Revelation 6 through 22 : Discuss

[Berean777]

Jesus tells Israel to Flees Judea when they see the Abomination of Desolation.

What is the abomination that maketh desolate?

If it is something that doesn't concern those who listened to this warning, why did Jesus tell it to them?

Notice the real meaning of this verse ? The Anti-Christ will through insolence and by force/being strong, cause Israel to make a COVENANT/AGREEMENT for One Week,(Seven Years) in the middle of the Seven Years in a Wing of the Temple, this Anti-Christ will place an IDOL of Himself or the False Prophet does, and this will STUN Israel, it will Shock them. They understand now that they have to Flee just as Jesus told them they would have to, I think Israel have turned to the Messiah by this time, because Malachi chapter 4 says God will send Elijah back before the Day of the Lord (Tribulation period) to turn Israel back to God. Now, does this match-up with Rev. chapter 13 ? LETS SEE:

What is in the peace contract or covenant that God regards more important than his only begotten Son's blood covenant? That is if Jesus is declared to be the Prince of Peace, what other peace contract is also entertained by God?

I do not need to provide evidence to what God has revealed unto me, I can't prove God wrong because He is never wrong

How could anyone believe anything in this regard, if God only reveals to some, while others can't verify what those significant others are been shown?

If I know how to use a mobile phone, and my friend didn't know how to, then I would put him in the driving seat to let him discover the functionality of the mobile phone.

How could one test their faith, if all we have to go by is the unverifiable testimony of significant others?

 

[Graham Dull]

Jesus is the High Priest in Revelation 1:12-20.
Revelation 1:20
… the seven stars that you saw in my (Jesus’) right hand…

In 1:20 Jesus is ministering in the sanctuary.

That's right the appearance of the Son of Mam strongly resembles the vestments of the Levitical priesthood. The seven lamps are probably the seven prongs of the Menorah that burned continually in the Holy Place.

I agree, and now Christ is ministering in heaven.

Hebrews 8:1
Now the main point of what we are saying is this: We do have such a high priest, who sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in heaven, 2 and who serves in the sanctuary, the true tabernacle set up by the Lord.

(I know that you already understand this.)

 

[mark kennedy]

I agree, and now Christ is ministering in heaven.

Hebrews 8:1
Now the main point of what we are saying is this: We do have such a high priest, who sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in heaven, 2 and who serves in the sanctuary, the true tabernacle set up by the Lord.

(I know that you already understand this.)

Of course I whole heartedly agree. I think what started us down this road was something in Ezekiel. Does that ring any bells? I'm kind of fuzzy on it myself.

 

[Graham Dull]

Of course I whole heartedly agree. I think what started us down this road was something in Ezekiel. Does that ring any bells? I'm kind of fuzzy on it myself.

Ezekiel, YES.

I used to think that it was principally from the Book of Daniel that Revelation drew it parallels. But that view is too narrow. I am now convinced that it draws from much of the Old Testament: Ezekiel, Exodus, Daniel, Zechariah, and more.

Ezekiel 9:4 says -- Go throughout the city of Jerusalem and put a mark on the foreheads of those…

Ezekiel's passage is relevant in interpreting Revelation 7:3.
.

 

[Revealing Times]

Is the Assyrian a symbol for Satan? Or are you saying an Assyrian from a race called Assyrians?

Who are the Assyrians?

Hello Brother, I will attempt to answer there, I think you are just looking for answers like we all are. I posted this on the Apocalypse thread a short time ago, easier for me to C&P and bring it here. Kind of long, but it makes the full point.

I will be glad to share it brother. I will take this one step at a time (I was referring to who the Anti-Christ is, where hes born etc.) 1. Assyrian, 2. Born in Greece to Turkish Parents. 3. Will be an Atheist.

1. The Assyrian is someone spoken of By Isaiah and Micah in Micah 5:5-6, but I will just use Isaiah chapter 10 and 11, they are really one chapter per se. The Assyrian is mentioned as a tool of Gods hand in the First part of chapter 10:5-6 THEN he is spoken of in a different manner:

Isaiah 10:20 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the remnant of Israel, and such as are escaped of the house of Jacob, shall no more again stay upon him that smote them; but shall stay upon the Lord, the Holy One of Israel, in truth.
21 The remnant shall return, even the remnant of Jacob, unto the mighty God. {{ This is telling us Israel is going to turn back to God after the Assyrian comes against them. }}

22 For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return: the consumption decreed shall overflow with righteousness.23 For the Lord God of hosts shall make a consumption, even determined, in the midst of all the land. {{ God is going to bring Israel back from the dead, make their bones come alive (Ezekiel) they will become Righteous by Jesus' blood. }}

24 Therefore thus saith the Lord God of hosts, O my people that dwellest in Zion, be not afraid of the Assyrian: he shall smite thee with a rod, and shall lift up his staff against thee, after the manner of Egypt. 25 For yet a very little while, and the indignation shall cease, and mine anger in their destruction. {{ Here God is telling Israel, DO NOT FEAR the Assyrian, or the Anti-Christ, he will smite you (Abomination of Desolation/makes Israel Flee) but God then says, but yet a little while and the INDIGNATION WILL CEASE....This is the Indignation Daniel spoke of, it is one of the 70th Week Decrees that must happen, when Israel turns back unto God, His anger at them will CEASE, and He will welcome them back into His family. }}

26 And the Lord of hosts shall stir up a scourge for him according to the slaughter of Midian at the rock of Oreb: and as his rod was upon the sea, so shall he lift it up after the manner of Egypt. 27 And it shall come to pass in that day, that his burden shall be taken away from off thy shoulder, and his yoke from off thy neck, and the yoke shall be destroyed because of the anointing. {{ God will lift the burden of the Assyrian/Anti-Christ off of Israel, he will protect them in the Wilderness. He will break the Yoke. How are we 100 percent sure this is the End Times/Anti-Christ ? Well we have to dip into chapter 11 and see where we are, because these two chapters mesh, there were no chapters until 1611. The Yoke will be broken forever.}}

Isaiah 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: 2 And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord; 3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the Lord: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears: 4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth: with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked. 5 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.

6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them. 7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox. 8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.

{{ As you see, the text about the Assyrian is followed by the Lamb and the Leopard lying next to each other. (In Gods Kingdom) This Anti-Christ will be of Assyrian descent. Old Assyria is in Turkey, many Turks live in Greece, this is where the Bible says the Anti-Christ will be born.}}

 

[Revealing Times]

What are they prophesying/preaching? I mean what would be more important than the message contained in the gospel of Jesus Christ ?

The Two-Witnesses is what you are speaking about, to clarify to others.

Revelation 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. 4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed. 6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

I think the Lambs Wrath is the Seals, the Two-Witnesses bring forth the Trumpet Wrath, the prayers of the Saints are mingled with fire and Cast Down to earth, and then the Trumpets sound. Then you have the Wrath of God Himself/Vial of Gods Wrath.

 

[Revealing Times]

What other covenant would God consider more important than the covenant of his only begotten Son?

All a covenant means is an Agreement between two parties. Only a Covenant between God and man is a Holy Covenant. This is basically an agreement between men/Countries/Leaders. The Fallacy comes from thinking Covenant Auto means Holy Covenant, it doesn't have to be.

This only explains how the Anti-Christ gains an advantage over Israel, and all he world, with fake Security/Peace, he gains their trust then, BOOM...

Can't the King be a religious head of a relgious institution? Does he have to be non religious?

Please explain why the two witnesses need to be two people in time and space? What is so important in their message that the gospel of Jesus Christ has not already provided for our salvation?

Its called deception, they have to explain why millions of people (Christians) died. (We went to Heaven and had to leave our bodies, we die) Then they come up with this False Prophet who can do Great Miracles, and he gets many to believe that he is Holy, and the people who died were bigots who preached against homosexuality, etc. etc. Except look at today's elite. they will not pretend to be like Jesus or Christians but they will say they are Holy and Righteous. They actually think they are RIGHTEOUS....They really think Homosexual Marriage is a great thing, etc. etc. It will be THEIR OWN understanding of Righteousness. The Two-Witnesses are just testifying that God is God and the Anti-Christ/Beast and the False Prophet are lying. Then the will pray down plagues on all who follow the Anti-Christ.

 

[Revealing Times]

What is the abomination that maketh desolate?

If it is something that doesn't concern those who listened to this warning, why did Jesus tell it to them?

On the next question in your post, I posted in the Post you replied to exactly what the Abomination of Desolation is, go back and look at it. IN SHORT: It is an Image standing in the Temple of God that the False Prophet and the Anti-Christ demands everyone to worship. Desolate only means to SHOCK. Abomination means a Filthy, Idolatrous thing.

Jesus knows all, He knew his words would be published word-wide, he was Warning the future Israel/Jews on what to do. In my opinion, Israel will be a Christian Nation by this time, and they will understand Jesus' warning.

How could anyone believe anything in this regard, if God only reveals to some, while others can't verify what those significant others are been shown?

If I know how to use a mobile phone, and my friend didn't know how to, then I would put him in the driving seat to let him discover the functionality of the mobile phone.

How could one test their faith, if all we have to go by is the unverifiable testimony of si

God should never be tested nor tempted. Faith is believing God and learning how to hear the Holy Spirit. God reveals Himself to those who BE STILL and LISTENS. Not to those who are listening to me or the world. You have to understand, what did most of the Prophets do ? What did Jesus do ? They went unto the desert, and separated themselves from men, the clutter is a bad thing.

 

[mark kennedy]

Ezekiel, YES.

I used to think that it was principally from the Book of Daniel that Revelation drew it parallels. But that view is too narrow. I am now convinced that it draws from much of the Old Testament: Ezekiel, Exodus, Daniel, Zechariah, and more.

Ezekiel 9:4 says -- Go throughout the city of Jerusalem and put a mark on the foreheads of those…

Ezekiel's passage is relevant in interpreting Revelation 7:3.
.

I can see the parallels:

Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. (Rev. 7:3)
​

The Revelation does draw from all parts of the Bible, that's why it has been called the grand central station of the Bible. I'm not sure what this seal is exactly but it's used to seal up the abyss when Satan is cast into it and also seals up prophecy in Daniel, in the Revelation those prophecies are not sealed. For some reason what the seven thunders said is sealed but there is no indication why.

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[Berean777]

The Two-Witnesses is what you are speaking about, to clarify to others.

Revelation 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. 4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed. 6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

I think the Lambs Wrath is the Seals, the Two-Witnesses bring forth the Trumpet Wrath, the prayers of the Saints are mingled with fire and Cast Down to earth, and then the Trumpets sound. Then you have the Wrath of God Himself/Vial of Gods Wrath.

So does this have something to do with the message to worship the one true God?

Doesn't the gospel already proclaim this message?

So what extra message could be more important than the one that is already document in the bible?

Or

Are they revealing something in plain sight that no one was able to comprehend until they made the connections?

 

[Berean777]

Hello Brother, I will attempt to answer there, I think you are just looking for answers like we all are. I posted this on the Apocalypse thread a short time ago, easier for me to C&P and bring it here. Kind of long, but it makes the full point.

I will be glad to share it brother. I will take this one step at a time (I was referring to who the Anti-Christ is, where hes born etc.) 1. Assyrian, 2. Born in Greece to Turkish Parents. 3. Will be an Atheist.

1. The Assyrian is someone spoken of By Isaiah and Micah in Micah 5:5-6, but I will just use Isaiah chapter 10 and 11, they are really one chapter per se. The Assyrian is mentioned as a tool of Gods hand in the First part of chapter 10:5-6 THEN he is spoken of in a different manner:

Isaiah 10:20 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the remnant of Israel, and such as are escaped of the house of Jacob, shall no more again stay upon him that smote them; but shall stay upon the Lord, the Holy One of Israel, in truth.
21 The remnant shall return, even the remnant of Jacob, unto the mighty God. {{ This is telling us Israel is going to turn back to God after the Assyrian comes against them. }}

22 For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return: the consumption decreed shall overflow with righteousness.23 For the Lord God of hosts shall make a consumption, even determined, in the midst of all the land. {{ God is going to bring Israel back from the dead, make their bones come alive (Ezekiel) they will become Righteous by Jesus' blood. }}

24 Therefore thus saith the Lord God of hosts, O my people that dwellest in Zion, be not afraid of the Assyrian: he shall smite thee with a rod, and shall lift up his staff against thee, after the manner of Egypt. 25 For yet a very little while, and the indignation shall cease, and mine anger in their destruction. {{ Here God is telling Israel, DO NOT FEAR the Assyrian, or the Anti-Christ, he will smite you (Abomination of Desolation/makes Israel Flee) but God then says, but yet a little while and the INDIGNATION WILL CEASE....This is the Indignation Daniel spoke of, it is one of the 70th Week Decrees that must happen, when Israel turns back unto God, His anger at them will CEASE, and He will welcome them back into His family. }}

26 And the Lord of hosts shall stir up a scourge for him according to the slaughter of Midian at the rock of Oreb: and as his rod was upon the sea, so shall he lift it up after the manner of Egypt. 27 And it shall come to pass in that day, that his burden shall be taken away from off thy shoulder, and his yoke from off thy neck, and the yoke shall be destroyed because of the anointing. {{ God will lift the burden of the Assyrian/Anti-Christ off of Israel, he will protect them in the Wilderness. He will break the Yoke. How are we 100 percent sure this is the End Times/Anti-Christ ? Well we have to dip into chapter 11 and see where we are, because these two chapters mesh, there were no chapters until 1611. The Yoke will be broken forever.}}

Isaiah 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: 2 And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord; 3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the Lord: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears: 4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth: with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked. 5 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.

6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them. 7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox. 8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.

{{ As you see, the text about the Assyrian is followed by the Lamb and the Leopard lying next to each other. (In Gods Kingdom) This Anti-Christ will be of Assyrian descent. Old Assyria is in Turkey, many Turks live in Greece, this is where the Bible says the Anti-Christ will be born.}}

Interesting! Thanks for the versus.

So this Assyrian is not anyone from the race that goes by the name Assyrian today?

Because in the Old Testament the Assyrians were the diets Semitic tribe and when Jews were taken into exile by the Assyrian King sanhareb, many of the Jewish men married Assyrian women.

Are Assyrians Turks, Muslims, Christians.... I remember you said atheists..... Is that possible?

 

[Revealing Times]

So does this have something to do with the message to worship the one true God?

Doesn't the gospel already proclaim this message?

So what extra message could be more important than the one that is already document in the bible?

Or

Are they revealing something in plain sight that no one was able to comprehend until they made the connections?

This is the Great and Terrible Day of the LORD. God was angry in the Days of Noah and wiped out evil, He will do the same here, only after the Church is Raptured to Heaven, to all that take the Mark of the Beast.

Remember when Moses said, "choose ye this day whom ye will serve" God that very day destroyed many a men who choose to stand against Him.

 

[Berean777]

All a covenant means is an Agreement between two parties. Only a Covenant between God and man is a Holy Covenant. This is basically an agreement between men/Countries/Leaders. The Fallacy comes from thinking Covenant Auto means Holy Covenant, it doesn't have to be.

This only explains how the Anti-Christ gains an advantage over Israel, and all he world, with fake Security/Peace, he gains their trust then, BOOM...


Its called deception, they have to explain why millions of people (Christians) died. (We went to Heaven and had to leave our bodies, we die) Then they come up with this False Prophet who can do Great Miracles, and he gets many to believe that he is Holy, and the people who died were bigots who preached against homosexuality, etc. etc. Except look at today's elite. they will not pretend to be like Jesus or Christians but they will say they are Holy and Righteous. They actually think they are RIGHTEOUS....They really think Homosexual Marriage is a great thing, etc. etc. It will be THEIR OWN understanding of Righteousness. The Two-Witnesses are just testifying that God is God and the Anti-Christ/Beast and the False Prophet are lying. Then the will pray down plagues on all who follow the Anti-Christ.

So it will be a time of strong delusion in those who are perishing.

Will there be Christians left around at that time?

 

[Revealing Times]

Interesting! Thanks for the versus.

So this Assyrian is not anyone from the race that goes by the name Assyrian today?

Because in the Old Testament the Assyrians were the diets Semitic tribe and when Jews were taken into exile by the Assyrian King sanhareb, many of the Jewish men married Assyrian women.

Are Assyrians Turks, Muslims, Christians.... I remember you said atheists..... Is that possible?

Old Assyria was in Turkey and a few other countries, but mostly in Turkey and Syria. But him being of Assyrian descent only means he will come from that lineage. So we understand he comes from this Assyrian lineage, we understand from reading Daniel chapters 7 and 8 that the Anti-Christ/Little Horn arises out of Two-Kingdoms at once, this has always been a Mystery, or Secret because God told Daniel it would be bound up until the End Times when Knowledge increased. I think God has showed me where the Anti-Christ is born.

He Arises from the Fourth Beast in Daniel 7, and he is from one of the Four Generals Kingdom (of Alexander), in the Latter Times, he is the man of Fierce Countenance that comes against he Holy People and tries to make war with the Prince of princes (Jesus) Just like in Rev. 19. So this man arises out of Two-Kingdoms, Daniel 8 IS NOT Antiochus who never came against Jesus. But once I understood this I was like HOW GOD !!! ? How can a man arise out of Two Kingdoms ?

Then it hit me, Greece (Macedonia ) is in the European Union.....BOOM. He arises out of a Small peoples(nation). Many Turks live in Greece. In Rev. 13 the Beast that arises out of the Seas main body is "As it were a Leopard".

Daniel 11:37 maybe 36 and 38 also, show he is an Atheist. I have a blog on it, that's easier to follow.
http://mrrondonmon.blogspot.com/2016/03/the-birthplace-of-anti-christ.html

 

[Berean777]

This is the Great and Terrible Day of the LORD. God was angry in the Days of Noah and wiped out evil, He will do the same here, only after the Church is Raptured to Heaven, to all that take the Mark of the Beast.

Remember when Moses said, "choose ye this day whom ye will serve" God that very day destroyed many a men who choose to stand against Him.

So it's a call to side with God instead of man, right?

 

[Revealing Times]

So it will be a time of strong delusion in those who are perishing.

Will there be Christians left around at that time?

I think Satan always deceives. But in essence, many who choose to take the Mark of the Beast. Many love Satan and hate God. Ever notice the hateful people who call God names, say if he exists He is evil, and they would rather live in hell ? Many people will serve the Beast Gladly. There will be Christians who became Christians after the Rapture, but they will be beheaded for their Faith. Israel will be protected by God, probably in Petra.

 

[Revealing Times]

So it's a call to side with God instead of man, right?

Yes, you either chose to take the Mark of the Beast or the Anti-Christ will kill you.

Bur Remember, the Rapture happens and the Church is in Heaven marrying the Lamb (Rev. 19). We do not have to go through this event. The Five Foolish Virgins will not hear or see the Bridegroom when he comes, because their Lamp was not filled with oil. They had no or little Holy Spirit, they were too much of the world so to speak, now they must endure the Tribulation.

 

[Graham Dull]

The Revelation does draw from all parts of the Bible, that's why it has been called the grand central station of the Bible.

Correct. The more I study, the more I realize that Revelation draws both Old and New Testaments together. It shows the fulfillment of OT and NT prophecies.

Besides revealing the final climax of all history, it makes us aware of the important events leading up to the end of time, and how important is is for every person to make the crucial decision relative to salvation -- Are we with Christ or against him?
---------------

HORSEMEN OF THE APOCALYPSE

(Continuing on from #122), another related link to the Old Testament is Revelation 6:1-8, and Zechariah 6:1-8. (I've just now realized for the first time that both these 'chapter and verse references' are identical.)

Comparing these verses makes a lot of difference to the interpretation which may be applied to the 'Four horsemen of the Apocalypse.'

Zechariah 6:2-3 'The first chariot had red horses, the second black, the third white, and the fourth dappled—all of them powerful.'

Revelation 6:2 'I looked, and there before me was a white horse.'

The horses in Zechariah pulled a chariot, whereas those in Revelation carried a rider. Thus, there are obvious differences between the narratives. But, none-the-less, both had four chariots/horses, and the horses were of different colours.

What are we to make of the similarities between these passages? And what should Zechariah 6 teach us about Revelation 6? In Zechariah, who was in control of the horses? In Revelation, who is in control of the horses?
.

 

[Berean777]

I think Satan always deceives. But in essence, many who choose to take the Mark of the Beast. Many love Satan and hate God. Ever notice the hateful people who call God names, say if he exists He is evil, and they would rather live in hell ? Many people will serve the Beast Gladly. There will be Christians who became Christians after the Rapture, but they will be beheaded for their Faith. Israel will be protected by God, probably in Petra.

What is Petra?

 

[Douggg]

Old Assyria was in Turkey and a few other countries, but mostly in Turkey and Syria. But him being of Assyrian descent only means he will come from that lineage.

Revelation 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

The beast currently in the bottomless pit that was, and is not - where is that person from ?

And when does he ascend out of the bottomless pit during the 70th week?

And what does this mean "continue a short space" regarding King 7 ?

10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

___________________________________________________________
The little horn will be King 7 descended from the Roman line of Julio-Claudians - not an Assyrian. He becomes the Anti-Christ, the King of Israel. After the person is killed and brought back to life - he continues the short space as the beast - because the beast - who is associated as being assyrian and tied to the tower of babel - will ascend out of the bottomless pit to possess him.

Where is Assyria? This is the Assyrian captivity at the time of those passages in the Tanach. Where was the tower of Babel?

.