Let's Talk About Hell (3)

[createdtoworship]

You are going to be surprised.



So I should believe you and ignore God's Word??


Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

Explain baptism of fire?

Mark 9:49For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.

Luke 3:16 John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:

Luke 3:17 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and will gather the wheat into his garner; but the chaff he will burn with fire unquenchable

Do you know anything about farming, the chaff is the outer (flesh) of the wheat until the wheat is mature the chaff and the wheat are the same and cannot be separated.
Hebrews 12:18 For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest,


1 Peter 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

being baptized with fire referred to pentecost and the fire of tongues.

not gehennah. Every occasion of fire in the new testament doesn't refer to gehennah nor does it refer to hell either one. in hebrews 12 it was the mountain burning not the believer. So you need more proof than the fact that the word fire is in a verse. But what is the context of the fire. is it cloven tongues of fire as in pentecost or is it the fire of tribulations meaning a refining fire not a literal fire. You have yet to provide a verse suggesting that believers will literally burn and be purified.

 

[Ed Bana]

I do not need to prove nothing, fire is big part of God's process of perfection of His elect. This is not literal fire a so called witch being burnt in the dark age of man's history but the fire of God in us to purge out all that is carnal and earthy the outer hull, the chaff, or our fleshy nature.

I ask why fire why cloven tounges of fire on the first day of Pentecost?

No one said the believer is going to get burnt up. How carnal. God's fires are spiritual they will burn up the wood hay and stubble, but not the people.

“Chaff” are you a city person or are you experience enough with farming you know what chaff is?
The green chaff is our carnal nature which needs to be burnt.

You see wheat is always hidden under the green chaff; in fact they are not even interchangeable until the wheat has reached maturity. God’s Word is our bread, which is made from wheat; which was part of the chaff in its immaturity. The wheat had to be gathered, winnowed and crushed; then mixed with oil (anointing) and water and then placed in an oven to be baked; later the bread was broken; symbolism.


These verses are not speaking of pentecost they are speaking of God's firey process beyond the basic salvation experence.

The apostle Peter expressed the truth of it this way: "Beloved, do not be amazed and bewildered by the fiery ordeal which is taking place to test your quality, as though something strange - unusual and alien to you and your position - were befalling you" (I Pet. 4:12, Amplified).

1 Peter 1:7 (KJV) That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

1 Peter 1:7 (WYC) that the proving of your faith be much more precious than gold, that is proved by fire; and be found into praising, and glory, and honour, in the revelation of Jesus Christ
　
Don't forget Daniels friend’s thrown in the Fiery Furnace in Babylon.Only their bondages were burn. (now that is something real spiritual)

Dan 3:23 And these three men, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, fell down bound into the midst of the burning fiery furnace.
　24Then Nebuchadnezzar the king was astonished, and rose up in haste, and spake, and said unto his counsellors, Did not we cast three men bound into the midst of the fire? They answered and said unto the king, True, O king.
　25He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.
　
That is why there is no such thing as a so called rapture. God wants overcoming sons not escapist.
　
　

being baptized with fire referred to pentecost and the fire of tongues.

not gehennah. Every occasion of fire in the new testament doesn't refer to gehennah nor does it refer to hell either one. in hebrews 12 it was the mountain burning not the believer. So you need more proof than the fact that the word fire is in a verse. But what is the context of the fire. is it cloven tongues of fire as in pentecost or is it the fire of tribulations meaning a refining fire not a literal fire. You have yet to provide a verse suggesting that believers will literally burn and be purified.

 

[Ed Bana]

Explain to me why you believe this?

being baptized with fire referred to pentecost and the fire of tongues.
.

 

[Ed Bana]

Why fire?

Why not Gehenna?

Did you find me that proof I ask for that Gehenna is for the lost and sinners of the world?
　
Matt. 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell (Gehenna) fire.


"brother"

being baptized with fire referred to pentecost and the fire of tongues.

not gehennah.
.

 

[createdtoworship]

Why fire?

Why not Gehenna?

Did you find me that proof I ask for that Gehenna is for the lost and sinners of the world?
　
Matt. 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell (Gehenna) fire.


"brother"

matthew 5:22 is real hell

 

[Timothew]

matthew 5:22 is real hell

The Scriptures say γέενναν ge'ennaan in Matthew 5:22.

Jesus' listeners knew what ge'ennan was. They could even see it if they wanted to.

 

[Ed Bana]

Yes it is for believers. Unless you can prove it is for the heathen, lost etc by using God's Word not you bias religious opinion.

What is a real hell?

matthew 5:22 is real hell

 

[Timothew]

Yes it is for believers. Unless you can prove it is for the heathen, lost etc by using God's Word not you bias religious opinion.

What is a real hell?

Hell is for believers not unbelievers. That's a new twist.

 

[Ed Bana]

There is no hell. Hell is a lie made up by Rome. Gehenna is for believers. Read what I have already posted.

Hell is for believers not unbelievers. That's a new twist.

 

[createdtoworship]

Yes it is for believers. Unless you can prove it is for the heathen, lost etc by using God's Word not you bias religious opinion.

What is a real hell?

you are the one twisting orthodox truth, so prove it is for believers only then. You can't so you ask us to prove it.

 

[Ed Bana]

I aleady did. I gave you scripture and context of thet scripture proved your false god you call orthodox wrong again. I believe in the Spirit of truth to lead and guide me into all truth. Not the false god man made religious orthodoxy.

Just like God caused the fall.

Ps. 90:1-3. "Lord, You have been our dwelling place in all generations. Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever You have formed the earth or the world, even from everlasting to everlasting, You are God. You (God) turn man to destruction; and say return you children of men.

Notice time frame in red.

you are the one twisting orthodox truth, so prove it is for believers only then. You can't so you ask us to prove it.

 

[createdtoworship]

I aleady did. I gave you scripture and context of thet scripture proved your false god you call orthodox wrong again. I believe in the Spirit of truth to lead and guide me into all truth. Not the false god man made religious orthodoxy.

Just like God caused the fall.

Ps. 90:1-3. "Lord, You have been our dwelling place in all generations. Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever You have formed the earth or the world, even from everlasting to everlasting, You are God. You (God) turn man to destruction; and say return you children of men.

Notice time frame in red.

from what I remember you quoted every verse in the new testament that had "fire" in it and you assumed it meant gehennah. Is this the evidence you speak of? Try again.

 

[Ed Bana]

Try reading what I said instead of your memory.

Well you better look closer because that is not what happened. The only verse I quoted with Gehenna in it was Matt. 5:22 which clear has the word “brother” in it.
Not heathen, the lost, or the wicked. We will all go thought the Lake of Divine Purging but not forever and ever. Matt. 5:22 is my evidence something you do not have unless you can produce a verse with evidence that the heathen, lost and the wicked will en up in Gehenna.

Matt. 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell (Gehenna) fire.

All the other verses I quoted you were in reference to believer and the fiery process of purification we must all go thought be in by the baptism of fire. If we do not go thought this process of fire then we will need to go thought the Lake of fire. Only the overcomers were not hurt by the second death which is the Lake of Fire. Because they all ready went thought God’s awesome spiritual fire.
It is not a matter of if we go thought the fire it is when.

Isaiah 43:2
King James Version (KJV)
2When thou passest through the waters, I will be with thee; and through the rivers, they shall not overflow thee: when thou walkest through the fire, thou shalt not be burned; neither shall the flame kindle upon thee.
How about you read what I have already said and refute it or agree instead of asking me to try again. I am the one with the scriptural facts here. You’re the one who has noted refuted a word I said,
　
　

from what I remember you quoted every verse in the new testament that had "fire" in it and you assumed it meant gehennah. Is this the evidence you speak of? Try again.

 

[createdtoworship]

Try reading what I said instead of your memory.

Well you better look closer because that is not what happened. The only verse I quoted with Gehenna in it was Matt. 5:22 which clear has the word “brother” in it.
Not heathen, the lost, or the wicked. We will all go thought the Lake of Divine Purging but not forever and ever. Matt. 5:22 is my evidence something you do not have unless you can produce a verse with evidence that the heathen, lost and the wicked will en up in Gehenna.

Matt. 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell (Gehenna) fire.

All the other verses I quoted you were in reference to believer and the fiery process of purification we must all go thought be in by the baptism of fire. If we do not go thought this process of fire then we will need to go thought the Lake of fire. Only the overcomers were not hurt by the second death which is the Lake of Fire. Because they all ready went thought God’s awesome spiritual fire.
It is not a matter of if we go thought the fire it is when.

Isaiah 43:2
King James Version (KJV)
2When thou passest through the waters, I will be with thee; and through the rivers, they shall not overflow thee: when thou walkest through the fire, thou shalt not be burned; neither shall the flame kindle upon thee.
How about you read what I have already said and refute it or agree instead of asking me to try again. I am the one with the scriptural facts here. You’re the one who has noted refuted a word I said,
　
　

my verses debunk your verses

Jesus declared on the cross, "It is finished!"
John 19:30

Ye are complete in Him." Paul said.
Colossians 2:10

The sacrifice was made for us "once for all ... forever ..."
Hebrews 9:11, 12, 25-28; 10:9-14
1 Peter 3:18

 

[Ed Bana]

Amen. Yes Jesus reverse the curse it is finished.

Are you saying there is no pressing onward and upward to the high callings of Christ Jesus. Or are you to that finished work and perfect and the work of the cross can do no more for you.

Philippians 3:13-15 (King James Version)
13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

You really are ignoring all of theses verse that speak of God's fire in believers.

my verses debunk your verses

Jesus declared on the cross, "It is finished!"
John 19:30

Ye are complete in Him." Paul said.
Colossians 2:10

The sacrifice was made for us "once for all ... forever ..."
Hebrews 9:11, 12, 25-28; 10:9-14
1 Peter 3:18

 

[he-man]

Yes it is for believers. Unless you can prove it is for the heathen, lost etc by using God's Word not you bias religious opinion.

What is a real hell?

The GRAVE.
Deu 32:22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell < H7585>, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.
&#1513;&#1488;&#1493;&#1500;
H7585
From H7592; hades or the world of the dead (as if a subterranian retreat), including its accessories and inmates: - grave, hell, pit.

 

[Ed Bana]

We are speaking of Gehenna

The GRAVE.
Deu 32:22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell < H7585>, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.
&#1513;&#1488;&#1493;&#1500;
H7585
From H7592; hades or the world of the dead (as if a subterranian retreat), including its accessories and inmates: - grave, hell, pit.

 

[createdtoworship]

Amen. Yes Jesus reverse the curse it is finished.

Are you saying there is no pressing onward and upward to the high callings of Christ Jesus. Or are you to that finished work and perfect and the work of the cross can do no more for you.

Philippians 3:13-15 (King James Version)
13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

You really are ignoring all of theses verse that speak of God's fire in believers.

pressing on toward the goal and burning in purgatory are two different things.

 

[Ed Bana]

Your whole concept of God's fire is physical.

Isaiah 48:10
Behold, I have refined thee, but not with silver; I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction.

pressing on toward the goal and burning in purgatory are two different things.

 

[createdtoworship]

Your whole concept of God's fire is physical.

Isaiah 48:10
Behold, I have refined thee, but not with silver; I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction.

Isaiah 48 is talking about Israel

Whatever the meaning, the Captivity was like being in a furnace, to test them, not destroy them. If God would go back on His word about the return, His reputation would be defamed.

Walvoord, John F. ; Zuck, Roy B. ; Dallas Theological Seminary: The Bible Knowledge Commentary : An Exposition of the Scriptures. Wheaton, IL : Victor Books, 1983-c1985, S. 1:1102