.... and... in the end... humans overcome and the bad aliens become friends and allies...

Do you not see what this is doing to us? It is numbing us to the deception that is coming.

Whatever the state of this world... they know something that they are not telling you....

The moon shot... is a total fake... It's a facade....it's a mask... they are hiding the truth.. This is what Satan does.

In the end, Satan will mimic all that Christ did. Satan will create his own beings...Aliens.... He will bring back the hybridization of the days of Noah. He will sell everyone on a pseudo immortality, fake so many things. Even the anti Christ will die and be resurrected, miraculously.
 
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USincognito

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They... is the military, the government and NASA, who is controlled by the government.

They are hiding it from you so that they can perpetuate their fake alien invasions and such which are coming in the end times.

I have said before that there are going to be things in the media that numb us to the events of Satan that are to come.

We already have all the super heroes of the "Avengers". One of which is a demi god. We have movies about aliens. Movies about meteors. Movies about invasions from other planets. We have people saying that they have been abducted and have had sex experiments done on them. Fetuses removed and harvested. Eggs and sperm harvested.

All of this aligns with the coming end times.

I just saw a movie.."Beyond Skyline" It has a mass alien abduction (Satan's fake rapture). Harvesting of Brains. Harvesting of babies, DNA alterations, Alien human hybridization.... and... in the end... humans overcome and the bad aliens become friends and allies...

Do you not see what this is doing to us? It is numbing us to the deception that is coming.

Whatever the state of this world... they know something that they are not telling you....

The moon shot... is a total fake... It's a facade....it's a mask... they are hiding the truth.. This is what Satan does.

In the end, Satan will mimic all that Christ did. Satan will create his own beings...Aliens.... He will bring back the hybridization of the days of Noah. He will sell everyone on a pseudo immortality, fake so many things. Even the anti Christ will die and be resurrected, miraculously.

Um, O.k. :scratch:
 
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Halbhh

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Yes, I am a believer in Christ..

You know what I mean when I said what I did.... No need to deflect. How confident are you in that methodology of proof? You know "the planets are spheres therefore we are"?
See with your own eyes things that are readily observable, as a first step, if you want to learn more of the geometry of Earth in the solar system. Start with what you yourself can see through telescopes.
 
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miamited

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True..

So, if you had a suit and it is under 7 pounds per square inch and you put it in a vacuum.... what would it look like?

The air that was in the suit would expand, under zero pressure and maybe look like this.

View attachment 230052

Hi jack,

Yes, but that would only be if the suit were made out of just a rubber expandable material. You don't get that you can put up to 200 psi in a tire here on the earth, which is way above the psi of sea level atmosphere and that tire will still retain its shape? Sea level air pressure is about 14 lbs./square inch. But because a tire has material cord embedded in the rubber, the cord prevents the tire from expanding. Similarly, if you wrap a man in a space suit that has corded material (here's what the article that I linked to stated about the construction of space suits: There is also a layer of urethane-coated nylon, which is involved in pressurization. Dacron—a type of polyester—is used for a pressure-restraining layer.) then the strength of the cords, just as with the tire, prevents the distention of the suit by the drop in the external pressure.

There are several billion cars rolling on the roads today that dispel the 'fact' that your video is trying to prove. Every one of those tires, except for maybe the tires on the presidential limousine, weigh much less than 7 lbs./ square inch. I worked for Goodyear for a few years and I can personally attest that a tire, and this would include the added weight of the road belts and the tread that aren't necessary in a space suit, only weighs about 50-60 lbs. overall. You can figure what that would be on a square inch basis. All I'm talking about is the sidewall construction of a tire. You can take out the steel bead ring, the steel road belts and all the 9/32's of tread and a material to withstand up to 200 psi of internal pressure pushing out would only weigh a couple of ounces per square inch. You're talking merely the pliable sidewall portion of a tire. A material that any 10 year old could manipulate. Then consider that a space suit doesn't need to withstand an inside force pushing out of 200 psi and you could lighten the load and the thickness of the material considerably. Just a thin shell of some vulcanized material with polyester thread embedded in it. It honestly wouldn't likely weigh more than a few ounces per square foot, let alone square inch.

It's simple science and is proven billions of times every day on our highways.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
 
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miamited

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Hi jack,

Thanks for your response:
I think what he is asking is to prove it. Prove that the suits work in a vacuum. It should not be that hard. I don't think he is saying that they will burst.. He is just saying that they would not work, be functional, keep them cool, keep them from cooking, and not look like sumo wrestler suits...

Modern day space suits have a power pack that provides the air circulation within the suit. In the early days of space travel there was no living outside of the space capsule and so the early suits wouldn't have needed to keep a man cool while traveling in space. The air conditioning of the capsule itself would do that. Further, the heat of the sun isn't that much hotter outside of the earth's atmosphere than it is inside the earth's atmosphere. Things aren't going to just burn up because they're outside of the earth's atmosphere because the heat generated by the sun is suddenly so much hotter. Our atmosphere doesn't actually cool the rays of the sun. What is hot, is when the space vehicle enters the earth's atmosphere and this is not because of the sun, but because of the friction created as the vehicle begins to interact with the molecules of our atmosphere.

Yes, if you stay in the rays of the sun's heat for an extended period of time, just as happens all over the world at the beach, you'll begin to cook. But space suits don't leave a lot of exposed skin to be cooked. The suit itself will begin to get hot just as a piece of material left out in the sun will today, but with inside air circulation and good insulation, the body inside won't feel it much.

Trust me, or don't, space suits work just fine and because of the materials with which they are constructed, they don't expand like a Sumo wrestler's suit. BTW last I checked all Sumo wrestlers wear is a crotch cloth, I have never seen a Sumo wrestler in some sort of suit. What you're likely referring to are those expanded suits that people walk around in that make them look like the Pillsbury dough boy, but you need to understand that those suits are designed and constructed to expand like that. They are built oversized so that when you fill them with air pressure, they expand. You can just as easily design a clothing suit that won't expand under pressure also.

But believe what you will. I would imagine the reason that no one has taken up the challenge that this man has set out is that all the rest of us understand that such a theory is disproven billions of times by automobile tires and if he's not smart enough to figure that out, then that's his problem. All anyone has to say to him is to look at an automobile tire. Rolling along with more pressure inside than outside and they aren't blowing up like balloons. Even if you put 100 psi in an automobile tire it will retain its shape within a couple of centimeters, but the ride will be very hard on your behind. If someone can't see that correlation, then there isn't much use trying to explain to him why a space suit doesn't expand like the Pillsbury dough boy.

You then responded:
Again, I don't think the suit would need to burst to prove his point.

That's right, but automobile tires prove everyday that you can have a greater pressure within a confined space than outside of that confined space and things don't all expand like the Pillsbury dough boy. I used the bursting balloon because that's how most people come to think that a space suit should expand just like a balloon does as it leaves the atmosphere, unless it has corded vulcanized material for its walls.

But look, believe what you will. NASA is doing a fine job with space exploration and I suppose its fortunate that they have wiser engineers that understand these things, it would appear, than you do.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
 
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miamited

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Hi jack,

You asked:
If God created all things, which I fully believe that He did.... can you state with 100%, bet your life on it, that the earth is a ball because God made all the planets as spheres?

Yes, I can state with 100% certainty that the earth is spherical and it has nothing whatsoever to do with other planets. I have sailed on cruise ships and I have flown in airplanes and I've yet to see the edge of the flat earth. I have yet to be in any place upon the earth where the horizon wasn't about the same distance away as it is everywhere else.

If the earth were flat, then there would be someplace that you could stand on the earth and the horizon would only be a few hundred feet ahead of you. There would likely even be a place where you could stand that you could lean over, like on the rim of the Grand Canyon, and see straight down (although it is agreed that 'down' is a relative term here). There are countless evidences, outside of pictures from space and seeing how all the other planets are formed, that show us that the earth is spherical in design. The ever distant horizon is only the greatest of these. There is no place that a man can go on the earth that the horizon is not hundreds of miles out from the place where he is standing.

Tell you what. At midnight tonight, call someone in China and ask them if they can see the sun? If the earth were flat, if the sun is shining in China, then it would be shining at your house too. We have dug holes in the earth about 2 miles deep. How deep is this flat earth? What does the side of the earth that is on the bottom of the flat part where we live, look like?

Or, is it your belief that China doesn't exist either? That's all part of the 'great conspiracy'.

God bless you,
In Christ, ted
 
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For anyone, how to really know with certainty...

By looking for yourself first hand.

I think you may have hit upon the way to resolve this Flerfer scepticism.

If we set up a fund, I’m sure we can gather enough $$ to get NASA to send all the Flerfers up into space to see the oblate sphericalosity of the Erf for themselves.

We could get this going quickly with only half the necessary $$$ if we wait ‘til the Flerfers are up there before worrying about funding the return trip. :rolleyes:
OB
 
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High Fidelity

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This whole flat earth conspiracy nonsense is getting ridiculous. Ask yourself what would be the point in lying? Do you seriously think there's some global conspiracy involving millions of people?

Think astronauts are lying? Think it's an American conspiracy, then explain why astronauts of other nations to visit space also don't claim it's flat.

Think even private companies are lying?

Think every other observable planetary body is spherical but earth is somehow an exception?

Come on. The god you believe in supposedly made us better than this otherwise we may as well be the beasts of the land and he subjects of something else if all we're going to so is squander our intelligence in favour of ignorance and anti-intellectual nonsense like this.
 
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JacksBratt

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See with your own eyes things that are readily observable, as a first step, if you want to learn more of the geometry of Earth in the solar system. Start with what you yourself can see through telescopes.

OK.... What if there is an Island on the lake I grew up on and it is six miles away but I can see the shoreline and watch the waves as they lap up on the shore? I can see people skating on a rink by it's shore, in the winter... all of this if I use binoculars...

If the earth is a globe... or should I say, If the globe is the size that they say that it is... the Island should be behind and hidden by 24 feet of curvature. I should not see the shore. I should not see the people on the rink... even at three miles I should not see someone unless they are taller than six feet and then only the part of them that is over six feet.

It just doesn't add up.

Is that "readily observable" enough for you?

That is what got me questioning this whole thing in the first place.... we......can.......see......too......far.
Everything else can have an argument but you cannot counter this fact.

Since you are the one who thinks that we see with our own eyes...... take this as a challenge.
Curving 8 inches in every mile is mighty fast and you don't have to have a 50 mile span to check it for yourself.
 
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JacksBratt

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Hi jack,

Yes, but that would only be if the suit were made out of just a rubber expandable material. You don't get that you can put up to 200 psi in a tire here on the earth, which is way above the psi of sea level atmosphere and that tire will still retain its shape? Sea level air pressure is about 14 lbs./square inch. But because a tire has material cord embedded in the rubber, the cord prevents the tire from expanding. Similarly, if you wrap a man in a space suit that has corded material (here's what the article that I linked to stated about the construction of space suits: There is also a layer of urethane-coated nylon, which is involved in pressurization. Dacron—a type of polyester—is used for a pressure-restraining layer.) then the strength of the cords, just as with the tire, prevents the distention of the suit by the drop in the external pressure.

There are several billion cars rolling on the roads today that dispel the 'fact' that your video is trying to prove. Every one of those tires, except for maybe the tires on the presidential limousine, weigh much less than 7 lbs./ square inch. I worked for Goodyear for a few years and I can personally attest that a tire, and this would include the added weight of the road belts and the tread that aren't necessary in a space suit, only weighs about 50-60 lbs. overall. You can figure what that would be on a square inch basis. All I'm talking about is the sidewall construction of a tire. You can take out the steel bead ring, the steel road belts and all the 9/32's of tread and a material to withstand up to 200 psi of internal pressure pushing out would only weigh a couple of ounces per square inch. You're talking merely the pliable sidewall portion of a tire. A material that any 10 year old could manipulate. Then consider that a space suit doesn't need to withstand an inside force pushing out of 200 psi and you could lighten the load and the thickness of the material considerably. Just a thin shell of some vulcanized material with polyester thread embedded in it. It honestly wouldn't likely weigh more than a few ounces per square foot, let alone square inch.

It's simple science and is proven billions of times every day on our highways.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
Again, I don't think that the point of this video was to say that the suits would burst, or not. It was to simply say that they have not shown any testing, the presenter wants them to do this. He offered to be a test subject, along with someone else.

He believes that the suits are a fraud, would not work in a vacuum.. not necessarily explode, but, not keep them at the proper temperature and not maintain a shape that would allow them to move around and work. They would probably puff up like a sumo suit.

If the suits cannot work in a vacuum... well, the whole deal comes down like a house of cards... therefore... for want of a nail... understand?
 
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JacksBratt

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Hi jack,

Thanks for your response:


Modern day space suits have a power pack that provides the air circulation within the suit. In the early days of space travel there was no living outside of the space capsule and so the early suits wouldn't have needed to keep a man cool while traveling in space. The air conditioning of the capsule itself would do that. Further, the heat of the sun isn't that much hotter outside of the earth's atmosphere than it is inside the earth's atmosphere. Things aren't going to just burn up because they're outside of the earth's atmosphere because the heat generated by the sun is suddenly so much hotter. Our atmosphere doesn't actually cool the rays of the sun. What is hot, is when the space vehicle enters the earth's atmosphere and this is not because of the sun, but because of the friction created as the vehicle begins to interact with the molecules of our atmosphere.

Yes, if you stay in the rays of the sun's heat for an extended period of time, just as happens all over the world at the beach, you'll begin to cook. But space suits don't leave a lot of exposed skin to be cooked. The suit itself will begin to get hot just as a piece of material left out in the sun will today, but with inside air circulation and good insulation, the body inside won't feel it much.

Trust me, or don't, space suits work just fine and because of the materials with which they are constructed, they don't expand like a Sumo wrestler's suit. BTW last I checked all Sumo wrestlers wear is a crotch cloth, I have never seen a Sumo wrestler in some sort of suit. What you're likely referring to are those expanded suits that people walk around in that make them look like the Pillsbury dough boy, but you need to understand that those suits are designed and constructed to expand like that. They are built oversized so that when you fill them with air pressure, they expand. You can just as easily design a clothing suit that won't expand under pressure also.

But believe what you will. I would imagine the reason that no one has taken up the challenge that this man has set out is that all the rest of us understand that such a theory is disproven billions of times by automobile tires and if he's not smart enough to figure that out, then that's his problem. All anyone has to say to him is to look at an automobile tire. Rolling along with more pressure inside than outside and they aren't blowing up like balloons. Even if you put 100 psi in an automobile tire it will retain its shape within a couple of centimeters, but the ride will be very hard on your behind. If someone can't see that correlation, then there isn't much use trying to explain to him why a space suit doesn't expand like the Pillsbury dough boy.

You then responded:


That's right, but automobile tires prove everyday that you can have a greater pressure within a confined space than outside of that confined space and things don't all expand like the Pillsbury dough boy. I used the bursting balloon because that's how most people come to think that a space suit should expand just like a balloon does as it leaves the atmosphere, unless it has corded vulcanized material for its walls.

But look, believe what you will. NASA is doing a fine job with space exploration and I suppose its fortunate that they have wiser engineers that understand these things, it would appear, than you do.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
OK, one question in resoponse to the first part. I only have a bit of time tonight, sorry.

So. My A/C unit takes the heat out of the air and then a fan blows through coils to radiate that heat outside. Likewise, a car radiator brings hot fluid from the cars engine out to cooling fins. Here, air flow carries the heat away and cools the fluid so it can go back into the water jacket around the engine to pick up more heat....

Simple concept... with an atmosphere....

Now, remove that atmosphere and there is absolutely nothing to radiate the heat away from the space suit. In space there is no atmosphere. It is a vacuum. There is no medium, like on earth where we have nitrogen and oxygen and water vapor in the air to pick up the heat and carry it away.. not in space..... none....nada.... ergo.... they would cook.
 
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JacksBratt

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Hi jack,

You asked:


Yes, I can state with 100% certainty that the earth is spherical and it has nothing whatsoever to do with other planets. I have sailed on cruise ships and I have flown in airplanes and I've yet to see the edge of the flat earth. I have yet to be in any place upon the earth where the horizon wasn't about the same distance away as it is everywhere else.

If the earth were flat, then there would be someplace that you could stand on the earth and the horizon would only be a few hundred feet ahead of you. There would likely even be a place where you could stand that you could lean over, like on the rim of the Grand Canyon, and see straight down (although it is agreed that 'down' is a relative term here). There are countless evidences, outside of pictures from space and seeing how all the other planets are formed, that show us that the earth is spherical in design. The ever distant horizon is only the greatest of these. There is no place that a man can go on the earth that the horizon is not hundreds of miles out from the place where he is standing.

Tell you what. At midnight tonight, call someone in China and ask them if they can see the sun? If the earth were flat, if the sun is shining in China, then it would be shining at your house too. We have dug holes in the earth about 2 miles deep. How deep is this flat earth? What does the side of the earth that is on the bottom of the flat part where we live, look like?

Or, is it your belief that China doesn't exist either? That's all part of the 'great conspiracy'.

God bless you,
In Christ, ted
I understand... but you would not see the edge unless, according to the FE model, you flew to the far south of Antarctica and kept going.

Also, you should look into their view of why the horizon is always at eye level... quite interesting.

As for your other comments... I understand. I had these same questions until I researched their view and found them to be only the tip of the iceberg..

I still have many questions on this topic.. both for FE and globe... Things do not add up.
 
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JacksBratt

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I think you may have hit upon the way to resolve this Flerfer scepticism.

If we set up a fund, I’m sure we can gather enough $$ to get NASA to send all the Flerfers up into space to see the oblate sphericalosity of the Erf for themselves.

We could get this going quickly with only half the necessary $$$ if we wait ‘til the Flerfers are up there before worrying about funding the return trip. :rolleyes:
OB
Does Occam's barber use his own razor?

I think you would have many people. FE and globers ready to take that flight.
 
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