LDS Mormons Take Satan's Deception From Genesis

[Scott Husted]

So could you say: Now faith is the "person as the image He expressed" of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Or do you just use the word "person", so it says:
Now faith is the "person" of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Are you trying to get God or Jesus into this description of what faith is because it has the words
"not seen" at the end? Not quite following you.

Faith works by what God is, which makes this inseparable to me.

 

[Jamesone5]

If Scott wants to say that God the Father is invisible, then I can almost believe him. Because God the Father has determined to let his Son, Jesus Christ be in charge of the creation and the governance of the world.

So Jesus is the spearhead for the Godhead, God the Father is not seen often, and has been virtually invisible.

Jesus Christ, who is the second God, is certainly not invisible, and he is God too. So Scott needs to adjust his words a little, and he would be going in the right direction.

Gee such confusion from believing in your three Gods.

Who is really in charge? who is the spearhead? who is and who is not invisible?

 

[Jamesone5]

I am not arguing against scripture, I am arguing against his logic. The scriptures are plain that Jesus is both visible and God, if someone comes along and says God is invisible, that knocks out Jesus (who is obviously visible), hence Jesus cannot be God.

Can you figure it any other way?

Uh, do you see Him right now?

Gee, do you think He might be invisible because you cannot see Him?

 

[mmksparbud]

Then Jesus cannot be God because he is not "invisible".

​

Isa_7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

Mat_1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Exo 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Mat_22:32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

Mar 14:61 But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
Mar 14:62 And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
Mar 14:63 Then the high priest rent his clothes, and saith, What need we any further witnesses?
Mar 14:64 Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.
Mar 14:65 And some began to spit on him, and to cover his face, and to buffet him, and to say unto him, Prophesy: and the servants did strike him with the palms of their hands.

It was Jesus---the IAM-- that spoke to Moses and led the children of Israel, gave the commandments. The Priests knew what Jesus meant when He said I am.

 

[Scott Husted]

All religions/serpents/perceptions aside ... the Word is God to us in a very practical sense.

You can't be a son of God without having always been, as Paul said let this mind be in you, as it was in him, who thought it not robbery to be equal with God (which balance is the form of a servant, or there is none good but God).

Through the perception of words we are adopted, born of God, have the testimony of, and are that Seed/Word/God, we are like the wind, and have a name no man knows, and we overcome the world by not being of it, and all of it by our Father who art in heaven.

For Jesus the son of man and the son of God were the same truth, a truth only the Father can reveal in you.

 

[Sam81]

The church has never backed off of the thoughts that we an become gods. You would have to show me who said, wait a minute we don't believe that exactly. I don't think so.

Satan said this:
4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

And God agreed this time with satan, who He knew very well.
22 ¶ And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Since the "us" in verse 22 is another word for "gods", then the truth is that Adam and Eve just took the first step toward being like "us", God. The obvious first big step is to know the difference between good and evil. God even tells us that A&E, because they now knew the difference between good and evil were had become as one of "US" who are "GODS".

So satan's deception, turns out not to be a deception. Except for a bunch of people who cannot countenance the idea of man can be like Gods, like "US".

Give it up, the bible is full of this doctrine. You just read over these scriptures with ignorance or with malice. But the bible is full of this doctrine.

I assure you that the Bible is not full of any such. The written word of God is always testifying to the Lord God, Jesus Christ, whose Name is above every other name.

Joseph Smith was a lying pervert and Mormonism is another gospel.

The good news is that our sins can be forgiven and we can be in fellowship with God forever, worshiping Him and basking in His glory.

You have no idea what you are saying when you say God is one of many. You would fall dead on your face if you could so much as catch a tiny glimpse of God! There are none like Him! How dare anyone believe others to be like Him! Mormonism is straight from Hell! You have no idea what you were doing when you say that YHWH is one of many. You really have no idea what you're saying. Oh, you should tremble at the very thought of God! He who always was and always will be; the great I AM. He alone is worthy of all glory and honor and worship forever and ever and ever. And NO ONE ELSE will EVER receive the worship that God, revealed through our Lord Jesus Christ, will receive.

If only you could catch a glimpse! You'd fall flat on your face. And the very words spoken that blaspheme God and attempt to reduce Him will brand your soul with the hottest iron in the presence of He who sits upon the throne. What an awful thing for those who love the lie!

 

[Peter1000]

Jesus said there is none good but God in response to someone calling him good. Truth, lie, both ... (this was a passover statement for Jesus, or the picking up of his cross, ie a servant/son)

The Revelation of who he was was given to him just as it is to every son; in terms that could be understood by those beholding the expressed image of the person of God (who he said to some looking at him, that they had neither heard him or seen at anytime) ... in the form of a son in whom God is well pleased.

I believe that is true what Jesus said, but if you are telling me that Jesus said, there is none good but God, are you questioning that Jesus is God again?

Whether he is the "express image" of God or the "expressed image" of God they both lead to the same idea, that Jesus was revealing the form that God is in heaven. He is a compound exalted man, and is the express image of his Son Jesus, a compound man on the earth. When Jesus died and was resurrected, he became a compound exalted man that sits next to his compound exalted man Father in heaven waiting for his second coming.

It is also correct that those he was speaking to had not seen the compound exalted man God, his Father and his God (John 20:17), except that as they saw him(Jesus, the compound man on earth), they in affect, were seeing what the compound exalted man in heaven looks like.

But you really did not answer my question. You said that God is invisible.

I said if that is the case, then Jesus cannot be God (at least for you) because Jesus is not invisible. What do you say about that?

 

[Peter1000]

I assure you that the Bible is not full of any such. The written word of God is always testifying to the Lord God, Jesus Christ, whose Name is above every other name.

Joseph Smith was a lying pervert and Mormonism is another gospel.

The good news is that our sins can be forgiven and we can be in fellowship with God forever, worshiping Him and basking in His glory.

You have no idea what you are saying when you say God is one of many. You would fall dead on your face if you could so much as catch a tiny glimpse of God! There are none like Him! How dare anyone believe others to be like Him! Mormonism is straight from Hell! You have no idea what you were doing when you say that YHWH is one of many. You really have no idea what you're saying. Oh, you should tremble at the very thought of God! He who always was and always will be; the great I AM. He alone is worthy of all glory and honor and worship forever and ever and ever. And NO ONE ELSE will EVER receive the worship that God, revealed through our Lord Jesus Christ, will receive.

If only you could catch a glimpse! You'd fall flat on your face. And the very words spoken that blaspheme God and attempt to reduce Him will brand your soul with the hottest iron in the presence of He who sits upon the throne. What an awful thing for those who love the lie!

You are right, the good news is that our sins can be forgiven, (even the sin of thinking differently about God than what you think is right). And we can be in fellowship with God forever, worshiping Him and basking in His glory.

You must understand that even though we know that there are other gods and lords, there is just one God that we have anything to do. You are the ones that make it such a big deal. You are the ones that agitate the discussion. We do not. We worship the God of the Bible only.

You know that when we finally meet God, it will only take minutes to know what the Bible has been trying to tell us he is like. So don't worry too much about it. Worry more about believing in his Son and doing what His Son tells us to do.

And it does not matter if you think JS is a pervert false prophet. If we believe in Jesus, according to you guys, we will be saved. Well, believe it or not, we believe explicitly in Jesus of the Bible, therefore we are also in his hand and no one will be able to pluck us out, not even you.

 

[Peter1000]

All religions/serpents/perceptions aside ... the Word is God to us in a very practical sense.

You can't be a son of God without having always been, as Paul said let this mind be in you, as it was in him, who thought it not robbery to be equal with God (which balance is the form of a servant, or there is none good but God).

Through the perception of words we are adopted, born of God, have the testimony of, and are that Seed/Word/God, we are like the wind, and have a name no man knows, and we overcome the world by not being of it, and all of it by our Father who art in heaven.

For Jesus the son of man and the son of God were the same truth, a truth only the Father can reveal in you.

"You can't be a son of God without having always been". This is exactly right. God is the Father of our spirits and we have always been the children of God from the beginning. Thank you for that.

 

[Peter1000]

YES!! SEE POST 37!

Yes what? Post 37 does not mention the word "invisible" once. That was the distinguishing characteristic being discussed.

Tell me how Jesus is invisible? If God is invisible per post 23, then according to Scott, Jesus cannot be God. Answer this conundrum. Not another one.

 

[TasteForTruth]

Mormons [of which I was one until God brought me out] assume too much from their Bibles and this is a classic example of that assuming.

As a former member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, you should know that the church's doctrine springs from revelation, not academics. All interpretation of scripture in the church is subject to that standard. So our understanding of the Bible flows down from the composite of revelation, not up from an isolated Bible analysis.

 

[Sam81]

You are right, the good news is that our sins can be forgiven, (even the sin of thinking differently about God than what you think is right). And we can be in fellowship with God forever, worshiping Him and basking in His glory.

You must understand that even though we know that there are other gods and lords, there is just one God that we have anything to do. You are the ones that make it such a big deal. You are the ones that agitate the discussion. We do not. We worship the God of the Bible only.

You know that when we finally meet God, it will only take minutes to know what the Bible has been trying to tell us he is like. So don't worry too much about it. Worry more about believing in his Son and doing what His Son tells us to do.

And it does not matter if you think JS is a pervert false prophet. If we believe in Jesus, according to you guys, we will be saved. Well, believe it or not, we believe explicitly in Jesus of the Bible, therefore we are also in his hand and no one will be able to pluck us out, not even you.

But Jesus Christ is not a god! He is not a lord! He is THE God, He is THE Lord. And NOT just the God and the Lord with which we have to do. He is the God and the Lord with which ANYONE in all existence has to do. Besides Him there is none other. Neither before Him, nor after Him, nor at any other time in all creation. He alone is God, He's the only God, and besides Him there is no other.

How dare anyone blaspheme by believing or teaching anything but that! How dare anyone try and detract from His true glory! Mormonism is a blasphemy from hell! The word of God and the Holy Spirit exalt the Lord above all! And the scriptures Mormons try and twist to support their false and blasphemous beliefs are so obviously misapplied. Those filled with the Holy Spirit know what the scriptures truly mean, as we live it daily.

 

[TasteForTruth]

But Jesus Christ is not a god! He is not a lord! He is THE God, He is THE Lord. And NOT just the God and the Lord with which we have to do. He is the God and the Lord with which ANYONE in all existence has to do. Besides Him there is none other. Neither before Him, nor after Him, nor at any other time in all creation. He alone is God, He's the only God, and besides Him there is no other.

I understand this view, but don't find it meaningful. The vigor with which it is asserted seems overblown. Not saying that it shouldn't be important to those to whom it is, just that I don't get it.

 

[Sam81]

I exalt the Lord more so than Mormons. I believe God to be above all things that could ever possibly be. There is nothing anywhere in all existence that can compare to the glory of God! There are no other gods anywhere nor could there ever be. God alone is to be glorified above all! The name of Jesus is above all names!

Even if there were, for a split second, Mormon gods on other planets...they would come and bow down before I AM! There are none like unto Him!

Supposing Mormonism were true, would the Lord God punish me or reward me less for thinking more highly of Him then the Mormons? But supposing I am correct, oh my, what a fearful thing for Mormons to stand and give an account of their blasphemy before One such as Him!!!

And I know the Bible is true! Mormons truly have much to fear!

 

[TasteForTruth]

I exalt the Lord more so than Mormons. I believe God to be above all things that could ever possibly be. There is nothing anywhere in all existence that can compare to the glory of God! There are no other gods anywhere nor could there ever be. God alone is to be glorified above all! The name of Jesus is above all names!

Even if there were, for a split second, Mormon gods on other planets...they would come and bow down before I AM! There are none like unto Him!

Supposing Mormonism were true, would the Lord God punish me or reward me less for thinking more highly of Him then the Mormons? But supposing I am correct, oh my, what a fearful thing for Mormons to stand and give an account of their blasphemy before One such as Him!!!

And I know the Bible is true! Mormons truly have much to fear!

Don't get me wrong. I'm not marginalizing your faith. I think it's great that you feel so strongly and speak so highly of God. Those are things to be commended!

 

[Jamesone5]

As a former member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, you should know that the church's doctrine springs from revelation, not academics. All interpretation of scripture in the church is subject to that standard. So our understanding of the Bible flows down from the composite of revelation, not up from an isolated Bible analysis.

Are you trying to tell me that it was supposedly revealed outside the Bible? God put it into His Word and later changed His Mind, through Joseph Smith?

That's seems to be your story here.

 

[Jamesone5]

delete

 

[Peter1000]

Uh, do you see Him right now?

Gee, do you think He might be invisible because you cannot see Him?

Uh, do you see the Grand Canyon right now?

Gee do you think the Grand Canyon might be invisible because you cannot see it?

The obvious answer is NO. Jesus is not invisible any time, even though he is not standing in my room right now. He is in heaven, not in my room. But those in heaven can see him because he is not invisible. Am I off my rocker for thinking this way?

 

[TasteForTruth]

Are you trying to tell me that it was supposedly revealed outside the Bible? God put it into His Word and later changed His Mind, through Joseph Smith?

That's seems to be your story here.

I'm just saying that God is the source of truth, not books, all of which were compiled by mortal hands. So if God reveals something today that appears to be different than what was compiled into a book yesterday, or 2000 years ago, it is short-sighted to ascribe to God the mortal condition of having "changed his mind." God works with us and through us, not in spite of us. We've got to allow him to do just that. Else we become entrenched in dogma, rather than being continually fed by the source of truth.

 

[Jamesone5]

Uh, do you see the Grand Canyon right now?

Gee do you think the Grand Canyon might be invisible because you cannot see it?

The obvious answer is NO. Jesus is not invisible any time, even though he is not standing in my room right now. He is in heaven, not in my room. But those in heaven can see him because he is not invisible. Am I off my rocker for thinking this way?

Am I off my rocker for thinking this way?---BoJ

You words not mine.

And are you in heaven to spritually see Jesus? Are we both here on earth where we can see the Grand Canyon, if we want to?

You make these arguments -----well, you said it about the rocker.