Orthodoxy & Comics: Is Paganism and the Old Ways being brought back via Comics?

[JeremiahsBulldog]

In Europe, especially in the French-speaking countries, comic books are treated as seriously as literature. For decades now, the European comics industry has - just like literature - children's and adult divisions. And many genres: contemporary, history, sci-fi... even westerns. There are some differences between them and American comics.

-1-
The comic-books are monthly, magazine-size, hardcover editions called "albums". A comic album can contain several short stories, or one complete story (like an american "one-shot"); or, a story can span several albums.

The closest thing to an ongoing comic-book series would usually be a story spanning several albums, coming to an end; and then leading to one or more sequels, each spanning several albums. Though there are also some series.

There are also monthly magazines which contain anthologies of comics short stories. For example, Metal Hurlant, also published in N America as Heavy Metal.

-2-
While the stories have heroes and villains like all literature, they tend to be conventional action heroes and villains, (like the old-west sheriff, James Bond, or Captain Kirk, and their adversaries), and not the formulaic superheroes and supervillains (superpowers + secret identity + funny costume + funny name) typical of American comics.

-3-
Most of the stories are secular, and (especially in sci-fi/horror) new-agey or downright neo-pagan. But there are also stories with Christian themes. And, since the french-speaking countries in particular, tend to be Roman Catholic; the Christian themes include RC stories, such as lives of saints. Here are some examples (Sorry, these sites are in French. You could translate them with Google Translate or Bing Translator):

St. Martin of Tours
St. Columban
St. Vladimir
St. Alexander Nevsky
A general list of some Christian titles
Another general list

---
There is an English-language graphic novel about St. Alexander Nevsky being prepared.


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[ArmyMatt]

Interestingly, there is an English-language graphic novel about St. Alexander Nevsky being prepared.

that sounds interesting

 

[JeremiahsBulldog]

I edited my last post above.

 

[Gxg (G²)]

In Europe, especially in the French-speaking countries, comic books are treated as seriously as literature. For decades now, the European comics industry has - just like literature - children's and adult divisions. And many genres: contemporary, history, sci-fi... even westerns.

Had no idea whatsoever that comics were taken that seriously on an academic level in the European context. But that's awesome to know, especially seeing the ways many people assume in the U.S that those into comics are automatically into material for "children" rather than seeing comics has having complex/adult themes and narratives just as other forms of literature.

There are some differences between them and American comics.

-1-

The comic-books are monthly, magazine-size, hardcover editions called "albums".

Not understanding how that differs from American comics, which are also monthly...although I understand the album difference.

A comic album can contain several short stories, or one complete story (like an american "one-shot"); or, a story can span several albums.

The closest thing to an ongoing comic-book series would usually be a story spanning several albums, coming to an end; and then leading to one or more sequels, each spanning several albums. Though there are also some series.

There are also monthly magazines which contain anthologies of comics short stories. For example, Metal Hurlant, also published in N America as Heavy Metal.

There are a lot of comic novels that have the same methodology within the U.S context. Going to the book store, I noticed many that had many short stories present within them and also spanned time.

-2-
While the stories have heroes and villains like all literature, they tend to be conventional action heroes and villains, (like the old-west sheriff, James Bond, or Captain Kirk, and their adversaries), and not the formulaic superheroes and supervillains (superpowers + secret identity + funny costume + funny name) typical of American comics.

Can definately see that. Part of me was thinking of the ways that there seems to be more focus on superhero comics in the U.S rather than those with technological abiltiies (i.e. James Bond), even though both exist in American culture and are talked on often (especially heros that are specialists due to their abilities/the ways they train themselves to be the best of the best----or others who are anti-heros in that they're vigilante, like Max Payne or Punisher, and dress normal in many cases)....while it seems that European comics focus mainly on heros who do not have powers and seem to be within the "adventure" genre more than anything else.

-3-
Most of the stories are secular, and (especially in sci-fi/horror) new-agey or downright neo-pagan.

How strong of a neo-pagan dynamic do those comics tend to possess? What is shared in them? For it sounds rather intensive based on how you described it..

But there are also stories with Christian themes. And, since the french-speaking countries in particular, tend to be Roman Catholic; the Christian themes include RC stories, such as lives of saints. Here are some examples (Sorry, these sites are in French. You could translate them with Google Translate or Bing Translator):

St. Martin of Tours
St. Columban
St. Vladimir
St. Alexander Nevsky
A general list of some Christian titles
Another general list

---

Fascinating, as I had no ideas that the lives of believers/saints were actually being made into comic/art form. Very thankful for them doing so, as I went to many of the links and it was interesting seeing the ways they were portrayed.

Perhaps the same would have been the case in the history of the U.S if there was more of a Christian culture (or certain times in history where CHristian themes were in view had comics made to reflect that).

Many thanks for sharing from the multi-cultural perspective you have via comics, as it's very insighful.

 

[Gxg (G²)]

there are also stories with Christian themes. And, since the french-speaking countries in particular, tend to be Roman Catholic; the Christian themes include RC stories, such as lives of saints. Here are some examples (Sorry, these sites are in French. You could translate them with Google Translate or Bing Translator):

St. Martin of Tours
St. Columban
St. Vladimir
St. Alexander Nevsky
A general list of some Christian titles
Another general list

---
There is an English-language graphic novel about St. Alexander Nevsky being prepared.

.

Letting you know that I think the graphic novel about St. Alexander Nevsky is absolutely stunning WFrom what I've studied thus far historically, St.Alexander Nevsky was truly an epic individual in many ways....Prince of Russia and being to Russian culture/Russian Orthodoxy what President George Washington is to American culture (alongside American Revolutionary ideology) because of how he bravely fought off invasion of others who wouldn't protect Russian identity.

​

So glad they came out with a novel that has great class in artistic style/presentation...for comics are truly some of the best ways to present historical truth--and the discipline that goes into comics is truly a lot. And I'm very thankful that the writers didn't feel the need to do creative liscense as has occurred with other historical figures made into comics. Not every historical figure needs to be given powers or made to be larger than life in order to make a large impact when learning of them....and comic art is truly one of the best ways to communicate historical truth.​

As another noted well on the comic:

Neither McCool or Guevara shy away from the potential impact of “silent” panels. Though Alexander Nevsky was a “talking” film when released in 1938, the influence of silent cinema on Eisenstein’s filmmaking remained, and produced the peculiar visual style of silence during movement to create thematic weight. The scene from the film, and also present in the graphic novel of the “Battle on the Ice” is a salient example. Guevara does not litter the clash between armies with overcrowded sound effects. We see small groups of combatants poised in motion. Facial expressions and physical positions replace dialogue or suggested sound, and remind us what comics can do particularly well: tell a story through direct visual cues which invite reader participation for interpretation.

...​

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Passalaqua’s colors also create an iconic palette for this comic, quite literally. The text is seeped in the ethereal blues of the interiors of Orthodox church domes and religious annunciations. It’s set off and edged with the intense reds of illustrated saints’ lives on wooden panels, and has a particular golden-brown glow of vellum manuscript pages and wooden statuary. Blue predominates imbuing the story with a particular mood of the sacred.​

​

Hoping for the day when they begin to make more novels on the lives of saints from the Byzantine era and other time periods (especially of those monks/priests who were warriors and adventurous)...but till then, glad for what they've already come out with

​

 

[JeremiahsBulldog]

My long-winded description of the album format was just to help you visualize the books when you look at the shrunken pictures in the sites I linked to. The albums are about the same size and thickness as magazines, and with hard covers.

The pagan themes in the stories are no better or worse, I suppose, than American comics. They'll show exotic cultures in, say Africa or Nepal, in such a way as to suggest that their magic spells and polytheistic rituals are more real than christianity. In the sci-fi/fantasy/horror genres, science will be combined with magic (like the force in Star Wars), with magic sometimes shown to be superior.

btw, The evangelical publisher Zondervan has just released a graphic novel about the Book of Revelation.

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[JeremiahsBulldog]

As far as the serious study of comics is concerned, there are already several excellent books on the history of comics. Two important ones are:

-1-
Comics and Sequential Art, by comics artist Will Eisner(1985).

-2-
Understanding Comics, by comics creator Scott McCloud (1993).


Both these books categorize comics as the modern version of sequential art. This links them to the whole history of art, going back to prehistoric cave paintings. Even manga (Japanese comic books) can be linked to traditional Japanese sequential art.

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[Gxg (G²)]

My long-winded description of the album format was just to help you visualize the books when you look at the shrunken pictures in the sites I linked to. The albums are about the same size and thickness as magazines, and with hard covers.
.

Got ya and thanks for the clarification. On a side note, didn't think the description you gave was "long-winded" at all personally

The pagan themes in the stories are no better or worse, I suppose, than American comics. They'll show exotic cultures in, say Africa or Nepal, in such a way as to suggest that their magic spells and polytheistic rituals are more real than christianity.

Odd..

How is it that Christianity is shown to have less reality than the other cultures? Is Christ depicted in the comics as if it's a myth?

In the sci-fi/fantasy/horror genres, science will be combined with magic (like the force in Star Wars), with magic sometimes shown to be superior.

The mix of science and magic seems to be on the rise nowadays. They had a comic series on that here in the West, entitled "Battle Chasers"...and it did some of the same, even though the artwork/concept was amazing.

​

​

It was like being in the Middle Ages and seeing the magical side contrasted with science (science itself being deemed a type of magic/sorcery). But the genre of stories taking place in an arcanepunk setting is very similar to what we see today.

btw, The evangelical publisher Zondervan has just released a graphic novel about the Book of Revelation.

They've been trying to do a lot of that lately..

 

[JeremiahsBulldog]

In European comics, Christianity gets mostly the same negative treatment as in Hollywood movies or modern novels. Christians are usually depicted as: blood-thirsty crusaders, evil inquisitors, oppressors of nuns, or plain purveyors of myths.

Or, in the sci-fi genre, a futuristic religion based on the RC church will be shown as . . . blood-thirsty crusaders, evil inquisitors, oppressors of nuns, or plain purveyors of myths.

It is then the hero's job to: rebel against it, or start an armed uprising, or overcome it with some newly-discovered magic talisman or ritual.

Except, of course, in the above-mentioned Christian comics.

 

[Gxg (G²)]

As far as the serious study of comics is concerned, there are already several excellent books on the history of comics. Two important ones are:

-1-
Comics and Sequential Art, by comics artist Will Eisner(1985).

-2-
Understanding Comics, by comics creator Scott McCloud (1993).



Both these books categorize comics as the modern version of sequential art.


This links them to the whole history of art, going back to prehistoric cave
paintings.
.

Although I know of others that were good reads, haven't caught those you brought up. Will need to check them out if at the bookstore and they have them available. I more than agree that sequential art is the proper place comics belong to...and thus, people (IMHO) need to take them more seriously whenever commentary occurs on them having no impact. It's a true form of aristic thought and meaning..

Even manga (Japanese comic books) can be linked to traditional Japanese sequential art.

Manga is another world in/of itself that can be very troublesome, especially in light of how much of it is truly comic art gone bad. I'm thinking specifically of the heavy sexualization present in many of the stories, much of it being directly related to inappropriate contentagraphy...even showing children being involved...and yet it's accepted. Japan actually made a law against manga that made it regulated in the way girls are depicted (more here )--but it can be difficult to handle that when the entire culture is often focused on making sexualization akin to innocence (as another said best elsewhere).....Although there are many aspects of manga that have been very beautiful when kept clean.

Actually bought a Manga Bible for one of the kids I worked with and they loved it, as I was very impressed

 

[Gxg (G²)]

In European comics, Christianity gets mostly the same negative treatment as in Hollywood movies or modern novels. Christians are usually depicted as: blood-thirsty crusaders, evil inquisitors, oppressors of nuns, or plain purveyors of myths.


Or, in the sci-fi genre, a futuristic religion based on the RC church will be shown as . . . blood-thirsty crusaders, evil inquisitors, oppressors of nuns, or plain purveyors of myths. .

Never will understand that and why it seems to be those who are Christians that're displayed as the "monsters" while other cultures are seen as the victims. It has gone in reverse many times, with the Christians being on the other end of violence at the hands of those who are dogmatically atheist or supporting other perspectives...and the fact that Europe would keep that from being displayed actively in the comics is odd. The French Revolution, Communist Regime, Germany under Hitler's regime and so many others..

It is then the hero's job to: rebel against it, or start an armed uprising, or overcome it with some newly-discovered magic talisman or ritual.

It seems, from what you noted, to be a definate return to paganism since they often felt the Christians were the ones who were brutes and that relying on magic/the "Old Ways" was the key to prosperity.

Except, of course, in the above-mentioned Christian comics

Thank goodness that Christian comics at least exist. Here in the U.S it doesn't seem that Christians are denoucned as much as they are potrayed many times as compromising....Christianity that's watered down and treated as simply one option amongst many others that are all equally valid.

 

[JeremiahsBulldog]

Manga, whatever its merits (I'm not a big fan), nevertheless seems to have influenced the west a lot. I detect manga artistic influence in the "Battle Chasers" art you linked to, for instance. Too bad the west can't influence manga to be more Christian.

 

[Gxg (G²)]

Manga, whatever its merits (I'm not a big fan), nevertheless seems to have influenced the west a lot. I detect manga artistic influence in the "Battle Chasers" art you linked to, for instance. Too bad the west can't influence manga to be more Christian.

How would you say that Manga has influenced the West? I know there are many shows made in Asian culture that have been very popular in American culture (i.e. Gundam Wing, Sailor Moon, Dragonball Z, Tenchi, Pokemon, etc)....and at times, a lot of intros for t.v shows had a bit of manga style (like the intro for ThunderCats).

With Battle Chasers, although there are some episodes of it that had certain manga looks (which I enjoyed), the artstyle itself didn't seem exclusively based on it. The West could influence Manga to be more Christian if a Christian culture was stronger in the West, IMHO.

 

[JeremiahsBulldog]

With Battle Chasers, although there are some episodes of it that had certain manga looks (which I enjoyed), the artstyle itself didn't seem exclusively based on it.

I'm not familiar with Battle Chasers as a whole. I was simply referring to the art sample displayed in your post. I'm not calling it "manga". Just saying its influenced by manga. I'd call it a manga/western fusion.

The West could influence Manga to be more Christian if a Christian culture was stronger in the West, IMHO.

True.

 

[ArmyMatt]

oh I think there is a definite manga influence to shows like the reboots of TMNT and The Batman.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I'm so sick of manga....:o

 

[Gxg (G²)]

I'm not familiar with Battle Chasers as a whole. I was simply referring to the art sample displayed in your post.

I'm not calling it "manga". Just saying its influenced by manga. .

The art sample was what I was thinking of when you mentioned manga, as I was wondering where you saw it present.

I'd call it a manga/western fusion.

Can definately see that.

 

[Gxg (G²)]

oh I think there is a definite manga influence to shows like the reboots of TMNT and The Batman.

Ahh....Can't STAND "The Batman" show. Nothing like the old school "Batman: The Animated Series"

 

[Gxg (G²)]

I'm so sick of manga....:o

Curious as to why you express sickness for it..

 

[Gxg (G²)]

that sounds interesting

If you've not checked out the English-language graphic novel about St. Alexander Nevsky, it truly is amazing. Long overdue...