Media (TV channels, etc.) as a tool of normalization for 'obscure' faiths

[dzheremi]

In a recent conversation in another thread, I advanced the idea of BYU-TV essentially being propaganda for the Mormon religion, which was not very well-received by my interlocutors. I also maintained that the same could be said regarding Roman Catholic TV channels like EWTN, Orthodox TV channels like Aghapy TV, or Protestant TV channels like CBN, in that they all exist to showcase and further a particular faith and the points of view (doctrinal, social, etc.) that are nurtured within their particular faith tradition(s). They have a definite 'agenda', you could say, and it makes complete sense that this is the case.

Pursuant to that idea, I want to share this interesting if a bit overlong video by ex-Scientologist Chris Shelton in which he talks about the arrival of Scientology TV, and (eventually) talks with ex-Mormon Jonathan Streeter regarding BYU-TV and its role in promoting Mormonism to the wider world:

(The interview begins at 21 minutes in, just in case the timestamp in the link doesn't work properly.)

I think Streeter's comment about the 'normalization' function of BYU-TV (that some of its programming is very innocuous, such that any non-Mormon who might be flipping through the channels might stop on it and get the idea "Ah, these Mormons aren't so weird/Mormonism seems like a normal faith") is right on for all of these examples. I know that is certainly true with regard to Coptic TV broadcast in the West, usually in English, often trying (sometimes quite awkwardly, if I can be honest about it) to appeal to Western/American (and often specifically youth) sensibilities, etc. These all have their reasons for being as they are, and are certainly meant to appeal to already-Coptic people, but also to the outside world all of this basically screams "We're integrating! We're a thing you can look into if you're a Westerner! It's not weird to be Coptic!" And having talked to a traveling monk who came to our parish one day to encourage us to take an interest in Coptic media, I can tell you that those who are intimately involved with the Coptic channels definitely see them as evangelization and normalization tools.

What does everyone think about the views expressed in the interview? Does your religion/tradition have a presence on TV (cable or internet), and if so what kind of programming does it show to make your faith look more appealing or accessible to those who are outside of it? Do you have any favorite shows that you always try to catch and/or show to others as an example of what your faith does?

I'm interested in the subject more generally because I remember when the monk came to us and talked to us about Coptic TV (I think he worked for CYC, the youth-oriented channel), he was kind of shocked/dismayed that none of us regularly watched it. He was kind of harsh about it, too ("No wonder you guys haven't received any new people in a long time! You're not getting out there!"), and addressed me in particular as the only non-Egyptian person there that day, asking me what I was doing to increase the visibility of the faith among other Anglophones, why I wasn't bringing friends to liturgy (I was in grad school; I didn't socialize/have friends because I was too busy...yeahhh, he didn't care; no excuses, habibi!), why I didn't watch Coptic TV, etc. It has kind of stuck with me in the years since then, even though to be honest I still don't watch Coptic TV unless it's in the form of YouTube clips, because I don't have the money nor the inclination to have to order some kind of "Middle Eastern channel package" to get it.

Anyway, please share what sorts of media your faith community produces! Examples of favorites of any kind would be really nice to see. I don't mean this to become a discussion of who is doing it "better" (though I put it in the debate forum because I expect that subsequent discussion could go that way)...just a general discussion of the role of media in your religion.

 

[dzheremi]

Since it's my thread, I guess I'll start with some examples from Coptic TV.

One of the things aired on Aghapy TV (a sort of 'general' Coptic channel, as opposed to CYC, which is focused on youth) that I really enjoy is the "Know Your Church" series, hosted by Fr. Mauritius Anba Bishoy, an affable monk-priest who goes through the rites of the Coptic Orthodox liturgy in this 35 part (!) series, presented in plain English so as to educate everyone on what is going on in the liturgy, since it is not always clear (as when the priest prays private/inaudible prayers, while the congregation sings a hymn or gives a certain response to the call from the deacon, something like that). I used to have a few booklets that tried to do the same thing, but I find it much easier and more helpful to watch this program, because the visual element really helps to reinforce the lesson in a way that printed words just can't.

From CYC, the youth channel, there is the program "A Monk's Life" with Fr. Lazarus El Antony, an Australian convert to the Church who eventually came to be connected to the Monastery of St. Anthony on the Red Sea in Egypt, and actually lives as an anchorite in St. Anthony's cave, away from the monastery. His sayings and advice have affected many people, even reaching non-Coptic people (many, in fact).

And of course the channels also show actual liturgies and other services, as when we have the Resurrection liturgy celebrated in the cathedral in Egypt:

And sometimes we also broadcast materials on/from the other Oriental Orthodox churches (liturgies or other programs on the Ethiopians, Syriacs, Malankara Orthodox, etc.), to help strengthen the bonds and understanding between the different churches, since we all have our own unique practices and they are often very different from one another. Here is a longer program on CYC about the Orthodox Church of Ethiopia:

I wish I could show this to all my Coptic friends, because we used to have a kind young Ethiopian woman worship with us who never received communion, and to Copts that is very, very strange (frequent reception is the norm for us), so they were concerned that something was really wrong with her, but as the above video explains, the Ethiopians approach the matter differently. It's good that we have this media as an opportunity to learn about one another and from one another, and to feel more united as one Church.

 

[Jane_Doe]

So... it's ok in your eyes for Coptics to run TV shows/channels, but not other faiths?

 

[dzheremi]

No. I'm not sure how you got that out of anything in the thread. There's no argument like that made in the OP.

Do you have something you'd like to share from Mormon media?

 

[Jane_Doe]

No. I'm not sure how you got that out of anything in the thread. There's no argument like that made in the OP.

You call tv programming of faiths you don't like "propaganda" and attempts as "normalization" (extremely negative and loaded words), and yet praise your own tv shows and say how you want people to see them.

 

[dzheremi]

You call tv programming of faiths you don't like "propaganda" and attempts as "normalization" (extremely negative and loaded words), and yet praise your own tv shows and say how you want people to see them.

Apparently you're reading a different OP, because the one I wrote specifically says:

"In a recent conversation in another thread, I advanced the idea of BYU-TV essentially being propaganda for the Mormon religion, which was not very well-received by my interlocutors. I also maintained that the same could be said regarding Roman Catholic TV channels like EWTN, Orthodox TV channels like Aghapy TV, or Protestant TV channels like CBN, in that they all exist to showcase and further a particular faith and the points of view (doctrinal, social, etc.) that are nurtured within their particular faith tradition(s). They have a definite 'agenda', you could say, and it makes complete sense that this is the case."

I'm not sure how you could miss most of the opening paragraph like that, but okay.

 

[ubicaritas]

In a recent conversation in another thread, I advanced the idea of BYU-TV essentially being propaganda for the Mormon religion, which was not very well-received by my interlocutors. I also maintained that the same could be said regarding Roman Catholic TV channels like EWTN, Orthodox TV channels like Aghapy TV, or Protestant TV channels like CBN, in that they all exist to showcase and further a particular faith and the points of view (doctrinal, social, etc.) that are nurtured within their particular faith tradition(s). They have a definite 'agenda', you could say, and it makes complete sense that this is the case.

Pursuant to that idea, I want to share this interesting if a bit overlong video by ex-Scientologist Chris Shelton in which he talks about the arrival of Scientology TV, and (eventually) talks with ex-Mormon Jonathan Streeter regarding BYU-TV and its role in promoting Mormonism to the wider world:

(The interview begins at 21 minutes in, just in case the timestamp in the link doesn't work properly.)

I think Streeter's comment about the 'normalization' function of BYU-TV (that some of its programming is very innocuous, such that any non-Mormon who might be flipping through the channels might stop on it and get the idea "Ah, these Mormons aren't so weird/Mormonism seems like a normal faith") is right on for all of these examples. I know that is certainly true with regard to Coptic TV broadcast in the West, usually in English, often trying (sometimes quite awkwardly, if I can be honest about it) to appeal to Western/American (and often specifically youth) sensibilities, etc. These all have their reasons for being as they are, and are certainly meant to appeal to already-Coptic people, but also to the outside world all of this basically screams "We're integrating! We're a thing you can look into if you're a Westerner! It's not weird to be Coptic!" And having talked to a traveling monk who came to our parish one day to encourage us to take an interest in Coptic media, I can tell you that those who are intimately involved with the Coptic channels definitely see them as evangelization and normalization tools.

What does everyone think about the views expressed in the interview? Does your religion/tradition have a presence on TV (cable or internet), and if so what kind of programming does it show to make your faith look more appealing or accessible to those who are outside of it? Do you have any favorite shows that you always try to catch and/or show to others as an example of what your faith does?

I'm interested in the subject more generally because I remember when the monk came to us and talked to us about Coptic TV (I think he worked for CYC, the youth-oriented channel), he was kind of shocked/dismayed that none of us regularly watched it. He was kind of harsh about it, too ("No wonder you guys haven't received any new people in a long time! You're not getting out there!"), and addressed me in particular as the only non-Egyptian person there that day, asking me what I was doing to increase the visibility of the faith among other Anglophones, why I wasn't bringing friends to liturgy (I was in grad school; I didn't socialize/have friends because I was too busy...yeahhh, he didn't care; no excuses, habibi!), why I didn't watch Coptic TV, etc. It has kind of stuck with me in the years since then, even though to be honest I still don't watch Coptic TV unless it's in the form of YouTube clips, because I don't have the money nor the inclination to have to order some kind of "Middle Eastern channel package" to get it.

Anyway, please share what sorts of media your faith community produces! Examples of favorites of any kind would be really nice to see. I don't mean this to become a discussion of who is doing it "better" (though I put it in the debate forum because I expect that subsequent discussion could go that way)...just a general discussion of the role of media in your religion.

The arrival of charismatic pentecostalism and fundamentalist preachers on American TV in the 80's did alot to undermine mainline Protestantism in the US as the dominant religious ethos in America. It propelled what had been a marginalized movement to the mainstream.

 

[ArmenianJohn]

I don't think my Church is making a huge effort to use television or to become "normalized" (I think my Church thinks they are "normal", whether that's what others think or not). However, I have noticed that lately they are creating official Church videos on YouTube or posted on other sites. Mostly they're informational/educational for both Armenian Christians or those interested in the Armenian Church. Here is a good example that I think is well done:

Fr. Vazken from this video also has his own ministry of evangelism and the website is http://inhisshoes.com - I don't think this is so much of an "Armenian Church" thing as much as just an evangelical outreach (which just happens to be Armenian), but in any case since it comes from an Armenian Church foundation it does spread information about the Armenian Church.

 

[dzheremi]

I like that video with Fr. Vazken. He has a very engaging, energetic style. Thank you, ArmenianJohn. I will have to also check out his evangelism website.

I have noticed that the Armenians do seem to have a little bit of a lower profile in media overall, in comparison to other churches in the communion: in addition to the Coptic channels, the Ethiopians have EOTC TV, the Indians have Gregorian TV, and the Syriacs have Suryoyo-Sat (broadcast from Sweden). I wasn't sure if the Armenians had something similar and I just didn't know about it because I don't know Armenian.

 

[dzheremi]

The arrival of charismatic pentecostalism and fundamentalist preachers on American TV in the 80's did alot to undermine mainline Protestantism in the US as the dominant religious ethos in America. It propelled what had been a marginalized movement to the mainstream.

Yes, I have noticed that, as well. When I was living in Albuquerque, NM several years ago, I did not have the money for cable TV, but could still pick up local channels and I noticed that despite the demographics of the state suggesting otherwise, the only religious programming I could ever find (since I was relying on public access TV) was charismatic Pentecostal services in Spanish being broadcast from Texas/Mexico border towns, or Islamic chant presented a bit later on in the night, complete with what appeared to be computer screensaver images of star fields and mountains and such as visual accompaniment. It was quite a bizarre mix. (I mainly stuck to local news programs, and the occasional Navajo-language soap opera out of curiosity.)

 

[Joy]

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[Robban]

TV Inter, mainly Swedish pentecostal made a series of programmes,

"Do you remember the song"

They were extemely popular among all backgrounds and ages.

Absolutely only music and songs, no preaching.

I would think it is very expensive to have a TV channel.


But I do not know

 

[dzheremi]

That's so interesting. Thank you, Robban. I know nothing about the existence of Pentecostalism in Sweden, so this is a real eye opener. My only real exposure to religion in Sweden comes from the Syriac community, who are obviously of a different orientation when it comes to religion.

 

[awitch]

Anyway, please share what sorts of media your faith community produces! Examples of favorites of any kind would be really nice to see. I don't mean this to become a discussion of who is doing it "better" (though I put it in the debate forum because I expect that subsequent discussion could go that way)...just a general discussion of the role of media in your religion.

I know of one of two Pagan-based magazine-type websites, but they basically post religion-based news and editorials. There are a few musicians who post their Pagan-themed music on Youtube but that's just about trying to get more exposure. I don't believe I'm allowed to share any links since that would probably fall under the "promotion" rules and restrictions.

I do see more regular TV shows with Pagan-themes, though. The new Ducktales cartoon incorporates a lot of mythology into the stories and Disney's upcoming The Owl House cartoon will be about a girl who wants to be a witch's apprentice.

 

[dzheremi]

Hmm. Interesting. I haven't had cable in several years, so I had no idea about any kind of Pagan themes in any shows, or even that they had a new Ducktales cartoon. I remember liking the old one when I was a child. I seem to remember it had some Aztec-themed episodes, but I think that was mostly about getting gold that was supposedly at the sites than about the mythology of the people.

I wouldn't have a problem with the display of such material in this thread, though I guess it's not up to me. This thread was moved into World Religions by a mod today, I assume so that everyone could participate, so I don't know why it wouldn't be allowed so long as it's not "pagan sermons" or whatever (you know, telling people to become pagan). I tried to pick Coptic media examples that weren't that, but were more descriptive/explanatory than evangelistic.

I found a YouTube channel "Pagans TV" with over 10,000 subscribers, but its content is all in French, for some reason. I guess there are lots of pagans in France and/or French Canada. The other videos I could find were mostly personal stories (why I am a Pagan, etc.) or documentary-type footage on Neo-Pagan gatherings, like this one from Russia Today interviewing a man in a hat about Stonehenge and showing some scenes from a Pagan gathering there:

I am going to imagine that this is not how Pagans themselves would choose to be portrayed if they had their own TV channels or what have you, but I don't know. At any rate, it is interesting as a cultural activity, I suppose, in a "look what these people over here are doing" kind of way. Probably doesn't work very well in terms of normalization, though.

 

[Robban]

That's so interesting. Thank you, Robban. I know nothing about the existence of Pentecostalism in Sweden, so this is a real eye opener. My only real exposure to religion in Sweden comes from the Syriac community, who are obviously of a different orientation when it comes to religion.

In the beginning it was free and open, but very soon others many baptists

joined, bringing their baggage with them which led to many battles.

 

[dzheremi]

How strange! I wonder why that happened. It seems like being entirely song-based would cut down on that kind of thing dramatically, since everyone can enjoy the technical artistry or the aesthetic beauty of a song by a group that they might disagree with theologically. (Or so I would think; maybe Swedish Baptists are different in that regard, for some reason.)

 

[awitch]

Hmm. Interesting. I haven't had cable in several years, so I had no idea about any kind of Pagan themes in any shows, or even that they had a new Ducktales cartoon. I remember liking the old one when I was a child. I seem to remember it had some Aztec-themed episodes, but I think that was mostly about getting gold that was supposedly at the sites than about the mythology of the people.

The old series was very much a child's version of Indiana Jones. You'll love the new series which has an overall story arch about finding Della Duck, the mother of the nephews and what her relationship is to Selene, the goddess of the moon. Various ancient Greek and Chinese deities (or parodies of them) make appearances in the show, and the evil witch, Magica DeSpell is darker and more disturbing than any horror movie. The show has a 10 out of 10 on Rotten Tomatoes

I wouldn't have a problem with the display of such material in this thread, though I guess it's not up to me. This thread was moved into World Religions by a mod today, I assume so that everyone could participate, so I don't know why it wouldn't be allowed so long as it's not "pagan sermons" or whatever (you know, telling people to become pagan). I tried to pick Coptic media examples that weren't that, but were more descriptive/explanatory than evangelistic.

Generally speaking, evangelizing is inappropriate (and non-nonsensical) in the Pagan world. No one should be told that they should be a Pagan.

Probably doesn't work very well in terms of normalization, though.

Agreed. While there are similar schools of thought throughout the Pagan spectrum, I'm not sure we have a normal.

 

[Robban]

How strange! I wonder why that happened. It seems like being entirely song-based would cut down on that kind of thing dramatically, since everyone can enjoy the technical artistry or the aesthetic beauty of a song by a group that they might disagree with theologically. (Or so I would think; maybe Swedish Baptists are different in that regard, for some reason.)

Well, I would think Pentecostal would be spirit based which in turn would bring forth song.

Lewi Pethrus was the pioneer of the movement and he was decided that
God gives of His spirit freely,
There were many tough battles .

Once I knew a Pentecostal pastor who was in the eyes of many both Pentecostals and Baptists very different.
The religious in the town ganged up on him,
I became his friend, and him, I, and a few others went to Budapest,

He had recieved reports from a little community that Baptists were causing trouble
and that they were hindering those who wished to join.

Boy, did he turn the place upside down.

 

[dzheremi]

The old series was very much a child's version of Indiana Jones. You'll love the new series which has an overall story arch about finding Della Duck, the mother of the nephews and what her relationship is to Selene, the goddess of the moon. Various ancient Greek and Chinese deities (or parodies of them) make appearances in the show, and the evil witch, Magica DeSpell is darker and more disturbing than any horror movie. The show has a 10 out of 10 on Rotten Tomatoes

That sounds very interesting. I still don't have cable so I probably can't watch it, but I will keep an eye out for it whenever I'm next in a place that has cable.

Generally speaking, evangelizing is inappropriate (and non-nonsensical) in the Pagan world. No one should be told that they should be a Pagan.

Makes sense. I just meant that in the sense that while I put up examples of religious content (as everything would be, since these are religious channels), it was more with the intention of saying "we show liturgies, we show talks with monks, we show explanations of the actions of the liturgy, etc.", because this is all part of what I've called (following Streeter in the video discussion on BYU-TV) 'normalization' functions of having the channels in the first place: to show that we're really not doing anything weird, and you can learn a lot about what we are doing and what we are about from such shows (in addition to of course what is probably the primary function of providing that content to people who are already Coptic Orthodox). I could see a similar role being played by a Neo-Pagan program, as an introduction to what it is.

Agreed. While there are similar schools of thought throughout the Pagan spectrum, I'm not sure we have a normal.

Yeah, but I meant normalization in the sense of being made to look/seem normal, or at least less weird, to outsiders, not standardization. Probably stuff like the RT story is not doing that, though what it has presented may seem attractive to someone anyway.