Orthodox Loyalists

[ProScribe]

Do some Orthodox Christians feel loyal to their respective church or is it connected with church and country? . .

 

[Dorothea]

I feel a sense of loyalty to my church - it's my extended family.

 

[Joseph Hazen]

Do you mean like, local church? Well, if all things are equal (and they hardly ever are, but take a situation where I have the chance to go to a Russian or Serbian parish, both all in English, both friendly communities, both with good priests, etc.) I'd choose the Serbian just because that's where I've gone before. Then again, my good friend who introduced me to Orthodoxy goes to an OCA parish, so I have a special spot for them as well and I would go there, possibly even over a Serbian parish, all other things equal. *shrug*

 

[ArmyMatt]

I feel a sense of loyalty to my church - it's my extended family.

I second that notion

 

[Ortho_Cat]

I like the AOCA, but I haven't been anywhere else so I don't know if I would like it better or worse. It's my only option, so it's a no brainer for me

 

[OuterWater]

I'm feeling less and less of a desire lately to be loyal to any particular country since my own country is becoming less and less deserving of my loyalty. I am loyal to my parish, my priest, my bishop. Most of all, to God.

 

[ProScribe]

It seems like most Orthodox, their church is connected to the country/region/province.

 

[katherine2001]

I second that notion

I third it!

 

[ProScribe]

<bump> . .

 

[Mariya116]

I feel loyal to the parish I chose to join and where I pay dues, even though I regularly express dissatisfaction with it - it's my church and my home. I'm also loyal to the country, as I obey the laws and pay taxes honestly! I'm also loyal to my ethnic origin, as I will only go to a Moscow Patriarchate church, whether far or inconvenient.

 

[buzuxi02]

It seems like most Orthodox, their church is connected to the country/region/province.

Correct. Traditional Orthodox countries did not know the concept of seperation between secular and religious until the 20th century.

 

[ProScribe]

I learned that from the novel -The Brothers Karamozov- by Fyodor Dostoyeksy

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

I learned that from the novel -The Brothers Karamozov- by Fyodor Dostoyeksy

I read it a few years ago but it was just on TCM with William Shatner as Alexei and Yul Brenner as Mitya. For some reason I did not recall Mitya's conversion when I read the novel. Very striking in the movie version.

 

[prodromos]

12 year thread resurrection! I think that's a record on CF

 

[ArmyMatt]

12 year thread resurrection! I think that's a record on CF

beat me to it.

 

[E.C.]

12 year thread resurrection! I think that's a record on CF

Normally we wait three days before resurrecting

 

[rusmeister]

I was part of a parish in Russia for nearly twenty years, conscious that my very presence was a denial that Orthodoxy was “a Russian thing”, of the essential connection some seek between their nation and their faith. It was an assertion that the Faith is for everybody, regardless of national origin.

Ultimately that denial/assertion didn’t add up to much. The ”nationalists” won, leading quickly to a state of affairs that led me to feel forced to leave the country.

Patriotism is a good thing. But when people try to fuse it with the Faith they go off in ugly directions. While it was in reaction to our own foreign policy, run by our neocons, leading to the Ukraine war, that fusion led to the rehabilitation of Lenin and Stalin, of Orthodox people nostalgizing for either the USSR or the Russian Empire, and we have even seen efforts to effectively canonize Stalin and get his image in icons (in a positive light).

I have distanced myself from the Russian Church; things said and done by its leadership, its Patriarch, bishops and priests, sicken me. I am ostensibly in the Serbian Church now, but don’t feel very much a part of it. So much has gone to the dogs over the past five years. I’ve withdrawn more into myself (not a good thing) and keep wishing there was a fast-forward button on my life.

As a result I’m navigating the shoals of immigration to another land that does not welcome immigrants, and wishing to God I didn’t have to. I have some critical moments ahead, and crave your prayers.

It’s clear to me that we can’t hold the two on the same level, that while we are right to love our nation, our patriotism should always be tempered by the fact that it is the love of a passing thing, a kingdom of this world, and we should never conflate it with our desire for the Kingdom of Heaven.