Proper Christian Behavior Does Not Include

[Floatingaxe]

I haven't lower myself by quoting Bible scriptures or posting stats, and have never created or been hostile to anyone, so again with the false witness.

You can think what you want on who will be and will not be in heaven, but when it all comes down to it it is the Lord who knows. Who has plainly told and warned us in His Word what will get people into heaven and what will not.

You know it is getting so old when people try to claim that I think I am better then anyone else, but I guess if it is said enough some will believe the lie and a miracle might happen and it become true.........................NOT.
______________________________________________________________

I thought maybe someone should go back and explain by this thread has went in the direction it has gone. So I thought I would try.

Many months ago someone posted on a thread that HIV/AIDS and homosexuals were not related or something like that. So me not being raised on computer, and not even thinking about the fact that it wasn’t just people talking from the USA, posted some CDC and/or JAMA stats that showed in America the largest number of cases of HIV/AIDS was spread by male to male homosexuals. I also posted stats that showed in several American cities those numbers were real high.

I didn’t add to or take away any information from these stats, and I even posted the links to the stats so that it could be plainly seen that I didn’t do anything but post the stats. A post soon after that pointed out that not everyone posting was from America, and that they were speaking world wide not just certain areas. I apologized for the misunderstanding and posted the stats for world wide spread of HIV/AIDS.

I was told that I was promoting hate, and that I was a prejudice bigot for posting stats that I didn’t make and/or change. I also was called a liar.

Anyhow, this is how this thread has went in this direction, and I am still wondering why I am having people bear false witness against me when all I did was post stats and nothing more.

If someone has problems with the stats then take it up with the CDC, JAMA and all other medical studies that have researched and released this information. Trying to say that I have done something to promote some lies and falsehood is totally ridiculous. As I and several other posted here have said more then once, I have no hate for those who say they are homosexual, and have nothing but love for them, as I do for all of God’s creations.

If I didn’t care I can assure you I would stay here and be lied about on what seems like a daily bases, anymore.

So for those who were wondering how this thread got where it is right now, this is why. No worries though as I have said all there is to say on this matter, and so will not be trying to correct anymore of the lies stated against me and others.

Please everyone read for yourself the post and not lean on someone else’s understanding.

God Bless.

Hi, savedandhappy1!

I do remember that post you made and I was aware that you posted the information in exactly the right spirit.

I know that you are only desiring truth to be known and that is the reason you post here, my dear!

 

[Crazy Liz]

maligning and scapegoating gays and lesbians.

People who go out of their way to spread misinformation about gays and lesbians are not behaving in a Christ like manner. In fact they are serving evil and perverting Christ's message.

I haven't lower myself by quoting Bible scriptures or posting stats, and have never created or been hostile to anyone, so again with the false witness.

You can think what you want on who will be and will not be in heaven, but when it all comes down to it it is the Lord who knows. Who has plainly told and warned us in His Word what will get people into heaven and what will not.

You know it is getting so old when people try to claim that I think I am better then anyone else, but I guess if it is said enough some will believe the lie and a miracle might happen and it become true.........................NOT.
______________________________________________________________

I thought maybe someone should go back and explain by this thread has went in the direction it has gone. So I thought I would try.

Many months ago someone posted on a thread that HIV/AIDS and homosexuals were not related or something like that. So me not being raised on computer, and not even thinking about the fact that it wasn’t just people talking from the USA, posted some CDC and/or JAMA stats that showed in America the largest number of cases of HIV/AIDS was spread by male to male homosexuals. I also posted stats that showed in several American cities those numbers were real high.

I didn’t add to or take away any information from these stats, and I even posted the links to the stats so that it could be plainly seen that I didn’t do anything but post the stats. A post soon after that pointed out that not everyone posting was from America, and that they were speaking world wide not just certain areas. I apologized for the misunderstanding and posted the stats for world wide spread of HIV/AIDS.

I was told that I was promoting hate, and that I was a prejudice bigot for posting stats that I didn’t make and/or change. I also was called a liar.

Anyhow, this is how this thread has went in this direction, and I am still wondering why I am having people bear false witness against me when all I did was post stats and nothing more.

If someone has problems with the stats then take it up with the CDC, JAMA and all other medical studies that have researched and released this information. Trying to say that I have done something to promote some lies and falsehood is totally ridiculous. As I and several other posted here have said more then once, I have no hate for those who say they are homosexual, and have nothing but love for them, as I do for all of God’s creations.

If I didn’t care I can assure you I would stay here and be lied about on what seems like a daily bases, anymore.

So for those who were wondering how this thread got where it is right now, this is why. No worries though as I have said all there is to say on this matter, and so will not be trying to correct anymore of the lies stated against me and others.

Please everyone read for yourself the post and not lean on someone else’s understanding.

God Bless.

I'm curious why you think the OP was specifically about you and that one post you made a few months ago?

I find it hard to imagine this whole thread is all about one post that was made months ago, but if that's what this is all about, then I'd like to be the first to step forward and offer a hand of reconciliation.

Posting US disease statistics, and nothing more, is not maligning and scapegoating gays and lesbians. It is not spreading misinformation. It is unjust and wrong to make such an accusation based on nothing more than posting health statistics. I call on everyone who has accused savedandhappy1 of doing these things merely by posting statistics a few months ago to apologize and repent of their unjust treatment.

I am truly sorry you were maligned just for posting health statistics.

Please forgive me.

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear Crazy Liz,

What makes you think catlover is discriminating? [.quote] Based on the Bible, the Bible warns against homosexual offenders and the proud and arrogant, what makes catlover think people subject to one sin will be ahead of people subject to another. In this way why discriminate against the arrogant?

As I read the 2 posts, I think catlover thinks both will be in heaven and you think both will be in hell.

Ok well not really as I am only referring to the sins not anyone people who catlover thinks might be grouped according to the sins. But your comment is even more amazing as the Bible warns sin leads to death and you are implying the opposite.

I am curious, though, why you spend so much more time and energy warning homosexuals of hell than warning the arrogant of hell.

I don’t spend any time warning homosexuals of hell, I am witnessing the gospel of Jesus Christ to my homosexual friends, if they accept Him as their Lord they will begin to deal with repenting from same-sex unions. Why do you spend so much of your time trying to argue against Christian Biblical beliefs on a Christian based forum?

 

[Crazy Liz]

Dear Crazy Liz,

What makes you think catlover is discriminating?

Based on the Bible, the Bible warns against homosexual offenders and the proud and arrogant, what makes catlover think people subject to one sin will be ahead of people subject to another. In this way why discriminate against the arrogant?

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source - Share This
dis·crim·i·nate Audio Help [v. di-skrim-uh-neyt; adj. di-skrim-uh-nit] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation verb, -nat·ed, -nat·ing, adjective
–verb (used without object)
1. to make a distinction in favor of or against a person or thing on the basis of the group, class, or category to which the person or thing belongs rather than according to actual merit; show partiality: The new law discriminates against foreigners. He discriminates in favor of his relatives.
2. to note or observe a difference; distinguish accurately: to discriminate between things.
–verb (used with object)
3. to make or constitute a distinction in or between; differentiate: a mark that discriminates the original from the copy.
4. to note or distinguish as different: He can discriminate minute variations in tone.
–adjective
5. marked by discrimination; making or evidencing nice distinctions: discriminate people; discriminate judgments.
[Origin: 1620–30; < L discr&#299;min&#257;tus separated, ptp. of discr&#299;min&#257;re. See discriminant, -ate1]

discriminate. Dictionary.com. Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1). Random House, Inc. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/discriminate (accessed: July 10, 2008).

It looks to me like it is you who are discriminating, not catlover.

 

[jamielindas]

Dear Jamielindas,

yes. So you agree arsenokoites =same-sex sex and is a sin. Good.


This is Vogon poetry which comes from The Hitchhikers guide to the Galaxy”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vogon_poetry
Oh freddled gruntbuggling,
Thy nacturations are to me
As plurdled grabbleblotchits
On a lurgid bee.
Groop, I implore thee, my footing turlingdromes
And hooptiously drangle me
With crinkly binglewurgles,
For otherwise, I will rend thee in the gobberwarts with my blurglecruncheon,
See if I don't!

So I have given you the wording and the source. What’s the source for yours?

I was using the Wycliffe NT, because it is the oldest one I am aware of in english.

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Bible_(Wycliffe)/1_Corinthis#Chapter_6
This one is vague


http://bibleresources.bible.com/passagesearchresults.php?passage1=1+Corinthians+6:9&version1=53
this one is more clear about lechery with men

 

[Ohioprof]

Dear catlover,
based on what? If the Bible indcates those who are arogant and homosexual offenders will not inherit the Kingdom how do you make your discrimination against the arogant?
Or perhaps its up to God whose testimony about it, is in the Bible, and some people dont like others pointing it out.

The Bible does not say "homosexual offenders." That is a translation, and a distorted translation.

 

[Ohioprof]

Dear Crazy Liz,

What makes you think catlover is discriminating? [.quote] Based on the Bible, the Bible warns against homosexual offenders and the proud and arrogant, what makes catlover think people subject to one sin will be ahead of people subject to another. In this way why discriminate against the arrogant?

Ok well not really as I am only referring to the sins not anyone people who catlover thinks might be grouped according to the sins. But your comment is even more amazing as the Bible warns sin leads to death and you are implying the opposite.

I don’t spend any time warning homosexuals of hell, I am witnessing the gospel of Jesus Christ to my homosexual friends, if they accept Him as their Lord they will begin to deal with repenting from same-sex unions. Why do you spend so much of your time trying to argue against Christian Biblical beliefs on a Christian based forum?

You make some assumptions here that are probably not accurate. Plenty of gay people accept Jesus as Lord and savior, ad they do not "repent from same-sex unions." That's because same-sex marriages are not a sin, and there is no need to repent from something that is not a sin.

 

[Floatingaxe]

Dear Crazy Liz,


You make some assumptions here that are probably not accurate. Plenty of gay people accept Jesus as Lord and savior, ad they do not "repent from same-sex unions." That's because same-sex marriages are not a sin, and there is no need to repent from something that is not a sin.

THAT is the problem. You can't make Jesus the Lord of your life when YOU are sitting on the throne, committing perverse acts against Him. Homosexual acts are indeed sinfully separating one from knowing God, and the marriage bit---well, that is absurd.

 

[Leah]

maligning and scapegoating gays and lesbians.

People who go out of their way to spread misinformation about gays and lesbians are not behaving in a Christ like manner. In fact they are serving evil and perverting Christ's message.

Hi Catlover.

I think what we should remember is WHO is it that enables anyone to be a christian. Godly behavior doesn't come from any one of us alone. No, Jesus is the one who works in a believer and our responsibility is to listen to (with the intent and intiative of obeying) Him. The more you hang with God, the more you become like Him in love. Just as a child resembles their parents, the same is true for believers and The Father. Right?

While I agree with what you said, its equally important to not put all christians in that box. IMO, it only arouses more hostility and there's enough of that as it is, wouldn't you agree?


One more thing, there's no such thing as a 'good christian'. Jesus said in John 15:4-5 that apart from Him, we can do nothing (bear good fruit). We cannot be any spiritual good without Christ. And that's a fact.

 

[Ohioprof]

THAT is the problem. You can't make Jesus the Lord of your life when YOU are sitting on the throne, committing perverse acts against Him. Homosexual acts are indeed sinfully separating one from knowing God, and the marriage bit---well, that is absurd.

What "perverse acts" do you accuse me of committing? What "homosexual acts" are you imagining that I commit?

The "marriage bit" is supported by my church. My church honors and performs same-sex marriages. And this "absurd" institution you call the "marriage bit" between same-sex spouses is now legally recognized in a growing number of nations, including yours.

 

[jamielindas]

Perhaps we should take this time to learn... since there seems to be plenty of the GLBT group on here, let's take this time to clear up any misinformation about gays, the 'gay lifestyle'.

Then we can move on to some of the chosen methods christians have used to take to gays and lesbians about whether their behavior is christian or not and discuss whether those methods themselves are christian...

 

[dead2self]

So would you say that your heterosexual lifestyle revolves around heterosexual sex? I suspect not. Similarly, the lifestyles of most homosexual people don't revolve around homosexual sex. Sure, some homosexual people engage in homosexual sex, but that's not the same as their lives revolving around it.

Actually, yes for many years my life did in fact revolve around sexual things. Not only intercourse but porn. But as for others, take a look at TV, at magazines, billboards, movies, novels, or listen to radio. Please try to tell me that western cultre does not revolve around sex. Anyway, I am not saying homosexuals are simply obsessed with sex. Our sexuality simply haapens to be a major defining element in society. But again, this seems to me to simply be proponents of Homosexuality picking apart terms for the sake of it. No matter how innocent or neutral a term is, there is allways a champion for the "oppressed" to take up the standard and complain about it.

The bigger problem with the term "homosexual lifestyle" is that in reality, there is not one single homosexual lifestyle - rather, there are many homosexual people, all leading their own individual lives and lifestyles. Sure, there's some similarity one with another, but then in my experience, there's a great deal of similarity between the lifestyles of homosexual and heterosexual people. The only difference is who they're likely to be attracted to and (if relevant) who they're likely to be having sex with.

David.[/quote]

Of course all homsexuals are different. So are all heterosexuals. Or all Christians. I will say that I live a Christian lifestyle without making a fuss over the fact that all Christians live diiferently.

When we talk about any group it is impossible not to generalise somewhat.

 

[jamielindas]

When we talk about any group it is impossible not to generalise somewhat.

Right... that's why we should think of them as labels, descriptors and attributes.
My sexuality is gay, but it isn't WHO I am.

The fact that I am attracted to other men doesn't actually have a HUGE impact on my life on a day to day basis. It does matter, but it does not define me.

See, this is what can get frustrating from time to time; when you reduce someone or a group of people down to a single descriptor, label or even action, you devalue them as whole people.

To say that I am nothing more than my sexuality is offensive. It's not the generalizing that's a problem... is the reduction of a person to a single thing.

 

[Ohioprof]

Actually, yes for many years my life did in fact revolve around sexual things. Not only intercourse but porn. But as for others, take a look at TV, at magazines, billboards, movies, novels, or listen to radio. Please try to tell me that western cultre does not revolve around sex. Anyway, I am not saying homosexuals are simply obsessed with sex. Our sexuality simply haapens to be a major defining element in society. But again, this seems to me to simply be proponents of Homosexuality picking apart terms for the sake of it. No matter how innocent or neutral a term is, there is allways a champion for the "oppressed" to take up the standard and complain about it.

The bigger problem with the term "homosexual lifestyle" is that in reality, there is not one single homosexual lifestyle - rather, there are many homosexual people, all leading their own individual lives and lifestyles. Sure, there's some similarity one with another, but then in my experience, there's a great deal of similarity between the lifestyles of homosexual and heterosexual people. The only difference is who they're likely to be attracted to and (if relevant) who they're likely to be having sex with.

David.

Of course all homsexuals are different. So are all heterosexuals. Or all Christians. I will say that I live a Christian lifestyle without making a fuss over the fact that all Christians live diiferently.

When we talk about any group it is impossible not to generalise somewhat.[/quote]

This is an interesting and thoughtful post. I agree with much of it.

I would point out, though, that people who support equal and fair treatment for gay people are not "proponents of homosexuality." That expression makes it sound as though we are going around advocating that people have sex with a partner of the same sex, and that's not true for most supporters of gay rights. We are proponents of equality. That's a more accurate description of those of us who support equal and fair treatment for gay people.

 

[Texas Lynn]

Me? shame? Hardly!

...

There is a huge homosexual agenda afoot! It is highly organized and moving at great speed through society, knocking down strongholds of righteousness that have been left unguarded.

There is no "righteousness" whatsoever in the hatred against LGBTs being expressed.

Denials of such an agenda are completely unbelievable. It is a Satanic machine that may have you blinded to its source, but it is a Satanic agenda just the same, and the soldiers are misguided and perverse people.

Hyperbole much?

You've got THAT right! Jesus Christ is totally left out of the lives of the perverse!

There is nothing whatsoever "perverse" about homosexuality at all; all that amounts to is a meaningless epithet based on ignorance.

The hatred is found in the hearts of those who embrace sin--hatred toward God Himself, and His loving provision for a Saviour and Lord.

This is ridiculous. There is nothing whatsoever about homosexuality that constitutes sin.

The attacks you speak of are not attacks at all! They are warnings and voices of truth that you need to heed.

There is no truth whatsoever in these puerile "warnings" which misuse Christ as a tool to promote heterosexism.

Christophobia lives here. It is behind the initiative

to silence moral and godly disapproval of homosexuality.

There has never been any "moral' or "Godly" disapproval of homosexuality ever expressed, only expressions of ignorance and bigotry, which all are free to make. They just are not freee to make them insulated from criticism.

 

[savedandhappy1]

Hi, savedandhappy1!

I do remember that post you made and I was aware that you posted the information in exactly the right spirit.

I know that you are only desiring truth to be known and that is the reason you post here, my dear!

Hi Floatingaxe,

Good to see you. It has been awhile, because there has been so much going on since my mother went home to be with the Lord.

I ask you and all my brothers and sisters to pray for a dear family who lost their wife, mother, grandmother, sister, daughter, and a dear friend to me today. She didn't know she had a brain aneurysm and it blew last Thursday while her and her husband were out eating supper. The damage was so bad............anyhow she past today at 3 PM. Please ask for comfort from the Lord for her family and friends. It was so sudden, and I will miss her alot, so you can imagine how her family feels.

Thanks for remembering the post I was speaking of and standing as a witness to the fact that I wasn't trying to do any of the things that I have been accused of.

Again good to see you. God Bless.

 

[Texas Lynn]

I am very aware. I contend that a homosexual is lost, spiritually and in need of a Saviour and Deliverer.

There is no basis for this whatsoever.

 

[savedandhappy1]

I'm curious why you think the OP was specifically about you and that one post you made a few months ago?

I find it hard to imagine this whole thread is all about one post that was made months ago, but if that's what this is all about, then I'd like to be the first to step forward and offer a hand of reconciliation.

Posting US disease statistics, and nothing more, is not maligning and scapegoating gays and lesbians. It is not spreading misinformation. It is unjust and wrong to make such an accusation based on nothing more than posting health statistics. I call on everyone who has accused savedandhappy1 of doing these things merely by posting statistics a few months ago to apologize and repent of their unjust treatment.

I am truly sorry you were maligned just for posting health statistics.

Please forgive me.

Not sure why you would think I thought it was just about me, but was just pointing out that not everyone who posted things that was being referred to were posted for the reasons that were being stated.

I am sorry if you thought I felt it was just about me, that wasn't my point. Even though it did soon seem to be just that. Again, sorry if that was the impression I was giving, because that wasn't the point I was trying to make. The point did seem to get lost in the accusation though, and again I am sorry about that.

I thank you for your kind words, and apologetic words. I am not sure why you would think you did anything, and I don't even remember if you did. I guess I should remember those who do, but we are plainly told that if we can't forgive others we can't be forgiven so I just ask the Lord to take care of it. That way I don't even have to go down that road. This is also the reason I explained what was being discussed and added that I wasn't going to continue with the exchanges. They weren't profitting anyone, and most of all I don't believe they were glorifying the Lord.

God Bless.

 

[dead2self]

See, this is what can get frustrating from time to time; when you reduce someone or a group of people down to a single descriptor, label or even action, you devalue them as whole people.

Actually friend I would have to disagree. I drive trucks. So do a lot of other people from all sorts of backgrounds with all different lifestyels, religions and moral values. Even the fundamental parts of our jobs can differ widely. However, I am a trucker. So are they. You may reduce us down to that single descriptor. By common usage it is understood that all truckers are not the same, even though a less than flattering sterotype exists. This goes for any single descriptor. By common usage, it is accepted by reasonable people that when you give a single descriptor of a group you are simply classifying them by one aspect of their lives. This in no way devalues people. Any thinking person must admit to knowing that every human is a complex mix of endelss things that could be labelled or classified and that each is unique. Accurately labelling any one person is next to impossible given the number of factors that make up an individual. Labeling 2 in a group even harder and one cannot ever hope to accurately label 3 or more people as a group if those people insist on being offended that the labels do not represent them in their wholeness.

Now given that, and the fact that this is a forum for the discussion of Homosexuality, it is entirely reasonable to use homosexual as a descriptor. Over in the trucker forum it is generally accepted that if we go there somone is going to call us truckers. Furthermore, they may actually call us all, as a group, truckers and even imply that we share a lifestyle. To an extent, we do. We drive. But I may tell you, trucker comes far after Christian, Husband and Father to me. Yet being called a trucker does not and wll never offend me. For as far a one can reasonably apply the term, it is what I am.

 

[dead2self]

I would point out, though, that people who support equal and fair treatment for gay people are not "proponents of homosexuality." That expression makes it sound as though we are going around advocating that people have sex with a partner of the same sex, and that's not true for most supporters of gay rights. We are proponents of equality. That's a more accurate description of those of us who support equal and fair treatment for gay people.

Duly noted. For the record I meant proponents of fair treatment of homosexuals. Forgive the inferrence due to my mistake in terminology.