Protestant Only Forum

[Dave-W]

Be that as it may, I'd support creating a Protestant-only forum although there's a serious possibility that the Protestants might verbally beat each other up

Ya think???

over who does and doesn't qualify as Protestant, whether evangelicals should be considered Protestant, etc.

Well, Most Catholics I know define protestant as anything other than Catholic. So in that sense the Orthodox would be the first protestants. And a few Orthodox believers I know consider Catholics to be protestants.

So are Evangelicals? Fundamentalists? Classic Pentecostals?

If you define "Protestant" as any who can trace their roots back to the Reformation, then that would include those groups and the non-denoms, since those congregations were started by people fed up with the denominational churches for whatever reason.

 

[Dave-W]

To my way of thinking, the ONLY group that would qualify as non-Orthodox, non-Catholic and not coming from the Protestant reformation is Messianic Judaism. (we were started in the late 1800s by Orthodox Jewish rabbis)

So would we be included in such a forum?

 

[Root of Jesse]

Then any non Catholic is basically nondenominational?



I'm not indicating anything one way or the other at this point, but could be interesting to discuss why that is. We are treated like brethren, we tend to act that way, but if not, well....

For instance calling anyone that is not a catholic, non denominational. Do you think saying things like that could ruffle feathers?

I don't think anyone said that. Non-Catholic = denominational, by definition. Denominational indicates divided.

Then there is "Mary", something I don't need to explain at all...things like that. Can anyone think of anything else?

Well, this isn't the place, but if you create a thread, we can discuss "Mary" all you want.

 

[Dave-W]

Non-Catholic = denominational, by definition. Denominational indicates divided.

Perhaps "franchise" would be a better term than denomination. Many locations but exactly the same, like McDonalds or WalMart.

 

[Kenny'sID]

I don't think anyone said that. Non-Catholic = denominational, by definition. Denominational indicates divided.Well, this isn't the place, but if you create a thread, we can discuss "Mary" all you want.

I could comment on both, but as you said, this isn't the place to do that. As to starting a thread on it, it's been done to death already, and you probably already know why some feel as they do about Mary worship.

And I know, it's always.. "we don't worship her" while I've seen the bowing before her graven image, meaning there is some type of denial thing going on there, so I doubt a thread would change a thing.

Anyway, I've said too much already for something we shouldn't be discussing here.

 

[Root of Jesse]

I could comment on both, but as you said, this isn't the place to do that. As to starting a thread on it, it's been done to death already, and you probably already know why some feel as they do about Mary worship.

And I know, it's always.. "we don't worship her" while I've seen the bowing before her graven image, meaning there is some type of denial thing going on there, so I doubt a thread would change a thing.

Right. We don't worship her (as we define worship-you define it differently. That won't change, so you're right. When we can come to a common understanding about what constitutes 'worship', we might get somewhere.). Bowing does not constitute worship, while it does constitute reverence. So there you go.
The reason I suggested starting a thread is not to argue, but to, at least, try to show you our POV. I know, you won't change, but if you understand our reasoning, it might help you. It's no skin off my back if you like it or not.

Anyway, I've said too much already for something we shouldn't be discussing here.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Right. We don't worship her (as we define worship-you define it differently. That won't change, so you're right. When we can come to a common understanding about what constitutes 'worship', we might get somewhere.). Bowing does not constitute worship, while it does constitute reverence. So there you go.
The reason I suggested starting a thread is not to argue, but to, at least, try to show you our POV. I know, you won't change, but if you understand our reasoning, it might help you. It's no skin off my back if you like it or not.

Then it is indeed ok to bow down to a graven image?

 

[Paidiske]

Perhaps "franchise" would be a better term than denomination. Many locations but exactly the same, like McDonalds or WalMart.

Except we're not. There are five or so other Anglican parishes within 5km of mine, and we're not offering a community, ethos or worship experience that's exactly the same, or in some cases, every very similar at all.

As to the bowing thing... guys, please. Bowing happens in lots of circumstances and has lots of different meanings. (Take Japanese culture, for example, where bowing is part of common courtesy, done to other people dozens of times a day. No one's suggesting the Japanese are worshipping one another, I hope?)

In my tradition we don't do the statues of Mary thing, but for example we bow at (not to) the altar; we're not worshipping the altar, we're expressing our reverence to the living and active God who is present to us as we gather around that altar.

Attempting to understand the nuance of others' motivations does go a long way...

 

[W2L]

Except we're not. There are five or so other Anglican parishes within 5km of mine, and we're not offering a community, ethos or worship experience that's exactly the same, or in some cases, every very similar at all.

As to the bowing thing... guys, please. Bowing happens in lots of circumstances and has lots of different meanings. (Take Japanese culture, for example, where bowing is part of common courtesy, done to other people dozens of times a day. No one's suggesting the Japanese are worshipping one another, I hope?)

In my tradition we don't do the statues of Mary thing, but for example we bow at (not to) the altar; we're not worshipping the altar, we're expressing our reverence to the living and active God who is present to us as we gather around that altar.

Attempting to understand the nuance of others' motivations does go a long way...

But why even have statues of Jesus and Mary, or anyone else, if they cause such division in the Church? Is division worth bowing to hunk of wood?

 

[Michie]

I think this thread has proved a point for those not in favor of this suggested and superfluous forum.

 

[W2L]

I think this thread has proved a point for those not in favor of this suggested and superfluous forum.

How generous of you to have your own forum but deny others the same.

 

[Michie]

That's not it. You all already own the majority of this board. You can post in many more places than we can. It is not my decision but I can weight in, which I am. And I explained why I was against it. Staff members have as well. This is a support forum. Not another forum to tear Catholicism and Catholics down. But look what it has turned into. Want to debate Catholicism, go to GT or any of the many where Protestants are free to do so. Your failure to understand what is right before your eyes all over CF is baffling.

 

[Hank77]

I think this thread has proved a point for those not in favor of this suggested and superfluous forum.

What happened to the St Justin Martyr forum?

 

[Michie]

It's in the Eastern Orthodox forum.

 

[Hank77]

Not another forum to tear Catholicism and Catholics down.

Why do you think some of us want a Protestant forum in order to tear Catholics down?

 

[Hank77]

It's in the Eastern Orthodox forim.

Thanks. I couldn't find it. It must be a sub-forum and I'm losing it in my older age..

 

[Michie]

Because as David explained, it brought more infighting not just as far as ripping on Catholics but between Protestants themselves.

Why do you think some of us want a Protestant forum in order to tear Catholics down?

 

[Michie]

Yeah it is a subforum. Right above the main forum.

Thanks. I couldn't find it. It must be a sub-forum and I'm losing it in my older age..

 

[Paidiske]

But why even have statues of Jesus and Mary, or anyone else, if they cause such division in the Church? Is division worth bowing to hunk of wood?

You could just as well ask, why do anything about which any of us ever disagree? But if we only ever did what every single Christian could agree with, what, precisely, would be left?

Better to allow each person or group their distinctive approach and practices, and interact with those from whom you differ with respect, courtesy and generosity.

 

[W2L]

You could just as well ask, why do anything about which any of us ever disagree? But if we only ever did what every single Christian could agree with, what, precisely, would be left?

Better to allow each person or group their distinctive approach and practices, and interact with those from whom you differ with respect, courtesy and generosity.

Its better to put away unnecessary things that divide. Thats my opinion.