Questions About Heaven and Hell

[Sammy-San]

I believe Satan hates US - because we are created in the image of God, and the faithful are destined to grow into His likeness as we were also created to bear. We will never be God, but we are to become like Him, and He loves us. Satan is jealous of that. He thought to make himself "like God" and because his efforts were a perversion of what is good, he made himself into something that is as close to the opposite of God as he can become. His jealousy is for us, what we are to become, and God's high esteem of us. I doubt he actually wants our salvation, per se, because that depends on God Himself, and he wants to be self-made, not dependent upon God.

Satan did not create hell. He does not rule it. If there is a physical place (not an actual necessity, because Satan and his demons do not have physical bodies) - but whatever the "Lake of fire" is, it was created by God. And it is not a kingdom for Satan to rule, but an agony he will experience.

Too many of our ideas come from Dante's Inferno and we take them too literally, sometimes, I think.

Satan's desire is to kill, to steal, to destroy, and with as much torment as he can build into it. He hates us. That's really all we need to know. The rest is irrelevant, really. Where Satan came from, what has happened to make him as he is, what he thinks, and what will become of him are between him and God. We need only know of his attacks and wiles, and try to avoid or fight them.

Please read what I said in context.

I said there is a place for briefly warning of ungodly lyrics in general, and for teaching people to recognize the difference themselves. And that this could be accomplished in one video.

I see dozens of videos (or more, I stopped scrolling after a while) that seem to be condemning artist after artist.

That is "something else".



Please remember that I said I didn't watch the videos, so I can't be disagreeing with their content.

I do most certainly agree that only God knows the heart, only God can judge. And if that's what the videos are purposed to do (judge people and "expose" the results, which seems to be the indication from the titles) - then I'm not interested in watching.

As to me discounting it because it comes from a Christian, I have no idea why you reach that conclusion, but that is not what I'm doing, nor would I.




Well, I'm not interested in going on a crusade against the ministry. You asked my opinion, and I gave it (along with my reasons) in case it might help you or someone in some way. Whether they are being used by God, I have no idea.

The rest of that paragraph seems to agree with what I said. Secular music is largely not spiritually beneficial. That's all we need to know. It wouldn't surprise me if the attached fame is spiritually damaging to the artists, but it's not my place to judge them. And focusing on evil, in whatever form, is not beneficial. We can much better spend our time on edifying things.

Testimony from Amhurst | Good Fight Ministries

Refuge Ministries

Showing concern for those out there who practice 'exposing satans kingdom'. God is in total control. I see a lot of podcasts and ministries that are focusing in on identifying demonic portals, Illuminati and secret societies, chemtrails, alien abductions, ghosts, paranormal/supernatural, nephilim, luciferians secret plans etc. This can lead to demonic obsession and speculation on your part.

As interesting as these topics seem and as convinced as you are that we need to know...I would challenge that what the body of Christ needs to know is the Word of God which proclaims absolute Truth and equips to stand in His faithfulness.
What I am not saying is that we are to be ignorant of satans devices. However, we are taught in Scripture, which does not include the book of Enoch, the what and how God wants us to know.

We need to discipline ourselves to eat only from the Tree of Life and walk away from the Tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Would you say the last post applies to those videos too?

The tree of life leads to life and brings us closer to God, whereas the tree of knowledge of good and evil doesn't. Just because something is true or exists doesn't mean that we should be thinking about it at all.
Like the tree of knowledge of good and evil... it did exist, but God told Adam and Eve not to eat from it.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Testimony from Amhurst | Good Fight Ministries

Refuge Ministries



Would you say the last post applies to those videos too?

The tree of life leads to life and brings us closer to God, whereas the tree of knowledge of good and evil doesn't. Just because something is true or exists doesn't mean that we should be thinking about it at all.
Like the tree of knowledge of good and evil... it did exist, but God told Adam and Eve not to eat from it.

I'm not quite sure what you're asking me.

But as I've said, our interaction with knowing about evil is only necessary to the point of recognizing what we shouldn't focus on, or what could prove harmful and should be avoided.

There is much that is edifying, more than we have time in this life to take it all in. A much better use of our time.

This is all summed up in Pillipians 4:8

Finally, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, dwell on these things.

 

[Sammy-San]

I'm not quite sure what you're asking me.

But as I've said, our interaction with knowing about evil is only necessary to the point of recognizing what we shouldn't focus on, or what could prove harmful and should be avoided.

There is much that is edifying, more than we have time in this life to take it all in. A much better use of our time.

This is all summed up in Pillipians 4:8

Finally, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, dwell on these things.

Ligonier Ministries

Regarding Goodfight Ministries and Hell's Bells by Eric Holmberg, would you say its necessary to know what innocent things are actually evil (or that is irrelevant too), and to show people their videos as proof their music is not godly or beneficial?

A lot of Christians and non Christians make excuses for listening to harmful music, or at least make excuses for bad messages that their favorite musicians promote.

 

[All4Christ]

Ligonier Ministries

Regarding Goodfight Ministries and Hell's Bells by Eric Holmberg, would you say its necessary to know what innocent things are actually evil (or that is irrelevant too), and to show people their videos as proof their music is not godly or beneficial?

A lot of Christians and non Christians make excuses for listening to harmful music, or at least make excuses for bad messages that their favorite musicians promote.

Certainly it is good to be cautious in the media - music, videos, etc. - that you enjoy. It is good to be aware of the environment in which we surround ourselves. However, we seek God first. The problem imho isn't so much making people aware of harmful media, so much as putting a strong focus on identifying the harmful things around us, rather than focusing on what God desires for us ourselves.

Remember the scripture about the log in a person's eye? We should all focus primarily on becoming more like God. Our focus should not be examining everyone else at the expense of our own spiritual walk. Rather, each day we should examine ourselves first. It is a balance.

Leaders do have a responsibility to watch out for their flock though. Putting a strong focus on evaluating media, however, may cause other important areas to be overlooked.

But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; who once were not a people but are now the people of God, who had not obtained mercy but now have obtained mercy. Beloved, I beg you as sojourners and pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts which war against the soul, having your conduct honorable among the Gentiles, that when they speak against you as evildoers, they may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of visitation. Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake, whether to the king as supreme,or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good. For this is the will of God, that by doing good you may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men– (1 Peter 2:9-15 NKJV)

 

[Sammy-San]

Please read what I said in context.

I said there is a place for briefly warning of ungodly lyrics in general, and for teaching people to recognize the difference themselves. And that this could be accomplished in one video.

I see dozens of videos (or more, I stopped scrolling after a while) that seem to be condemning artist after artist.

That is "something else".



Please remember that I said I didn't watch the videos, so I can't be disagreeing with their content.

I do most certainly agree that only God knows the heart, only God can judge. And if that's what the videos are purposed to do (judge people and "expose" the results, which seems to be the indication from the titles) - then I'm not interested in watching.

As to me discounting it because it comes from a Christian, I have no idea why you reach that conclusion, but that is not what I'm doing, nor would I.




Well, I'm not interested in going on a crusade against the ministry. You asked my opinion, and I gave it (along with my reasons) in case it might help you or someone in some way. Whether they are being used by God, I have no idea.

The rest of that paragraph seems to agree with what I said. Secular music is largely not spiritually beneficial. That's all we need to know. It wouldn't surprise me if the attached fame is spiritually damaging to the artists, but it's not my place to judge them. And focusing on evil, in whatever form, is not beneficial. We can much better spend our time on edifying things.

What is your issue-too much details on evil is fruitless?

 

[~Anastasia~]

What is your issue-too much details on evil is fruitless?

I'm sorry Sam, but because I have to keep my hand/arm wrapped right now due to swelling from damage from surgery, I'm very limited in what I can type.

Simply, I have never found spiritual benefit in focusing solely on demon or heresy hunting. We need to be aware of errors, and the wiles of the enemy, and avoid them. But as Scripture says, those things that are true, right, honorable, pure, etc - are what we are to focus on.

Phillipians 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, dwell on these things.

We ought to keep our eyes on Christ, our goal. Focusing exclusively on the enemy leads one to crash into the ditch - we tend to ever so subtly veer toward the place where our eyes are fixed.


Aside from that, the content seems to be saying that various persons are already condemned. That is NEVER our place to judge, but Christ's alone. We limit God's grace if we proclaim anyone beyond His ability to forgive. This is the kind of judgement we are told to avoid, unless we wish to be similarly judged. Anyone who makes such judgement a practice already misunderstands Scripture, and is not a particularly safe guide, IMO.

I won't be able to type much more.

 

[Sammy-San]

I'm sorry Sam, but because I have to keep my hand/arm wrapped right now due to swelling from damage from surgery, I'm very limited in what I can type.

Simply, I have never found spiritual benefit in focusing solely on demon or heresy hunting. We need to be aware of errors, and the wiles of the enemy, and avoid them. But as Scripture says, those things that are true, right, honorable, pure, etc - are what we are to focus on.

Phillipians 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, dwell on these things.

We ought to keep our eyes on Christ, our goal. Focusing exclusively on the enemy leads one to crash into the ditch - we tend to ever so subtly veer toward the place where our eyes are fixed.


Aside from that, the content seems to be saying that various persons are already condemned. That is NEVER our place to judge, but Christ's alone. We limit God's grace if we proclaim anyone beyond His ability to forgive. This is the kind of judgement we are told to avoid, unless we wish to be similarly judged. Anyone who makes such judgement a practice already misunderstands Scripture, and is not a particularly safe guide, IMO.

I won't be able to type much more.

Do you not agree with them claiming they sold their souls? Bob Dylan said it in interviews. The devil tempted Jesus with offers of power, but I don't think the devil can "own" a person irrevocably.

The “deal with the Devil” seems like a very frightening and eerie ritual. But what is always left out in the discussion is that since all people are born sinning and continue to sin through their life, sinful humanity is under Satan’s influence already. Ephesians Chapter 2 makes this clear:

And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. – Ephesians 2:1-3.

The Apostle Paul, writing to Christians in Ephesus told them “you” meaning Christians, were once unsaved sinners. All people who do not have saving faith in Jesus Christ are subject to the “prince of the power of the air” – a title for Satan. And have his spiritual influence in them. This is reflected in the sinful behavior, lack of repentance and concern for God seen in much of society today. So even without a contract, a person in this situation is under condemnation to spend eternity in Hell with Satan when they die (and notice in the commercial, even though the young man turns down the deal he still plans on getting the Mercedes-Benz and “everything that comes with it”).

Mercedes Benz’ Satanic Super Bowl Ad – Selling Your Soul To The Devil

 

[All4Christ]

Do you not agree with them claiming they sold their souls? Bob Dylan said it in interviews. The devil tempted Jesus with offers of power, but I don't think the devil can "own" a person irrevocably.


Mercedes Benz’ Satanic Super Bowl Ad – Selling Your Soul To The Devil

It's not our place to judge anyone's final salvation. I for one am very thankful that I am not responsible for judging other people's salvation.

 

[Sammy-San]

It's not our place to judge anyone's final salvation. I for one am very thankful that I am not responsible for judging other people's salvation.

Do you think people who die from overdoses find salvation? I thought about it and it doesn't seem possible, but I hope it has happened.

 

[All4Christ]

Do you think people who die from overdoses find salvation? I thought about it and it doesn't seem possible, but I hope it has happened.

It's possible. Could they be aware before they finally die, even if it wasn't full consciousness? May God have mercy on them? It's not something I want to chance, but it isn't my place to judge.

 

[Sammy-San]

It's possible. Could they be aware before they finally die, even if it wasn't full consciousness? May God have mercy on them? It's not something I want to chance, but it isn't my place to judge.

The videos aren't about salvation-they say, "they sold their souls" before the person's name.

 

[toLiJC]

When did Heaven and Hell come into existence?

God created the "heavens" in the beginning of this eternity (which was about 5-6 millennia ago - Genesis 1:1); the biblical "death" and "hell" are the first and the second manifestations of deterioration of the "darkness" (Revelation 6:8) - diseases, disorders, sufferings, etc. are different kinds of deterioration...

Was it God's will for humans to enter heaven or to stay on a paradise earth?

there is no "earth" without "heaven" and, therefore, no "heaven" without "earth" (Revelation 21:1) - the biblical "heaven" is (the world of) good itself, while the "earth" is the developed variety of good

Does the devil "manage" Hell? If so, does that mean God is using the devil to punish sinful people?

satan is the god of death and hell, actually the biblical "sin" and "death" are the two main aspects of the manifestation of the "darkness" (the word "sin" in the Bible is just one of the names of the devil) - "sin" is the delusion, "death" is the deterioration

If Adam and Eve said no to the snake and never ate the forbidden fruit, would there be a heaven for humans to enter?

yes, but adam and eve were just seduced into "eating" from the forbidden "tree"

Blessings

 

[All4Christ]

The videos aren't about salvation-they say, "they sold their souls" before the person's name.

You asked if I thought people who died from an overdose could be saved. I just answered your question. Stating that they sold their souls, though, certainly sounds like a judgment of salvation.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Do you not agree with them claiming they sold their souls? Bob Dylan said it in interviews. The devil tempted Jesus with offers of power, but I don't think the devil can "own" a person irrevocably.


Mercedes Benz’ Satanic Super Bowl Ad – Selling Your Soul To The Devil

We can't "sell ourselves" to the devil.

We are already slaves to sin if we do not come to Christ. If we come to Christ, Satan has no hold on us.

Satan would not have "owned Jesus' soul" if he had been successful at tempting Him (God forbid).

 

[All4Christ]

...

 

[Sammy-San]

We can't "sell ourselves" to the devil.

We are already slaves to sin if we do not come to Christ. If we come to Christ, Satan has no hold on us.

Satan would not have "owned Jesus' soul" if he had been successful at tempting Him (God forbid).

So what the article said was bibical?

 

[Sammy-San]

You asked if I thought people who died from an overdose could be saved. I just answered your question. Stating that they sold their souls, though, certainly sounds like a judgment of salvation.

Doesn't it mean they accepted the enemy's offer that he tempted Jesus with, not that he literally owns their souls?

 

[All4Christ]

Doesn't it mean they accepted the enemy's offer that he tempted Jesus with, not that he literally owns their souls?

I concur with Anastasia's comments. I do, however, disagree with much of the Theology in the article.

 

[Sammy-San]

I concur with Anastasia's comments. I do, however, disagree with much of the Theology in the article.

What was wrong with the theology of the article?

 

[~Anastasia~]

So what the article said was bibical?

Some of it was, some of it wasn't.

I'm sorry that I'm unable to comment line by line, and that's what it would take. There is a great mixture there.

But you were correct in your idea that Satan doesn't permanently "own" anyone. It's really not a matter of "Satan's kingdom" vs. "God's Kingdom". Rather, God offers everyone healing of the effects of sin, and forgiveness. We can either accept that or reject it. Satan doesn't have a kingdom, doesn't "own" anyone, and any "contract" with Satan is meaningless - UNLESS God were to completely withdraw His grace from a (reprobate) person, in which case salvation would be impossible. But there is no reason to believe God is concerned with any so-called "contract" with Satan. As always, He is concerned instead with our hearts, and our disposition toward Him.