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Exodus 34:28 28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.
The Jews had added their own "rules" regarding the keeping of the 7th day Sabbath and Jesus took exception to that .... Jesus said one could do good on the Sabbath. He healed the man on the 7th day Sabbath and that is good.John 5:18
For this reason therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.
I am aware that most commentators are of the opinion that Jesus did not break the Sabbath and that the Jews had falsely accused him, but if you look at it more closely, the Jews were actually right in their accusation that Jesus broke the Sabbath.
Reason:
The law says you shall not bear any burden on the Sabbath (Jeremiah 17:21-22). That this commandment is to be understood in exactly this way can be seen from the fact that God had a man stoned to death for carrying only wood on the Sabbath (Numbers 15:32-36). Jesus broke this commandment by commanding the healed man to carry his bed (John 5:10-11). The Jews were right in their accusation in this regard. And the clear proof that Jesus broke the Sabbath lies in the fact that John the author of the Gospel agrees with this in verse 18. If Jesus had not broken the Sabbath, he would not have expressed himself in this way but would have made it clear that the Jews were lying.
The reason why Jesus broke the ceremonial commandments like the Sabbath was not because he was a sinner for he is sinless but because he wanted to show that these commandments are to be understood spiritually. The Sabbath was never to be the seventh day of the week. The Sabbath was Jesus Christ, who is the true rest in which we should enter, as Paul said. Paul also said that God never wanted animal sacrifices, but that the true sacrifice is Jesus. The Old Testament is only a shadow, the New Testament is the fulfilment and the reality.
Though the book of John uses those words, there is no argument, it cannot mean what so many wish for it to mean.John 5:18
For this reason therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.
I am aware that most commentators are of the opinion that Jesus did not break the Sabbath and that the Jews had falsely accused him, but if you look at it more closely, the Jews were actually right in their accusation that Jesus broke the Sabbath.
Reason:
The law says you shall not bear any burden on the Sabbath (Jeremiah 17:21-22). That this commandment is to be understood in exactly this way can be seen from the fact that God had a man stoned to death for carrying only wood on the Sabbath (Numbers 15:32-36). Jesus broke this commandment by commanding the healed man to carry his bed (John 5:10-11). The Jews were right in their accusation in this regard. And the clear proof that Jesus broke the Sabbath lies in the fact that John the author of the Gospel agrees with this in verse 18. If Jesus had not broken the Sabbath, he would not have expressed himself in this way but would have made it clear that the Jews were lying.
The reason why Jesus broke the ceremonial commandments like the Sabbath was not because he was a sinner for he is sinless but because he wanted to show that these commandments are to be understood spiritually. The Sabbath was never to be the seventh day of the week. The Sabbath was Jesus Christ, who is the true rest in which we should enter, as Paul said. Paul also said that God never wanted animal sacrifices, but that the true sacrifice is Jesus. The Old Testament is only a shadow, the New Testament is the fulfilment and the reality.
They added 'fences' to keep the people from trespassing the commandments. While not a bad thing what Jesus was against was them upholding them more than the commandments of God themselves.The Jews had added their own "rules" regarding the keeping of the 7th day Sabbath and Jesus took exception to that .... Jesus said one could do good on the Sabbath. He healed the man on the 7th day Sabbath and that is good.
I believe we did mention we keep the Sabbath, but just not the way the ordinances described (sacred assemblies, Leviticus 23:3) since this was made optional through the cross. Sin is preaching inaccurate laws and commandments (Matthew 5:19). The commandments in Revelation 14:12 also reflect 2 Corinthians 3:7-11 and Hebrews 8:13, obsoleting the past covenant and those engraved on the stone Moses carried since “For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment ἐντολῆς (entolēs) going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof. For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God. (KJV Hebrews 7:18-19)” So I have just pointed out three verses that said the commandment ἐντολῆς (entolēs) changed. Anyway, take care.Well if we are to believe in God's Word, we should believe that God's saint keeps God's commandments, it is the fruit of a saved person so it should be something we all strive for because I do not think the saints means the lost.
Revelation14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.
The Sabbath God deemed one of His Ten Commandments written by His own finger, so I am going to place my trust that it's something we are to keep since it is what He told us to right in the Sabbath commandment. Exodus 20:8 Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exodus 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
Exodus 34:28 28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.
There is no scripture in the entire bible that says we are free to break any of God's commandments which includes the weekly Sabbath commandment Exodus 20:8-11. Colossians 2:14-17 is referring to sacrificial ordinances, it does not say commandments. Just because sacrifices ended on the first day doesn't remove the first day or the second or the Sabbath day. Obviously, the Sabbath continues forever Isaiah 66:22-23 just as God promised.
Anyway, I don't think we are going to agree and that's okay. The scripture references are there if interested. I actually didn't mean to jump in this tread again, I am going to sign out and unfollow. I wish you well in seeking His Word.
In the NT we are told "sin IS transgression of the Law" 1 John 3:4Did He break the Sabbath? I haven't seen anybody make a conclusive case that He did, but if He did, He is God and thus, there was nothing broken. He makes the rules.
IT looks like He is saying they are breaking the commandment of God.They added 'fences' to keep the people from trespassing the commandments. While not a bad thing what Jesus was against was them upholding them more than the commandments of God themselves.
See here in Mark 7
....
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
Not really.
Did Jesus let the blind man wander in the road in John 9:11-12?Jesus did just that in one of His healing of the blind (John 9:11-12), letting a blind man wander in the road (Deuteronomy 27:18). The Father is Spirit (John 4:24), even if the law is spiritual (Romans 7:14), what Jesus said in (Matthew 15:14) is in disagreement with Him. That is why I suggested it is not that straightforward. In many other cases, Jesus did break the law on the physical level but not on the spiritual level. That is why He never sins.
So you keep the commandment not made by GOD and carved into Stone, but one made by man, right?I believe we did mention we keep the Sabbath, but just not the way the ordinances described (sacred assemblies, Leviticus 23:3) since this was made optional through the cross. Sin is preaching inaccurate laws and commandments (Matthew 5:19). The commandments in Revelation 14:12 also reflect 2 Corinthians 3:7-11 and Hebrews 8:13, obsoleting the past covenant and those engraved on the stone Moses carried since “For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment ἐντολῆς (entolēs) going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof. For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God. (KJV Hebrews 7:18-19)” So I have just pointed out three verses that said the commandment ἐντολῆς (entolēs) changed. Anyway, take care.
If he healed him of blindness he was no longer blind and could walk about like any other seeing man.Did Jesus let the blind man wander in the road in John 9:11-12?
Yes, in some cases they were breaking them or tossing aside for their fences. I was thinking of this oneIT looks like He is saying they are breaking the commandment of God.
8 Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”
9 He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘The one who speaks evil of father or mother, is certainly to be put to death’; 11 but you say, ‘If a person says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is, given to God),’ 12 you no longer allow him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13 thereby invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”
Setting it aside, invalidating God's command, Not allowing the person to honor his parents in the example shown -- looks like it goes way beyond "too much emphasis" and goes to outright breaking the 5th commandment.
This was what happened in John 9:1-11. Instead of immediate recovery like in the other records, Jesus told him to wash in the Pool of Siloam without guiding him there (v7). After the blind regained his sight, he found no Jesus until verse 35. Jesus could heal him on the spot, but He chose not to.If he healed him of blindness he was no longer blind and could walk about like any other seeing man.
So are you saying Paul spoke his own idea, not from God in all 2 Corinthians 3:7-11, Hebrews 8:13, and Hebrews 7:18-19? If God revealed to Paul to instruct us to change, should we say it is man’s will and not God’s? If one is questioning the authority of the NT, then we are not worshipping the same Christ for Christ revealed to Paul (Galatians 1:12).So you keep the commandment not made by GOD and carved into Stone, but one made by man, right?
So what do you make of Revelation 11:19
Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail.
This is the Judgement. The Covenant or the 'ten commandments' are in there.
The 24 elders proclaimed this:
And the time of the dead, that they should be judged,And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints,And those who fear Your name, small and great,And should destroy those who destroy the earth.”Those Commandments have never changed. God does not Change.
There were no 'options at the cross'????
He did 'heal him on the spot' , he just told him to go and wash in the pool of siloam.This was what happened in John 9:1-11. Instead of immediate recovery like in the other records, Jesus told him to wash in the Pool of Siloam without guiding him there (v7). After the blind regained his sight, he found no Jesus until verse 35. Jesus could heal him on the spot, but He chose not to.
Torah - A matter must be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.So are you saying Paul spoke his own idea, not from God in all 2 Corinthians 3:7-11, Hebrews 8:13, and Hebrews 7:18-19? If God revealed to Paul to instruct us to change, should we say it is man’s will and not God’s? If one is questioning the authority of the NT, then we are not worshipping the same Christ for Christ revealed to Paul (Galatians 1:12).
In the ark (Revelation 11:19), there is one thing called the manna, and how did Jesus comment on it? “Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, yet they died. This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that anyone may eat of it and not die. I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. (John 6:49-51)” So, which manna do we eat? The one in the ark or Jesus? Also, do you think the beast in Revelation 11:7 is prefiguring something or an actual monster? If it is a prefiguration like the two olive trees and lampstands (v4), where comes the confidence that the temple of God in heaven is the literal temple and not Christ who rose to heaven(Matthew 12:6, John 2:21)? Then, manna in the ark is in Christ, so as the ten commandments (2 Corinthians 3:7-11) pointing to Him, and the rod of High priest pointing the mouth of Christ (Isaiah 11:4).
God never changes from what He intended to do. Otherwise, how do we explain God change His mind to extend the life of Hezekiah (Isaiah 38:1-5)? Or the case of Abraham offering Isaac?
The only thing it says is in the ark in heaven is the testimony of the covenant, thus the ten words written by God Himself. , No Manna, no Aarons budded staff.In the ark (Revelation 11:19), there is one thing called the manna, and how did Jesus comment on it? “Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, yet they died. This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that anyone may eat of it and not die. I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. (John 6:49-51)” So, which manna do we eat? The one in the ark or Jesus?
Coming out of the abyss you could certainly call it a beast.Also, do you think the beast in Revelation 11:7 is prefiguring something or an actual monster?
The two olive trees are the two witnesses, they are filled with the HOLY SPIRIT.If it is a prefiguration like the two olive trees and lampstands (v4), where comes the confidence that the temple of God in heaven is the literal temple and not Christ who rose to heaven(Matthew 12:6, John 2:21)? Then, manna in the ark is in Christ, so as the ten commandments (2 Corinthians 3:7-11) pointing to Him, and the rod of High priest pointing the mouth of Christ (Isaiah 11:4).
Supplication does that.God never changes from what He intended to do. Otherwise, how do we explain God change His mind to extend the life of Hezekiah (Isaiah 38:1-5)? Or the case of Abraham offering Isaac?
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