Once Saved Always Saved - Why is it so hard?

[Bible Highlighter]

Nope.

The writer of Hebrews spends the first fourteen verses of chapter 10 speaking of Christs death for dins, no more animal sacrifices. Then he states:

The Holy Spirit also testifies about this( what the writer has been previously stating)

This is the covenant I will make with them AFTER that time says the Lord
I will write my laws in their minds
And place them on their hearts...

I am not in disagreement that this was prophecy and speaking of the New Covenant. Israel as a whole did not accept God's laws by faith. That is what it is talking about. It does not mean that it was not possible to write or hide God's Word in your heart in the Old Testament. Hiding or Writing God's Word in your heart simply means that you meditated on God's laws and you put them into practice. Why would God not help His people in the Old Testament to do that? It is in God's best interest that He does so. It is just as a whole, Israel was not willing to do so. This does not mean there were not a select few in the OT who did obey God or write His laws upon their heart. It is just that this would be more easier to do under the New Covenant because of Jesus and His new teachings.


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[Bible Highlighter]

So we too have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law. Because by observing the law no one will be justified

If while we seek to be justified in Christ it becomes evident That we ourselves are sinners, does this mean That Christ promotes sin?
Absolutely not. If i rebuild what I destroyed I prove I am a lawbreaker


The moment you become a christian you are justified / righteous in Gods sight for you have a saviour from your sin. So what justification I Paul speaking of in the above?

In rom ch6 he tells us we come to Christ as slaves of sin, and must change to be slaves of righteousness, but This crossing over from one state to the other takes time, it I not instantaneous. In order for this to happen, certain sin must be dealt with for by its very nature it will consume us and stop us crossing over to where we need to be.
Paul states This justification is by faith in Christ, not observing the law( we strive to be justified by observing the law)
Aman becomes a christian, he has much evident sin in his life, God starts the process of changing him from one state to the other. While this is happening the man joins a church. He enthusiastically joins in the service worshipping and praising God with still glaring sin in his life he us trusting Jesus for victory over.
What would someone think who did not understand the gospel message of sanctification?
They would likely think Christ must promote sin if Thi man is in a saved state. For he I praising and worshipping God while an evident sinner. However, the man does not want the sin, he has been born again, the law is on his heart but he is still entitled to rejoice Christ is his saviour, while he trusts him to turn him into a slave of righteousness
Immediately after Paul asks the question:
Does Christ promote sin he answers it:
Absolutely not! If I rebuild what i destroyed I prove i am a lawbreaker
What has Paul sought to destroy? A law of righteousness. Therefore, if he rebuilt a law of righteousness and strove himself to defeat the sin in order to be justified before God he would fail, and simply prove he was a lawbreaker

No. Paul says,
15 "What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness? "
(Romans 6:15-16).

Paul says yield yourselves obedience unto righteousness.
John says, in 1 John 3:7 that, he that does righteousness is righteous.
How does one do righteousness?
By obeying God's laws.
How can one obey righteousness?
By obeying God's laws.

Also, the word "law" in Romans 6 that Paul speaks of is in reference to the Old Law. Again, Paul is referencing the Old Law because he was trying to refute the idea of circumcision. For he said,
"what profit is there of circumcision? (Romans 3:1).


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[stuart lawrence]

I am not in disagreement that this was prophecy and speaking of the New Covenant. Israel as a whole did not accept God's laws by faith as a whole. That is what it is talking about. It does not mean that it was not possible to write or hide God's Word in your heart in the Old Testament. Hiding or Writing God's Word in your heart simply means that you meditated on God's laws and you put them into practice. Why would God not help His people in the Old Testament to do that? It is in God's best interest that He does so. It is just as a whole, Israel was not willing to do so. This does not mean there were not a select few in the OT who did obey God or write His laws upon their heart. It is just that this would be more easier to do under the New Covenant because of Jesus and His words.


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The law got transferred from an external law written on tablets of stone to an internal law written on tablets of human hearts( 2cor3:3

The Holy Spirit writes the law on your mind and places it on your heart at the point if conversion. This cuts out a licence to sin
Because, and only because Thi has happened you get a saviour from your sin

 

[stuart lawrence]

No. Paul says,
15 "What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness? "
(Romans 6:15-16).

Paul says yield yourselves obedience unto righteousness.
John says, in 1 John 3:7 that, he that does righteousness is righteous.
How does one do righteousness?
By obeying God's laws.
How can one obey righteousness?
By obeying God's laws.

Also, the word "law" in Romans 6 that Paul speaks of is in reference to the Old Law. Again, Paul is referencing the Old Law because he was trying to refute the idea of circumcision. For he said,
"what profit is there of circumcision? (Romans 3:1).


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Well I knew you would have to disagree, however scripture has spoken. The quoted text started by Paul saying the christian is justified by faith I Christ, NOT observing the law.

You are arguing against the very plainly written word

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The law got transferred from an external law written on tablets of stone to an internal law written on tablets of human hearts( 2cor3:3

Because Israel as a whole did not accept the original agreement of doing so. But again, this does not mean that others were not faithful to God in the OT. Just read Hebrews 11. I mean, what about Enoch? Did he not please God?

The Holy Spirit writes the law on your mind and places it on your heart at the point if conversion. This cuts out a licence to sin
Because, and only because Thi has happened you get a saviour from your sin

Yet you say we are found as sinners in Galatians 2:17. So which is it? Are believers saints or sinners?


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[Bible Highlighter]

Well I knew you would have to disagree, however scripture has spoken. The quoted text started by Paul saying the christian is justified by faith I Christ, NOT observing the law.

You are arguing against the very plainly written word

No. You are doing so, dear sir.
For you have not explained the verses I brought forth.


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[Bible Highlighter]

Also, Paul says that... now that faith has come (Galatians 3:25).
Does that mean there was no faith before?
Obviously not. See Hebrews 11.


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[stuart lawrence]

No. You are doing so, dear sir.
For you have not explained the verses I brought forth.


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I'm afraid your verses are not contradicted
Gal2:16&17 is speaking of a person crossing over from being a slave of sin to a slave of righteousness. They do not remain a slave of sin. But the process takes time. And during Thi Time they are an evident sinner.
You are doing yourself no favours by opposing the explanation, for you are opposing the plainly written words of the bible. This crossing over/ this justification is by faith I Christ, NOT striving to obey the law

 

[stuart lawrence]

The convert trusts in Christ to get him to where he needs to be. Christ does it through the Spirit, man does not do it himself by striving to obey the law!!!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I'm afraid your verses are not contradicted
Gal2:16&17 is speaking of a person crossing over from being a slave of sin to a slave of righteousness. They do not remain a slave of sin. But the process takes time. And during Thi Time they are an evident sinner.
You are doing yourself no favours by opposing the explanation, for you are opposing the plainly written words of the bible. This crossing over/ this justification is by faith I Christ, NOT striving to obey the law

Obeying Jesus is a part of our faith just as believing in Him for our salvation is a part of our faith. For James says faith without works is dead (James 2:17). Our works alone? No. I am talking about God directed works done thru you.


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[Bible Highlighter]

The convert trusts in Christ to get him to where he needs to be. Christ does it through the Spirit, man does not do it himself by striving to obey the law!!!

Never said man strives to obey God without God. Nobody can do good without Jesus living in them (See John 15:5). In fact, it is Jesus who does the good work in us and not ourselves alone. It is why the saints had cast their crowns done before Jesus.


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[stuart lawrence]

Obeying Jesus is a part of our faith just as believing in Him for our salvation is a part of our faith. For James says faith without works is dead (James 2:17).


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Paul is crystal clear. This crossing over from being a slave of sin to a slave of righteousness/ this justification is achieved through faith in Christ, not striving to obey the law. We trust in Christ to get us to where we need to be.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Never said man strives to obey God without God. Nobody can do good without Jesus living in them (See John 15:5). In fact, it is Jesus who does the good work in us and not ourselves alone. It is why the saints had cast their crowns done before Jesus.


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Then we dont strive to obey the law do we!!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Also, one does not just automatically obey all of God's commands (By just having a belief on Jesus) in the New Testament without actively seeking to do so. That would be silly to suggest otherwise. To prove this. Simply write down everything that sounds like a command in the New Testament (from Jesus and His followers) and see if you are obeying them or not. You will be shocked to find out that there is a lot that you are not obeying. It does not mean we have a license to sin or to do or own thing. For we are not our own. We are bought and paid for with a price.


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[Bible Highlighter]

Then we dont strive to obey the law do we!!

There are things we do struggle with doing in the New Covenant that are not easy for us (even with God or Christ's help). But Jesus said, "with God, all things are possible."


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[stuart lawrence]

Also, one does not just automatically obey all of God's commands (By just having a belief on Jesus) in the New Testament without actively seeking to do so. That would be silly to suggest otherwise. To prove this. Simply write down everything that sounds like a command in the New Testament (from Jesus and His followers) and see if you are obeying them or not.


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You simply refuse to accept what Paul preached dont you:

Carry each others burdens and so fulfill the law of Christ fal6:2

You can strive to obey the letter of commands all you want but you will always come up short.
What did Jesus say to the rich young man:

Just one thing you lack

There will always be something you lack when you look to the letter

 

[Bible Highlighter]

God wrote down commands within the New Testament for us so that we obey them and not so that we can disobey them. Yes, this can only be possible if one has repented and believed on Jesus as their Savior first. Nobody is disputing that fact. But salvation in Jesus when we first accept Him does not give us the right to go back to our life of sin as if nothing ever happened.


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[stuart lawrence]

Also, one does not just automatically obey all of God's commands (By just having a belief on Jesus) in the New Testament without actively seeking to do so. That would be silly to suggest otherwise. To prove this. Simply write down everything that sounds like a command in the New Testament (from Jesus and His followers) and see if you are obeying them or not. You will be shocked to find out that there is a lot that you are not obeying. It does not mean we have a license to sin or to do or own thing. For we are not our own. We are bought and paid for with a price.


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You simply refuse to accept Paul's message dont you. We do not look to each and every literal command. We carry each others burdens ( love them) and so fulfill the law of Christ
Gal6:2

 

[stuart lawrence]

God wrote down commands within the New Testament for us so that we obey them and not so that we can disobey them. Yes, this can only be possible if one has repented and believed on Jesus as their Savior first. Nobody is disputing that fact. But salvation in Jesus when we first accept Him does not give us the right to go back to our life of sin as if nothing ever happened.


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Gal6:2

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You simply refuse to accept what Paul preached dont you:

Carry each others burdens and so fulfill the law of Christ fal6:2

You can strive to obey the letter of commands all you want but you will always come up short.
What did Jesus say to the rich young man:

Just one thing you lack

There will always be something you lack when you look to the letter

Jesus did not say the rich ruler was saved. In fact, if you were to read the last verse of that chapter it supports the idea that you do have to give up something in order to inherit eternal life. It is a part of .... denying yourself and picking up your cross. But your gospel message sings another tune. It says, I am found a sinner (as an ongoing state of my walk with God) and yet I can also serve God, too. But Jesus says you cannot serve two masters. For you will hate the one and love the other.


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