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It's rather simple.
Did God choose Israel over all of the nations on earth?
Deut 7:6 For you are a holy people to the Lord your God; the Lord your God has chosen you to be a people for His own possession out of all the peoples who are on the face of the earth.
Has God rejected His people?
Rom 11:1 I say then, God has not rejected His people, has He? May it never be! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.
Since Israel is God's chosen people and they have not been rejected then they remain His chosen people.
Having said that, it is the people of Israel that has faith in the Messiah that are counted as sons (and daughters) this includes those from among the nations that have faith as well, but it does not change who God's chosen people are. It only allows some from the nations to join (be grafted) into them and thus become one flock.
Otherwise, if it is an entirely new group then Israel would indeed have been rejected. I hope no one believes in replacement theology here.
It has already been discussed here and possibly in this thread. Your'e just generating posts.Really, I only listed two verses, could you not address them instead?
One of the verses I listed was from the NT.
Can you not just discuss Scripture?
The point is you really want to destroy any basis for truth.Hi Klutedavid,
Thank you for your input; but you've presented a false dichotomy.
I can readily come up with two more options, "both," or "neither."
With discernment, I would use both, and as many other documents available to me, in my search for truth.
In context of the conversation you're saying Scripture is in error. The support you provide is conflicting versions. You've not provided any argument about versions disagreeing with themselves and altering the original meaning of the text.Never say never!
Your sister may do both. What I wonder is if she isn't involved either directly or indirectly here claiming to be a Christian.I did, my sister is a witch, they worship other gods.
I wouldn’t know, it’s been many years since I’ve talked to her.Your sister may do both. What I wonder is if she isn't involved either directly or indirectly here claiming to be a Christian.
Luk 12:51 - “Do you suppose that I came to give peace on earth? I tell you, not at all, but rather division.I wouldn’t know, it’s been many years since I’ve talked to her.
Why do you reject Hosea on this?
And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.
No where does Hosea day these people will become Israel. Neither does Paul in Romans. besides that your idea violates the promise given to Abraham about the nations.
It's becoming very evident to me, that there are at least 2 different Messiah's in here, and in the world, that people are pushing: Messiah #1 & his Apostles taught obedience to God's law, and Messiah #2 & Apostles who teach disobedience to God's law(lawlessness)
The Anti-Messiah is called the man of lawlessness.
It is apparent to me that many are
/teaching/promoting the anti-Messiah, even right here on this very board & in this thread
There is only ONE Messiah, and His name is Yeshua haMashiach.
The Anti-Messiah, the one of evil that is prophesied about, is NOT the Messiah, but the Anti-Messiah. Big difference.
Only ONE Messiah can save us from sin into a life of eternity spent with Elohim. That is Yeshua.
Only ONE Messiah came from G-d and IS G-d, and that is Yeshua.
Be careful in what you accuse people of please. You are accusing people of heresy.
John 1 is what we believe and promote.
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with G-d, and the Word was G-d. 2 He was in the beginning with G-d. 3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life,[a] and the life was the light of men. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
6 There was a man sent from G-d, whose name was John. 7 He came as a witness, to bear witness about the light, that all might believe through him. 8 He was not the light, but came to bear witness about the light.
9 The true light, which gives light to everyone, was coming into the world. 10 He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him. 11 He came to his own, and his own people[c] did not receive him. 12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of G-d, 13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of G-d.
14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son[d] from the Father, full of grace and truth. 15 (John bore witness about him, and cried out, “This was he of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me ranks before me, because he was before me.’”) 16 For from his fullness we have all received, grace upon grace.[e]
7 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ. 18 No one has ever seen G-d; the only G-d,[f] who is at the Father's side,[g] he has made him known.
An analogy:
I’ve always resisted being a registered driver but as I got older I realized that it was in my best interest.
I finally got my driver’s license and became a full fledged legal driver in my state.
Now the laws of the road have no hold on me. I’m a real driver - I don’t need those rules because I have a license.
I resisted accepting Yeshua as my Saviour but when I matured I realized it was the right path for my life.
Now that I’m saved I don’t need all those laws that we are told to keep - I’m already saved.
Does anyone see a correlation here?
Obviously, the anti-Messiah is not *the* Messiah
My point is that there are 2 different people being spoken of in this thread. The difference is their character, which is reflected in what they teach.
Some people promote a Messiah who taught disobedience to God's law and commands. Let's call this man "Messiah A"
1 John 2:4;Please stop right there. This is bearing false witness against your neighbor and it is a violation of both Covenant laws.
No where, no how, no way, as any one here (except those, like you who accuse us falsely and bear false witness) have EVER said that Yeshua taught or we believe that we, as born again Believers in Yeshua, should disobey G-d. Never, ever. Please cease the false accusations.
What has been said, if you will please take the time and make the effort to read what has been written is that, according to Scripture, Yeshua fulfilled the Old Covenant Law of Moses and has, by His blood as the Perfect Lamb sacrifice, given us His NEW Covenant, which we adhere to.
Jeremiah 31:31-34 Luke 22:20
Please stop right there. This is bearing false witness against your neighbor and it is a violation of both Covenant laws.
No where, no how, no way, as any one here (except those, like you who accuse us falsely and bear false witness) have EVER said that Yeshua taught or we believe that we, as born again Believers in Yeshua, should disobey G-d. Never, ever. Please cease the false accusations.
What has been said, if you will please take the time and make the effort to read what has been written is that, according to Scripture, Yeshua fulfilled the Old Covenant Law of Moses and has, by His blood as the Perfect Lamb sacrifice, given us His NEW Covenant, which we adhere to.
Jeremiah 31:31-34 Luke 22:20
It's not a false accusation. I've seen it many times - some directly say it, some indirectly say it
The Messiah taught his followers to obey the law. If anybody teaches that we are not supposed to obey the law, then they're going against what the Messiah said. And if they say that his followers are not supposed to obey the law, then they're making him out to be a liar, and are probably following another "Messiah", whom I would say is the anti-Messiah, aka the man of lawlessness
Mat 5:19 - “Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.It's not a false accusation. I've seen it many times - some directly say it, some indirectly say it
The Messiah taught his followers to obey the law. If anybody teaches that we are not supposed to obey the law, then they're going against what the Messiah said. And if they say that his followers are not supposed to obey the law, then they're making him out to be a liar, and are probably following another "Messiah", whom I would say is the anti-Messiah, aka the man of lawlessness
Mat 5:19 - “Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
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