Protestant errors and inventions (2)

[Albion]

Well, aside from a few entries the list is almost entirely made up of beliefs held by denominations and/or non-denominational groups as a doctrine of their group. For example, TULIP is held by several rather well known denominations. The rapture is held by several denominations and quite a few non-denominational groups. There are some beliefs in the list that are unique to a single denomination and some may be held only by a limited number of non-denominational groups.

Then I guess we'd better start calling this the errors and inventions of those few groups. As it is, most of the people identified in the title of the thread, DO NOT subscribe to your list entries. I was merely suggesting that this ought to matter to you.

There very likely are some catholics who hold to one of more peculiar ideas but those would not be the teaching of the Catholic Church.

Doesn't matter. I'm applying the same standard to them that you just explained as your standard for Protestants--if there are any Protestants of any denomination anywhere who believe such and such, it's OK to present it as what all believe. Seem fair to make the same kind of list with Catholics, then.

In another post I will clean up the list because I have added a few items which are probably representative of personal beliefs held by no significant group and/or are not held by a significant number of people scattered across the groups or involved in no group

That's not good enough. You cannot in fairness take a belief held by one or two or several denominations and present it as something believed in by "Protestants" when most Protestants don't believe whatever it is. Have a list for Primitive Baptists and another for Pentecostals, for example, if you are planning to continue with this.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The list has been tidied up. Numbering has been made a little more consistent. Some comments were added in blue text. Perseverance of the saints was added as the fifth of the five points of Calvinism. The point about altars with coals was removed because it is more a point made in GT discussion than a formal doctrine or practise of a denomination or non-denominational group that I have been able to verify from a web page.

1. The sermon - being an explanation of the meaning of the text of scripture or a lesson on morals or doctrine for the instruction of the congregation - is the central act of worship in the gathering of the Lord's people on the Lord's day.
2. The pulpit ought to be the focus of a church building's architecture and the table for use on communion ought to be to the side or located in a different part of the church because there is no altar in the church and no sacrifice is made in a church service.
3. Sola Scriptura - In English "Scripture alone" is the theory (unsupported by sacred scripture) that "all things necessary for God's glory, man's salvation, faith and life, is either expressly set down in Scripture, or by good and necessary consequence may be deduced from Scripture: to which nothing at any time is to be added, whether by new revelations of the Spirit, or apostolic tradition".
4. Prima Scriptura - A doctrine teaching that besides canonical scripture, there are other guides for what a believer should believe, and how he or she should live; the ways of knowing or understanding God and his will, that do not originate from canonized scripture, are in a second place, perhaps helpful in interpreting that scripture, but testable by the canon and correctable by it, if they seem to contradict the scriptures.[Editorial note: in many ways Prima Scriptura is an improvement over sola scriptura, it does, however, suffer from the core disadvantage of sola scriptura in that it is neither a teaching of scripture itself nor does it adequately deal with Apostolic Tradition and Magisterial authority.]
5. Personal & Private interpretation of scripture
6. Faith alone - In Latin "sola fide" is the theory (unsupported by scripture fact) that salvation is obtained by faith alone.
7. The One True Church is made up of all true believers scattered throughout all denominations.
8. The One True Church is not a visible institution.
9. Denominationalism
10. A bible with only 66 books.
11. Saint Paul's letters are not inspired.
12. Lone ranger Christianity - the belief that one need not be associated with any church or group. While this is not a denominational belief it is sufficiently widespread to make a kind of theology of its own.
13. Man, by his fall into a state of sin, has wholly lost all ability of will to any spiritual good accompanying salvation: so as, a natural man, being altogether averse from that good, and dead in sin, is not able, by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto. [This is rather similar to Total Depravity (see below) it may be double counting let me know if you think that it is.]
14. Total depravity - one of the five points of Calvinism (All human beings are affected by sin in every area of thought and conduct so that nothing that comes out of anyone apart from the regenerating grace of God can please God. As far as our relationships to God are concerned, we are all so ruined by sin that no one can properly understand either God or God's ways. Nor do we seek God, unless He is first at work within us to lead us to do so).
15. Unconditional election - second point of Calvinism (If sinners are as helpless in their depravity as the Bible says they are, unable to know and unwilling to seek God, then the only way they could possibly be saved is for God to take the initiative to change and save them. This is what election means. It is God choosing to save those who, apart from His sovereign choice and subsequent action, certainly would perish.).
16. Limited atonement - third point of Calvinism (Reformed theology stresses that Jesus actually atoned for the sins of those the Father had chosen. He actually propitiated the wrath of God toward His people by taking their judgment upon Himself, actually redeemed them, and actually reconciled those specific persons to God. A better name for "limited" atonement would be "particular" or "specific" redemption.).
17. Irresistible grace - fourth point of Calvinism (When God works in our hearts, regenerating us and creating a renewed will within, then what was undesirable before becomes highly desirable, and we run to Jesus just as previously we ran away from Him. Fallen sinners do resist God's grace, but His regenerating grace is effectual. It overcomes sin and accomplishes God's purpose).
18. Perseverance of the saints - the fifth point of Calvinism (You cannot lose your salvation. Because the Father has elected, the Son has redeemed, and the Holy Spirit has applied salvation, those thus saved are eternally secure. They are eternally secure in Christ. Some of the verses for this position are John 10:27-28 where Jesus said His sheep will never perish; John 6:47 where salvation is described as everlasting life; Romans 8:1 where it is said we have passed out of judgment; 1 Corinthians 10:13 where God promises to never let us be tempted beyond what we can handle; and Phil. 1:6 where God is the one being faithful to perfect us until the day of Jesus’ return.) [This belief is similar to OSAS but not quite the same.]
19. Double predestination.
20. Lapsarian views:
    1. Supralapsaranism
    2. Infralapsarianism
    3. Sublapsarianism.
21. Penal substitutionary atonement - A widespread Reformed conception of the Atonement is that in Christ’s Passion and death, God the Father poured out all of His wrath for the sins of the elect, on Christ the Son. In Christ’s Passion and death, Christ bore the punishment of the Father’s wrath that the elect deserved for their sins.
22. Prosperity gospel
23. Ordinances (instead of sacraments?)
24. Baby dedication (not baptism) in a worship-service. [This is a common practise in many groups but rarely has a formal doctrine accompanying it as an explanation of why it is done.]
25. Believer's baptism as a public testimony to one's faith but not as the washing away of one's sins nor as the means by which God brings about the birth from above.
26. Covenant baptism as a sign and symbol of inclusion into the new covenant community but not as the means by which God gives sanctifying grace.
27. The Lord's supper as sign and symbol but not as the body and blood of the Lord.
28. Two greater and five lesser Sacraments
29. Dispensing with baptism and the Lord's supper altogether. [A few groups have dropped all sacraments.]
30. The rapture
31. The Rapture divided into three different flavours:
    1. A pre tribulation rapture.
    2. A mid tribulation rapture.
    3. A post tribulation rapture.
32. A seven year reign of anti-christ with three and a half years of Israelite temple worship.
33. Dispensations through which scripture must be rightly divided.
34. The sermon on the mount as "old testament teaching" that's not applicable under the new covenant.
35. Once saved always saved.
    1. Once saved always saved even when one denies the faith some time after being saved.
    2. Rededications even though once saved always saved.
36. Congregations electing their ministers.
37. Seeker sensitive churches.
38. Accountability partners.
39. Altar calls.
40. Church discipline effectively nullified because of the difficulty of enforcement in a multi-denominational community. [You can't excommunicate a protestant - seems to be an observation about the effective impossibility of excommunicating or otherwise disciplining a person in one denomination if they can hop over to some other denomination and fellowship there as if nothing had happened.]
41. Alcohol is wicked, "a devil's brew".
42. Christians shall have no shellfish, crustaceans, pork, or any 'unclean meat' because they are forbidden in the Law of Moses.
43. It isn't baptism unless one is submerged.
44. Only people old enough to say the sinner's prayer can be baptised.
45. One is born again by saying & believing the sinner's prayer (or a near equivalent).
46. The papacy is the antichrist.
47. A specific pope will be the antichrist.
48. Trail of blood - also known as Baptist successionism. It is the theory (unsupported by fact) that Jesus Christ is the founder of the Baptist denomination (Which in fact started around 1605 AD in England).
49. The Jesuit oath - An absurd fake oath that among other things says "make and wage relentless war, secretly and openly, against all heretics, Protestants and Masons".
50. Michael the Archangel and Jesus being the same person.
51. Blessed assurance - possibly a variant on the perseverance of the saints, like once saved always saved.
52. Oneness (denying the Trinity) - some might think this is a non-christian sect's doctrine while others are inclined to believe that Oneness Pentecostalism is within the confines of Christianity.
53. Heaven being in the Orion nebula.
54. Death is an unconscious, sleep-like state. When Jesus Christ comes again, He will resurrect the dead who believe in Him and will take them to heaven. The dead who are unbelievers will be resurrected 1000 years later.
55. For a period of a thousand years the earth will be utterly desolate and only Satan and his angels will be on earth. At the end of the thousand years the the Holy City in heaven will descend to earth. The unrighteous dead will be resurrected and with Satan and his angels, they will surround the Holy City to attack God and His people. God will destroy Satan and his followers, hence removing sin forever.
56. Equivocating "worship" and "worship service" - meaning that worship in a small group consisting of two or more is the same as the 'worship service' one would normally experience on a Sunday in a church [building]. [Not a formal doctrine but a widely held view of Christian worship among some of those in denominations and also some in non-denominational and other groups.]

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

It's an interesting contrast between the Levitical model and the Christian one.

Hbr. 7:13 For he [Christ] of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe [Judah], of which no man gave attendance at the altar.

Don't forget, that the house/kingdom of Judah consisted of the priestly tribe of Levi [Levi was also a full blooded brother of Judah]

There is also division in Christianity concerning "hell"........

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

The parable of Lazarus and the rich man has been the foundation for many of the erroneous beliefs about "hell" within traditional Christianity. Some have viewed it not as a parable, but as a true story Yeshua told to give details about the punishment of sinners in hell..........

LUKE 16:27 "Then he said, 'I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father's house,
28 for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.' "

The fact that the rich man has five brothers is a vital clue to his true symbolic identity.
Judah, the progenitor of the Jews, was the son of Jacob through Leah (Gen. 29:35). He had five full-blooded brothers: Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Issachar, and Zebulun (Gen. 35:23).
While the significance of this seemingly pointless detail has been neglected by scholars throughout the centuries, you can be certain that it did not escape the notice of the Pharisees and scribes to which Yeshua was speaking. They thoroughly knew their history and were extremely proud of their heritage. Yeshua wanted those self-righteous Pharisees to know exactly who he was referring to with this parable.

This detail cements the identity of the rich man as the House of Judah, the Jews!



.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Then I guess we'd better start calling this the errors and inventions of those few groups. As it is, most of the people identified in the title of the thread, DO NOT subscribe to your list entries. I was merely suggesting that this ought to matter to you.

The list that I have posted does not claim to be the belief of all protestants. It would be very difficult to list beliefs held in common by all protestants. One can try, but there is bound to be some group that objects. Your suggestion is akin to finding the 'essential to salvation' doctrines that are sometimes debated among Protestants.

...

 

[Pteriax]

1. An altar in Church, if one's Church has one, must be filled with burning coals (something to do with Isaiah chapter six) and correspond in appearance to the altar of burnt offerings in the Israelite temple.

An altar in a church should be an altar by definition or it should be called something else. This is neither an invention nor an error.

 

[Pteriax]

Since "the list" is essentially beliefs held by some Protestant somewhere, but few items are typical of Protestantism, consider the list that could be compiled for Catholics, using the same standard.

1. Worship of potato chips, stale sliced bread, and other edibles believed to have miraculously taken on the appearance of a Caucasian-looking "Jesus."

2. Using a wall to screen the congregation off from viewing the altar.

3. Having yourself crucified during Holy Week in order to gain merit with God.

and so on.

P.S. What, again, is the reason we want to do this?

Since MoreCoffee is also including things done by cults like the JWs, we could also include Catholic-ish cults like Santeria in the Catholic list. Devil worship for example.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by Albion

Since "the list" is essentially beliefs held by some Protestant somewhere, but few items are typical of Protestantism, consider the list that could be compiled for Catholics, using the same standard.

​

Since MoreCoffee is also including things done by cults like the JWs, we could also include Catholic-ish cults like Santeria in the Catholic list. Devil worship for example.

There is a thread created for that very thing

http://www.christianforums.com/t7767882/
What errors and inventions arose in Roman Catholicism?






.

 

[Pteriax]

The list has been tidied up. Numbering has been made a little more consistent. Some comments were added in blue text. Perseverance of the saints was added as the fifth of the five points of Calvinism. The point about altars with coals was removed because it is more a point made in GT discussion than a formal doctrine or practise of a denomination or non-denominational group that I have been able to verify from a web page.

1. The sermon - being an explanation of the meaning of the text of scripture or a lesson on morals or doctrine for the instruction of the congregation - is the central act of worship in the gathering of the Lord's people on the Lord's day.
2. The pulpit ought to be the focus of a church building's architecture and the table for use on communion ought to be to the side or located in a different part of the church because there is no altar in the church and no sacrifice is made in a church service.
3. Sola Scriptura - In English "Scripture alone" is the theory (unsupported by sacred scripture) that "all things necessary for God's glory, man's salvation, faith and life, is either expressly set down in Scripture, or by good and necessary consequence may be deduced from Scripture: to which nothing at any time is to be added, whether by new revelations of the Spirit, or apostolic tradition".
4. Prima Scriptura - A doctrine teaching that besides canonical scripture, there are other guides for what a believer should believe, and how he or she should live; the ways of knowing or understanding God and his will, that do not originate from canonized scripture, are in a second place, perhaps helpful in interpreting that scripture, but testable by the canon and correctable by it, if they seem to contradict the scriptures.[Editorial note: in many ways Prima Scriptura is an improvement over sola scriptura, it does, however, suffer from the core disadvantage of sola scriptura in that it is neither a teaching of scripture itself nor does it adequately deal with Apostolic Tradition and Magisterial authority.]
5. Personal & Private interpretation of scripture
6. Faith alone - In Latin "sola fide" is the theory (unsupported by scripture fact) that salvation is obtained by faith alone.
7. The One True Church is made up of all true believers scattered throughout all denominations.
8. The One True Church is not a visible institution.
9. Denominationalism
10. A bible with only 66 books.
11. Saint Paul's letters are not inspired.
12. Lone ranger Christianity - the belief that one need not be associated with any church or group. While this is not a denominational belief it is sufficiently widespread to make a kind of theology of its own.
13. Man, by his fall into a state of sin, has wholly lost all ability of will to any spiritual good accompanying salvation: so as, a natural man, being altogether averse from that good, and dead in sin, is not able, by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto. [This is rather similar to Total Depravity (see below) it may be double counting let me know if you think that it is.]
14. Total depravity - one of the five points of Calvinism (All human beings are affected by sin in every area of thought and conduct so that nothing that comes out of anyone apart from the regenerating grace of God can please God. As far as our relationships to God are concerned, we are all so ruined by sin that no one can properly understand either God or God's ways. Nor do we seek God, unless He is first at work within us to lead us to do so).
15. Unconditional election - second point of Calvinism (If sinners are as helpless in their depravity as the Bible says they are, unable to know and unwilling to seek God, then the only way they could possibly be saved is for God to take the initiative to change and save them. This is what election means. It is God choosing to save those who, apart from His sovereign choice and subsequent action, certainly would perish.).
16. Limited atonement - third point of Calvinism (Reformed theology stresses that Jesus actually atoned for the sins of those the Father had chosen. He actually propitiated the wrath of God toward His people by taking their judgment upon Himself, actually redeemed them, and actually reconciled those specific persons to God. A better name for "limited" atonement would be "particular" or "specific" redemption.).
17. Irresistible grace - fourth point of Calvinism (When God works in our hearts, regenerating us and creating a renewed will within, then what was undesirable before becomes highly desirable, and we run to Jesus just as previously we ran away from Him. Fallen sinners do resist God's grace, but His regenerating grace is effectual. It overcomes sin and accomplishes God's purpose).
18. Perseverance of the saints - the fifth point of Calvinism (You cannot lose your salvation. Because the Father has elected, the Son has redeemed, and the Holy Spirit has applied salvation, those thus saved are eternally secure. They are eternally secure in Christ. Some of the verses for this position are John 10:27-28 where Jesus said His sheep will never perish; John 6:47 where salvation is described as everlasting life; Romans 8:1 where it is said we have passed out of judgment; 1 Corinthians 10:13 where God promises to never let us be tempted beyond what we can handle; and Phil. 1:6 where God is the one being faithful to perfect us until the day of Jesus’ return.) [This belief is similar to OSAS but not quite the same.]
19. Double predestination.
20. Lapsarian views:
    1. Supralapsaranism
    2. Infralapsarianism
    3. Sublapsarianism.
21. Penal substitutionary atonement - A widespread Reformed conception of the Atonement is that in Christ’s Passion and death, God the Father poured out all of His wrath for the sins of the elect, on Christ the Son. In Christ’s Passion and death, Christ bore the punishment of the Father’s wrath that the elect deserved for their sins.
22. Prosperity gospel
23. Ordinances (instead of sacraments?)
24. Baby dedication (not baptism) in a worship-service. [This is a common practise in many groups but rarely has a formal doctrine accompanying it as an explanation of why it is done.]
25. Believer's baptism as a public testimony to one's faith but not as the washing away of one's sins nor as the means by which God brings about the birth from above.
26. Covenant baptism as a sign and symbol of inclusion into the new covenant community but not as the means by which God gives sanctifying grace.
27. The Lord's supper as sign and symbol but not as the body and blood of the Lord.
28. Two greater and five lesser Sacraments
29. Dispensing with baptism and the Lord's supper altogether. [A few groups have dropped all sacraments.]
30. The rapture
31. The Rapture divided into three different flavours:
    1. A pre tribulation rapture.
    2. A mid tribulation rapture.
    3. A post tribulation rapture.
32. A seven year reign of anti-christ with three and a half years of Israelite temple worship.
33. Dispensations through which scripture must be rightly divided.
34. The sermon on the mount as "old testament teaching" that's not applicable under the new covenant.
35. Once saved always saved.
    1. Once saved always saved even when one denies the faith some time after being saved.
    2. Rededications even though once saved always saved.
36. Congregations electing their ministers.
37. Seeker sensitive churches.
38. Accountability partners.
39. Altar calls.
40. Church discipline effectively nullified because of the difficulty of enforcement in a multi-denominational community. [You can't excommunicate a protestant - seems to be an observation about the effective impossibility of excommunicating or otherwise disciplining a person in one denomination if they can hop over to some other denomination and fellowship there as if nothing had happened.]
41. Alcohol is wicked, "a devil's brew".
42. Christians shall have no shellfish, crustaceans, pork, or any 'unclean meat' because they are forbidden in the Law of Moses.
43. It isn't baptism unless one is submerged.
44. Only people old enough to say the sinner's prayer can be baptised.
45. One is born again by saying & believing the sinner's prayer (or a near equivalent).
46. The papacy is the antichrist.
47. A specific pope will be the antichrist.
48. Trail of blood - also known as Baptist successionism. It is the theory (unsupported by fact) that Jesus Christ is the founder of the Baptist denomination (Which in fact started around 1605 AD in England).
49. The Jesuit oath - An absurd fake oath that among other things says "make and wage relentless war, secretly and openly, against all heretics, Protestants and Masons".
50. Michael the Archangel and Jesus being the same person.
51. Blessed assurance - possibly a variant on the perseverance of the saints, like once saved always saved.
52. Oneness (denying the Trinity) - some might think this is a non-christian sect's doctrine while others are inclined to believe that Oneness Pentecostalism is within the confines of Christianity.
53. Heaven being in the Orion nebula.
54. Death is an unconscious, sleep-like state. When Jesus Christ comes again, He will resurrect the dead who believe in Him and will take them to heaven. The dead who are unbelievers will be resurrected 1000 years later.
55. For a period of a thousand years the earth will be utterly desolate and only Satan and his angels will be on earth. At the end of the thousand years the the Holy City in heaven will descend to earth. The unrighteous dead will be resurrected and with Satan and his angels, they will surround the Holy City to attack God and His people. God will destroy Satan and his followers, hence removing sin forever.
56. Equivocating "worship" and "worship service" - meaning that worship in a small group consisting of two or more is the same as the 'worship service' one would normally experience on a Sunday in a church [building]. [Not a formal doctrine but a widely held view of Christian worship among some of those in denominations and also some in non-denominational and other groups.]

You left in all of the cult beliefs, as well as fringe beliefs, as well as several duplicates, as well as several misrepresentations, ALL of which has been pointed out and explained by me twice and by others as well. If you actually made this a real list of things protestants "invented" You would be down to less than five items. If this list were legitimate, it would be equally legitimate to ascribe Voodoo practices to Catholics. I will fix the list for you in my next post in this topic.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by MoreCoffee

The list has been tidied up. Numbering has been made a little more consistent. Some comments were added in blue text. Perseverance of the saints was added as the fifth of the five points of Calvinism. The point about altars with coals was removed because it is more a point made in GT discussion than a formal doctrine or practise of a denomination or non-denominational group that I have been able to verify from a web page.

​

You left in all of the cult beliefs, as well as fringe beliefs, as well as several duplicates, as well as several misrepresentations, ALL of which has been pointed out and explained by me twice and by others as well. If you actually made this a real list of things protestants "invented" You would be down to less than five items. If this list were legitimate, it would be equally legitimate to ascribe Voodoo practices to Catholics.
I will fix the list for you in my next post in this topic.

I for one anxiously await that





.

 

[Tzaousios]

Since MoreCoffee is also including things done by cults like the JWs, we could also include Catholic-ish cults like Santeria in the Catholic list. Devil worship for example.

Is this to score points against Catholicism by associating it with "devil worship?" In terms of standards of wickedness and evil, comparing JW's and Devil worship is a bit incongruent.

 

[shturt678]

Small kine error: "Essential to salvation" = "Statement or Profession of faith" = / = "My statement of faith" = / = "Your statement of faith" = / = "RCC statement of faith" = / = "Protestant statement of faith" My end point: A heads up to set your hot coffee cup down. Agreeing to disagree is healthy, but to be shaken to the point of accidentally spilling a hot cup of coffee painfully onto one's lap (owe) just because someone calls a spade a spade is ludicrous, ie, bringing to the forefront that each one of us has a different "Statement of faith" thinking we have the one valid 'Statement' and mums the word. Oh well, we'll find out upon passing, ie, I better scrutinize Lk.16:23 or so, along with the different levels of hell ahead of time, eg, Lk12:45-48. Just ol' old Jack preparing for the forever journey in case I have the invalid "Statement."

 

[MoreCoffee]

You left in all of the cult beliefs, as well as fringe beliefs, as well as several duplicates, as well as several misrepresentations, ALL of which has been pointed out and explained by me twice and by others as well. If you actually made this a real list of things protestants "invented" You would be down to less than five items. If this list were legitimate, it would be equally legitimate to ascribe Voodoo practices to Catholics. I will fix the list for you in my next post in this topic.

What cult(s) are you thinking of?

The beliefs in the list are by and large held by reputable denominations. Even the Michael = Jesus belief is held by Seventh Day Adventists (and others) and they are within the ambit of Protestantism.

 

[Pteriax]

1. The sermon is the central act of worship in the gathering of the Lord's people on the Lord's day. This is simply false. Communion, singing, prayer, as well as the sermon are all equal parts of Sunday worship services.
2. The pulpit ought to be the focus of a church building's architecture and the table for use on communion ought to be to the side or located in a different part of the church because there is no altar in the church and no sacrifice is made in a church service. Again, this is simply false.
3. Sola Scriptura. Actually means scripture alone as a source of authority, and is itself supported by scripture. Matthew 4:1-11.
4. Prima Scriptura. This is the exact same thing as sola scriptura.
5. Personal & Private interpretation of scripture. [FONT=&quot]This is universalism / relativism. We believe that anyone may read and understand scripture, which is actually a completely different concept. There is only one right reading of scripture in most cases.[/FONT]
6. Faith alone - In Latin "sola fide" is the theory that salvation is obtained by faith alone. It is supported by scripture. Verses Showing Justification by Faith | Bible and Justification by Faith | Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry
7. The One True Church is made up of all true believers scattered throughout all denominations. [FONT=&quot]The church is the body of believers. I am the church, as are all who are saved. This is not an invention, it is Biblical.[/FONT]
8. The One True Church is not a visible institution. See above.
9. Denominationalism. Correct, this is an actual protestant invention.
10. A bible with only 66 books. [FONT=&quot]The ECFs in the first couple centuries only quoted from 64 books, none of which were apocryphal.[/FONT]
11. Saint Paul's letters are not inspired. Cultic, not protestant.
12. Lone ranger Christianity - the belief that one need not be associated with any church or group. While this is not a denominational belief it is sufficiently widespread to make a kind of theology of its own. Not protestant.
13. Man, by his fall into a state of sin, has wholly lost all ability of will to any spiritual good accompanying salvation: so as, a natural man, being altogether averse from that good, and dead in sin, is not able, by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto. This is exactly the same as Total Depravity.
14. Total depravity - one of the five points of Calvinism. This is scriptural. Total Depravity Verse List « Travis Carden .com
15. Unconditional election - second point of Calvinism. This is scriptural. Unconditional Election Verses
16. Limited atonement - third point of Calvinism. This is scriptural. Doctrines of Grace - Limited Atonement
17. Irresistible grace - fourth point of Calvinism. This is scriptural. http://www.gospeloutreach.net/irresistible_grace.html
18. Perseverance of the saints - the fifth point of Calvinism. This is exactly that same as OSAS. This is scriptural. http://doctrine.landmarkbiblebaptist.net/eternal-security.html
19. Double predestination. Can't have one without the other, see scripture references above.
20. Lapsarian views:
    1. Supralapsaranism is found in scripture see references above.
    2. Infralapsarianism not a real protestant doctrine
    3. Sublapsarianism. Not a real protestant doctrine
21. Penal substitutionary atonement This is scriptural, ergo not an invention.
22. Prosperity gospel This is cultic.
23. Ordinances (instead of sacraments?) Ordinances do not replace sacraments.
24. Baby dedication (not baptism) in a worship-service. Methodists and possibly other Wesleyans do this.
25. Believer's baptism as a public testimony to one's faith but not as the washing away of one's sins nor as the means by which God brings about the birth from above. This was done in the Bible.
26. Covenant baptism as a sign and symbol of inclusion into the new covenant community but not as the means by which God gives sanctifying grace. This just seems like word play.
27. The Lord's supper as sign and symbol but not as the body and blood of the Lord. As Jesus explained it to His apostles, these things are spirit.
28. Two greater and five lesser Sacraments Not a protestant belief.
29. Dispensing with baptism and the Lord's supper altogether. This is obviously cultic
30. The rapture I know Catholics that believe in the rapture.
31. The Rapture divided into three different theories:
    1. A pre tribulation rapture.
    2. A mid tribulation rapture.
    3. A post tribulation rapture.
32. A seven year reign of anti-christ with three and a half years of Israelite temple worship. Not sure who believes this
33. Dispensations through which scripture must be rightly divided. Cultic
34. The sermon on the mount as "old testament teaching" that's not applicable under the new covenant. Cultic.
35. Once saved always saved. See scripture references above.
    1. Once saved always saved even when one denies the faith some time after being saved. They were never saved then were they. See the parable of the sower.
    2. Rededications even though once saved always saved. Not sure what churches do this.
36. Congregations electing their ministers. As opposed to cardinals electing a pope?
37. Seeker sensitive churches. cultic
38. Accountability partners. secular
39. Altar calls. cultic
40. Church discipline effectively nullified because of the difficulty of enforcement in a multi-denominational community. False. Church discipline prevents one from joining another congregation.
41. Alcohol is wicked, "a devil's brew". lol
42. Christians shall have no shellfish, crustaceans, pork, or any 'unclean meat' because they are forbidden in the Law of Moses. Cultic.
43. It isn't baptism unless one is submerged. See diadache.
44. Only people old enough to say the sinner's prayer can be baptised. Where did you even hear this?
45. One is born again by saying & believing the sinner's prayer (or a near equivalent). Cultic
46. The papacy is the antichrist. Cultic
47. A specific pope will be the antichrist. Cultic
48. Trail of blood - also known as Baptist successionism. It is the theory (unsupported by fact) that Jesus Christ is the founder of the Baptist denomination (Which in fact started around 1605 AD in England). Cultic
49. The Jesuit oath - An absurd fake oath that among other things says "make and wage relentless war, secretly and openly, against all heretics, Protestants and Masons". Never saw proof that this was fake, but what difference does it make as this is not a protestant doctrine?
50. Michael the Archangel and Jesus being the same person. Cultic.
51. Blessed assurance - possibly a variant on the perseverance of the saints, like once saved always saved. Then it is covered twice above.
52. Oneness (denying the Trinity) - some might think this is a non-christian sect's doctrine while others are inclined to believe that Oneness Pentecostalism is within the confines of Christianity. Cultic
53. Heaven being in the Orion nebula. Cultic
54. Death is an unconscious, sleep-like state. When Jesus Christ comes again, He will resurrect the dead who believe in Him and will take them to heaven. The dead who are unbelievers will be resurrected 1000 years later. Cultic
55. For a period of a thousand years the earth will be utterly desolate and only Satan and his angels will be on earth. At the end of the thousand years the the Holy City in heaven will descend to earth. The unrighteous dead will be resurrected and with Satan and his angels, they will surround the Holy City to attack God and His people. God will destroy Satan and his followers, hence removing sin forever. Cultic
56. Equivocating "worship" and "worship service" - meaning that worship in a small group consisting of two or more is the same as the 'worship service' one would normally experience on a Sunday in a church [building]. Different kinds of worship, both supported scripturally, yet not equal.

Here is the accurate list:

1. Denominationalism.
2. Baby dedication (not baptism) in a worship-service. Methodists and possibly other Wesleyans do this.
3. The Rapture divided into three different theories:
   1. A pre tribulation rapture.
   2. A mid tribulation rapture.
   3. A post tribulation rapture.
4. Alcohol is wicked.

Not much left is there? And MoreCoffee has yet to defend even one of these so called errors and inventions of his.

 

[Pteriax]

Is this to score points against Catholicism by associating it with "devil worship?"

No.

 

[Tzaousios]

No.

Okay, but why did you edit out the rest of my post?

 

[Pteriax]

What cult(s) are you thinking of?

JWs, Mormons, Oneness, Campbellites, new age / ultra liberal churches, Unity, Unitarianism, Christian science, etc...

The beliefs in the list are by and large held by reputable denominations. Even the Michael = Jesus belief is held by Seventh Day Adventists (and others) and they are within the ambit of Protestantism.

No, they are not. SDA is a cult too, they hold a false prophet above scripture, believe in works for salvation, and as you pointed out deny the deity of Christ. That is a different gospel and it most certainly is a different Jesus. Which is exactly what makes one a cult (aside from declaring itself the one true church of course).

 

[Pteriax]

Okay, but why did you edit out the rest of my post?

Because it was irrelevant if the part I quoted wasn't correct.

 

[Tzaousios]

Because it was irrelevant if the part I quoted wasn't correct.

No, you tried to compare JW worship with Devil worship, which is incompatible except for pejorative, apologetic purposes. That is why I said it gave the impression that your ultimate target was Catholicism.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Here is the accurate list:

1. Denominationalism.
2. Baby dedication (not baptism) in a worship-service. Methodists and possibly other Wesleyans do this.
3. The Rapture divided into three different theories:
   1. A pre tribulation rapture.
   2. A mid tribulation rapture.
   3. A post tribulation rapture.
4. Alcohol is wicked.

Not much left is there? And MoreCoffee has yet to defend even one of these so called errors and inventions of his.

Do you think that all the others are either truths of scripture "cult" beliefs ...

Of course you are entitled to your opinion. One cannot help but notice that both paedo-baptism (Presbyterian, Reformed, Methodist, and others) and credo-baptism (Baptists, Pentecostals, many non-denominational, Church of Christ, and others) are missing. The real presence is not there (Many Anglicans, Many Lutherans, and others), nor is symbolic presence (Most Baptists, many Presbyterians, many non-denominational, and others), and so on, yet each of those mutually exclusive beliefs is held by millions of Protestants. And, if I am not mistaken, the Salvation Army Dispenses with baptism and the Lord's supper altogether.

 

[shturt678]

Due to the world wide pretentious worship of today, ie, just my opinion, I have to make sure that I place the Sacraments on equal plane with the Sermons in my worship - ol' school during the week as well as Sunday for the hour and a half. Just ol' old infant dunker Jack