Is modern secular society headed down the path to Sodom and Gomorrah.

[stevevw]

I am interested in this as I was speaking to some friends the other day about how especially in the media, Hollywood, Music and entertainment there seems to be this pagan or even Satanic ritualistism going on. Things like wearing these head dresses with goat horns and other pagan symbols. Its alwats very provocative and sexual as well. Almost a celebration of our animalistic side.

I think I know what is happening. Just loike in the days when people defied God they turned to nature, to animals and nature itself like Stone idols. Now that modern society is rejecting God this same belief is coming back. It may seem natural for people to worship nature as god. But primarily when this happens its not really about gods in nature but the self as god.

Also in those times people were made gods when theres no transcendent God. As self is god desires and feelings and self experience becomes the god. Therefore pleasure and all the good feelings are moral and the aweful feeling ones are sin.

So are we seeing a repeat of the down fall of society like Sodom and Gormorrah or like with how Empires have fallen where sexxual immorality and pleasure and where the created is worshipped and not the Creator.

 

[Paulos23]

I am interested in this as I was speaking to some friends the other day about how especially in the media, Hollywood, Music and entertainment there seems to be this pagan or even Satanic ritualistism going on. Things like wearing these head dresses with goat horns and other pagan symbols. Its alwats very provocative and sexual as well. Almost a celebration of our animalistic side.

Good old drugs, sex, and rock and roll. It hasn't killed us yet and has become a part of American culture.

 

[Desk trauma]

No.

 

[Whyayeman]

Now that modern society is rejecting God this same belief is coming back.

I don't think the decline of religion, which I agree has being going on for quite some time (since the Enlightenment), has had the effect suggested in the OP. To me it seems to be a sensible, rational development.

 

[BCP1928]

Perhaps you could explain the connection between sexual activity and the decline of empires. How does departure from some arbitrary standard of sexual behavior cause the failure of economic and political systems?

 

[Maria Billingsley]

I am interested in this as I was speaking to some friends the other day about how especially in the media, Hollywood, Music and entertainment there seems to be this pagan or even Satanic ritualistism going on. Things like wearing these head dresses with goat horns and other pagan symbols. Its alwats very provocative and sexual as well. Almost a celebration of our animalistic side.

I think I know what is happening. Just loike in the days when people defied God they turned to nature, to animals and nature itself like Stone idols. Now that modern society is rejecting God this same belief is coming back. It may seem natural for people to worship nature as god. But primarily when this happens its not really about gods in nature but the self as god.

Also in those times people were made gods when theres no transcendent God. As self is god desires and feelings and self experience becomes the god. Therefore pleasure and all the good feelings are moral and the aweful feeling ones are sin.

So are we seeing a repeat of the down fall of society like Sodom and Gormorrah or like with how Empires have fallen where sexxual immorality and pleasure and where the created is worshipped and not the Creator.

These " secular " people are the harvest for the Kingdom of God. Jesus Christ of Nazareth pointed out that there are few who will be bold enough to preach His Good News among such as these. So consider His calling to harvest from the weary, scattered and lost. This is the only field we have. Think about it.

Matthew 9
35 Then Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people. 36 But when He saw the multitudes, He was moved with compassion for them, because they were weary and scattered, like sheep having no shepherd. 37 Then He said to His disciples, “The harvest truly is plentiful, but the laborers are few. 38 Therefore pray the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into His harvest.”

 

[essentialsaltes]

report on the Prince Regent’s grand ball from the society pages of The Times of London, summer 1816.

“We remarked with pain that the foreign dance called the Waltz was introduced (we believe for the first time) at the English court on Friday Last. … National morals depend on national habits; it is quite sufficient to cast one’s eyes on the voluptuous intertwining of the limbs and close compressure on the bodies in their dance, to see that it is indeed far removed from the modest reserve, which has hitherto been considered distinctive of English females. So long as this obscene display was confined to prostitutes and adulteresses, we did not think it deserving of notice; but now that it is attempted to be forced on the respectable classes of society by the civil examples of their superiors, we feel it is a duty to warn every parent against exposing his daughter to so fatal a contagion.” (Knowles, 2009)

 

[Whyayeman]

How uneasy the English mother would feel to see her daughter so unfamiliarly treated and still more to note the obliging manner in which the freedom is returned by the females. James Gilray 1810

 

[Rsdar]

The kingdom of this world is at enmity with the Kingdom of God. Unfortunately many Christians still are deceived by political correctness or this party is for us and that party isn't. The Scriptures are pretty clear on this. First chapter of Romans shows the state of the world and it's need for God and its state without Him.

 

[Whyayeman]

First chapter of Romans shows the state of the world and it's need for God and its state without Him.

That rascal St Paul! Wickedness all around!

 

[BNR32FAN]

I am interested in this as I was speaking to some friends the other day about how especially in the media, Hollywood, Music and entertainment there seems to be this pagan or even Satanic ritualistism going on. Things like wearing these head dresses with goat horns and other pagan symbols. Its alwats very provocative and sexual as well. Almost a celebration of our animalistic side.

I think I know what is happening. Just loike in the days when people defied God they turned to nature, to animals and nature itself like Stone idols. Now that modern society is rejecting God this same belief is coming back. It may seem natural for people to worship nature as god. But primarily when this happens its not really about gods in nature but the self as god.

Also in those times people were made gods when theres no transcendent God. As self is god desires and feelings and self experience becomes the god. Therefore pleasure and all the good feelings are moral and the aweful feeling ones are sin.

So are we seeing a repeat of the down fall of society like Sodom and Gormorrah or like with how Empires have fallen where sexxual immorality and pleasure and where the created is worshipped and not the Creator.

Not a repeat just a continuation of what man has been doing since creation.

 

[BNR32FAN]

These " secular " people are the harvest for the Kingdom of God. Jesus Christ of Nazareth pointed out that there are few who will be bold enough to preach His Good News among such as these. So consider His calling to harvest from the weary, scattered and lost. This is the only field we have. Think about it.

Matthew 9
35 Then Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people. 36 But when He saw the multitudes, He was moved with compassion for them, because they were weary and scattered, like sheep having no shepherd. 37 Then He said to His disciples, “The harvest truly is plentiful, but the laborers are few. 38 Therefore pray the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into His harvest.”

Wow there a lot of truth to this very good point sister. But then again an argument could be made that if they hear the gospel and reject it then we should shake the dust from our sandals. But your absolutely right in the aspect that all of us were secular at one time and that we are called to preach the gospel to all nations.

 

[Roderick Spode]

I am interested in this as I was speaking to some friends the other day about how especially in the media, Hollywood, Music and entertainment there seems to be this pagan or even Satanic ritualistism going on. Things like wearing these head dresses with goat horns and other pagan symbols. Its alwats very provocative and sexual as well. Almost a celebration of our animalistic side.

I think I know what is happening. Just loike in the days when people defied God they turned to nature, to animals and nature itself like Stone idols. Now that modern society is rejecting God this same belief is coming back. It may seem natural for people to worship nature as god. But primarily when this happens its not really about gods in nature but the self as god.

Also in those times people were made gods when theres no transcendent God. As self is god desires and feelings and self experience becomes the god. Therefore pleasure and all the good feelings are moral and the aweful feeling ones are sin.

So are we seeing a repeat of the down fall of society like Sodom and Gormorrah or like with how Empires have fallen where sexxual immorality and pleasure and where the created is worshipped and not the Creator.

There have always been similarities with any society, and Sodom and Gomorrah. One particular society that often seems to be associated with S&G, is San Francisco. However, San Francisco is far from S&G which appears to have been cities that were lawless, at least in terms of human rights of it's average citizen, and strangers. We can go to most cities in the world, and have relative protection. Even in dangerous cities or neighborhoods, even where law enforcement is corrupt, in principle the law is meant to provide protection. This didn't seem to be the case in S&G. A stranger, and average citizen could be open target. And the number of people accounted as righteous were so few, that evacuation could be done for them quick enough to avoid the destruction.

I think with the addition of the internet, particularly YouTube, it's easier to get the impression of S&G being right at our fingertips (whether it is or not). It seems a lot of videos on the subject use common clickbait tactics, showing thumbnail pictures we already know won't show up in the video, etc.

 

[Rsdar]

I do wish sometimes I had some hope in man to solve these problems. Then I think it's irrational to think man can solve them because man himself is the problem. I am at least thankful that God revealed that to us so we would know where to place our faith and hope.

 

[RandytheOldGuy]

'No' to what?

 

[Desk trauma]

'No' to what?

The question posed in the OP.

 

[ViaCrucis]

I am interested in this as I was speaking to some friends the other day about how especially in the media, Hollywood, Music and entertainment there seems to be this pagan or even Satanic ritualistism going on. Things like wearing these head dresses with goat horns and other pagan symbols. Its alwats very provocative and sexual as well. Almost a celebration of our animalistic side.

I think I know what is happening. Just loike in the days when people defied God they turned to nature, to animals and nature itself like Stone idols. Now that modern society is rejecting God this same belief is coming back. It may seem natural for people to worship nature as god. But primarily when this happens its not really about gods in nature but the self as god.

Also in those times people were made gods when theres no transcendent God. As self is god desires and feelings and self experience becomes the god. Therefore pleasure and all the good feelings are moral and the aweful feeling ones are sin.

So are we seeing a repeat of the down fall of society like Sodom and Gormorrah or like with how Empires have fallen where sexxual immorality and pleasure and where the created is worshipped and not the Creator.

There is a strange myth, which people keep telling about how Rome fell. The funny thing about that myth is that if anyone has a working knowledge of Late Antiquity, and some basic interest in history generally--is that it's totally nonsense.

I mention this, because the whole "fall of empires" thing often comes down to this old myth about how Rome fell. But if we look at things historically, that's not really the pattern we see.

There probably are some common social factors we could find through that analysis--but I suspect it's not what people usually envision.

And that applies to Sodom as well, at least if one pays attention to it biblically, rather than impose what they think they know about Sodom. What people think the Bible says about Sodom, and what the Bible actually says about Sodom is actually quite stark in contrast. I've actually been mocked a few times for just quoting the Bible on this subject.

A society whose principles and values are not aligned with empathy, compassion, nor concerned with human life and flourishing is, of course, a deeply sick society. And, looking at the Bible--big picture--such is the sickness of the human condition.

So more importantly, I'd think, is how do we answer bigger questions, like, what is the goal of human society? What is its purpose, what is--let's bring a fancy Greek word into the conversation--the intended telos of human society? The end goal, the whole point, what is the destination toward which human society should be oriented.

Because depending on how we answer that, and talking about the means of getting it or hindering it, might make talk of Sodom and Gomorrah more relevant.

Ezekiel 16:49-50.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[stevevw]

There have always been similarities with any society, and Sodom and Gomorrah. One particular society that often seems to be associated with S&G, is San Francisco. However, San Francisco is far from S&G which appears to have been cities that were lawless, at least in terms of human rights of it's average citizen, and strangers. We can go to most cities in the world, and have relative protection. Even in dangerous cities or neighborhoods, even where law enforcement is corrupt, in principle the law is meant to provide protection. This didn't seem to be the case in S&G. A stranger, and average citizen could be open target. And the number of people accounted as righteous were so few, that evacuation could be done for them quick enough to avoid the destruction.

I don't think its just about danger. I would imagine that some in S&G were not about killing or mugging but about taking advantage. About luring people into their lifestyle of sex and partying to excesses and bringing everyone down to their level. All the sins that go with defying God.

If you look at some cities they almost look like hell on earth with people drugged out and overdosing, living in carboard cities on the streets with poverty and deprivation all around in the back streets while the elite celebrate their lifestyles. They may paint a pretty picture but under the surface we are seeing much division and a breakdown of morals.

I think it was Camelia Paglia who mentions that one sign of a civilisation headed towards collaspe is a breakdown in sexual morality where people become more androgynous. Where all reality breakdown and the long held truths that held societies together are abandoned like with Gods order of sex as between a male and female or we are all made in GOds image. Now we measure this truth by our identity group which divides people against each other.

These are all little signs of a society breaking down and it doesn't have to be measured in crime stats. There is massive mental illness and family breakdown unlike decades before. The fact is healthy and strong societies are built on strong and healthy families. But even the family today is seen as an enermy of the State and its agents ideologues such as the elits and corporations and radicals who push this rubbish.

I think with the addition of the internet, particularly YouTube, it's easier to get the impression of S&G being right at our fingertips (whether it is or not). It seems a lot of videos on the subject use common clickbait tactics, showing thumbnail pictures we already know won't show up in the video, etc.

What are the actual signs of S&G. Its not really the danger but actually the celebration of sin. That is exactly what we are seeing. At least in the past we had some moral compass and respect for God. But now as the balance is tipping toward more people rejecting God than believing in Him things have changed. The void is being filled with human made gods.

In some ways the internet is part of that. Even though it can be very useful inevitably it becomes a tool to control and promote the post modernist ideology of not Truths or Facts with false facts and narratives that poison peoples minds. Look how social media and the media in general can actually influence elections and can destroy peoples lives with cancel culture.

Inevitaably its the people with the loudest and most destructive ideologies that get the attention and take over the narrative and unfortunately they use a Trojan Horse of nobel causes to push their ideology and many fall fall it due to their kind nature. Now its mainstream thinking and dictates our lives.

 

[stevevw]

Not a repeat just a continuation of what man has been doing since creation.

It is a repeat in that we can look back and see this pattern of rising and falling empires or groups who moved away from God or even the life principles we know keep everything in order such as those of the West for example like 'Made in the image of God".

Which is basically the idea that humans themseves are weak and fallible and need something beyond themselves which is uncorruptable to guide us. When we move away from this we start to believe in our own feelings and desires as being god.

This was seen when the Pharaoh refused to acknowledge God and then they experienced the plagues and the deterioration of their society. Or even when the Isrealites rejected God and began to worship the Caananite idols where they began to suffer and their society broke down.

So we can see the signs that lead to this. In some ways the entire western civilisation is moving away from God and we are seeing the undermining of these long held truths and life principles like being made in Gods image and sacricing for others and the better good of all are breaking down.

People are becoming individualistic and more concerned with self, self pleasuring and hedonism. We see a rise in mental illness and people identifying with delusions based on subjective feelings that are made the basis for what is real and good. Hense rather than being united under one GOd and order we are divided into identity groups pitted at each other.

We become more tribal and that is when we become antagonistic and radical professing all sorts of lies as truths and dictating how everyone should be ordered. In other words we lose our moral compass and decend into whatever can be justified according to subjective feelings. If you look below the surface we will find a whole lot of debortuary and all sorts of crazy and horrible stuff going on.

So if this is the case then just like in the past when the majority of people moved completely away from God and Gods wrath came down I would expect the same to happen again as we move further and further away from God. I think we passed the tipping point around 20 years ago in most western societies. A concerted effort to reject God really began around the 60's.

Now most nations are pasing the 50% against God and this is reflected in the morals and ideology we are governed by which is rather quickly turning radical and unreal. So I think this is a repeat of past collapses but just on a much bigger scale because I think the West is so influential.

Whether the fall will come by self destruction and/or from outside forces such as conflicts with other cultures and the forces of nature brought on by destablizing things or from God Himself it's getting closer rather to that situation and will happen.

 

[stevevw]

These " secular " people are the harvest for the Kingdom of God. Jesus Christ of Nazareth pointed out that there are few who will be bold enough to preach His Good News among such as these. So consider His calling to harvest from the weary, scattered and lost. This is the only field we have. Think about it.

Matthew 9
35 Then Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people. 36 But when He saw the multitudes, He was moved with compassion for them, because they were weary and scattered, like sheep having no shepherd. 37 Then He said to His disciples, “The harvest truly is plentiful, but the laborers are few. 38 Therefore pray the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into His harvest.”

Yes this is interesting in light of current times and how many are moving away from God. It seems the culture at present has been growing to almost antagonism towards Gods message in mainstream society.

So it seems that going out into the world to preach the gospel is very relevant today. But it also means that it is a time frought with trials and tribulations where Christians will be called to put their faith into action and be persecuted in Christs name just as He said.