Savior of the World, or Eternal Failure?

nolidad · May 20, 2020

FineLinen said:
I know precisely who will be saved!

It is the identical polus made sinners in Adam1 "made righteous" in the Last Adam, the Lord Isous.

Every last one

Having eyes to see yet you remain blind!

nolidad · May 20, 2020

ClementofA said:
If you think you have evidence to support your views, then i invite you to try to refute the evidence i've posted here:

the finiteness of "eternal life" (aionon zoe) in John?

Immortality is athanasia and all will put on immortality! 1 Cor. 15!

Saint Steven · May 20, 2020

Again, when we read, "That was the true light that lights every man that comes into the world" (Jn. 1:9), our observation says, Not so; every man has not been enlightened; we cannot see that our Lord has lighted more than a few of earth's billions. Even in this comparatively enlightened day, millions of heathen give no evidence of such enlightenment; neither do many now living on our street; neither did the Sodomites, nor multitudes of others in past generations and ages.

We read that Jesus Christ, by the grace of God, tasted death "for every man" (Heb. 2:9). But if He tasted death for the one hundred and sixty billions, and from any cause that sacrifice becomes efficacious to only five billion, was not the redemption comparatively a failure? And in that case, is not the apostle's statement too broad? When again we read, "Behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people" (Lk. 2:10), and looking about us, see that it is only to a "little flock" that it has been good tidings, and not to all people, we would be compelled to wonder whether the angels had not over-stated the goodness and breadth of their message, and overrated the importance of the work to be accomplished by the Christ whom they announced.

Source: The Savior of the World, by J. Preston Eby
Kindgdom Bible Studies Savior of the World Series Part 1

agapelove · May 20, 2020

nolidad said:
Having eyes to see yet you remain blind!

Perhaps you are the one who has been blinded, dear friend. If there is one thing the Devil does not want you to see, it is the magnanimity of the Lord's power to save.

FineLinen · May 21, 2020

agapelove said:
Perhaps you are the one who has been blinded, dear friend. If there is one thing the Devil does not want you to see, it is the magnanimity of the Lord's power to save.

Dear A.L.: There are a great many within the fundy world who cannot see beyond their cramped little world. Good ole Noli must stay where he abides in the cramped space until the glorious day when the scales fall from his eyes by the Christ of ephphatha.

The magnanimity of the power of the Lord is salvation to the all.

Saint Steven · May 21, 2020

Another statement is, "There is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave Himself a ransom for all" (I Tim. 2:5-6). A ransom for ALL? Then why should not all involved have some benefit, from Christ's death? Why should not ALL come to a knowledge of the truth that they may believe? Without the KEY, how dark, how inconsistent these statements appear; but when we find the KEY to God's plan, these texts all declare with one voice, "God is love." This key is found in the latter part of the text last quoted - "Who gave Himself a ransom for all, TO BE TESTIFIED IN DUE TIME." Ah, God has a "due time" for everything! He could have testified it to these in their past lifetime; but since He did not, it proves that their "due time" must be the future. For those who will be of the Church, the body of Christ, the firstfruits of His redemption, the present is the "due time" to hear and receive; and whosoever now has an ear to hear, let him hear and heed, and he will be blessed accordingly. Though Jesus paid our ransom before we were born, it was not our "due time" to hear of it for long years afterward, and only the appreciation of it, quickened by the Holy Spirit, brought responsibility; and this, only to the extent of our ability and appreciation. The same principle applies to all: in God's due time it will be testified to all, and all will then have the glorious opportunity to believe and be blessed by it. The prevailing opinion is that death ends all opportunity; but there is no Scripture which so teaches; and all the above, and many more Scriptures, would be meaningless, or worse, if death ends all hope for the ignorant masses of the world.

Source: The Savior of the World, by J. Preston Eby
Kindgdom Bible Studies Savior of the World Series Part 1

nolidad · May 21, 2020

agapelove said:
Perhaps you are the one who has been blinded, dear friend. If there is one thing the Devil does not want you to see, it is the magnanimity of the Lord's power to save.

Well, as I rest on teh Scripture as written and not reinterpreted , I am solid ground! I know the extreme generosity of the Lord and His power to save! Everyone became savable by the Lords death! But I slao know the limit God placed on salvation- trusting the Lords death and resurrection in ones human lifetime! There are no verses that show repentance after death! If there were, one of you four would have showed them by now! But you gang of four misapply verses, misunderstand verses or cloud clear meaning of words by herwtical scholars to support a biblically unsupportable doctrine.

FineLinen · May 21, 2020

nolidad said:
Well, as I rest on teh Scripture as written and not reinterpreted , I am solid ground! I know the extreme generosity of the Lord and His power to save! Everyone became savable by the Lords death! But I slao know the limit God placed on salvation-

Noli: Your scope is one of potential. God is the Saviour of all mankind: your grasp = God is the potential Saviour of some of mankind.

There is precisely one Scripture using the word "limited."

YOU have limited the Holy One of Israel !

FineLinen · May 21, 2020

Is the love of God temporary?

NO!

Is God’s mercy temporary?

NO!

Will God in His love & mercy save all Israel?

YES!

Will God in His love & mercy save all?

YES!

Is there an expiration date on the love & mercy of the Father?

Are you kidding!

Surely you jest!

FineLinen · May 21, 2020

nolidad said:
Well, as I rest on teh Scripture as written and not reinterpreted , I am solid ground! I know the extreme generosity of the Lord and His power to save! Everyone became savable by the Lords death! But I slao know the limit God placed on salvation- trusting the Lords death and resurrection in ones human lifetime! There are no verses that show repentance after death! If there were, one of you four would have showed them by now! But you gang of four misapply verses, misunderstand verses or cloud clear meaning of words by herwtical scholars to support a biblically unsupportable doctrine.

Whatever a "herwtical" scholar is I will never know.

I do know that the "gang of four" is somewhat larger (on C.F.) your poor math calculation has been able to compute.

I also know the Master of Reconciliation, the Lord Jesus Christ
never adopted the language of His day regarding punishment.

Their language was aidios timοria , endless torment.

His language was aionion kolasin , age-lasting correction.

“αιδιος τιμωρια” and “αιωνιον κολασιν”, although the usual word for “torment” is “βασανισμος”. This word is found five times in the NT, all in the book of Revelation:

Rev. 9:5 And they were not permitted to kill anyone, but to torment for five months; and their torment was like the torment of a scorpion when it stings a man.

Rev. 14:11 “And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”

Rev 18:7 "To the degree that she glorified herself and lived sensuously, to the same degree give her torment and mourning; for she says in her heart, ‘I SIT as A QUEEN AND I AM NOT A WIDOW, and will never see mourning.’

Rev. 18:10 standing at a distance because of the fear of her torment saying, ‘Woe, woe, the great city, Babylon, the strong city! For in one hour your judgment has come.’

Rev. 18:15 "The merchants of these things, who became rich from her, will stand at a distance because of the fear of her torment weeping and mourning…

However, the word “τιμωρια” occurs only once in the NT— in the book of Hebrews:

Heb 10:29 How much severer punishment (τιμωρια) do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has insulted the Spirit of grace?

Saint Steven · May 21, 2020

FineLinen said:
Whatever a "herwtical" scholar is I will never know.

I thought I saw that waskily wabbit around here earlier.

FineLinen · May 21, 2020

Saint Steven said:
I thought I saw that waskily wabbit around here earlier.

Quick, lasso that waskil, do not let him escape. We will not allow him to join the gang of untold. (lol)

Der Alte · May 21, 2020

FineLinen said:
...
Their language was aidios timοria , endless torment.
...

I stand in awe of the amazing scholarship so many folks around here, profess to have. They probably couldn't locate a Hebrew verb or parse a Greek verb if their lives depended on it and don't know a hithpael from a hatpin or an aorist from an apple, but know exactly which words the writers of the NT should or should not have used in any given situation.
I have revealed this truth many times but it appears before blind eyes.
"Kolasis" the word CORRECTLY translated "punishment" in Matthew 25:46 occurs one other time in the NT in one 1 John 4:18

1 Jn 4:18
18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. [κολασιν/kolasin] He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

There is no "correction" fear has torment and is not corrected, not made perfect. But certain groups prefer to listen to would be scholars who tell them what they want to hear.
As many times as I have posted it this truth has never been addressed.

agapelove · May 21, 2020

Der Alte said:
1 Jn 4:18
18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. [κολασιν/kolasin] He that feareth is not made perfect in love.
There is no "correction" fear has torment and is not corrected, not made perfect. But certain groups prefer to listen to would be scholars who tell them what they want to hear.
As many times as I have posted it this truth has never been addressed.

The "truth" you wish to be addressed is in the very same verse.

He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

has not been perfected | τετελείωται (teteleiōtai)
From teleios; to complete, i.e. accomplish, or consummate.

Why would someone who is already perfected need to be corrected?

ClementofA · May 21, 2020

Der Alte said:
I stand in awe of the amazing scholarship so many folks around here, profess to have.

Where did they profess that?

What's your scholarship?

Does scholarship equal knowledge of the truth?

Who had more scholarship, the 12 disciples of Jesus or the Pharisees?

Der Alte said:
They probably couldn't locate a Hebrew verb or parse a Greek verb if their lives depended on it and don't know a hithpael from a hatpin or an aorist from an apple,

Does knowledge re how to do those things equal knowledge of the truth of the Scriptures?

Or simply knowledge which puffeth up:

1 Cor.8:1b We know that "We all possess knowledge." But knowledge puffs up while love builds up.

Lk.24:45 Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures.

Acts 4:13 When they saw the courage of Peter and John and realized that they were unschooled, ordinary men, they were astonished and they took note that these men had been with Jesus.

Der Alte said:
but know exactly which words the writers of the NT should or should not have used in any given situation.

What makes you think you know this? Mind reading of anonymous internet posters?

Der Alte said:
I have revealed this truth many times but it appears before blind eyes.

"Kolasis" the word CORRECTLY translated "punishment" in Matthew 25:46 occurs one other time in the NT in one 1 John 4:18

1 Jn 4:18
18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. [κολασιν/kolasin] He that feareth is not made perfect in love.
There is no "correction" fear has torment and is not corrected, not made perfect. But certain groups prefer to listen to would be scholars who tell them what they want to hear.
As many times as I have posted it this truth has never been addressed.

You say "fear has torment and is not corrected". That makes no sense. Fear is not an intelligent being that may be corrected. Though a person who has fear can be corrected. Even the fear itself can be useful in correcting a person.

Saint Steven · May 22, 2020

Nothing is more evident in the Word of God than the fact that man had his beginning IN GOD. Every son of Adam, born as he is in trespasses and sins, enters into this world shrouded by the darkness of the carnal mind and imprisoned by the power of the carnal nature. But it was not always so! Everything everywhere OUTSIDE OF CHRIST belongs to the realm of death, and because it belongs to the realm of death, it likewise belongs to the realm of darkness. Before ever man touched this dreadful realm the record states: "In the beginning WAS the Word, and the Word WAS with God, and the Word WAS God. In Him WAS life; and the life WAS the light of men" (Jn. 1:1,4). W-A-S! It is a wonderful fact that in Him IS life, and His life IS the light of every man who believes, but, wonder of wonders, in that long ago beginning Christ WAS THEN THE LIFE and His life WAS THEN THE LIGHT OF MEN. It was into this realm OUTSIDE OF CHRIST, the realm of OUTER DARKNESS, that Adam was banished when he partook of that strange tree of the knowledge of good and evil. There he died, as God had warned, and we all died in him. Thus death passed upon all men, for all have sinned. Has mankind not fully proved throughout the centuries that he is in truth the son of Adam? Which of all God's commandments have we not broken, justifying ourselves in having done so even as Adam seemed to do.

Source: The Savior of the World, by J. Preston Eby
Kindgdom Bible Studies Savior of the World Series Part 1

Der Alte · May 22, 2020

agapelove said:
The "truth" you wish to be addressed is in the very same verse.
He that feareth is not made perfect in love.
has not been perfected | τετελείωται (teteleiōtai)
From teleios; to complete, i.e. accomplish, or consummate.
Why would someone who is already perfected need to be corrected?

Is this supposed to be as gotcha post? What is your point? UR-ites, usually with zero knowledge of Greek, claim "kolasis" in Mat 25:46 means NOT "punishment," as in KJV, NIV, ASV etc., but "correction."
I showed from 1 Jn 4:18 that "kolasis" does NOT mean "correction" since in 1 Jn 4:18 the one who has fear has "kolasis" but is not corrected i.e. "not made perfect."

FineLinen · May 22, 2020

agapelove said:
The "truth" you wish to be addressed is in the very same verse.

He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

has not been perfected | τετελείωται (teteleiōtai)
From teleios; to complete, i.e. accomplish, or consummate.

Why would someone who is already perfected need to be corrected?

Dear AgapeLove: There are those trotting around on these links who actually think our Abba does not bring to perfect completion what He has begun as the A & F.

I believe in the One who consummates the all within Himself. That consummation lacks nothing & reaches as far as the curse is found!

"We miss Jesus' point entirely when we use His words as weapons against others." -Brennan Manning-

FineLinen · May 22, 2020

Saint Steven said:
Nothing is more evident in the Word of God than the fact that man had his beginning IN GOD. Every son of Adam, born as he is in trespasses and sins, enters into this world shrouded by the darkness of the carnal mind and imprisoned by the power of the carnal nature. But it was not always so! Everything everywhere OUTSIDE OF CHRIST belongs to the realm of death, and because it belongs to the realm of death, it likewise belongs to the realm of darkness. Before ever man touched this dreadful realm the record states: "In the beginning WAS the Word, and the Word WAS with God, and the Word WAS God. In Him WAS life; and the life WAS the light of men" (Jn. 1:1,4). W-A-S! It is a wonderful fact that in Him IS life, and His life IS the light of every man who believes, but, wonder of wonders, in that long ago beginning Christ WAS THEN THE LIFE and His life WAS THEN THE LIGHT OF MEN. It was into this realm OUTSIDE OF CHRIST, the realm of OUTER DARKNESS, that Adam was banished when he partook of that strange tree of the knowledge of good and evil. There he died, as God had warned, and we all died in him. Thus death passed upon all men, for all have sinned. Has mankind not fully proved throughout the centuries that he is in truth the son of Adam? Which of all God's commandments have we not broken, justifying ourselves in having done so even as Adam seemed to do.

Source: The Savior of the World, by J. Preston Eby
Kingdom Bible Studies Savior of the World Series Part 1

Dear Saint: This man of God articulates the wonderful Father that reaches for every last one of us broken & lost sinners. Thank you for bringing his words of life to us.

com7fy8 · May 22, 2020

God is succeeding, but there are humans who do not see this.

"For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren." (Romans 8:29)

"in this world" God is succeeding in this >

"Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness in the day of judgment; because as He is, so are we in this world." (1 John 4:17)

Right now, He is doing what He is able to do; so it is not wise to put this off and suppose that this will happen after we die.

"For to this end we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe." (1 Timothy 4:10)

Those who do not obey do not get the benefit they could. And they will reap what they have been sowing. They will consciously reap so much more than those little seeds they sowed.

"Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life." (Galatians 6:7-8)

Right now, humans are experiencing "corruption that is in the world through lust" > 1 Peter 1:4. And in this "corruption" there is "torment" in their love-dead stuff >

"There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment. But he who fears has not been made perfect in love." (1 John 4:18)

So, already there is "torment" in those who refuse Jesus. And they can reap so much more, unless they turn from their selfish ways and trust in Jesus.

So, teaching procrastination is not right. Now is the time. God's correction of His children is now . . . while now we are being conformed to the image of Jesus > Hebrews 12:4-14 is clear how now we need to actively seek our Father for His real correction.

Savior of the World, or Eternal Failure?

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This is me about 1 yr. old. when FDR was president

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