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The “Trinity” is not three separate God’s.
Please go read the forum rules. Denying the Trinity is a violation of those rules.
As I said, if we don’t agree on that, which is a core doctrine of the faith, there is no point in continuing this discussion.
Or, maybe they’ll choose to read the entire chapter, or better the entire letter, and carefully study it for themselves. (If they haven’t already).
Just wondering why you keep repeating yourself. I’ve already responded to this.
I guess you once again missed the point. You pulled out verses from the middle of the chapter to “prove” salvation can be lost.
I addressed every single verse in your OP.
Let me ask you this: do you believe Jesus actually did enough to save us? Or is something more needed?
I haven’t ignored any verses and I certainly don’t dislike any of them. I strive always to understand them in context.
Now, as we differ so vastly on core theology, it is time to move on.
I never said I deny the Trinity; those are your words.
But don't you believe in God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit? I count three. How many do you count?
You have ignored verse 21; why do you deny that?
I haven’t “ignored” anything. Individual verses don’t stand alone, we need context.
I am not going to endlessly repeat myself. This is the last time I will say it.
I have studied that. I don't believe in three Gods.
Hi Em, why did you ask me what "come to Me" meant if you understood it then?David, 'coming to Christ' is no different than 'coming to anybody'. No matter if you are called or not, you must be willing to 'come'.
So many "creative" ways to not discuss these verses.
Hebrews 6
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.
7 For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.
Since you claim that is "you" discussing the details of Hebrews 6:4-7 --
We will see how the objective unbiased readers respond to such a detailed review of those verses.
In fact you do not address those verses 6:4-7. In Hebrews 6 you address the verses before the ones we are discussing (6:4-7) then a few verses at the end.
You knew we could all see that -- right?
Indeed. And as we all know the writer of Hebrews put no chapter dividers at all in his text.
Quoting the entire book of Hebrews to make a point about vs 4-7 in chapter 6... is pointless as I am sure you would agree.
I merely point to the verses that make my point and that you appear to not want to discuss.
By responding to each with "nope... I don't see anything here".
That is not even remotely exegesis of the text to show your point.
I think we both know that.
Let me ask you this - in addition to needing to avoid the actual verses in Hebrews 6:4-7 do you also need to avoid Romans 10 in asking the question you just asked?
for example Rom 10:9-11
if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes in Him will not be disappointed.”
And also to ignore Revelation 3?
20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me. 21 He who overcomes, I will grant to him to sit down with Me on My throne
Hopefully your response is that you don't need to avoid any of those texts and that they do not show what some erroneously call salvation by works.
I have studied that. I don't believe in three Gods.
You have ignored it. Well, give me the context of God not sparing you. He didn't spare Israel; does that mean they are still saved?
He does in fact “spare” all who are saved, born again and sealed by the Holy Spirit. They have passed from death to life and the wrath of God no longer remains upon them.
What exactly do you think is meant by “salvation” and “eternal life”? That God still isn’t going to “spare” us after all? That He didn’t mean what He said? That Jesus somehow failed?
He does in fact “spare” all who are saved, born again and sealed by the Holy Spirit. They have passed from death to life and the wrath of God no longer remains upon them.
I don't think I would blame it on God. I would blame it on the person.
Was His chosen people, Israel not saved? How did He not spare them?
Yep. QFT.Oh, but I'm afraid it does, my fellow brother in Christ.The semi-Pelagian conception of OSAS is false, but the Calvinistic doctrine of perseverance of the saints/eternal security is
I see we have some brother and sisters in Christ here of the Arminian or Methodist tradition.It's not a "single verse", but there is certainly this short passage from the Gospel of John to consider:
“ALL that the Father gives Me WILL come to Me, and .. of ALL that He has given Me I LOSE NOTHING, but raise it up on the last day." ~John 6:37-40 (excerpt)
Yours and His,
David
John 6
44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws Him; and I will raise him up on the last day.
.
Really? That’s what you got out of those questions?
Quite telling. If you ever want to give an honest answer, maybe then we can have an honest conversation.
The question is why did he not spare them? If you go back and actually read my post, (and more importantly, read the verses in context) you will see why.
And no, it isn’t because they didn’t do enough “good works.”
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