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On Free Will

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by Hammster, Jul 1, 2017.

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  1. dqhall

    dqhall Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Matthew 9:36
    But when he (Jesus) saw the multitudes, he was moved with compassion for them, because they were harassed and scattered, like sheep without a shepherd.

    By my nature, I am incomplete. If I follow God like a shepherd, I may learn of spiritual things. Jesus had a body like we have bodies. He overcame temptation.

    John 5:30
    Jesus said, "By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who sent me."

    I have free will. I may decide to follow or turn away on my own. What happened to the sheep lost outside of the sheepfold at night? He was a dead sheep if a pack of wolves found him.
     
  2. Hammster

    Hammster Semper Fi! Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Where in those narratives does it say that they believed by their free will?
     
  3. Phoebe Ann

    Phoebe Ann From Mormonism to Christ Supporter

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    How can he?

    1 Corinthians 2
    14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
     
  4. Hammster

    Hammster Semper Fi! Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    So by your free will you just decided to believe and follow in your natural state?
     
  5. Phoebe Ann

    Phoebe Ann From Mormonism to Christ Supporter

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    ??? Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. (Philippians 2:3)
     
  6. Phoebe Ann

    Phoebe Ann From Mormonism to Christ Supporter

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    What makes us good people?

    Romans 3
    10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
     
  7. GingerBeer

    GingerBeer Cool and refreshing with a kick!

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    What's free will got to do with reformed theology?
     
  8. CodyFaith

    CodyFaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Matthew 12:35
    Romans 5:7

    There is a seperation of good people and wicked people.
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2017
  9. PeaceB

    PeaceB Well-Known Member

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    But God's grace goes beyond what you describe. It is an enabling power to live in the Spirit. It is a supernatural help of God that enlightens our mind and strengthens our will to do good and avoid evil.

    You can see the above in Scripture. For example:

    11 For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people. 12 It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, 13 while we wait for the blessed hope—the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.

    9 For I am the least of the apostles and do not even deserve to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10 But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace to me was not without effect. No, I worked harder than all of them—yet not I, but the grace of God that was with me.

    They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away fromb the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might, 10when he comes on that day to be glorified in his saints, and to be marveled at among all who have believed, because our testimony to you was believed. 11To this end we always pray for you, that our God may make you worthy of his calling and may fulfill every resolve for good and every work of faith by his power, 12so that the name of our Lord Jesus may be glorified in you, and you in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.​
     
  10. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    I believe he was saying that just the mention of Reformed theology will bring a "but man has free will" reply from the opponents of Reformed theology.
     
  11. Phoebe Ann

    Phoebe Ann From Mormonism to Christ Supporter

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    Romans 5
    8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

    Ephesians 2
    1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

    2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

    3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

    4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

    5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)


    Eventually --- but who has never sinned? Only God is good and His imputed righteousness is the only righteousness we have.
     
  12. Hammster

    Hammster Semper Fi! Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    How do you define "good people"?
     
  13. Hammster

    Hammster Semper Fi! Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    It comes up in every discussion.
     
  14. GingerBeer

    GingerBeer Cool and refreshing with a kick!

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    Oh! Yeah, that's possibly true. But free will is not a reformed doctrine. Reformed theology appears to go out of its way to dismiss the idea.
     
  15. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    Seems this way, eh?
    Thus, even the 'good'/ 'religious' people who think they have free will each day , day after day, as if each day to choose to follow or "turn away on my own" /
    and so they
    remain deceived, sons of disobedience.
    (as written all through the NEW TESTAMENT.)

    This is so very simple, but cannot be resolved on a forum/ internet.

    No, until someone seeks YHWH with their whole heart, with all that is within them , every bit, to serve Him always no matter what,
    they remain sons of disobedience with the rest of the world,
    as written all through the NEW TESTAMENT...
     
  16. Hammster

    Hammster Semper Fi! Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Then you should respond to the OP. :)
     
  17. GingerBeer

    GingerBeer Cool and refreshing with a kick!

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    Caiaphas did a spiritual good when he prophesied of Christ's sacrifice for the salvation of the nation.
     
  18. sdowney717

    sdowney717 Newbie

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    What happens to a persons free will when God gives people over to their sins?
    Were they ever free of sin at all?
    God gives them over to a debased mind...so then this reads to me like total depravity, a satanic captivity of the will, to which they are enslaved.
    What was different about Abraham you think?

    Romans 1
    24 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, 25 who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

    26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.

    28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting; 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality,wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving,unmerciful; 32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.
     
  19. ChristIsSovereign

    ChristIsSovereign Well-Known Member

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    I would have to agree that the natural man cannot do what is good in the eyes of the LORD. I can testify to that for certain. I used to make up my own 'God' all the time, thinking that I could please 'Him' by having ecstatic experiences at Beaver Camp and church services.

    At the same time, I now know that God was preparing me to become the person I am now. I am still a major work-in-progress and still struggle with a lot of things from my past, but God has been working those problems out of me slowly but surely. He delivered me from ecstatic worship. He delivered me from Charismatic churches. He let me understand the Scriptures more clearly.

    Despite not having a soteriology, I see this as evidence for divine election. I am not proud of it but thankful to the Father for giving me the Truth.
     
  20. Hammster

    Hammster Semper Fi! Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    He did that to glorify God? How can you tell?
     
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