Matt 1:21 He Shall save His People

[Brightfame52]

It is incidental and was practical, that revelation was first shown to a clan and a group of tribes to be able to pass it on further. Dispensations 1a and 1b in a nutshell! ;-)

Lol, I dont understand a word you saying. Do you believe His People to save in Matt 1:21 is confined to ethnic jews ?

 

[OldAbramBrown]

Lol, I dont understand a word you saying. Do you believe His People to save in Matt 1:21 is confined to ethnic jews ?

No, the covenant mentioned gentiles all along. I'm talking about the practical prior history which so many people at this thread have trouble with but God doesn't. God doesn't work by magic or mystique. When God spoke with Abraham, Moses, Jeremiah He always stressed this was for gentiles (but practical provisions such as circumcision evolved). If God had a hangup about Jews He wouldn't have picked them to be involved, the benefit to them is to be likewise invited to be grafted in alongside all gentiles! As believer I don't pretend to be jewish so there is nothing to falsely react against (most CF members are doing both). The OT is open to all nationals to believe - as meaning. Materialists can't understand language, nationality, how things work, anything. I've said the same as you all along.

 

[zoidar]

No, the covenant mentioned gentiles all along. I'm talking about the practical prior history which so many people at this thread have trouble with but God doesn't. God doesn't work by magic or mystique. When God spoke with Abraham, Moses, Jeremiah He always stressed this was for gentiles (but practical provisions such as circumcision evolved). If God had a hangup about Jews He wouldn't have picked them to be involved, the benefit to them is to be likewise invited to be grafted in alongside all gentiles! As believer I don't pretend to be jewish so there is nothing to falsely react against (most CF members are doing both). The OT is open to all nationals to believe - as meaning. Materialists can't understand language, nationality, how things work, anything. I've said the same as you all along.

Your view then is that Matt 1:21 means God will save the chosen/elect from their sins?

 

[zoidar]

Who are His People in Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

It is not all ethnic jews even though some are included. Yet scripture has other names for this " His People" of Jesus,

1. His Sheep Jn 10:15,16
2. His Church Eph 5:25
3 His Body Eph 5:23
4. His brethren Heb 2:17
5. The children of God Jn 11:52

And ...
1. His own (John 1:11)
2. Your people (Luke 2:32)
3. My people (Matt 2:6)

Christ, when he said that he laid down his life for his sheep, included in that expression the elect Gentiles, those other sheep, Jn 10:16, which he says he must bring, indicating, that all the chosen/elect shall, by him, be brought to God by His death 1 Pet 3:18


For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

Bringing to God is saving them from their sins !

 

[Brightfame52]

No, the covenant mentioned gentiles all along. I'm talking about the practical prior history which so many people at this thread have trouble with but God doesn't. God doesn't work by magic or mystique. When God spoke with Abraham, Moses, Jeremiah He always stressed this was for gentiles (but practical provisions such as circumcision evolved). If God had a hangup about Jews He wouldn't have picked them to be involved, the benefit to them is to be likewise invited to be grafted in alongside all gentiles! As believer I don't pretend to be jewish so there is nothing to falsely react against (most CF members are doing both). The OT is open to all nationals to believe - as meaning. Materialists can't understand language, nationality, how things work, anything. I've said the same as you all along.

Okay, after I checked your previous posts I see we may agree. Salvation of Gods People has never been about race, even when dealing with nation as a whole under the OT, it was only a remnant according to the election of grace that was saved, it had nothing to do with their race even then, but only grace. Now under the New Covenant the saving of His People continue however the majority will be gentiles, in fact they will all be gentiles because, the ethnic jews as a nation no longer have that National Covenant relationship with God, it ended at the Death of Christ, so now jews are like any other gentile people who belong to the election of grace.

 

[Brightfame52]

Jesus Christ came specifically to save a special peculiar people that belonged to Him Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Yes it was for His peculiar people He came to save. Titus 2:12

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem/save us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

The word peculiar is the greek word periousios:

that which is one's own, belonging to one's possessions

1. a people selected by God from the other nations for his own possession

Thats the His People He came to save or redeem, a people belonging to Him ! This of course is His Church !

 

[zoidar]

Jesus Christ came specifically to save a special peculiar people that belonged to Him Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Yes it was for His peculiar people He came to save. Titus 2:12

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem/save us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

The word peculiar is the greek word periousios:

that which is one's own, belonging to one's possessions

1. a people selected by God from the other nations for his own possession

Thats the His People He came to save or redeem, a people belonging to Him ! This of course is His Church !

They said to him, “In Bethlehem of Judea; for this is what has been written by the prophet:
‘And you, Bethlehem, land of Judah,
Are by no means least among the leaders of Judah;
For out of you shall come forth a Ruler
Who will shepherd My people Israel.’”
— Matthew 2:5-6

Why does Matthew 2:6 say Jesus will shepherd My people Israel? Why is it referring only to the Jews, or you are of the opinion it's referring to the elect?

 

[Brightfame52]

They said to him, “In Bethlehem of Judea; for this is what has been written by the prophet:
‘And you, Bethlehem, land of Judah,
Are by no means least among the leaders of Judah;
For out of you shall come forth a Ruler
Who will shepherd My people Israel.’”
— Matthew 2:5-6

Why does Matthew 2:6 say Jesus will shepherd My people Israel? Why is it referring only to the Jews, or you are of the opinion it's referring to the elect?

If you believe Matt 1:21 " His People" refers to only ethnic jews, you promote a false Gospel, that God has promised to save His people from sin based upon ethnicity, the flesh.

 

[zoidar]

If you believe Matt 1:21 " His People" refers to only ethnic jews, you promote a false Gospel, that God has promised to save His people from sin based upon ethnicity, the flesh.

That was not an answer to my question.

 

[Brightfame52]

That was not an answer to my question.

Thats the only answer I have for you, until you have been delivered from your trusting in the flesh for salvation, there's no sense in anymore discussion.

 

[zoidar]

Thats the only answer I have for you, until you have been delivered from your trusting in the flesh for salvation, there's no sense in anymore discussion.

I don't understand what my salvation has to do with if Jesus initially was sent to save the Jews or not... You will have to help me understand that.

 

[Brightfame52]

Who are His People in Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

The seed of Abraham that belong to Him Gal 3:29

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

They are the heirs spoken of here Heb 1:14

14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Heb 6:17

17 Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath: 6

 

[Brightfame52]

I don't understand what my salvation has to do with if Jesus initially was sent to save the Jews or not... You will have to help me understand that.

As long as you insist that His People in Matt 1:21 are only ethnic jews, you condition salvation on ethnicity. I can do absolutely nothing to give you understanding, thats out of my ability.

 

[zoidar]

As long as you insist that His People in Matt 1:21 are only ethnic jews, you condition salvation on ethnicity. I can do absolutely nothing to give you understanding, thats out of my ability.

I insist that My people in Matt 2:6 are only the Jews as well.

You keep saying ethnic Jews, but also those married into the Jewish family and customs were considered Jews.

 

[Brightfame52]

I insist that My people in Matt 2:6 are only the Jews as well.

You keep saying ethnic Jews, but also those married into the Jewish family and customs were considered Jews.

As long as you insist that His People in Matt 1:21 are only ethnic jews, you condition salvation on ethnicity and deny Salvation by Grace !

 

[zoidar]

As long as you insist that His People in Matt 1:21 are only ethnic jews, you condition salvation on ethnicity and deny Salvation by Grace !

What do you mean by salvation by grace? How can salvation be anything else than grace? If you have been saved surely it was by grace and mercy.

 

[Brightfame52]

What do you mean by salvation by grace? How can salvation be anything else than grace? If you have been saved surely it was by grace and mercy.

If you teach as you do, that the ones promised to be saved from sin in Matt 1:21 is restricted to ethnic jews, you deny salvation by grace and make it promised on the condition of ethnicity. Salvation is by Grace not race.

 

[zoidar]

If you teach as you do, that the ones promised to be saved from sin in Matt 1:21 is restricted to ethnic jews, you deny salvation by grace and make it promised on the condition of ethnicity. Salvation is by Grace not race.

I guess I was saved then because I'm Western European.

 

[Brightfame52]

I guess I was saved then because I'm Western European.

As long as you believe Matt 1:21 refers to only ethnic jews, you may as well, either way you condition salvation from sin based upon ethnicity.

 

[zoidar]

As long as you believe Matt 1:21 refers to only ethnic jews, you may as well, either way you condition salvation from sin based upon ethnicity.

At least I think we can agree it's not what we wish Matt 1:21 says that matters, but what it actually says. It's not whether it fits our theology, but if our theology fits Matt 1:21.