Let's Talk About Hell (3)

[createdtoworship]

No. I do not believe in purgartoy. I believe Go fire are spiritual in nature. As any Catholic they will tell you purgatory are literal fires.

Sure it natural Israel is accepatble to God.

What I am saying is Spiritual Israel was always God's plan. Natural Israel never had the blood of Jesus.

Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the House of Israel and with the house of Judah:
9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the House of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.


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there is no spiritual Israel, the quote you have was for the House of Israel. Every time it mentions israel it means israel. This is replacement theology. Not orthodox.

If the church is spiritual israel then we must keep the sabbath.

 

[createdtoworship]

No. I do not believe in purgartoy. I believe Go fire are spiritual in nature. As any Catholic they will tell you purgatory are literal fires.

Sure it natural Israel is accepatble to God.

What I am saying is Spiritual Israel was always God's plan. Natural Israel never had the blood of Jesus.

Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the House of Israel and with the house of Judah:
9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the House of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

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"spiritual israel"


Look up this phrase; you’ll never find the term or concept in the Bible. There are only two verses that are used to validate this view, both are unsupported when they are read in their full context.

There was no Church in the Old Testament because there was no incarnation, no revelation of the Son, nor his sacrifice that broke down the middle wall of partition that separated the Jews from the Gentiles (Eph.2:14). For the Church is made up of both believing Jews and Gentiles, not so for Israel.

Gal.3:29 says that those who belong to Christ are Abraham’s seed. The seed of Abraham does not mean one is Israel. It means those who are justified by faith are spiritual descendants of Abraham but this does not make them descendants of Jacob, who is Israel. They partake in the spiritual blessings that come through Israel. While there are two different groups of people who can be descendants of Abraham one of which is the Arabs, they do not share in the promises of Jacob. Only Israel is descended from the physical posterity of Jacob. God had specially promised to Israel salvation and the believing Jews received it through the gospel. But Paul explains that not all the natural descendants of Jacob were embraced in this “Israel;” for that “they are not all Israel, which are of Israel” (Rom. 9:6). As Paul already declared in an earlier chapter: “He is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; but he is a Jew, which is one inwardly” (Rom. 2:28, 29). The seed which is Israel is from Jacob and the apostle and other writers make a clear distinction between this and Abraham’s seed.

“But they have not all obeyed the gospel” ( Rom. 10:16). They have not all responded to God’s call to repentance and faith in Jesus Christ. This is foretold by Isaiah, who is quoted by Paul in Rom. 9:27; that only a remnant of the natural descendants of Jacob would obtain the salvation of God. “Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the remnant hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded” (Rom. 11:7).

Gal. 3:7 “Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham." Being a son of Abraham does not make one a Jew, being a son of Jacob does, so a gentile can be a son of Abraham. But Jew’s are a son of Abraham and of Jacob.

As Paul stated in Rom. 4:11-16, the children of Abraham, are those who have the faith of Abraham, whether by their natural birth they were Jews or Gentiles. This is detailed in Galatians 3 and 4; Gal. 3:26 “For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus” both Jews and Gentiles are spiritual brethren in the body of Christ.” The apostle says, to Gentile believers: “And if ye be Christ’s then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise” (Gal. 3:29). So those who accept the Gospel both Jews and Gentiles are of Abraham's seed, but only those who are physically Israel are from Jacobs seed.

The other verse is Gal.6:16 where Paul is addressing both believing Jews and Gentiles in the church “As many as walk according to this rule (Gentile believers) and upon “the Israel of God.” This can be made clear by the preceding verses v.12-13 where Paul is tackling the topic of circumcision and the Jews influence to have the gentiles circumcised. He then tells us the mandatory rite of the Abrahamic covenant is not applicable to the believer but it is the cross that is necessary to make a new creation. In its context this term means Jews who are believers, who believe salvation is by faith in Christ contrary to what the Judaizer's were teaching that the law was needed also. Those (Jews) who obey this are the Israel of God (the remnant). Paul also addresses this in Rom.9:6-8 that there are two Israel's, one that consists of Jews and the elect, the true Israel which are the physical posterity and also have the faith of Abraham, they are the Israel of God mentioned in Gal.6. As Paul states, “ for they are not all Israel who are of Israel” (Rom.9:6). There is also “Israel” after the flesh found in 1 Cor.10:18. The Church is never called spiritual Israel or is a new Israel replacing the old. Nor does it say believers become Jews. Both gentiles and Jews participate together in the New Covenant. as Eph. 2 addresses the middle wall of partition being broken down and God making a new entity. The church is neither Jew or Gentile but consists of both. The two put together make one “new man,” a third entity that is not Israel nor gentile. The word Israel is used 73 times in the New Testament, not once is it used for the Church.

Romans 2:28-29, “For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.” Notice that the whole chapter is addressing the Jews. Within Paul’s theme of the book of Romans he addresses mankind that can be outlined in 3 portions. The whole world is under condemnation of sin1:18-3:30; then he addresses the Gentiles 1:18-2:16; He addresses the Jews 2:17-3:20.

According to Paul’s specific aim in this portion of the letter, not all the descendants from Jacob are Israel; as he states on 9:6 “They are not all Israel who are Israel.” Not all who are named Jews are truly Jews, the true Israel of God (the Jews) are those who believe in the Messiah. Rom.2:17- 20 starts with the greater responsibility the Jews have. He points to the law that was not given to the Gentiles but the nation of Israel, and they have the responsibility of knowing God.



IS THE CHURCH (spiritual) ISRAEL

 

[he-man]

I do not respond to just verses. If God's Word does not spea to your spirit then all you have is the letter that illeth.

Here is the LETTER that Killeth!

Zec 12:11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.

Zec 12:9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem

 

[createdtoworship]

the whole picture....about eternal hell


This message will change your life! - YouTube

 

[Ed Bana]

I do not believe in your false god you call orthodoxy.

Perfection is found in God's seconds.

Often the firsts are but a type and a shadow of the reality which is later to be found in the seconds.

In the former we find the negative realm working out its purpose, and in the latter there is the glorious positive fulfilling its sphere.



Should I repost my list of God's first and seconds again?


Obviously you did not read them or you have no spiritual discernment.

gradyll;

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there is no spiritual Israel, the quote you have was for the House of Israel. Every time it mentions israel it means israel. This is replacement theology. Not orthodox.

If the church is spiritual israel then we must keep the sabbath.

 

[Ed Bana]

I do not respond to verses by them selves, The letter killeth.

Here is the LETTER that Killeth!

Zec 12:11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.

Zec 12:9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem

 

[Ed Bana]

These verses are all speaking of Spiritual Israel but you do not see it.

[



L

ook up this phrase; you’ll never find the term or concept in the Bible. There are only two verses that are used to validate this view, both are unsupported when they are read in their full context.

There was no Church in the Old Testament because there was no incarnation, no revelation of the Son, nor his sacrifice that broke down the middle wall of partition that separated the Jews from the Gentiles (Eph.2:14). For the Church is made up of both believing Jews and Gentiles, not so for Israel.

Gal.3:29 says that those who belong to Christ are Abraham’s seed. The seed of Abraham does not mean one is Israel. It means those who are justified by faith are spiritual descendants of Abraham but this does not make them descendants of Jacob, who is Israel. They partake in the spiritual blessings that come through Israel. While there are two different groups of people who can be descendants of Abraham one of which is the Arabs, they do not share in the promises of Jacob. Only Israel is descended from the physical posterity of Jacob. God had specially promised to Israel salvation and the believing Jews received it through the gospel. But Paul explains that not all the natural descendants of Jacob were embraced in this “Israel;” for that “they are not all Israel, which are of Israel” (Rom. 9:6). As Paul already declared in an earlier chapter: “He is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; but he is a Jew, which is one inwardly” (Rom. 2:28, 29). The seed which is Israel is from Jacob and the apostle and other writers make a clear distinction between this and Abraham’s seed.

The ten tribes of Israel are all scattered and you do not know who or where they are.

Genesis 22:16-18 (King James Version)
16And said, By myself have I sworn, saith the LORD, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son:
17That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars (spiritual Israel) of the heaven, and as the sand (natural Israel) which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;
18And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.

“But they have not all obeyed the gospel” ( Rom. 10:16). They have not all responded to God’s call to repentance and faith in Jesus Christ. This is foretold by Isaiah, who is quoted by Paul in Rom. 9:27; that only a remnant of the natural descendants of Jacob would obtain the salvation of God. “Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the remnant hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded” (Rom. 11:7).

Again this is God's elect which are spiritual people not natural.

Romans 11:26And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

If God made a covenant with Abram that his seed would multiply thy seed as the stars (spiritual Israel) of the heaven, and as the sand (natural Israel) which is upon the sea shore how can it just be a remnant be saved. Stop and thing for a second???? How many grains of sand can you place in th epalm of your hands? A lot more then a remnant.


Genesis 22:16-18 (King James Version)
16And said, By myself have I sworn, saith the LORD, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son:
17That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars (spiritual Israel) of the heaven, and as the sand (natural Israel) which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;
18And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.

Gal. 3:7 “Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham." Being a son of Abraham does not make one a Jew, being a son of Jacob does, so a gentile can be a son of Abraham. But Jew’s are a son of Abraham and of Jacob.

Judah is but one tribe and they are not of the ten tribes that were scattered.

As Paul stated in Rom. 4:11-16, the children of Abraham, are those who have the faith of Abraham, whether by their natural birth they were Jews or Gentiles. This is detailed in Galatians 3 and 4; Gal. 3:26 “For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus” both Jews and Gentiles are spiritual brethren in the body of Christ.” The apostle says, to Gentile believers: “And if ye be Christ’s then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise” (Gal. 3:29). So those who accept the Gospel both Jews and Gentiles are of Abraham's seed, but only those who are physically Israel are from Jacobs seed.

Spiritual Israel.

The other verse is Gal.6:16 where Paul is addressing both believing Jews and Gentiles in the church “As many as walk according to this rule (Gentile believers) and upon “the Israel of God.” This can be made clear by the preceding verses v.12-13 where Paul is tackling the topic of circumcision and the Jews influence to have the gentiles circumcised. He then tells us the mandatory rite of the Abrahamic covenant is not applicable to the believer but it is the cross that is necessary to make a new creation. In its context this term means Jews who are believers, who believe salvation is by faith in Christ contrary to what the Judaizer's were teaching that the law was needed also. Those (Jews) who obey this are the Israel of God (the remnant). Paul also addresses this in Rom.9:6-8 that there are two Israel's, one that consists of Jews and the elect, the true Israel which are the physical posterity and also have the faith of Abraham, they are the Israel of God mentioned in Gal.6. As Paul states, “ for they are not all Israel who are of Israel” (Rom.9:6). There is also “Israel” after the flesh found in 1 Cor.10:18. The Church is never called spiritual Israel or is a new Israel replacing the old. Nor does it say believers become Jews. Both gentiles and Jews participate together in the New Covenant. as Eph. 2 addresses the middle wall of partition being broken down and God making a new entity. The church is neither Jew or Gentile but consists of both. The two put together make one “new man,” a third entity that is not Israel nor gentile. The word Israel is used 73 times in the New Testament, not once is it used for the Church.

The Church is not God's elect. The ovecomers are God's elect.

There are two groups of people I the book of Revelation; those who overcome (God’s elect) and everyone else.

Notice there is a distinction between the great multitudes BEFORE the throne (Rev. 7:9) in comparison to the overcomer who Christ will grant to sit with me on my throne (Rev. 3:21) .

Rev. 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

Rev. 3: 21To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne. 22He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches

Romans 2:28-29, “For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.” Notice that the whole chapter is addressing the Jews. Within Paul’s theme of the book of Romans he addresses mankind that can be outlined in 3 portions. The whole world is under condemnation of sin1:18-3:30; then he addresses the Gentiles 1:18-2:16; He addresses the Jews 2:17-3:20.

Spiritual Israel.

 

[Ed Bana]

Babylonian Propaganda

the whole picture....about eternal hell


This message will change your life! - YouTube

 

[createdtoworship]

These verses are all speaking of Spiritual Israel but you do not see it.

[



L

The ten tribes of Israel are all scattered and you do not know who or where they are.

Genesis 22:16-18 (King James Version)
16And said, By myself have I sworn, saith the LORD, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son:
17That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars (spiritual Israel) of the heaven, and as the sand (natural Israel) which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;
18And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.




Again this is God's elect which are spiritual people not natural.

Romans 11:26And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

If God made a covenant with Abram that his seed would multiply thy seed as the stars (spiritual Israel) of the heaven, and as the sand (natural Israel) which is upon the sea shore how can it just be a remnant be saved. Stop and thing for a second???? How many grains of sand can you place in th epalm of your hands? A lot more then a remnant.


Genesis 22:16-18 (King James Version)
16And said, By myself have I sworn, saith the LORD, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son:
17That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars (spiritual Israel) of the heaven, and as the sand (natural Israel) which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;
18And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.



Judah is but one tribe and they are not of the ten tribes that were scattered.




Spiritual Israel.



The Church is not God's elect. The ovecomers are God's elect.

There are two groups of people I the book of Revelation; those who overcome (God’s elect) and everyone else.

Notice there is a distinction between the great multitudes BEFORE the throne (Rev. 7:9) in comparison to the overcomer who Christ will grant to sit with me on my throne (Rev. 3:21) .

Rev. 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

Rev. 3: 21To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne. 22He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches




Spiritual Israel.

if the church is spiritual israel we must keep the sabbath like israel does

here is a cut and paste about replacement theology

Replacement Theology - Among theologians, the older and more widely used term is “supersessionism.” The Church “supersedes” Israel. Its proponents teach that God has set aside Israel and made the Church “new Israel,” the new and improved people of God. There are many variations within the broad spectrum of Replacement Theology, but two of the main approaches are these:

1. Israel’s role as the people of God was completed (economic supersessionism). This is the kinder and gentler way of stating the basic thesis of Replacement Theology. It says that once the Messiah came 2,000 years ago, Israel’s mission was completed. A transition occurred at that point, and the Church took over as the people of God and became the focal point for the outworking of God’s plan and purpose in redemption. God is no longer working administratively through ethnic Israel.

2. Israel’s place as the people of God was forfeited (punitive supersessionism). Other Replacement theologians are more straightforward and actually say that the supposed replacement of Israel was a divine judgment on the nation for its rejection of the Messiah in the first century. This is what some writers have called “punitive secessionism.”

Perhaps Martin Luther articulated this position most eloquently when he wrote: “For such ruthless wrath of God is sufficient evidence that they [i.e., the Jewish people] assuredly have erred and gone astray. Even a child can comprehend this. For one dare not regard God as so cruel that he would punish his own people so long, so terrible, so unmercifully … Therefore this work of wrath is proof that the Jews, surely rejected by God, are no longer his people, and neither is he any longer their God” (“On the Jews and Their Lies,” Trans. Martin H. Bertram, in Luther’s Works [Philadelphia: Fortress Press, 1971], p. 265).

Common threads that weave their way through the numerous variations of supersessionism are (1) that God is finished with Israel as a nation, and (2) that the promises He made to Israel in the Old Testament have been inherited by the Church. (However, most Replacement theologians are reluctant to say that the Church - which is largely in apostasy today - has also inherited the curses and judgments that God pronounced on Israel for her apostasy.)

One defender of Replacement Theology writes: “The Jewish nation no longer has a place as the special people of God; that place has been taken by the Christian community which fulfills God’s purpose for Israel” (Bruce Waltke, “Kingdom Promises as Spiritual,” in Continuity and Discontinuity: Perspectives on the Relationship Between the Testaments, Ed. John S. Feinberg [Wheaton, Illinois: Crossway, 1987] p. 275). This is how one evangelical theologian summarized the essence of supersessionism in a paper he presented at the Evangelical Theological Society annual meeting a few years ago: “The issue is whether national Israel as an administrative structure is still in the plan of God” (“A Future for Israel in Covenant Theology: The Untold Story” by R. Todd Mangum, Instructor in Historical and Systematic Theology at Biblical Theological Seminary in Hatfield, Pennsylvania [November 16, 2000], p. 20.

Theological Basis

Replacement Theology is closely associated with Reformed (or Covenant) Theology, the brand of theology historically linked to John Calvin (1509-1564) and the Protestant Reformation. Reformed/Covenant Theology, in turn, is closely associated with amillennialism, an eschatological view with a spiritualized (rather than literal-historical) interpretation of the prophetic Scriptures. The natural affinity these views (that is, Replacement Theology and amillennialism) seem to have for each other is understandable because Replacement Theology relies so heavily on a non-literal and allegorical interpretation of the biblical promises to Israel.

Although many of the early Reformers and Puritans - including even Calvin himself - wrote about the nation of Israel one day being restored by the grace of God and experiencing a national regeneration, that is an increasingly marginalized, minority view in Reformed Christianity today (which is ironic, since we have seen the amazing rebirth of the nation of Israel, just as the Word of God predicted!). And even among those who allow for an end-time work of the Spirit of God among the Jewish people, there is still a reluctance to acknowledge that God is not finished with His people Israel as a nation, or to acknowledge the prospect of a future Kingdom on the Earth.

This view stands in contrast to the teachings of Dispensational Premillennialism, which affirms the continuing role that Israel plays (in tandem with the Church) in the outworking of God’s plan of redemption.

Exegetical Problems with Supersessionism

Did the sins of the Jewish nation result in her rejection? Paul’s answer is found in Romans 11: I say then, has God cast away His people? Certainly not! For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. God has not cast away his people whom He foreknew (vv. 1-2, NKJV). I say then, have they [Israel] stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles. Now if their fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness! (vv. 11-12, NKJV). For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead? (v. 15, NKJV).

If the Jewish nation has no future in God’s plan, as the supersessionists claim, then what is the future “fullness” of Israel that Paul mentions in verse 12? And when, exactly, will the nation be resurrected (“life from the dead&#8221 and “accepted” by God (verse 15)? Paul can’t be talking about the Church in this passage because the Church has never died - and never will (John 11:26). The only reasonable answer is that Paul is referring to a yet-future resurrection and restoration of Am Israel (the “people of Israel,” a collective term for the nation), as prophesied in passages like Ezekiel 37:1-14. It doesn’t mean they will automatically be saved simply because they are Jewish; rather, it means that the majority of Jewish people who are living at that time will recognize Yeshua of Nazareth as their Messiah and receive Him as Savior (Zechariah 12:10, Romans 11:26).

They will be saved in the same way believers from all ages and generations have been saved; that is, they will be saved by grace, through faith (Eph. 2:8-10). The problem with saying that God rejected His people Israel is that the term “rejection” implies permanence and finality. Paul’s forceful statements in Romans 11 probably indicate that people were claiming, even in his day, that God had “cast away” His people Israel (v. 1). They were saying that Israel had “stumbled’ and “fallen” from her former position (vv. 11-12). Paul rejected any such notion (“Certainly not!” in verses 1 and 11). Then he goes on to say that even if we insist on saying that they were rejected, then we are forced to the conclusion that the rejection is only temporary. Even if we insist on saying that they did stumble and fall, then it must also be said that their fall brought salvation to the rest of the world (Gentiles) - and Israel’s fall, too, is only temporary because they are destined to be restored one day to a position of “fullness” (v. 12).

The “fullness of the Gentiles” (Rom. 11:25) refers to the time when the full number of non-Jewish believers has been added to the ranks of the Church and the last person has been saved. Likewise, the “fullness” of the Jewish people (v. 12) refers to the time when “all Israel shall be saved” (v. 26). As we saw earlier, that means the Jewish people en masse will recognize and receive their Messiah, Yeshua of Nazareth. There may be some dissenters - and their probably will be - but the Holy Spirit of God will do a powerful work among the Jewish people, and multitudes of them - the vast majority of them - will come to faith in the Messiah of Israel, Jesus of Nazareth.

The truth is that God is no more finished with Israel than He is finished with the Gentiles. Neither one has been replaced by the other; and God’s plan for both remains intact, in spite of their failures. This is really the crux of the issue. Replacement Theology says that Israel was rejected by God and that the rejection was permanent and irrevocable; however, we say that God’s calling on Israel was permanent and irrevocable, in spite of her many sins and shortcomings (Romans 11:29)

from

http://www.shema.com/Combating Replacement Theology/crt-004.php


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cdp1ysPYC6Y

 

[createdtoworship]

Babylonian Propaganda

I did a thesis on Babylonian beliefs, this is not babylonian. If anything your anti israel beliefs are babylonian.

regarding your quote

"Again this is God's elect which are spiritual people not natural. "

 

[he-man]

I do not respond to verses by them selves, The letter killeth.

Especially when your tongue is tied?
Originally Posted by he-man

Here is the LETTER that Killeth!

Zec 12:11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.

Zec 12:9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem
​

 

[Ed Bana]

I do not respond to verses by them selves, The letter killeth

Especially when your tongue is tied?
Originally Posted by he-man

Here is the LETTER that Killeth!

Zec 12:11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.

Zec 12:9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem
​

 

[Ed Bana]

You are NOT a spiritual man. You are a religious man I can see this by your post. You have no vision other then the vision you have been spoon fed by your false god you call Orthodoxy.

Babylon speaks of man made religious and political systems and one of the biggest man made religious system is orthodoxy.

There is no words in the Bible for the false belief in the rapture nor are two words together for the false belief in the “second coming” but you still cling to these beliefs no matter what is said to you. Spiritual Israel is God’s out called and if there is a natural connection only God’s knows for I have no clue of where these chosen people of God were scattered. I understand if God want the physical lost tribes to be his spiritual Israel he would have no problem knowing where his people are.

I see a heavenly Mt Zion as well as a Mt Zion where David lived and ruled and worshiped every day for the ark of God was at Mt Zion in scripture.

I see a heavenly Tabernacle of David as well as a Tabernacle of David where David lived and ruled and worshiped every day for the ark of God was at Mt Zion in scripture.

I see a heavenly New Jerusalem as well as a earthy Jerusalem in scripture.
So many of God’s people think that the earthy Jews/Israelites will rebuild their physical temple and start killing sheep and goats and observer the feast as they did at the time of old which will never happen. That the earthy Jews/Israelites will some day be restored to their place of glory.
This will never happen in a physical sense.

All of these ceremonies and temple worship are with in us not some outward observation which was but a type and shallow of things to come.

It is the Melchizedek priesthood that will be established with in God’s Spiritual Israel, in God’s Spiritual New Jerusalem at God spiritual Mt Zion, and a Spiritual Tabernacle of David which is far more real then any physical of the above mentioned. You will never see this for your vision is controlled by orthodoxy.
　
Prov 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.
　

I did a thesis on Babylonian beliefs, this is not babylonian. If anything your anti israel beliefs are babylonian.

regarding your quote

"Again this is God's elect which are spiritual people not natural. "

 

[Ed Bana]

GradyII,
If you look what scripture says truth is not revealed in the NT by man's dead traditions, creeds or dogma which is looking back in time for what God is saying.
Which is the letter that killeth

Spiritual truth is revealed by God's Spirit with in us which is the revelation of the Spirit.

Which is the Spirit that quicken (made alive)

If truth came from tradition then Jesus would been in total harmony with the religious of his day the Pharisees and the Sadducees but we all know they were one of the major forces to which he had conflict with.

2 Corinthians 3:6
Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

But there is a BIG difference between the living Word of God quicken by the very Spirit of Truth that God's Word also declares is the only source that can lead and guide us into all truth. There is the letter that killeth which is the literal Bible. And then their is what scripture gives life. BIG difference which is the Word of God revealed by his divine Spirit.

 

[createdtoworship]

GradyII,
If you look what scripture says truth is not revealed in the NT by man's dead traditions, creeds or dogma which is looking back in time for what God is saying.
Which is the letter that killeth

Spiritual truth is revealed by God's Spirit with in us which is the revelation of the Spirit.

Which is the Spirit that quicken (made alive)

If truth came from tradition then Jesus would been in total harmony with the religious of his day the Pharisees and the Sadducees but we all know they were one of the major forces to which he had conflict with.

2 Corinthians 3:6
Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

But there is a BIG difference between the living Word of God quicken by the very Spirit of Truth that God's Word also declares is the only source that can lead and guide us into all truth. There is the letter that killeth which is the literal Bible. And then their is what scripture gives life. BIG difference which is the Word of God revealed by his divine Spirit.

you can't quote the same verse (the letter that killeth) whenever someone quotes a Bible verse that you can't answer. You can't spirtualize israel.....anti semitism was the reason for the holocaust (and Hitler was a religious man).

 

[createdtoworship]

You are NOT a spiritual man. You are a religious man I can see this by your post. You have no vision other then the vision you have been spoon fed by your false god you call Orthodoxy.

Babylon speaks of man made religious and political systems and one of the biggest man made religious system is orthodoxy.

There is no words in the Bible for the false belief in the rapture nor are two words together for the false belief in the “second coming” but you still cling to these beliefs no matter what is said to you. Spiritual Israel is God’s out called and if there is a natural connection only God’s knows for I have no clue of where these chosen people of God were scattered. I understand if God want the physical lost tribes to be his spiritual Israel he would have no problem knowing where his people are.

I see a heavenly Mt Zion as well as a Mt Zion where David lived and ruled and worshiped every day for the ark of God was at Mt Zion in scripture.

I see a heavenly Tabernacle of David as well as a Tabernacle of David where David lived and ruled and worshiped every day for the ark of God was at Mt Zion in scripture.

I see a heavenly New Jerusalem as well as a earthy Jerusalem in scripture.
So many of God’s people think that the earthy Jews/Israelites will rebuild their physical temple and start killing sheep and goats and observer the feast as they did at the time of old which will never happen. That the earthy Jews/Israelites will some day be restored to their place of glory.
This will never happen in a physical sense.

All of these ceremonies and temple worship are with in us not some outward observation which was but a type and shallow of things to come.

It is the Melchizedek priesthood that will be established with in God’s Spiritual Israel, in God’s Spiritual New Jerusalem at God spiritual Mt Zion, and a Spiritual Tabernacle of David which is far more real then any physical of the above mentioned. You will never see this for your vision is controlled by orthodoxy.
　
Prov 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.
　

Read Ezekiel 40-48 it's the temple that you say the Jews are not supposed to build.

 

[Ed Bana]

That temple is being built now with in us.

Read Ezekiel 40-48 it's the temple that you say the Jews are not supposed to build.

 

[Ed Bana]

Yes I can. You too are a religiousman and know nothing that is spiritual. All you believe must fit in your man made little orthadox box.

you can't quote the same verse (the letter that killeth) whenever someone quotes a Bible verse that you can't answer. You can't spirtualize israel.....anti semitism was the reason for the holocaust (and Hitler was a religious man).

 

[he-man]

I do not respond to verses by them selves, The letter killeth

Here are some more for you to kiss:

Psa 2:12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.

Dan 2:44 And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.

Zec 12:3 And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it.

You say you would not comment on 2 verses? Better to hold your tongue than for it to consume away in the mouth

Zec 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Isa 60:12 For the nation and kingdom that will not serve thee shall perish; yea, those nations shall be utterly wasted

Hag 2:22 And I will overthrow the throne of kingdoms, and I will destroy the strength of the kingdoms of the heathen; and I will overthrow the chariots, and those that ride in them; and the horses and their riders shall come down, every one by the sword of his brother.

Luk 19:27But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.

 

[createdtoworship]

That temple is being built now with in us.

Thats not the same temple Ezekiel mentions, it mentions width height and breadth of the layout along with all the furnishings and the lavers. But the temple mount is in muslim control right now, it's impossible to rebuild. It's a future prophecy. You don't believe in messianic prophecy?