One Jesus, two testimonies?

[davedjy]

No, nothing I say can do such a dastardly deed. But your words reveal your position...

That is a contradicting statement. My position is irrelevant and as is my walk with God on this discussion, but you like to bring that up as if it matters here. Only one who cannot debate would resort to addressing a poster's walk with God personally. It isn't professional, and it isn't valid as a discussion point. I don't address your walk with God as it is irrelevant in this debate forum. So why do it?

I know exactly what I am talking about. Whitewash is just that---whitewash. Jesus talks about such a thing:

Matthew 23:27
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which indeed appear beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men’s bones and all uncleanness.

There isn't any "whitewash", I have already shown how the translators are unsure of the word definition. You cannot prove otherwise, so you resort to making the translators up to the same level as God. You aren't debatable as long as you do that, and it would not stand as a debate point by anyone.

I don't need to know the history of the word---the Bible is timeless in its message. You take issue with a holy God because you refuse to be holy. The translators were God-picked. I trust my God! Sorry for you that you do not.

There is no dispute, the Bible is timeless in it's message...however, translations have not been universally accepted, nor translated the same way "throughout time".


If the translators were God-picked, why would they not be in unison with each other?
Once again, your debate point fails, and there isn't any Godly wisdom in that whatsosever.

You can't even PROVE by the Bible that the translators were "God-picked", ONLY the Apostles were God-picked! that is the only thing that can be proven. Why would God bring translators that contradict each other? God isn't the spirit of confusion!

 

[Ohioprof]

OK, so Jesus knows you don't trust Him at His word. That's all I needed to know.

I do not believe that all of the words attributed to Jesus in the Bible are what he actually said. Indeed, most of what is attributed to Jesus in the Bible he probably did not say, and most of what is attributed to Jesus in the Gospel of John he quite clearly did not say.

 

[GenemZ]

Then you would probably need to explain why all translations are not consistent with each other. Or perhaps, why the translations such as masturbation, male prostitute, male pimp, have anything to do with the same thing as "homosexual". It's called biased translation. If you don't know what a word means, you translate it based upon what you think it means, but that does not make it correct.

You have no BIAS? And, I should listen to you? You just told me I should not!

Arguments based upon omitted text are not good ones. Paul does not condemn same sex committed relationships, nor does he use the standard term for sexual behavior between males which was the Greek term "Paiderasste".

Interesting point.

How long have these "committed relationships" been existing? Only until recently?

 

[Ohioprof]

Because you have sinful people who are disobedient and hard-headed who refuse teaching. Jesus calls them "stiff-necked" people.They refuse the Word of God as truth and they refuse Christ as the means for salvation...then there are those who say they accept Christ, but they lie, because they refuse to follow after Him in holiness.

So, you have all manner of sick people who need healing in matters of faith.

Everyone else in the Church of Jesus Christ have merely minor differences and they don't let them get in the way of fellowship or their obedience to the gospel.

I follow the teachings of Jesus. I have a different view than you do about what his teachings were.

I love God, and I try to love my neighbor as myself. That's the essence of what Jesus taught, as I understand him.

 

[Ohioprof]

You have no BIAS? And, I should listen to you? You just told me I should not!




Interesting point.

How long have these "committed relationships" been existing? Only until recently?

Gay people have had committed relationships for as long as people have existed. You only noticed them recently.

 

[Ohioprof]

Sorry, but the bible doesn't teach that. You disagree with God. It would be nice to see you say something that God says for a change, especially as you say you love Him so much.

2 Timothy 3:15
and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

1 Peter 1:5, 9
who are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation ready to be revealed in the last time...
receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls.

I disagree with you, not with God. I don't believe the Bible is the word of God, and so hitting me on the head with Bible verses is pointless, my friend.

 

[Ohioprof]

How confused you are!

"Born again" is becoming a Christian! So, as you know nothing about receiving salvation, how can you possibly contend for Christ?

I am not confused. I simply disagree with you.

I believe in universal salvation, and faith is not necessary for salvation. I have faith, but not because I am trying to earn salvation. I have faith because I love God and I love life.

 

[davedjy]

You have no BIAS? And, I should listen to you? You just told me I should not!

I have "no bias"? what does this have to do with me? I'm not the one translating the words!

Interesting point.

How long have these "committed relationships" been existing? Only until recently?

If they have, wouldn't that give it all the more reason to ask why they weren't condemned, nor the standard Greek term (Paiderasste) for sexual behavior between males?

 

[Floatingaxe]

I know many Christians who believe what I do. There are not many of them posting here, but there are many in the world. The entire Christian community does not believe what you do. Different Christians hold different beliefs about the role of the Bible in their faith, how to interpret the Bible, and what other sources of knowledge to look to.

You know many PEOPLE who believe as you do. They aren't Christians in the least.

The entire Christian community, as members of the Church of Jesus Christ--the Body of Christ--does believe what I do. It's the TRUTH! It's God's Word!

You are choosing to believe a lie. There is no other source of Truth than the Bible, and its Truth is revealed ONLY by the Holy Spirit.

 

[Ohioprof]

Because you have sinful people who are disobedient and hard-headed who refuse teaching. Jesus calls them "stiff-necked" people.They refuse the Word of God as truth and they refuse Christ as the means for salvation...then there are those who say they accept Christ, but they lie, because they refuse to follow after Him in holiness.

So, you have all manner of sick people who need healing in matters of faith.

Everyone else in the Church of Jesus Christ have merely minor differences and they don't let them get in the way of fellowship or their obedience to the gospel.

If the differences among Christians have been so minor, why was there a Protestant Reformation? Why did the Protestant churches then split into many sects? Why did some of those sects then split apart over the issue of slavery? Why is the Anglican Church today splitting apart over the issue of how to treat gay people?

If the differences are so minor, why these major splits?

 

[Ohioprof]

You know many PEOPLE who believe as you do. They aren't Christians in the least.

The entire Christian community, as members of the Church of Jesus Christ--the Body of Christ--does believe what I do. It's the TRUTH! It's God's Word!

You are choosing to believe a lie. There is no other source of Truth than the Bible, and its Truth is revealed ONLY by the Holy Spirit.

Ah, you claim again to speak for God. But you don't. Your beliefs are only beliefs, just like mine.

Btw, some of the people who believe as I do are Christian ministers. You want to tell them that they are not really Christians? I bet you do.

 

[davedjy]

The entire Christian community, as members of the Church of Jesus Christ--the Body of Christ--does believe what I do. It's the TRUTH! It's God's Word!

OPINION, opinion, opinion...

 

[Ohioprof]

OPINION, opinion, opinion...

Right you are.

 

[jream]

This is an angry thread

 

[Ohioprof]

Some people who post here seem to think that by shouting their doctrine over and over, they will convince those of us who disagree with them. It won't work. Shouting at us, and then shouting louder, is not going to change my thinking. It's just a lot of pointless noise.

 

[Ohioprof]

Yeah, I think some people are angry. I am not angry. I am simply stating what I believe, so folks know that there are diverse viewpoints among Christians.

How are you today? I went out and got some coffee, inspired by tulc, and I feel quite perky. You are welcome to share coffee with me. So is everyone else.

 

[Floatingaxe]

That is a contradicting statement. My position is irrelevant and as is my walk with God on this discussion, but you like to bring that up as if it matters here. Only one who cannot debate would resort to addressing a poster's walk with God personally. It isn't professional, and it isn't valid as a discussion point. I don't address your walk with God as it is irrelevant in this debate forum. So why do it?

If you were a brother in Christ, we would have a level playing field for debate. There is no debate when we are from two separate camps, spiritually.

It is relevant.

There isn't any "whitewash", I have already shown how the translators are unsure of the word definition. You cannot prove otherwise, so you resort to making the translators up to the same level as God. You aren't debatable as long as you do that, and it would not stand as a debate point by anyone.

It's a whitewash, just to fit your ideas. You don;t believe in the Word of God or that God is omnipotent, so what basis would we have to debate. I have said it beforer--Christians cannot debate issues of morality with unbelievers. It's like apples and oranges.

There is no dispute, the Bible is timeless in it's message...however, translations have not been universally accepted, nor translated the same way "throughout time".

Sure they have - until this new Sodom age.

If the translators were God-picked, why would they not be in unison with each other?
Once again, your debate point fails, and there isn't any Godly wisdom in that whatsosever.

You can't even PROVE by the Bible that the translators were "God-picked", ONLY the Apostles were God-picked! that is the only thing that can be proven. Why would God bring translators that contradict each other? God isn't the spirit of confusion!

There is great unity in the transcription of the Scriptures. Do you really think God, the Master of all Creation would leave the job of translation up to just anyone? Give your head a shake.

 

[Floatingaxe]

I do not believe that all of the words attributed to Jesus in the Bible are what he actually said. Indeed, most of what is attributed to Jesus in the Bible he probably did not say, and most of what is attributed to Jesus in the Gospel of John he quite clearly did not say.

You are a broken record. You are wrong to believe that. It isn't even logical to do that.

Christianity is not some smorgasbord, where you can pick and choose!

 

[Floatingaxe]

I am not confused. I simply disagree with you.

I believe in universal salvation, and faith is not necessary for salvation. I have faith, but not because I am trying to earn salvation. I have faith because I love God and I love life.

If God, whom you claim to love, never said that, then why would you believe it?

You are making it up as you go along. what reward is there in that and what assurance could you possibly have? Why do you disregard what He says?

It is obvious, you love only the idea of God that you have created yourself. It isn't God at all.

 

[Floatingaxe]

If the differences among Christians have been so minor, why was there a Protestant Reformation? Why did the Protestant churches then split into many sects? Why did some of those sects then split apart over the issue of slavery? Why is the Anglican Church today splitting apart over the issue of how to treat gay people?

If the differences are so minor, why these major splits?

The Catholic church veered way off-base. The Reformation blew it wide open.

Denominations are evidence that people cannot agree with one another, and that there are those who refuse to be led--so they leave their local body and start up another. It's the sin of sedition.

But there is a core of believers everywhere in this world who have it down good! Even with some of these denominations, the differences are relatively negligible, and do not impede on people receiving Christ.

The bigger issues such as homosexuality are blowing up congregations and doing great damage to the Body of Christ, because some churches are allowing sin and liberalism in, thereby bringing in that great apostasy that is prophsied about.

It is here on our doorstep.