Obama Won!!!!

[Gwendolyn]

Yes, I am proud of my political partys victory and believe that Obama will make a great president and will make progress in uniting the people. I willl not support his views on abortion and will fight and pray that FOCA does not become a reality and hope that Obama ends his association with Planned Parenthood.

The simple reality is that Obama is president and it is now time to address issues on an individual basis and not the individual.

That is a good attitude to have, BA. I'm not American, obviously, but I do think that Obama can do some good things for the US. I agree that we should not support his views on abortion... FOCA really scares me... but now it is time to focus our prayers on the country as a whole to make sure that this really does become something good and positive for America.

 

[CaDan]

Not so much.
Why?
Well right now there is a court case to determine if Obama was even born in America.
He is currently hiding his records and the DNC filed a motion to dismiss and then to conceal.

IMHO - if he had nothing to hide, there wouldnt be a motion to conceal.
Furthermore, it is of the utmost importance that this man's past and birth be absolutely exposed.

In the constitution - a man cannot run nor be someone born outside the US, nor may he have dual citizenship.

And Obama - who taught Constitution Law - should know that he cannot do those things.

SO - why is he concealing this information??

Brining us a reason and cause to wonder.

The matter was dismissed on a finding that the Hawaii records were accurate. Please stop spreading paranoid lies.

 

[benedictaoo]

The matter was dismissed on a finding that the Hawaii records were accurate. Please stop spreading paranoid lies.

But actual document was never produced and that is what the crux of the matter is about. Hawaii ponies it up and it's put to rest.

 

[BAFRIEND]

Obama did not dummy his birth records when he was in diapers.

He is the president of the United States chosen by the people.

Believe me, if Obama could not legally run for executive office- it would have come to light during the primarys- you know, the Clintons ?

Also, thanks to our current president- Obama's personal records are now off limits.

 

[CaDan]

But actual document was never produced and that is what the crux of the matter is about. Hawaii ponies it up and it's put to rest.

"Actual document" is irrelevant. There was testimony of the custodian of records as to authenticity.

Get back to me after you've taken Evidence. Until then, put a cork in it and stop spreading paranoid lies.

 

[Davidnic]

Archbishop Chaput and the other bishops who agreed with him treated Americans, basically, like illiterate peasants.http://www.dailycamera.com/news/2008/nov/04/personhood-amendment-failing/?partner=RSS

With all do respect Fantine. If the Archbishop wanted to treat us like illiterate peasants he would not have written a book to get his points across. And honestly...it is a great book. Very compassionate to others but at the same time direct in Church teaching.

The following quotes from his book are an example of the overall tenor:

Let me explain what this book will not do. It will not endorse any political party or candidate. Both major U.S. political parties have good people in their ranks. Neither party fully represents a Catholic way of thinking about social issues. One of the lessons we need to learn from the last fifty years is that a preferred American "Catholic" party doesn't exist. The sooner Catholics feel at home in any political party, the sooner that party begins to take them for granted and then to ignore their concerns. Party loyalty is a dead end. It is a lethal form of laziness. Issues matter. Character matters. Acting on principal matters. The sound bite and the slogan do not matter. They belong to a vocabulary of the herd and human beings deserve better.

Not a man speaking to illiterate peasants. Also:

My friends often ask me if Catholics in genuinely good conscience can vote fro Pro-Choice Candidates. The answer is: I couldn't. Supporting a right to choose abortion simply masks and evades what abortion truly is: The deliberate killing of an innocent life. I know of nothing that can offset that kind of evil.

But I do know sincere Catholics who reason differently, who are deeply troubled by war and other injustices in our country, and they act in good conscience. I respect them, I don't agree with their calculus. What distinguishes such voters is they put real effort into struggling with the abortion issue. They Don't reflexively vote for the candidate of "their" party. They don't except abortion as a closed matter. They refuse to stop pushing to change the direction of their party on the abortion issue. They won't e quiet. They keep pushing for a more humane party platform, one that would protect the unborn child. Their decision to vote for a pro-choice candidate is genuinely painful and never easy for them.

He does not excuse such a vote...but he does not attack those who make it as bad people.

Chaput has been maligned in the media. He has taken a compassionate but forceful stance that is on solid moral theology that does not shift or change. His voice, as a citizen, is one needed to hea. His voice as a Bishop is not to be mocked.

Personally I have read his book and respect him. I urge anyone who has not read it to please go to a library and get a copy. It is not a book for one election...it is not written that way. For anyone who wants a rational and compassionate presentation of many of the arguments often reduced to nonsensical soundbite...I urge them to read Render Unto Caesar: Serving the Nation by Living our Catholic Beliefs in Political Life

 

[benedictaoo]

Gwendolyn;



Its been happening in other forums and threads as well.


Anyway, I think Barrack Obama is going to be a great president. I think pro-life people will be surprised on how he comes down on the side of pro-life issues, now that he is president.


I've read his books, and learned about him, before he announced his candidacy for president. There is a greater man than what the campaign rhetoric painted him as.

I pray for his success as president. His success will be America's success.

Jim

Really, well guess what? Washington passed a suicide law for the terminally ill and California is passing gay marriage.

I don't see this country turning around, I see her fully accepting the culture of death and sin more and more and Christanity is fading. Christians may be plentiful but Christianity is dead.

What Christianity means to this country is Jesus is God and He died so we all have a free ticket to heaven and that's it. We have lost fear of the Lord, fear of offending such a good and loving God.

So forgive me but I do not share your optimism and Tonk's is correct, Catholic but our hearts are far from it.

 

[Davidnic]

Obama's a citizen that was proven via necessary legal means.

 

[benedictaoo]

"Actual document" is irrelevant. There was testimony of the custodian of records as to authenticity.

Get back to me after you've taken Evidence. Until then, put a cork in it and stop spreading paranoid lies.

I'm not spreading any lie... I'm not saying it is or is not true, just that I read the complaint given to the SC and I think they guy has a case.

And do not speak to me or WA the way you have. Do not accusing us of spreading lies. That is a nasty accusation.

If the document would be given to the ppl this "lie" would cease to be "spread."

The one that Obama put on the Internet is altered and forged and that is the crux, we need to see the actual document becuase the one he gave is invaild.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

benedictaoo;

Really, well guess what? Washington passed a suicide law for the terminally ill and California is passing gay marriage.

What does Barrack Obama have to do with this?

I don't see this country turning around, I see her fully accepting the culture of death and sin more and more and Christanity is fading. Christians may be plentiful but Christianity is dead.

I think Christianity is alive and well. Fanaticism has been give a place in the dark where it belongs.

What Christianity means to this country is Jesus is God and He died so we all have a free ticket to heaven and that's it. We have lost fear of the Lord, fear of offending such a good and loving God.

Christianity has a different meaning for Catholics than it does for Evangelicals and others. We live in a pluralistic society, and must respect the religious beliefs of others.

So forgive me but I do not share your optimism and Tonk's is correct, Catholic but our hearts are far from it.

Well speak for yourself.

Others and myself, are very much Catholic and our hearts are very close to the Christ and the Church.

One of the gifts of Holy Spirit is Hope.

I wonder how it is, that a professed Christian does not have this gift?

Jim

 

[Davidnic]

The real test here will be for the pro-life democrats. They have gained power over the last few years. They are pausing the Pregnant Women Support act...they are opposing the FOCA. They forged an interesting relationship with Obama with hopes of moderating his views.

We do not have an ideal world. But if the pro-life Democrats and the Republicans willing to work with them stand together on these two issues as well as approving judges... there is hope. Not only for stopping abortion but also for implementing many other points of Catholic social doctrine.

It is not ideal. But it is an option we have now.

 

[benedictaoo]

Davidnic, as long as FOCA is not signed. If it is, it's curtains for the Pro life movement.

The problem is Obama promised big and promised all things to all ppl and we all know he can't deliver.

It will be interesting to see what he chooses, the radical pro death culture or to put his money where his mouth is.

 

[NDIrish]

As much as I'm tempted to move the family to Ireland and become a potato farmer, now's not the time to run from the looming expansion of this genocide. We need to stay and fight for what is right...if all the good people leave, who will be left to fight the good fight?

This is certainly discouraging, but let's not forget our apostolic responsibilities...pagan Rome was defeated by that apostolic spirit....we can do the same.

 

[Davidnic]

What does Barrack Obama have to do with this?

Likely the argument, a valid one, that many voters for Obama voted for those two things. Just like Ohio in 2004 had ballot referendums effected by Bush turn out...or vice versa. The real tragedy was increased pro-choice turn out in South Dakota is likely responsible for the defeat of a move there to prevent all abortion except in cases of rape and life of the mother. The demographics are fairly telling with that one.

So, it can not be denied that no matter what the thought process of Catholics who voted for Obama...there was a strong pro-choice vote for him as well. The fact that I got 12 fliers from planned parenthood and 6 phone calls from them in 1 week...is testament to that. And that effected many ballot initiatives that focused on life.

I think that is a fairly strong argument. And although it does not strike to Obama personally...he needs to reach across the aisle as he says he will and restore balance in many issues.

Will he? I honestly do not know. His record is all over the place...so, frankly, we will see.

My main concern remains how formed he is by liberation theology of the exact brand the Church opposes. And how that can make some social agenda seem like Catholic views when they are disastrously opposed to the core of our theology.

 

[NDIrish]

My main concern remains how formed he is by liberation theology of the exact brand the Church opposes. And how that can make some social agenda seem like Catholic views when they are disastrously opposed to the core of our theology.

Bingo...this is where our Bishops will need to speak up with a strong, clear voice to instruct their sheep.

 

[CaDan]

I'm not spreading any lie... I'm not saying it is or is not true, just that I read the complaint given to the SC and I think they guy has a case.

Fail. "Complaints" are not given to the Supreme Court. Maybe a petition, but not a complaint.

And do not speak to me or WA the way you have. Do not accusing us of spreading lies. That is a nasty accusation.

I was pretty much silent while such wingnuttery was spread prior to the election. I let it pass. No more.

If the document would be given to the ppl this "lie" would cease to be "spread."

The one that Obama put on the Internet is altered and forged and that is the crux, we need to see the actual document becuase the one he gave is invaild.

Blah, blah, blah.

Fail. "The one . . . put on the Internet" couldn't be the original document, because it would be a reproduction.

The custodian of records has testified that the copies produced accurately reflect reflect reality. That is sufficient under the Rules of Evidence, and the court so held.

Look: Don't make legal arguments to me and expect me to not answer them.

 

[benedictaoo]

benedictaoo;



What does Barrack Obama have to do with this?




I think Christianity is alive and well. Fanaticism has been give a place in the dark where it belongs.





Christianity has a different meaning for Catholics than it does for Evangelicals and others. We live in a pluralistic society, and must respect the religious beliefs of others.




Well speak for yourself.

Others and myself, are very much Catholic and our hearts are very close to the Christ and the Church.

One of the gifts of Holy Spirit is Hope.

I wonder how it is, that a professed Christian does not have this gift?

Jim

Jim, the ppl spoke last night... is all you heard was we elected the first black man? Or didn't you hear? The ppl also spoke and choose pro death candidates all over the country and voted to pass individual pro death laws in their state.

Christians do not vote to pass laws for gay marriage or suicide or abortion but yet they have, so either they are schizophrenic or they do not take seriously their own values.

That is what 64 million choose... a pro abortion, believer of RvW, who will appoint pro death judges to the bench, a supporter of FOCA, person...

However Obama did not win in the landslide everyone thinks he did. Yes he did well but Clinton got more electorals in both his elections then he did and probably more actual votes.

Obama only got 200,000 more then Bush did... and he did not sweep the country blue the way Reagan swept it red in 84' and he didn't even do as well as the daddy Bush did in 88'.

So of course I have hope but we are at a fork in the road- we can go with this push to the left that is all about the death culture and socialism or we can stand up if we really haven't lost our way and show that we do care for the unborn and that we still do fear the Lord and that we are still a country of opportunity where hard work and family values prevail.

We will just have to see what happens but don't think it's Obama's goverment to run.. It will be Pelosi's government and its she we have to look out for.

 

[benedictaoo]

Fail. "Complaints" are not given to the Supreme Court. Maybe a petition, but not a complaint.



I was pretty much silent while such wingnuttery was spread prior to the election. I let it pass. No more.



Blah, blah, blah.

Fail. "The one . . . put on the Internet" couldn't be the original document, because it would be a reproduction.

The custodian of records has testified that the copies produced accurately reflect reflect reality. That is sufficient under the Rules of Evidence, and the court so held.

Look: Don't make legal arguments to me and expect me to not answer them.

I find you to be indignant and that is more or less what I was addressing, your indigence to someone who has a right to think what she wants.

I too have read the complaint and feel there is a case. I could care less if you disagree.

 

[MoNiCa4316]

I don't see this country turning around, I see her fully accepting the culture of death and sin more and more and Christanity is fading. Christians may be plentiful but Christianity is dead.

What Christianity means to this country is Jesus is God and He died so we all have a free ticket to heaven and that's it. We have lost fear of the Lord, fear of offending such a good and loving God.

too true.

I wonder if there would be more chastisements on the world from the increase of abortions that might happen..and just from the increased 'tolerance' for sin, people buying into the enemy's lies about so called "rights", etc... the enemy likes to use rhetoric for sure!

well pretty much everyone here at my university are celebrating that Obama got elected... even my professor mentioned that she's very happy about this, and almost the whole class agreed.

However, I've thought about it... what if freedom of choice act gets passed... what then..and Obama wants to sign it!
when I thought about that I saw beyond the externals. Sure he is popular, charismatic, has all these good ideas about social and economic reform...yet... check out the freedom of choice act and what it includes:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_Choice_Act
this isn't some sort of propaganda, it's from a pro choice website:
http://www.prochoiceamerica.org/assets/files/Abortion-Access-to-Abortion-FOCA.pdf


if this happens, there would be NO restrictions on abortions! think about that...

 

[stone]

According to the Hebrew scholars the translation 'GIANTS' is erroneous - and the actual translation is aborted babies.

Technically, this is not true at all. This denies what is written and i guarantee you Jesus would not approve. What did David kill with a stone and sling? a fetus? It's dangerous to change what is written, but then again, the sign of the times is clear.