• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.

Featured Pre-Trib Only My New End Times Chronology

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Bible Highlighter, Apr 9, 2019.

  1. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    Isaiah 14:19-20 is in context to the King of Babylon (See Isaiah 14:4). Is there a clear Bible reference of the man of sin or the little horn or the 7th king as being the king of Babylon?
     
  2. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,601
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    No, there is not that I know of. Everything has been sealed by code names. The prince of Tyre and the king of Tyre in Ezekiel 28 are two other code names.

    In Revelation, the book was "sealed". Without Revelation, the end times cannot be understood. 7th and 8th king comes only from Revelation.

    _______________________________________________________________

    Satan's kingdom in Revelation is mystery, Babylon the Great. Babylon is fallen is fallen in Revelation 18 is Satan and his angels being cast down to earth. As the dismantling of his kingdom begins. So from that it is apparent that Satan is the king of mystery, Babylon the great.

    His kingdom, it's sudden end, is likened to a great trading city of the earth that suddenly comes to its end. There is no earthly city such as New York, Rome, Jerusalem, Hong King, being referred to. It could also be referring to the crash of the world's economic system in the middle of the seven years.

    That the great city is mystical in Revelation 18 is in Revelation 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2019
  3. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    I decided to do some digging on this. Based on an article at Biblehub, it makes a good case that the Antichrist is Jewish. They reference Ezekiel 21:25. It says,

    "And thou, profane wicked prince of Israel, whose day is come, when iniquity shall have an end," (Ezekiel 21:25).​

    In Daniel 9, the "he" is in reference to the "prince" from the "prince of the people who destroy the sanctuary." Also, the time-mark is given in this verse when it says: "when iniquity shall have an end." It is the End-Time which is in view.

    Another good piece of Scripture that the Antichrist is Jewish is Daniel 11:36-37. It says,

    36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.
    37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all." (Daniel 11:36-37).​

    This passage, it is evident, refers to and describes none other than the coming Antichrist. But what we wish to call special attention to is the last sentence quoted -- "The God of his fathers."

    Thank you Doug for pointing me in the right direction on this.

    May God bless you.

    Article source used:
    The Antichrist Will be a Jew
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2019
  4. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    I am led to believe that the Olivet Discourse verses on the Son of Man's coming and His gathering of His elect by angels is a Mid Tribulation event and it is not the Post-Trib call that we see in Revelation 19. Why? The details and the order of the events.

    #1. Revelation 19 talks about how the bride has made herself ready up in heaven already (Revelation 19:7).
    #2. Revelation 19 describes how the armies followed Jesus (Revelation 19:14).
    #3. Revelation 19 describes how the angel calls the fowls in the heaven (eagles or believers) to the supper of the Lamb (the battle of Armageddon).
    #4. Revelation 19 mentions nothing about a gathering up of the Elect.
    #5. The Olivet Discourse verses appear to line up best with the Middle of the Tribulation with the following of the sixth seal in Revelation and not with Christ's 2nd coming.
    #6. In the Olivet Discourse: The Elect are gathered up by angels AFTER the Son of Man is coming. Yet, in Revelation, the Elect are in Heaven and they made themselves ready there and FOLLOWED Jesus into the battle down to Earth.
    #7. So if there was some kind of gathering up of the Elect by angels in Revelation 19, it would have had to been BEFORE. Yet, in the Olivet Discourse, the gathering of the Elect happens AFTER.

    Conclusion:

    They are not the same event.

    Why it is confusing is that folks automatically assume that because Jesus is coming, that He must be coming to destroy the wicked. But this time, Christ's coming is for the rest of His elect. Like in the Rapture, he descends from Heaven to meet His bride in the air. The only difference here is that the wicked will see Him coming this time. But He is not coming for them just yet, but He is coming for His Elect via by the gathering of His angels.


    Side Note:

    I decided to make this a commentary (i.e. Commentary #5) in the beginning of this thread in post #20.
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2019
  5. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    Update:

    I also added Commentary #4. You can see a list of all my commentaries in the first post of this thread here. I will attempt to add commentaries 6-10 (maybe 11) whenever I have the time to do so.
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2019
  6. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    Update:

    There are also two little things I want to fix in my chronology, as well.
    I will let folks here know when I made the changes.
     
  7. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    Update:

    I may add the "Crowns and No Crowns" part of Scripture to my chronology (Seeing it is important to some). I will probably add a Commentary (explanation) as to the importance of the temple sacrifice ceasing being the middle of the week as a possible Commentary #11.
     
  8. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    Update:

    I may also add the importance of the different beast empires and how that relates to Daniel's 70th week (or last week), or I may add the importance of showing how the Jewish sacrifice will cease during the middle of Daniel's 70th week as a part of a possible commentary #12. Today, so many are not following the traditional prophecy of Daniel's 70 weeks. They think that the antichrist could arise here in America, etc. This just does not jive with Scripture.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2019
  9. ItIsFinished!

    ItIsFinished! Jesus Christ is our only hope.

    +1,063
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    Good morning Jason, what are your thoughts on the Third Temple?
     
  10. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    I think the most important thing for us to realize by the nearing of the upcoming future rebuilding of the temple is that we all need to get ready and we need to watch. This means to love God with everything we got (even more so) and to ask God for protection and guidance in being ready. To be ready to be taken up; Or if we fail the test, to be ready for what is to come so as to shine forth the light of Jesus Christ to a lost and dying world. For me: The third temple is a sign for me to get ready even more. We are closer now than ever before by the fact that they are going to build the temple in the near future. So our efforts for the Lord should be with even more passion seeing we are drawing closer to Him. That is what the Temple represents to me. The Bible is being fulfilled before our eyes and our Lord is ever nearer than before.
     
  11. iamlamad

    iamlamad Lamad

    +546
    United States
    Word of Faith
    Married
    This was good up until:
    What things shall we escape if we pray?

    All these things listed in the Olivet discourse go with the words Jesus also said, "the end is not yet." These are church age events. No one escapes these things. It is the days of great tribulation that one can escape - which comes with the wrath of God.

    Jesus does not get to end times until Mat. 24:verses 13 & 14 - and then He skips over the first half of the week and goes straight to the abomination.

    Next, Jesus took all in Abraham's bosom to heaven when He ascended. That place has been empty for a long time now. The dead in Christ are in heaven WITH GOD. It is written that Jesus brings them WITH HIM as He descends to the clouds. Many people now have been to heaven and came back to tell about it. We have report after report, all telling us similar things - things the bible has already told us. Several people have SEEN Abraham and talked with Him. There is proof "Abraham's bosom" is empty. The ONLY reason people had to go there was because the sin problem had to be delt with first. Once Jesus died and rose again, than all the righteous could go to heaven - and they did.

    Different people talk of seeing Paul, Jonah, Adam and Eve, Abraham, David all in heaven. And of course many saw their own family that had gone on before. Therefore I am amazed you would think otherwise.
     
  12. iamlamad

    iamlamad Lamad

    +546
    United States
    Word of Faith
    Married
    This theory is FAR from Christian norm, and I disagree. First, Jesus was not mixed up on timing. The elect are gathered (note: from all of earth and all of heaven) AFTER the "tribulation" "of those days" has finished. How then could ANYONE imagine it is midtrib? Just so you know, it is the 7th trumpet that marks the midpoint of the week.

    This gathering in the Olivet Discourse is without any doubt God gathering all the descendants of Jacob back to Israel as He promised them. It has NOTHING to do with Paul's rapture or any other rapture.

    Indeed, in Rev. 19 HE IS COMING to destroy the wicked - that is exactly what the battle of Armageddon is about.
     
  13. iamlamad

    iamlamad Lamad

    +546
    United States
    Word of Faith
    Married
    Not so fast! It is not that simple: there are other absolute proofs that the earthquake is the very same earthquake as in Isaiah 2, which Isaiah tells us is a part of the Day of the Lord. John almost copies Isaiah word for word.

    Those people SAW and felt the earthquake, remembered the scriptures of Isaiah and Joel, and saw the sun turn dark and the moon into blood, and therefore KNEW the Day was at hand. The question is, HOW LONG "before" must the sign be? Could it be just long enough for John to write, "the day of His wrath is come?"

    Perhaps you need a little more time. How about by the first trumpet judgment? God's plan in THE DAY is to destroy the earth and destroy the sinners on the earth. As we read the trumpet judgments, we can see that is EXACTLY what God is doing.

    Therefore, if you resist THE DAY starting with the 6th seal, then push it to the 7th seal, or first trumpet - as you have done - BUT NO LATER. All the trumpets come with the wrath of God. The DAY has started.

    An earthquake may last for a few minutes, but it takes TIME for people to run to the mountains and cry for them to fall on them. I think that is enough time for John to correctly write that THE DAY has started.

    By the way, who is to say they did not see a blood moon a month or two before this earthquake? We have certain seen an abundance in the last few years!
     
  14. iamlamad

    iamlamad Lamad

    +546
    United States
    Word of Faith
    Married
    Great post! Good job here.
     
  15. iamlamad

    iamlamad Lamad

    +546
    United States
    Word of Faith
    Married
    "The Tribulation" or the 70th week of Daniel will begin at the 7th seal, NOT THE FIRST SEAL.

    In Mat. 24 Jesus said, "the end is not yet" showing us the beginning of sorrows is the church age. In Revelation John shows us very clearly that the first seals were opened around 32 AD when Jesus ascended. The first seal is to represent the CHURCH sent out with the GOSPEL.

    Seals 2-4 are the Red Horse and rider, the Black horse and rider, and the Pale horse and rider who all ride together. They are to represent the devil's attempts to STOP THE GOSPEL. However, God limited their theater of operation to only one fourth of the earth.

    Seal 5 is for the martyrs of the church age.

    Seal 6 begins judgment - what the martyrs were crying for. The church has been between the 5th and 6th seals all this time. Paul's rapture will come a moment before the 6th seal. The earthquake at the 6th seal will be Paul's "sudden destruction." And Paul said that we will have no appointments with His wrath; "they" get the sudden destruction, while those in Christ get raptured. Paul hints strongly here that the sudden destruction is the start of God's wrath. That fits with what John wrote, "the day of His wrath has come."
     
  16. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    I don't want to endlessly debate. But ALL these things we shall escape if we pray is from Luke 17 and not Matthew 24.

    You can line up what Jesus says in Luke 17 with what happens in Revelation.

    As for Abraham's Bosom: Many people (I am not implying you or anything) think from a selfish "ME" perspective (when reading the Bible). For they do not like the idea of going to some sub Heaven like Abraham's Bosom. For some beleivers use the verse in Ephesians out of context from how the Bible uses the phrase "lead captivity captive." It's an OT phrase that has nothing to do with the rescue of believers.

    Also, where are the dead in Christ rising from? Do they go from Heaven down into the grave to then rise again? That makes no sense. The passage on the Rapture talks about how the dead in Christ will RISE first. So they have to be in a place where they are able to rise.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2019
  17. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    Thank you.
     
  18. ItIsFinished!

    ItIsFinished! Jesus Christ is our only hope.

    +1,063
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    Jason, thanks for the earlier response regarding the Third Temple that will be built.
    I may offer some thoughts on that later.

    Where do you place The Marriage Supper of The Lamb?
    Also, who do you believe will attend?
     
  19. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    Your welcome.
    One thing that the new temple makes me think about are the words of Jesus that say:

    "There shall not be left here one stone upon another,
    that shall not be thrown down."
    (Matthew 24:2).​

    Some do not know this but the temple includes the outer court and the inner court.

    "Over against the twenty cubits which were for the inner court, and over against the pavement which was for the utter court [i.e. outer court], was gallery against gallery in three stories."
    (Ezekiel 42:3).
    This means that the wailing wall that Jews pray at is a part of the last remnant of the temple. It is the outer court wall. So these are the stones that have not been thrown down that Jesus is talking about. When they rebuild the temple, the wailing wall shall be in view of it being the outer court wall of the inner temple. The WHOLE temple (outer court walls) and inner court temple will be destroyed entirely at the 7th bowl judgment with a large earthquake. I believe Christ returns right before that at the 6th bowl judgment. But the thing here is that the new temple will be destroyed by God. The new temple is also something that Jews are to run away from during when the Abomination of Desolations is set up in the temple (i.e. the Beast's idol statue or image of himself for others to worship). So the new temple makes me think about the fulfillment of Jesus's words. All the stones will be thrown down. So while the Jews may rebuild this temple. The Lord is going to tear this new temple down. Why? Jesus is the true temple and Messiah. He is the new temple who makes all things new.

    Great. I look forward to it, if you feel like sharing it when you are ready (under the Lord's guidance).

    I place it at the breaking of the 6th bowl judgment with Christ's 2nd coming.
    The marriage is not a feast in heaven, but it is a battle.
    The phrase "eat the flesh of kings, and of captains" is an OT phrase for conquering one's enemies.
    So this will not be a literal meal, but a metaphorical one of Christ and His elect conquering the remaining wicked inhabitants of this world (who will refuse to repent).

    Disembodied saints (who have lived out their faith). For they come down from out of Heaven. Jude talks about 10's of thousands of saints. So there will be a lot of believers in attendance. But who specifically? Definitely those taken up in the Mid-Trib gathering by angels. For in the Olivet discourse (shortly after Jesus talking about the Abomination of Desolations and telling Jews to run for the hills if they see it) we are told that one will be in a field and one will be taken and the other is left. In the Olivet discourse we are also told to: "Look up for your redemption draws near." In the Olivet discourse, we are also told that for the Elect's sake those days (the tribulation days with the antichrist and his abomination of desolations) will be shortened. Anyways, when one shall be taken, and the other left, the disciples ask Jesus where they are being taken. They are being taken up to later enter into the battle with Christ at the end of the Tribulation. They will be protected against God's wrath until His return. For general faithful believers in Christ are not appointed unto wrath. They will be taken up to fight in the battle. Jesus makes a reference to where the carcass is, there will the eagles (us) be gathered together. We are the eagles.

    "But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles;..." (Isaiah 40:31).

    I hope this helps;
    And may God's goodness be upon you today.
     
  20. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +4,778
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    You can see the Marriage Supper of the Lamb placed at the start of the 2nd Coming in my chronology. I don't mention the Marriage supper until the body of believers is called to the fight.

    Here is part of my chronology that talks about it:

    The Second Coming of Christ:
    (The Lord Appears in the Clouds Coming in Great Power & Glory):

    Revelation 16:15

    The Sixth Vial (Part 3):

    "Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame."​

    Revelation 1:7 NIV

    Look, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him; and all the peoples of the earth will mourn because of him.​

    Matthew 24:27

    For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.​

    Luke 17:24

    For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.​

    Isaiah 26:21a NLT

    Look! The LORD is coming from heaven to punish the people of the earth for their sins.​

    Psalm 96:13 NKJV

    For He is coming, for He is coming to judge the earth. He shall judge the world with righteousness​

    Revelation 19:11-13 and Revelation 19:15-16

    And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

    And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.​

    1 Timothy 6:14 NLT and 1 Timothy 6:15 NKJV

    Our Lord Jesus Christ comes again...
    He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.​

    Certain Saints in Heaven Are Made Ready For The Marriage Supper of The Lamb:


    Revelation 19:6-8 HCS and Revelation 19:9 NIV

    Then I heard something like the voice of a vast multitude, like the sound of cascading waters, and like the rumbling of loud thunder, saying:

    "Hallelujah, because our Lord God, the Almighty, has begun to reign! Let us be glad, rejoice, and give Him glory, because the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has prepared herself. She was given fine linen to wear, bright and pure. For the fine linen represents the righteous acts of the saints."

    Then the angel said to me,

    Write: ‘Blessed are those who are invited to the wedding supper of the Lamb!’”​

    The Lord Gathers His Elect For the Upcoming Battle:
    (The Call to the Marriage Supper of the Lamb):

    Revelation 19:17-18 and Revelation 19:14

    And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying

    "To all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great."

    And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
    Isaiah 40:31

    But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles;
    Luke 17:37

    Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

    Matthew 24:28

    For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.​

    Jude 1:14

    Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,​

    Isaiah 31:4 NLT

    The LORD of Heaven’s Armies will come down​

    Isaiah 26:21b NLT

    The earth will no longer hide those who have been killed. They will be brought out for all to see.
    The battle of our Lord or the Marriage supper itself can be seen in post #8.

     
Loading...