Reconciled to God while enemies !

[oikonomia]

Those in 2 Cor 5:20 being addressed had already been reconciled to God, in fact they were already new creatures in Christ, look at Vs 17

If there were no further need for reconciliation he would not have said -
God entreats you through us; we beseech you on behalf of Christ, Be reconciled to God.

So then if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old things have passed away; behold, they have become new. (v.17)
You are a Christian?
Are all old things passed away out of you?
You hopefully are in the process old things still passing away as you sink more into Christ.

I am still in the process of this wonderful ongoing reconciliation if you are not.

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

Give God the Glory !

We do give Him the glory. Now in chapter three Paul speaks of our ongoing process of being transformed from glory to glory.
Since this is an ongoing process by degrees we are under the second aspect of subjective reconciliation.

And the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
But we all with unveiled face, beholding and reflecting like a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord Spirit. (2 Cor. 3:17,18)

I like many of the Corinthian Christians receive Paul's entreaty gladly "Be reconciled to God."
In the normal church life we are going from glory to glory.
And old things are more and more passing away.

 

[oikonomia]

 

[Brightfame52]

If there were no further need for reconciliation he would not have said -
God entreats you through us; we beseech you on behalf of Christ, Be reconciled to God.

So then if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old things have passed away; behold, they have become new. (v.17)
You are a Christian?
Are all old things passed away out of you?
You hopefully are in the process old things still passing away as you sink more into Christ.

I am still in the process of this wonderful ongoing reconciliation if you are not.

We do give Him the glory. Now in chapter three Paul speaks of our ongoing process of being transformed from glory to glory.
Since this is an ongoing process by degrees we are under the second aspect of subjective reconciliation.

And the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
But we all with unveiled face, beholding and reflecting like a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord Spirit. (2 Cor. 3:17,18)

I like many of the Corinthian Christians receive Paul's entreaty gladly "Be reconciled to God."
In the normal church life we are going from glory to glory.
And old things are more and more passing away.

no there wasnt no futher need of reconciliation, God did a complete , perfect work, why do you doubt it ? 2 Cor 5:18-19

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

See from your view, what God in Christ did wasn't enough to reconcile sinners to Himself, which frankly I see as Blasphemy

 

[oikonomia]

no there wasnt no futher need of reconciliation, God did a complete , perfect work, why do you doubt it ? 2 Cor 5:18-19

Paul did not see it that way. He entreats the saints in Corinth to be reconciled to God.

See from your view, what God in Christ did wasn't enough to reconcile sinners to Himself, which frankly I see as Blasphemy

So it is blasphemy for me to hear the apostles' enreaty.
On behalf of Christ then we are ambassadors,
as God entreats you through us; we beseech you on behalf of Christ, Be reconciled to God. (2 Cor. 5:20)

It is not blasphemy to believe in two steps of reconciliation.
In the next chapter he further entreats the believers in Corinth.

And working together with Him, we also entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain; (6:1)

Was Paul blaspheming for implying that these reconciled Christians could receive the grace of God in vain?

 

[zoidar]

The sin of His elect whom He came to save, all others besides them were created for destruction.

Even if it were to be so, my point stands. Then Jesus won victory over some sin, some evil, on the cross. I on the other hand believe Jesus won victory over the very root of sin, all evil in the whole world, but from your view he only won victory over parts of the evil in the world.

Now judgment is upon this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out.
— John 12:31

 

[Brightfame52]

Paul did not see it that way. He entreats the saints in Corinth to be reconciled to God.

So it is blasphemy for me to hear the apostles' enreaty.
On behalf of Christ then we are ambassadors,
as God entreats you through us; we beseech you on behalf of Christ, Be reconciled to God. (2 Cor. 5:20)

It is not blasphemy to believe in two steps of reconciliation.
In the next chapter he further entreats the believers in Corinth.

And working together with Him, we also entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain; (6:1)

Was Paul blaspheming for implying that these reconciled Christians could receive the grace of God in vain?

Its blasphemy to speculate that what God did in Christ by reconciling them He died for unto Him, didn't do a complete work, but man must put the finishing touches on it to make it complete.

 

[Brightfame52]

Even if it were to be so, my point stands. Then Jesus won victory over some sin, some evil, on the cross. I on the other hand believe Jesus won victory over the very root of sin, all evil in the whole world, but from your view he only won victory over parts of the evil in the world.

Now judgment is upon this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out.
— John 12:31

You entitled to your point.

 

[zoidar]

You entitled to your point.

Yeah, you too of course! God bless!

 

[oikonomia]

Its blasphemy to speculate that what God did in Christ by reconciling them He died for unto Him, didn't do a complete work, but man must put the finishing touches on it to make it complete.

You ignored the simple question. A Yes or No would do.
For God has not given us a spirit of cowardice, but of power and of love and of sobermindedness. (2 Tim. 1:7)

Was Paul blaspheming to imply that reconciled Christians could possibly receive the grace of God in vain?
And working together with Him, we also entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain; (2 Cor. 6:1)

If your answer is Yes then the Apostle Paul was still a blasphemer.
If your answer is No tell us what could he have meant for Christians to receive the grace of God in vain?

 

[Brightfame52]

Reconciled to God apart from conditions performed by the reconciled !

This is a Truth the religion of man cannot receive, its foolishness to the religion of man 1 Cor 2:14

14 But the natural, nonspiritual man does not accept or welcome or admit into his heart the gifts and teachings and revelations of the Spirit of God, for they are folly (meaningless nonsense) to him; and he is incapable of knowing them [of progressively recognizing, understanding, and becoming better acquainted with them] because they are spiritually discerned and estimated and appreciated. AMP

Now how is it we know for sure that God has been reconciled to man, and man to God without man performing any conditions whatsoever ? Simple, Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Tis because they were enemies when this reconciliation was made ! It was made by the Death of Christ, not by any conditions performed by them. 22

 

[oikonomia]

Reconciled to God apart from conditions performed by the reconciled !

This is a Truth the religion of man cannot receive, its foolishness to the religion of man 1 Cor 2:14

14 But the natural, nonspiritual man does not accept or welcome or admit into his heart the gifts and teachings and revelations of the Spirit of God, for they are folly (meaningless nonsense) to him; and he is incapable of knowing them [of progressively recognizing, understanding, and becoming better acquainted with them] because they are spiritually discerned and estimated and appreciated. AMP

Now how is it we know for sure that God has been reconciled to man, and man to God without man performing any conditions whatsoever ? Simple, Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Tis because they were enemies when this reconciliation was made ! It was made by the Death of Christ, not by any conditions performed by them. 22

This is very good and helpful. But you don't want to directly answer my questions.
I am willing to take "I am not sure how to answer at this time" as a legtimate answer.

Was or was not Paul commiting blasphemy when implying the saints in Corinth possibly could receive God's grace in vain?
And working together with Him, we also entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain; (2 Cor. 6:1)

Please choose one:

Yes he was blapheming.
No he was not blaspheming.
Not sure how to answer right now.

 

[oikonomia]

I would like to submit a scripture song for the enjoyment of some.
It is 2 Cor. 5:20,21 about being reconciled to God.

 

[zoidar]

This is very good and helpful. But you don't want to directly answer my questions.
I am willing to take "I am not sure how to answer at this time" as a legtimate answer.

Was or was not Paul commiting blasphemy when implying the saints in Corinth possibly could receive God's grace in vain?
And working together with Him, we also entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain; (2 Cor. 6:1)

Please choose one:

Yes he was blapheming.
No he was not blaspheming.
Not sure how to answer right now.

I never thought about 2 Cor 6:1. Interesting verse, I have to say. Thanks for bringing it to attention!

 

[oikonomia]

I never thought about 2 Cor 6:1. Interesting verse, I have to say. Thanks for bringing it to attention!

Thank the Lord for his rich word.

Second Corinthians is really something of Paul's autobiography. God preserved this letter I feel
to give us a glimpse into his ministry. He is ever forced to write about the ministry of himself and his co-workers.

This passage (2 Cor. 6:1) about him entreating the Corthinthians not to receive the grace of God in vain
echoes Paul's own personal experience. He did not at all receive the grace of God in vain.
He kepts spending it. He kept taking advantage of it. He kept letting it work and operate in him.

Galatians 2:21a - I do not nullify the grace of God;

He allowed the grace the full freedom to operate unhindered to make him what he was.
Again a fuller context -

I am crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but it is Christ who lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live in faith, the faith of the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me.

I do not nullify the grace of God; for if righteousness is through law, then Christ has died for nothing.

Understandably his rich experience of dying and living with Christ prompted him to tell the Christians in Corinth -
And working together with Him, we also entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain; (2 Cor. 6:1)

 

[Brightfame52]

This is very good and helpful. But you don't want to directly answer my questions.
I am willing to take "I am not sure how to answer at this time" as a legtimate answer.

Was or was not Paul commiting blasphemy when implying the saints in Corinth possibly could receive God's grace in vain?
And working together with Him, we also entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain; (2 Cor. 6:1)

Please choose one:

Yes he was blapheming.
No he was not blaspheming.
Not sure how to answer right now.

Nothing to discuss, you have rejected the truth.

 

[oikonomia]

Nothing to discuss, you have rejected the truth.

Oh, don't be ridiculous.

Your own post testifies brother, that the carnal ones among the saints in Corinth needed
further reconciliation. Otherwise there would have been no problem and NO NEED for a letter
dealing with about nine problems there in the church in Corinth.

As for self effort - it is cooperating with the operating God within.
We take, He undertakes.

So then, my beloved, even as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only but now much rather in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
For it is God who operates in you both the willing and the working for His good pleasure. (Phil.2:12,13)

Does your book of Romans end at chapter five?
Look again. After the Justification by Faith ending around chapter five there are still eleven chapters more to go.
Try taking all 16 of them seriously sometime.

 

[oikonomia]

Some dear saints seem to have only part of the book of Romans in their NT.
They have just enough to know they are saved from eternal punishment through the redemption of Christ.

They have only a sense of the sinner's need.
They have little sense that God has a purpose or the God needs.

This is OD-ing on Reform Theology to the point that ANY kind of teaching of COOPERATING with
God's grace after being re-born is a danger sign to them that Christ doesn't do it all.

Paul did not NULLIFY the powerful grace of God assuming that all was done because he was forgiven.
And Paul entreats us that neither do we receive this wonderful grace in vain, remaining immature, unbuilt up, untransformed,
lots of old things not yet having fully passed away.

On behalf of Christ then we are ambassadors, as God entreats you through us; we beseech you on behalf of Christ, Be reconciled to God. (2 Cor. 5:20)

And working together with Him, we also entreat you not to receive the grace of God in vain; (6:1)

Brightframe52, a little more brightness is in order with your ministry.

 

[oikonomia]

Concering Romans 5:10 I appreciate the English renderings which bring out the meaning that we
are saved in the realm and sphere of Christ's resurrection life.

[my emphasis below with caps and colors]

Recovery Version
For if we, being enemies, were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more we will be saved IN His life, having been reconciled,

Berean Literal Bible
having been reconciled, shall we be saved IN His life!

Christian Standard Bible
having been reconciled, will we be saved BY his life.

Literal Standard Version
much more, having been reconciled, we will be saved IN His life.

Berean Standard Bible
how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved THROUGH His life!

Weymouth New Testament
it is still more certain that now that we are reconciled, we shall obtain salvation THROUGH Christ's life.

Young's Literal Translation
much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved IN his life.

 

[John Mullally]

Reconciled to God apart from conditions performed by the reconciled !

This is a Truth the religion of man cannot receive, its foolishness to the religion of man 1 Cor 2:14

14 But the natural, nonspiritual man does not accept or welcome or admit into his heart the gifts and teachings and revelations of the Spirit of God, for they are folly (meaningless nonsense) to him; and he is incapable of knowing them [of progressively recognizing, understanding, and becoming better acquainted with them] because they are spiritually discerned and estimated and appreciated. AMP

What does Paul mean by a “natural man”? Does it mean an unregenerate lost person? Not in this context. In this context, Paul uses that term to refer to immature Corinthian believers, whom he calls “infants in Christ” (1 Corinthians 3:1), and whom he says are not ready for “solid food” but only metaphorical “milk.”

1 Corinthians 3:1 Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly—mere infants in Christ. 2 I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. 3 You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans?​

Now how is it we know for sure that God has been reconciled to man, and man to God without man performing any conditions whatsoever ? Simple, Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Tis because they were enemies when this reconciliation was made ! It was made by the Death of Christ, not by any conditions performed by them. 22

And Paul goes on to say that this reconciliation is to all people.

Romans 5:18 Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.​

​

Since Jesus took upon Himself the “sin of the world,” (John 1:29), His atonement is therefore available to all, though is only applied whenever people place their faith in Him, just like His illustration at John 3:14-15 of Numbers 21:6-9 shows. Before a person looked upon the serpent on a standard, was anyone healed? Before a person believes in Jesus, is anyone saved?

 

[oikonomia]

What does Paul mean by a “natural man”? Does it mean an unregenerate lost person? Not in this context. In this context, Paul uses that term to refer to immature Corinthian believers, whom he calls “infants in Christ” (1 Corinthians 3:1), and whom he says are not ready for “solid food” but only metaphorical “milk.”

I like this post. And if you feel moved pray for me. You see Brightframe52 says I have rejected truth. I have also blasphemed
according to Brightframe52.

But I love this post because it points out I think that the immature carnal ones Paul was trying to HELP needed
shepherding, perfecting, healthy teaching and therefore the ministry of reconcilation.

They needed to grow in grace for further reconciliation. They had been reconciled in the sense
of eternal redemption of course already.

1 Corinthians 3:1 Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly—mere infants in Christ. 2 I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. 3 You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans?​

And Paul goes on to say that this reconciliation is to all people.

Romans 5:18 Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.​

​

Since Jesus took upon Himself the “sin of the world,” (John 1:29), His atonement is therefore available to all, though is only applied whenever people place their faith in Him, just like His illustration at John 3:14-15 of Numbers 21:6-9 shows. Before a person looked upon the serpent on a standard, was anyone healed? Before a person believes in Jesus, is anyone saved?

Here I might submit that I consider reconciliation a matter of taking away the enmity between parties.
I have learned to think of Justification more in legal terms.

I mean a Judge may justify one who is otherwise guilty.
But the two still are not that close as friends.

Reconciliation takes away the enmity, the unfriendliness, the adverse relationship.
Probably some overlap is true.
But I think of Redemption and Justification more along the legal aspect.
And Reconcliation more along removing the barrier of advarsarial enmity between us and God.

Of course He ever loved us. We did not love Him.

Much more then, having now been justified in His blood, we will be saved through Him from the wrath.
For if we, being enemies, were reconciled to God through the death of His Son,
much more we will be saved in His life, having been reconciled, (Rom. 5:9,10 Recovery Version)

I sing about this. Join in making a joyful noise.