Only sinners die as death is the wages for sin, ie, the consequence for choosing to sin. Every sinner sown (planted, not created) into the world (Matt 13:38-39) was put here to be in Adam's death (not his sin) so by one death of Christ covered all elect sinners in Adam.
There is physical death and spiritual death. All men will die physically as a consequence of Adam sinning not because of inheriting Adam's sin. Did Christ die physically because of inheriting Adam's sin?
Yet only those who choose to sin and refuse to repent of those sins will die spiritually. Infants are not capable of sinning, they are not accountable to God's law (Romans 7:8-9) therefore born innocent, safe.
TedT said:
I hear this pov so seldom I probably will not remember it as your theology...please just bear with me if I don't remember.
Original sin is a misnomer for our inherited sin. I agree most vehemently that we inherit no one's sin nor sinfulness or anything from them spiritually:
Ezekiel 18:20 The one who sins is the one who will die. The child will not share the guilt of the parent, nor will the parent share the guilt of the child.
with
Jeremiah 31:30 Instead, everyone will die for their own sin;
...but we do have our own personal original sin that caused our initial separation from GOD (except for the promise of election) that had us to be born into Adam's death.
I agree people are sinners for THEIR OWN PERSONAL SINS and not because they inheirted sin from Adam.
Yet people are not born with personal sins. Sin is not just an idea one is born with but sin is actual transgressions committed, 1 John 3:4. Not until one transgresses God's law can he be a sinner and infants are not able to sin and are not accountable to God's law.
It seems you are trying to make one a sinner BEFORE one even commits a sin, which is not possible. That's like calling a wall painted BEFORE even putting any paint on it. What a person is is determined by what a person does...a person who does righteous is righteous and person who sins is a sinner. And "righteous" and "sinner" are not just labels placed randomly upon people apart from what people do.
TedT said:
Infants die; death proves sin; infants are guilty of their own sinfulness, just not while in the womb - they arrive already sinful.
--all people, including infants, die as a consequence of Adam sinning not because being born with sin.
--the Bible defines sin as transgression of God's law. What sin have infants at conception committed that makes them a sinner? None, for they are not capable of sinning, they have no knowledge or idea of what sin even is and not even accountable to God's law, Romans 7:8-9.
TetT said:
About breaking the law causing one to be a sinner:
Have you ever noticed that the purpose of the law is to instruct sinners, not to create them? Ie, sin comes before the law: 1 Tim 1:9 We realize that law is not enacted for the righteous, but for the lawless and rebellious, etc, etc...
so it is curious why GOD gave Adam and Eve a command with the legal consequence of death to not eat if they were innocent or even righteous, eh?
But infants cannot be instructed. Infants have not developed intellectual ability nor have language skills to be instructed as to what sin is, they have not learned right from wrong (Isaiah 7:14-15) therefore not accountable to God's law and not being able to sin they cannot be sinners. Infants have done no evil (Romans 9:11) therefore not sinners....can't call one a sinner who has committed no sin.
Romans 7:8-9
For without the law sin was dead.
For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
--without law sin is dead, sin is not imputed where there is not law and Paul says he was once without law meaning that as an infant he was without law therefore sin was dead to him, sin was not imputed to him
--yet as Paul intellectually matured leaning right from wrong, he became accountable to God's law THEN sin sprang up in him. He was not born with sin but sin speang up in him later in life.
--Paul says he was spirirtually
alive once (as an infant) but later spiritually
died (became an accountable to God's law knowing right from wrong). If original sin were true, then he would NOT have been spiritually alive once but would have been born spiritually dead and remained spiritually dead until he became a born again Christian.[/quote]