Looks Like Maybe Ellen White Was Right!

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Danthemailman

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The passage speaks of the fulfillment of the Sabbath-rest in relationship with God. We have rested from our (inadequate) labors ... and rest completely in Him.

Note that the seventh day (or any other) is not mentioned in this passage.

The Hebrews are being urged to forsake striving to keep the Law as a requirement for relationship, ... and to move into the rest of faith in God's love for them.

It is the difference between the first and second covenants.
Good points brother. :)

Keeping the weekly sabbath day under the law is certainly NOT the eternal rest that the writer of Hebrews was discussing in Hebrews 4:1-11, but instead was talking about our eternal rest in Christ which only genuine believers enter into. Hebrews 4:1 - Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it. 2 For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. 3 For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said:

“So I swore in My wrath,
‘They shall not enter My rest,’ ”

although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

We need to remember that the Sabbath was instituted by God as a sign in the old covenant with Israel (Exodus 31:12-17). Paul makes it clear that Jesus is the fulfillment of all that the Old Testament prophesied, prefigured, and foreshadowed: Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day— things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ. (Colossians 2:16-17)

When Paul says that the Sabbath is a shadow, of which Christ is the substance, he means that the physical rest provided by the Sabbath finds its fulfillment in the spiritual rest provided by Jesus.
 
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Ceallaigh

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Forgive me ... I should stick with Bible Gateway ... for my Bible quotes ...

You had me a bit confused because you don't strike me as an Armstrongite. I pretty much always use Bible Gateway and Bible Hub.
 
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Bob S

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God's 10 commandments according to the scriptures have not been done away.
According to scripture, 2 Cor 3:6-11, the ten have been done away. None of your "proof Texts" change what Paul wrote in those verses. The ministration of death were the ten commandments. The ten were to be the guide for one nation, Israel. Israel failed to keep the commands thus negating the covenant lock stock and barrel. Jesus new and better covenant has given all mankind the gift of the Holy Spirit JN14:16
“If you really love me, you will keep the commandments I have given you and I shall ask the Father to give you someone else to stand by you, to be with you always. I mean the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot accept, for it can neither see nor recognise that Spirit. But you recognise him, for he is with you now and will be in your hearts. I am not going to leave you alone in the world—I am coming to you. In a very little while, the world will see me no more but you will see me, because I am really alive and you will be alive too. When that day come, you will realise that I am in my Father, that you are in me, and I am in you." Phillips

6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

LGW, What does transitory mean? In verses 7-11 what is it that was glorious? What does "for what was glorious has NO glory now" mean? In Gal 3:19 Why, then, was the law given at all? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. Why would Paul write that the Law, which included the ten commandments, ended with the coming of Jesus? It is certainly confirming what he wrote in 2Cor 3 is it not.
 
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Ceallaigh

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Sorry Brian I did not know you were telling a joke. Thanks though it maybe late my time Zzz :)

Just to be clear I was equating EGW to who/whatever you are calling false. I regard what you're teaching the same as you regard whatever guevaraj is teaching. Not that I regard him any differently than you when it comes what you both teach, though I love you both.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Keeping the weekly sabbath day under the law is certainly NOT the eternal rest that the writer of Hebrews was discussing in Hebrews 4:1-11, but instead was talking about our eternal rest in Christ which only genuine believers enter into. Hebrews 4:1 - Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it. 2 For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. 3 For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: “So I swore in My wrath, ‘They shall not enter My rest,’ ” although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
According to Hebrews 4:1-9 there is no scripture anywhere that is talking about an eternal rest that is to come . The scripture context of Hebrews 3:8-19 is to God's people who did not enter into Gods' rest because of their sins (defined in the scripture as breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments - see James 2:10-11; 1 John 3:4; and unbelief - Romans 14:23). So it was Gods' rest that those do not enter into because of unbelief and sin because they hardened their hearts to hearing and seeing Gods' Word *Hebrews 3:8. These did not enter into God's rest/His rest/ My rest because of unbelief and sin. According to the scriptures Hebrews 4:1-5 defines Gods' rest/His rest/My rest in Hebrews 3:11; Hebrews 4:1; 3; 5-6; 10-11 which is defined in Hebrews 4:3-4 as the "seventh day" Sabbath given from the foundation of the world that we who believe enter into (present tense) not future *see Hebrews 4:1-2. It is sin (breaking Gods' commandments) and unbelief that keeps us out of God's rest that all receive who believe and follow Gods' Word (the gospel rest) according to Hebrews 3:12-13; Hebrews 3:17-19; Hebrews 4:2. Therefore according to the scriptures there remains (or is left behind) a Sabbath rest or sabbath keeping for the people of God (those who believe and follow Gods' Word) *Hebrews 4:9.
We need to remember that the Sabbath was instituted by God as a sign in the old covenant with Israel (Exodus 31:12-17).
According to Jesus the Sabbath was made for all mankind and he is the Lord of it in Mark 2:27-28. The Sabbath was made therefore at creation on the seventh day of the creation week according to Genesis 2:1-3 where God blessed the “seventh day” and made the “seventh day” a holy day of rest for all mankind. There was no Jew, no Israel and no Moses, no sin and no law and no plan of salvation given because it was not needed. So to try and make claim that the Sabbath was made only for old covenant Israel is not biblical according to the scriptures because all the disciples of Jesus continued keeping Gods 4th commandment according to the scriptures post-cross after the death and resurrection of Jesus until they died according to the scriptures which was in accord with what Jesus taught them about the Sabbath (see Matthew 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; John 2:6; Matthew 16:24; see Matthew 28:1; Acts of the Apostles 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4.

We should also keep in mind that Gods' Israel in the new covenant is simply a name given by God to all those who believe and follow what Gods' Word says. According to the scriptures Gods' Israel in the new covenant is no longer only those who are born of the flesh of the seed of Abraham but are now all those who have been born again of the Spirit of God into Gods' new covenant promise *see John 3:3-7; Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 2:28-29; Romans 2:28-29; Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. God never made a new covenant with gentiles. All are now one in Christ. "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh but he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God." - Romans 2:28-29.

According to the scriptures gentile believers are now grafted in to Gods' Israel *Romans 11:13-27 and into God's new covenant promise (Jeremiah 31:31-34) through faith *1 John 5:3-4. If we are not a part of God's Israel we have no part in Gods new covenant promise which is only given to Israel *Hebrews 8:10-12. So what this means is that the Sabbath is still a sign to His people Israel in the new covenant which now includes everyone born of the Spirit through faith. The Sabbath is a sign that we worship the only truth God of creation and it is God who sanctifies us *Exodus 31:12-13. This of course we are also told in the scriptures is Gods' 4th commandment *Exodus 20:8-11 which is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken in the new covenant *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; James 2:10-11. The Sabbath is not only a sign to Gods' true Israel who are all those who are born of the Spirit to believe and follow Gods' Word but it is an everlasting covenant to Gods' true Israel as shown in Exodus 31:16 that will be continued to be kept in the new heavens and the new earth *Isaiah 66:22-23. Therefore all the promises of Gods' Word for Israel is to all those who believe and follow Gods' Word who according to the scriptures are Gods' true Israel in the new covenant.
Paul makes it clear that Jesus is the fulfillment of all that the Old Testament prophesied, prefigured, and foreshadowed: Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day— things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ. (Colossians 2:16-17) When Paul says that the Sabbath is a shadow, of which Christ is the substance, he means that the physical rest provided by the Sabbath finds its fulfillment in the spiritual rest provided by Jesus.
According to the scriptures the context of Colossians 2:16-17 is to the meat and the drink offering, and the new moons and the sabbaths in the annual Feast days and not judging others in this regard which are shadows of things to come but but the body is of Christ.

I am not sure if you are aware but Paul is referring to a number of scriptures in the old testament (e.g. Ezekiel 45:17). There were many different kinds of sabbaths (plural) in the old covenant especially connected directly to the annual Feast days, the new moons, the meat and drink offerings that could fall on any day of the week outside of Gods 4th commandment that was simply every "seventh day" of the week as a memorial of creation and a celebration of God as the creator of heaven and earth. These annual Feast sabbaths (including holy convocations where no work was allowed) included; (1) Feast of Unleavened Bread (first and last day) *Leviticus 23:6-8 (2) Feast of Trumpets *Leviticus 23:24-25 (3) Day of Atonement *Leviticus 23:27-32 (4) Feast of Booths *Leviticus 23:34-36 (5) Feast of First Fruits *Leviticus 23:39 (6) Feast days of Holy convocation of no work (sabbaton Colossians 2:16 *Leviticus 23:7-8; 21;24; 27; 35-36). Colossians 2:16-17 is in reference to the meat and drink offerings the new moons and the sabbaths (plural) that were connected to these Feasts that are shadows of things to come. Not Gods' 10 commandments or Gods 4th commandment that gives us the knowledge of what sin is when broken (Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; James 2:10-11). Therefore it remains for the people of God to keep the Sabbath (Hebrews 4:9).

It is impossible Gods' 4th commandment seventh day Sabbath to be a shadow of anything as it points backwards to the finished work of creation, not forwards to things to come. When the Sabbath was made for mankind in Genesis 2:1-3 there was no sin, no plan of salvation because there was no sin and no Moses and no Mosaic shadow laws of things to come which was not given until after mankind had sinned according to the scriptures.

Hope this is helpful Dan.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Just to be clear I was equating EGW to who/whatever you are calling false. I regard what you're teaching the same as you regard whatever guevaraj is teaching. Not that I regard him any differently than you when it comes what you both teach, though I love you both.
No it sound like you might have a misunderstanding Brian. I do not believe what guevaraj is teaching.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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According to scripture, 2 Cor 3:6-11, the ten have been done away. None of your "proof Texts" change what Paul wrote in those verses. The ministration of death were the ten commandments. The ten were to be the guide for one nation, Israel. Israel failed to keep the commands thus negating the covenant lock stock and barrel. Jesus new and better covenant has given all mankind the gift of the Holy Spirit JN14:16
“If you really love me, you will keep the commandments I have given you and I shall ask the Father to give you someone else to stand by you, to be with you always. I mean the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot accept, for it can neither see nor recognise that Spirit. But you recognise him, for he is with you now and will be in your hearts. I am not going to leave you alone in the world—I am coming to you. In a very little while, the world will see me no more but you will see me, because I am really alive and you will be alive too. When that day come, you will realise that I am in my Father, that you are in me, and I am in you." Phillips

6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

LGW, What does transitory mean? In verses 7-11 what is it that was glorious? What does "for what was glorious has NO glory now" mean? In Gal 3:19 Why, then, was the law given at all? It was added because of transgressions
until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. Why would Paul write that the Law, which included the ten commandments, ended with the coming of Jesus? It is certainly confirming what he wrote in 2Cor 3 is it not.
Context and detail matters Bob. According to the scriptures in 2 Corinthians 3:3-11 God's 10 commandments according to the scriptures have not been done away. It is the ministration of condemnation and death that has been done away *2 Corinthians 3:3-11; Romans 8:1-4; Romans 3:31; Romans 13:8-10; James 2:10-11 not Gods' 10 commandments. Gods Word does not teach a false doctrine of lawlessness (without law). According to the scriptures the purpose of Gods' law (10 commandments) is to give us the knowledge of good (moral right doing) and evil (moral wrong doing); sin (moral wrong doing) and righteousness (moral right doing) *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172 and according to James if we break anyone of them we stand guilty before God of sin. To claim that Paul is teaching that Gods' 10 commandments has Paul in contradiction with Paul when he says to the Romans gentile believers in Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yes, we establish the law and again here to the Corinthians believers (gentiles) in 1 Corinthians 7:19 19, Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God. Let's look at the scriptures once more time with the above in mind...

2 CORINTHIANS 3:3-18
[3], For as much as YOU ARE MANIFESTLY DECLARED TO BE THE LETTER OF CHRIST MINISTERED BY US, WRITTEN NOT WITH INK, BUT WITH THE SPIRIT OF THE LIVING GOD; NOT IN TABLES OF STONE, BUT IN FLESHY TABLES OF THE HEART.
[4], And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:
[5], Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
[6], WHO ALSO HAS MADE US ABLE MINISTERS OF THE NEW TESTAMENT; NOT OF THE LETTER, BUT OF THE SPIRIT: FOR THE LETTER KILLS, BUT THE SPIRIT GIVES LIFE.
[7], BUT IF THE MINISTRATION OF DEATH, WRITTEN AND ENGRAVED IN STONES, WAS GLORIOUS, SO THAT THE CHILDREN OF ISRAEL COULD NOT STEADFASTLY BEHOLD THE FACE OF MOSES FOR THE GLORY OF HIS COUNTENANCE; WHICH GLORY WAS TO BE DONE AWAY:
[8], HOW SHALL NOT THE MINISTRATION OF THE SPIRIT BE RATHER GLORIOUS?
[9], FOR IF THE MINISTRATION OF CONDEMNATION be glory, much more does the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
[10], For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excels.
[11], FOR IF THAT WHICH IS DONE AWAY WAS GLORIOUS, MUCH MORE THAT WHICH REMAINS IS GLORIOUS.
[12], Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:
[13], AND NOT AS MOSES, WHICH PUT A VEIL OVER HIS FACE, THAT THE CHILDREN OF ISRAEL COULD NOT STEADFASTLY LOOK TO THE END OF THAT WHICH IS ABOLISHED:
[14], BUT THEIR MINDS WERE BLINDED: FOR UNTIL THIS DAY REMAINS THE SAME VEIL NOT TAKEN AWAY IN THE READING OF THE OLD TESTAMENT; WHICH VEIL IS DONE AWAY IN CHRIST.
[15], But even to this day, when Moses is read, the veil is on their heart.
[16], NEVERTHELESS WHEN IT SHALL TURN TO THE LORD, THE VEIL SHALL BE TAKEN AWAY.
[17], Now THE LORD IS THAT SPIRIT: AND WHERE THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD IS, THERE IS LIBERTY.
[18], But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the LORD.

.....................

Did you catch that Bob? It is the ministration of condemnation and death by the letter that is done away by the ministration of the Spirit through God's mercy, grace and forgiveness through faith that works by love in fulfillment of Gods' new covenant promise (Hebrews 8:10-12; from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27) that is done away not God's 10 commandments. All God's 10 commandments do under the new covenant is to give us the knowledge of good (moral right doing) and evil (moral wrong doing); sin (moral wrong doing) and righteousness (moral right doing) *Romans 3:20: Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172. An interpretation that 2 Corinthians 3 is talking about abolishing Gods' 10 commandments has Paul in contradiction to Paul when he says in Romans 3:31 that faith does not abolish Gods' law it establishes God's law and again in Romans 13:8-10 where Paul says we love our neighbor as our self by being obedient to those laws in God's 10 commandments that show us our duty of love to our fellow man. Indeed the ministration of the Spirit is greater the than the ministration of the letter because while the letter brings death and condemnation while the Spirit brings life and forgiveness through Christ and writes the law on the heart through faith that works by love which is Gods' new covenant promise in all those who have been born again to believe and follow God's Word and walk in newness of life *John 3:3-7; 1 John 3:4-9; Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27; Romans 6:1-23.

Take Care.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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The letter of Hebrews is teaching Jews who converted to Christianity, not to go back to Mosaic law.
True we do not get our righteousness from law keeping we get it though faith in Christ but no one here is telling you to get your righteousness through law keeping. According to the scriptures, we are saved by grace through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God and not of works lest any man should boast *Ephesians 2:8-9. As posted earlier, somewhere, obedience to God's words are not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of genuine faith of one that is already been given Gods promise of salvation and the fruit of God's work in us *Philippians 2:13 as we believe and follow his word *John 10:26-27. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *James 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *Matthew 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50; Hebrews 10:26-27. Therefore we do not abolish God's law through faith like some people teach but God's law is established in the heart by faith that works by love *Romans 3:31; 1 John 5:3-4; Romans 13:8-10. According to the scriptures, sin (breaking God' commandments and not believing and following God's Word) is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 John 3:6-10; 1 John 2:3-4; Revelation 12:17; Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14. At the second coming Christs reward is with him *Revelation 22:12.
 
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Ceallaigh

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No it sound like you might have a misunderstanding Brian. I do not believe what guevaraj is teaching.

No I know that. There's one thing we can agree on; we both don't believe what guevaraj is teaching. Likewise I don't believe what you are teaching either. I regard your teaching as you regard guevaraj's teaching.
 
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No I know that. There's one thing we can agree on; we both don't believe what guevaraj is teaching. Likewise I don't believe what you are teaching either. I regard your teaching as you regard guevaraj's teaching.
The difference though between you and I though Brian is that by Gods' grace, I can show you what I believe from the scriptures and also show why I do not believe mainstream Christianity is correct in regards to Hebrews 4 and the Sabbath in general and show why the man-made teachings and traditions around Sunday worship that the Christian world is following after as a replacement for Gods' 4th commandment is not biblical. On the other hand you cannot tell me why you disagree with what I have posted here from the scriptures in this thread that I have shared with you only in love, despite me asking you many times now what is it specifically that I have posted that you disagree with and why. We can only find the truth of Gods' Word as we turn away from the teachings and the traditions of men that break the commandments of God *Matthew 15:2-9 as we prayerfully seek it through Jesus claiming His promises through his Word (John 14:26: John 16:13; John 7:17: John 8:31-36; Hebrews 8:10-11; 1 John 2:27; Jeremiah 29:13-14). This is the only place I want people to look and this is where I seek to point everyone who has ears to hear and eyes to see because He must increase and we must decrease according to the scriptures.
 
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Ceallaigh

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True we do not get our righteousness from law keeping we get it though faith in Christ. According to the scriptures, we are saved by grace through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God and not of works lest any man should boast *Ephesians 2:8-9. As posted earlier, somewhere, obedience to God's words are not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of genuine faith of one that is already been given Gods promise of salvation and the fruit of God's work in us *Philippians 2:13 as we believe and follow his word *John 10:26-27. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *James 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *Matthew 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50; Hebrews 10:26-27. Therefore we do not abolish God's law through faith like some people teach but God's law is established in the heart by faith that works by love *Romans 3:31; 1 John 5:3-4; Romans 13:8-10. According to the scriptures, sin (breaking God' commandments and not believing and following God's Word) is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 John 3:6-10; 1 John 2:3-4; Revelation 12:17; Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14. At the second coming Christs reward is with him *Revelation 22:12.

Orthodox Christianity doesn't say the law was abolished. But rather says according to the New Testament/New Covenant, that the law was fulfilled in Jesus Christ. And our (sabbath) rest in Jesus Christ, not in the Old Covenant law given by Moses.
 
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Orthodox Christianity doesn't say the law was abolished. But rather says according to the New Testament, that the law was fulfilled in Jesus Christ. And our (sabbath) rest in Jesus Christ, not in the law given by Moses.
Same outcome. Many claim that Jesus fulfilled the law so that we no longer have to. This is a teaching that is not biblical. God's Word does not teach lawlessness (without law). According to the scriptures in the old covenant, the Mosaic shadow laws for remission of sins from the Mosiac book of the covenant *Exodus 24:7 (e.g. The Priesthood laws, the Sanctuary laws, the laws of animal sacrifices and sin offerings, the annual Feast days etc..). These were all prophetic in nature pointing to the coming of the Messiah in Jesus as Gods sacrifice for the sins of the world once and for all *John 1:29:John 1:36: Hebrews 10:10 and His ministration on our behalf under the new covenant in the Heavenly Sanctuary that the Lord pitched and not man based on better promises (see Hebrews 7:1-25; Hebrews 8:1-13; Hebrews 9:1-27 and Hebrews 10:1-22.) Of course Jesus also fulfilled all of God's 10 commandments and laws in order to be our perfect sacrifice for sin. However Jesus did not fulfill the law so that we no longer have to. He led the way and we are to follow in His footsteps to be born again of the Spirit into Gods 'new covenant promise *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. Do you know what Gods' new covenant promise is to us Brian? If so what do you think it means? Our sabbath rest in Jesus only come as we believe and follow what Gods' Word says. We do not enter into Gods 'rest if we do not believe and follow what Gods' Word says according to the scriptures (see Hebrews 3:8-19; Hebrews 4:1-5). This includes breaking his commandments *1 John 2:3-4; 1 John 5:2-3; John 14:15; John 15:10; 1 John 3:6-9; Revelation 12:17; Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14. According to the scriptures sin (breaking Gods' commandments and unbelief) is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil in 1 John 3:6-10. These are the same warnings that are given to us in Hebrews 3:8-19 and Hebrews 4:1-11.

Take Care Brian.
 
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Are you saying that goes against orthodox Christian teaching?
No sir. The context of the letter does not imply or say what you are conferring.
 
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Ceallaigh

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The difference though between you and I though Brian is that by Gods' grace, I can show you what I believe from the scriptures and also show why I do not believe mainstream Christianity is correct in regards to Hebrews 4 and the Sabbath in general and show why the man-made teachings and traditions around Sunday worship that the Christian world is following after as a replacement for Gods' 4th commandment is not biblical. On the other hand you cannot tell me why you disagree with what I have posted here from the scriptures in this thread that I have shared with you only in love, despite me asking you many times now what is it specifically that I have posted that you disagree with and why. We can only find the truth of Gods' Word as we turn away from the teachings and the traditions of men that break the commandments of God *Matthew 15:2-9 as we prayerfully seek it through Jesus claiming His promises through his Word (John 14:26: John 16:13; John 7:17: John 8:31-36; Hebrews 8:10-11; 1 John 2:27; Jeremiah 29:13-14). This is the only place I want people to look and this is where I seek to point everyone who has ears to hear and eyes to see because He must increase and we must decrease according to the scriptures.

You've never posted any scripture that says Christians are required to keep the old covenant saturday sabbath. I've only seen you and and your cohorts unconvincingly read that into scripture. You display being thoroughly immersed in what I know to be a latter-day man-made unorthodox unsound doctrine. I'm sure you're sincere and mean well, but it just doesn't wash.
 
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HIM

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How does what I said go against orthodox Christian teaching?
Please show how orthodox Christian teaching came to the following conclusion you are putting forth
The letter of Hebrews is teaching Jews who converted to Christianity, not to go back to Mosaic law.
 
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Ceallaigh

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Please show how orthodox Christian teaching came to the following conclusion you are putting forth

I'm asking you to point out my error according to orthodoxy so that I can see where I went wrong.
 
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