ROCOR vs OCA

[All4Christ]

So my husband and I are enjoying a beautiful vacation, and found a place that we would love to buy. We probably won't do it, but it is tempting. That said, we looked up Orthodox churches and found one about 45 minutes away. It's a ROCOR church. We haven't visited yet, but it'd be the primary option should we move here.

I've heard that ROCOR and the OCA were not in full communion a few years ago. That is no longer the case, correct? Also, I've heard that it is more Traditional. I've heard of cases where some converts were chrismated, but had to be baptized when they became ROCOR. I'm not sure if that was true, or if it is no longer true?

Are any of you ROCOR? Do you know how it differs from the OCA / Greek / Antiochian churches?

Thanks!

 

[gzt]

OCA and ROCOR play nice now, and there would not be any rebaptism of converts or anything. They have some particular practices that reflect some things that might be considered more Traditional whether or not that really expresses The Tradition more, but it can be hard to characterize because there are a few strains of ROCOR. I mean, New England old White Russian ROCOR is a different pedigree than, say, rural southern recent convert priest ROCOR or where-all-the-Russian-immigrants-go ROCOR.

But OCA and ROCOR play nice these days and with the exception that they are on the old calendar, tend to do vigil, prefer archaic translations, and tend toward mandatory confession before communion, not much difference with OCA.

 

[~Anastasia~]

From what I've seen, comparing ROCOR to OCA depends on the OCA parish. I've visited some that seem indistinguishable to me.

As I'm sure you know, ROCOR has the reputation of being generally more conservative, and more likely to require baptism (I have heard too even after being received by Chrismation in another jurisdiction), head coverings, and weekly confession in order to receive the Eucharist, etc. I am not positive about the break in communion - I think I know, but I try to stay out of knowing more than I need to about such things.

I think (from what I've heard) it would be a very good idea to visit the parish and talk to the priest (and meet parishioners) as sentiments seem to vary. That's probably generally good advice anywhere - I find for myself coming from a Greek parish it being especially important as regards a Russian priest. But some are very well-disposed and kind.

Of course, my experience is just that I've visited a lot, and chatted with a number of priests, not anything in depth.

 

[gzt]

The ROCOR returned to the rest of Orthodoxy nearly a decade ago.

 

[Anhelyna]

The Russian Church I occasionally attend is very conservative - service is in Slavonic , there is always a Confession line before Liturgy , dress for women - below knee and heads are covered [ even the wee girls ] .The only singing [ other than the Symbol of Faith and the Our Father ] is done by the Chanters.

Having said all that - they have absolutely no problem with me going to kiss the Cross and receive antidoron at the end of Liturgy - and yes they know I'm UGCC

 

[ArmyMatt]

ROCOR is in full communion with the OCA. Should not be a problem.

 

[~Anastasia~]

The Russian Church I occasionally attend is very conservative - service is in Slavonic , there is always a Confession line before Liturgy , dress for women - below knee and heads are covered [ even the wee girls ] .The only singing [ other than the Symbol of Faith and the Our Father ] is done by the Chanters.

Having said all that - they have absolutely no problem with me going to kiss the Cross and receive antidoron at the end of Liturgy - and yes they know I'm UGCC

A bit OT, but I was surprised to read about rules at a monastery the other day, that they do not allow antidoron even for catechumens - ONLY for baptized Orthodox who did not receive the Eucharist at the Liturgy. I believe this was one of Fr. Ephraim's Greek Orthodox monasteries in the US, iirc.

 

[gzt]

That's a traditional Greek thing - on fact traditional Greek practice would be to fast before antidoron as well, whereas the Russians would say if you're not partaking you may as well eat "for strength" before liturgy.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

OCA? ROCOR? None of the above! Hail the Serbs!!

 

[rusmeister]

I thought from the title that it was going to be a boxing match...

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

ROCOR IMO is more traditional. I actually like going to our local ROCOR church, it just a bit longer drive, that's all.

 

[ArmyMatt]

A bit OT, but I was surprised to read about rules at a monastery the other day, that they do not allow antidoron even for catechumens - ONLY for baptized Orthodox who did not receive the Eucharist at the Liturgy. I believe this was one of Fr. Ephraim's Greek Orthodox monasteries in the US, iirc.

yeah, Elder Ephraim's mission here in the US is solely for the Orthodox, and he often follows the Athonite way of doing things and his teacher, Elder Joseph the hesychast. as another example, catechumens depart at catechumens depart in the Liturgy.

 

[All4Christ]

We need to check out some more details regarding the area, but next time we visit (especially if we pursue the house) we will definitely travel up to the church to check it out. Thanks everyone for the information!

 

[ZaidaBoBaida]

Where are you thinking of moving?

 

[All4Christ]

Where are you thinking of moving?

Up in Maine

 

[gzt]

Well, you can probably get a hint of what's on the plate if you look up the parish's website. If I recall one of the ROCOR places up there is a western rite parish, so that would be something different.

 

[All4Christ]

Well, you can probably get a hint of what's on the plate if you look up the parish's website. If I recall one of the ROCOR places up there is a western rite parish, so that would be something different.

It looks like an Eastern Rite parish. They mentioned the dress requirements, and their schedule has vigils each Saturday, plus at 3:30 before Vespers, they have something called the Rule of Communion and Confession? I'm not sure what that would be. The name of the priest doesn't seem like a Russian name, though I haven't seen him in person to know for sure. They also said vigil is primarily English, but Divine Liturgy is mixed Slavic and English. Do you know what the Rule of Communion and Confession is? I thought it might be confession, but the website says they have confession after vigil, not before.

ETA: I reread it and it says that weekday vigils have Confession after the service. So I'm guessing Rule of Communion and Confession is Confession and Pre-Communion prayers?

 

[gzt]

I've seen a ROCOR parish have the reading of the rule before communion (possibly including the three canons and an akathist) in public. See the Jordanville prayer book. It makes it possible to get it all out of the way. I presume that they do have confessions at that time and the website is a little off.

 

[Jesus4Madrid]

Its all Orthodox! Glory to God!

 

[All4Christ]

I've seen a ROCOR parish have the reading of the rule before communion (possibly including the three canons and an akathist) in public. See the Jordanville prayer book. It makes it possible to get it all out of the way. I presume that they do have confessions at that time and the website is a little off.

I've used the pre-Communion Prayers, including the canon, in the Jordanville prayer book a few times, though I tend to use a different version on a regular basis. I'll pull it out and take a look at it. Thanks!