Once Saved Always Saved - Why is it so hard?

[stuart lawrence]

What did Jesus say about collapsing houses?

26 "And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it." (Matthew 7:26-27).​

It sure doesn't sound like anything you are saying.
Jesus says, those who hear his sayings and does them not is like a foolish man who built his house upon the sand and when a storm came, great was the fall of it.


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The core foundation of the new covenant states the applicable law is written I your mind and placed on your heart.
That cuts out a licence to sin
It also states
Your sins and lawless deeds will be remembered no more.
That cuts out a law of righteousness

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Your post us frankly hopeless hason.

Paul states

IF WHILE WE SEEK to be justified in Christ it becomes evident Tha we ourselves are sinners...
He is NOT solely speaking of the day you get converted, and you CANNOT bevan evident singer under non applicable law.


I would give up I i was you

Nowhere does Paul say that our being in sin is an ongoing state. Before you said who is defending sin? I would say that you are doing so if you are now proposing that believers are always "found as sinners" in their entire walk with God. For can you stop sinning for 5 minutes? Are you found as a sinner for 5 minutes out of the day? How about for an hour? Can you stop sinning for an hour? Surely you can do it. So you are not found a sinner if you are not sinning for an hour. You can ask Jesus to forgive you of your sin and be cleansed of all unrighteousness (1 John 1:9), and then walk in His light as he is in the Light so that the blood of Christ cleanses you from all sin (1 John 1:7). Being found as sinners is walking in darkness and it is not the light or the true way of abiding in the Lord.


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[stuart lawrence]

Y

Nowhere does Paul say that our being in sin is an ongoing state. Before you said who is defending sin? I would say that you are doing so if you are now proposing that believers are always "found as sinners" in their entire walk with God. For can you stop sinning for 5 minutes? Are you found as a sinner for 5 minutes out of the day? How about for an hour? Can you stop sinning for an hour? Surely you can do it. So you are not found a sinner if you are not sinning for an hour. You can ask Jesus to forgive you of your sin and be cleansed of all unrighteousness (1 John 1:9), and then walk in His light as he is in the Light so that the blood of Christ cleanses you from all sin (1 John 1:7). Being found as sinners is walking in darkness and it is not the light or the true way of abiding in the Lord.


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There's no point in continuing this. You clearly cannot understand what is being preached in those verses, due to what you have already stated/ and / or not stated
Your above post simply adds proof you don't understand what Paul wrote

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The core foundation of the new covenant states the applicable law is written I your mind and placed on your heart.
That cuts out a licence to sin
It also states
Your sins and lawless deeds will be remembered no more.
That cuts out a law of righteousness

Okay. So a person can do drugs, sleep around with a bunch of women, hate, revile the poor, and yet also serve Christ? Surely not.
Christ is not the minister of sin (Galatians 2:17).
Just know things will not go well for that person's soul in the afterlife if they were to do so. The Bible condemns such sins (Regardless if they are a believer or not).


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[Bible Highlighter]

Y
There's no point in continuing this. You clearly cannot understand what is being preached in those verses, due to what you have already stated/ abd/ or notvstated

You have to actually explain those verses using the context. Just saying you are right does not make it so.


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[stuart lawrence]

You have to actually explain those verses using the context. Just saying you are right does not make it so.


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I can explain them. If anyone else asks me to I will.
If I explain them to you now, you will just ignore the explanation, so no point spending the time doing it

 

[stuart lawrence]

Okay. So a person can do drugs, sleep around with a bunch of women, hate, revile the poor, and yet also serve Christ? Surely not.
Christ is not the minister of sin (Galatians 2:17).
Just know things will not go well for that person's soul in the afterlife if they were to do so. The Bible condemns such sins (Regardless if they are a believer or not).


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Ok. If something I placed on your heart, can you wilfully, AND happily, go against it without conscience?
Yes or no

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Ok. If something I placed on your heart, can you wilfully, AND happily, go against it without conscience?
Yes or no

Whether that is your intention or not, at times, it sounds to me like you are defending the idea that a person can sin and still be saved. That no sin can separate a believer from God. Cannot a person easily misunderstand you and think you are teaching that we have a license to sin? You said before that Galatians 2:17 is teaching that we are found as sinners. You believe this to be the constant state of the believer. You do not believe it is talking about Initial Salvation (Which is the Biblical view). So the writing of God's law upon your heart is a moot point, because our conversations do not lead me to think that I have to worry about obeying God's laws (without severe consequences to my soul in the afterlife attached).


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[stuart lawrence]

You are defending the idea that a person can sin and still be saved. That no sin can separate a believer from God. Cannot a person easily misunderstand you and think you are teaching that we have a license to sin? You said before that Galatians 2:17 is teaching that we are found as sinners. You believe this to be the constant state of the believer. You do not believe it is talking about Initial Salvation (Which is the Biblical view).


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You don't know what I think concerning gal2:16&17 for as yet I have offered no explanation.
You yourself believe you can be a sinner and saved.
The people who concern me are christians struggling under a law of righteousness.
It is impossible for them to believe grace is a licence to sin

You didn't answer the question

If something I placed on your heart, can you happily, without conscience go against it?
Yes or no

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I can explain them. If anyone else asks me to I will.
If I explain them to you now, you will just ignore the explanation, so no point spending the time doing it

Don't do it for me. Do it for others who may come accross this thread (just reading).


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[Bible Highlighter]

You don't know what I think concerning gal2:16&17 for as yet I have offered no explanation.
You yourself believe you can be a sinner and saved.
The people who concern me are christians struggling under a law of righteousness.
It is impossible for them to believe grace is a licence to sin

You didn't answer the question

If something I placed on your heart, can you happily, without conscience go against it?
Yes or no

Again, I cannot see how your belief lines up with having the Law written in your heart. You said before in Galatians 2:17 that we are found as sinners. This means clearly that one has not written the law in their heart because they are always finding that they are a sinner (i.e. one who breaks God's laws). A person who breaks God's laws does not have the Law written upon their heart.


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[stuart lawrence]

Again, I cannot see how your belief lines up with having the Law written in your heart. You said before in Galatians 2:17 that we are found as sinners. This means clearly that one has not written the law in their heart because they are always finding that they are a sinner (i.e. one who breaks God's laws).


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At some point I will give the explanation of those verses, then if you are willing to see you will.

Why do refuse to answer my question. Are you afraid of answering it?

If something is placed on your heart, can you happily, without conscience go against it?
Yes or no

 

[Bible Highlighter]

At some point I will give the explanation of those verses, then if you are willing to see you will.

Why do refuse to answer my question. Are you afraid of answering it?

If something is placed on your heart, can you happily, without conscience go against it?
Yes or no

If the Law was truly written upon a person's heart, they would not teach others that one can sin and still be saved or that we are found as sinners as a part of their constant walk with God. Yes, of course anyone who sins and has the law written in their heart will not be happy in doing so. However, Judas hung himself knowing what he did wrong and he was a disciple of Jesus Christ. He committed a sin that he could not repent of. He was sorry about his sin, but he did not repent. Instead, he committed suicide. Peter was sorry that he denied the Lord three times, but he repented of such a sin and he didn't commit suicide. Therein lies the difference. One was unfaithful and the other was faithful.

Judas had a worldly sorrow.
Peter had a Godly sorrow.
2 Corinthians 7:10 says Godly sorrow leads to repentance unto salvation and that worldly sorrow brings death.


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[stuart lawrence]

Again, I cannot see how your belief lines up with having the Law written in your heart. You said before in Galatians 2:17 that we are found as sinners. This means clearly that one has not written the law in their heart because they are always finding that they are a sinner (i.e. one who breaks God's laws). A person who breaks God's laws does not have the Law written upon their heart.


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I will do a deal with you. If I explain gal2:16&17 do you promise to then answer my question?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I will do a deal with you. If I explain gal2:16&17 do you promise to then answer my question?

I already did.


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[stuart lawrence]

If the Law was truly written upon a person's heart, they would not teach others that one can sin and still be saved or that we are found as sinners as a part of their constant walk with God. Of course anyone who sins and has the law written in their heart will not be happy in doing so. Judas hung himself knowing what he did wrong and he was a disciple of Jesus Christ. He committed a sin that he could not repent of. He was sorry about his sin, but he did not repent. Instead, he committed suicide. Peter was sorry that he denied the Lord three times, but he repented of such a sin and he didn't commit suicide. Therein lies the difference. One was unfaithful and the other was faithful.


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Judas did not have the law written on his mind and placed on his heart. He lived under the old covenant
Thank you for confirming you cannot be happy I you sin I the law us placed on your heart.
The licence to sin is removed under the core terms of the new covenant
If a christian has not attained to sinless perfection they commit sin.
Ars you going to give sincere christians the impression christians never commit sin?
You will crush them with impossible demands I you do.

Try not to just have your head theology, think of people and their feelings. Dont crush them with statements you know you yourself cannot and do not live up to

 

[Bible Highlighter]

In fact, Jesus had many disciples that stopped following Him (John 6:66).
Were they saved? Luke 10:20 suggests that they were saved at one time.

Howver, were they saved after they walked away from Jesus? (John 6:66).
Surely not. Peter said Jesus had the words of eternal life.


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[Bible Highlighter]

Judas did not have the law written on his mind and placed on his heart. He lived under the old covenant
Thank you for confirming you cannot be happy I you sin I the law us placed on your heart.
The licence to sin is removed under the core terms of the new covenant
If a christian has not attained to sinless perfection they commit sin.
Ars you going to give sincere christians the impression christians never commit sin?
You will crush them with impossible demands I you do.

Try not to just have your head theology, think of people and their feelings. Dont crush them with statements you know you yourself cannot and do not live up to

No. Judas was a disciple and he spread the gospel and did miracles. He started to later slowly fall away from the faith. Hence, why he betrayed Jesus. You cannot betray somebody if you were never loyal to them in the first place.


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[stuart lawrence]

I already did.


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Fair enough. It will take me a little time to write it out. I may do it in two parts as I am on a mobile and I often lose cf. I dont want to write most of it out and lose it on my phone.
IF I explain it I two parts, please do not respond till both parts have been posted

 

[stuart lawrence]

No. Judas was a disciple and he spread the gospel and did miracles. He started to later slowly fall away from the faith. Hence, why he betrayed Jesus. You cannot betray somebody if you were never loyal to them in the first place.


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The issue is. Was the law written on the mind and placed on the heart of Judas? The answer is no, Tha is specific to the NC