Israel's future and Pat: Your view

[Jesus Is Real]

. We took the scenic route.

Thanks,
Ed

We all can appreciate your humor.


Take Care,
Connie

 

[Edial]

We all can appreciate your humor.


Take Care,
Connie

 

[Jesus Is Real]

sorry but you missed the whole heart of what I posted.....Ripping apart my post and debating the points in it totally takes the Spirit in which I wrote it away....all those issues were there as examples only not an exhaustive list and certainly not the subject of my post.

If the only contact you have with Messianics is on the Web then you are missing out on a wonder experience....Messianics love the Body of Messiah and are NOT against the Church!That kind of talk can only lead to further separation of The Body:(

Tishri1,

Yes and further it only hinders "Israel" from coming in today. Let alone abounding in more Love toward eachother.

We, in this spirit-of-the-world, are not walking in Christ' Love in His Mercy towards "Israel" and let alone towards the second--the greek as well. When we walk in even a little strife towards one another, it hurts Jesus' Witness and ours as well. In short, we only are blocking THE WAY of those who would be coming in the Kingdom of God right now. WE BREAK THE PATTERN OF OUR ROLE TOWARD GOD HAVING NOT HIS SPIRIT THROUGH UNBELIEF. AS MOSES, AT THE END OF HIS DAYS, BROKE AS WELL.

And so the Gentiles are actually falling away more than rather 'coming in to it's Fullness' in the Love of God. Many of us are standing in jeopardy. I am compelled to speak this, lest I fall away myself into strife which is demonic.

Prov 16:1-7
Proverbs 16

16:1 The preparations of the heart in man, and the answer of the tongue, is from the LORD.

2 All the ways of a man are clean in his own eyes; but the LORD weigheth the spirits.

3 Commit thy works unto the LORD, and thy thoughts shall be established.

4 The LORD hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.

5 Every one that is proud in heart is an abomination to the LORD: though hand join in hand, he shall not be unpunished.

6 By mercy and truth iniquity is purged: and by the fear of the LORD men depart from evil.

7 When a man's ways please the LORD, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him.
KJV

In The Fear of The Lord - Father help us all,
Connie

 

[Melethiel]

I've asked this many times and have yet to receive an answer - What SPECIFICALLY is the "Pattern of God"?

 

[Jesus Is Real]

To Connie ...


Connie, with all due respect, but the statement that believers are to die for their enemies is not what Christ taught.

The turning point of the NT is that Christ died for his enemies.
It is His role.

RO 5:6 You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly. 7 Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous man, though for a good man someone might possibly dare to die. 8 But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

We (believers) are told to lay down our lives for our friends, other believers.

1JN 3:16 This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers.

I addressed our actions concerning the enemies of the gospel, below.


And concerning intercession for others ...

There are only 2 intercessors in the NT -

RO 8:26 In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groans that words cannot express. 27 And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints in accordance with God's will.

RO 8:31 What, then, shall we say in response to this? If God is for us, who can be against us? 32 He who did not spare his own Son, but gave him up for us all--how will he not also, along with him, graciously give us all things? 33 Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? It is God who justifies. 34 Who is he that condemns? Christ Jesus, who died--more than that, who was raised to life--is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us.

HEB 7:23 Now there have been many of those priests, since death prevented them from continuing in office; 24 but because Jesus lives forever, he has a permanent priesthood. 25 Therefore he is able to save completely those who come to God through him, because he always lives to intercede for them.

I do not know of any other intercessors in the NT.

Connie, Christ died for us (his enemies) and He intercedes for others (we cannot).
You know why we cannot? Because God already has an Intercessor - His Son.
He will not accept our intercession.

Also, concerning our actions when Israel sins against believers -

When Israel sins, we are to do several things.
1. Rebuke Israel, hoping the she will repent.
2. Pray for Israel's salvation.
3. Help her, but only when she comes to us for help.

All 3 are backed up with Scriptures.

Thanks,
Ed

Ed,

The only way we can love our enemies, is to die to our flesh nature first and doing this is dying for others (in other words if you want to use 'strife' and 'pride' toward others die for them - in dying to that flest nature which is same as Satan. Don't give others your frustrations and strife and the like - it's not love unto them. Don't walk in strife and frustrations, then you can love them aright. God knows everyone's weakness, receive Israel by Faith in Love - extend Mercy to them as we are instructed to do. When you read your Bible FIND THE LOVE AND THE JUDGMENT OF GOD FOR YOU FIRST,...THEN IT WILL MORE MAKE SENCE TO YOU WHAT IS BEING SAID HERE.

But it's when the Holy Spirit is working in you that you can even hear this, we must all unlearn things and we are all working through things. It's a Supernatual Work of God, NO MAN CAN GET THIS GLORY. GOD IS JEALOUS FOR YOUR OWN HEART, ED.

Your death of the flesh nature is unto God's Glory when this happens and He receives this as you Loving Him and He sees it as you are loving even your enemies and your neighbor as youself.

YOU WANT ISRAEL TO LIVE UNTO CHRIST, SHOW THEM YOUR OWN DEATH ON THE CROSS SHOWING THEM MERCY AND GOD WILL SAVE THEM BY YOUR MERCY!

Rom 11:31
31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
KJV

Do you have ears to hear this now,
Connie

 

[Jesus Is Real]

I've asked this many times and have yet to receive an answer - What SPECIFICALLY is the "Pattern of God"?

Melethiel,

If all you can see is their unrepentant heart,.....then BE A PRIEST TO THEM, AS Revelation calls you into through Christ:

1.) Interceed for them - with your whole life - love them as yourself. (This takes a death to self)

2.) Carry their burden - with your whole life - love them as yourself. (This takes a death to self)

IF YOU PERSONALLY KNOW A JEW,...REBUKE THEM IN LOVE, (by your own death to your own flesh nature which is the same as Satan), AND THEN BE A PRIEST.
DON'T BREAK THE PATTERN!!!

Go back to my posts,....that is,...when you can.
you might want to print them out - they are more of Pondering and Praying Posts

Starting at My Post: #601 and #610
HERE: http://www.christianforums.com/t2492209-israels-future-and-pat-your-view.html&page=61

Then read here: Post #611
HERE:http://www.christianforums.com/t2492209-israels-future-and-pat-your-view.html&page=62

Then read here: Post #614 "One Picture Form: MOSES BROKE THE PATTERN:"
Then read here: Post #615 "BE A PRIEST TO THEM!!!"
HERE: http://www.christianforums.com/t2492209-israels-future-and-pat-your-view.html&page=62

Then read here: Post #624 "Recap: The Pattern Of God"
HERE: http://www.christianforums.com/t2492209-israels-future-and-pat-your-view.html&page=63

But sorry I missed your questions, hope this now helps,.......did it?

BE GREATLY BLESS IN CHRIST,
CONNIE

DONE UPDATING!!

 

[Jesus Is Real]

Actually, "Christian" was first used (in an intentionally derisive tone) by the Romans in reference to followers of The Way. It meant that they were "little Christs". The word does not carry this connotation today, though, and no Christian should be ashamed to be called a "little Christ". But I too have noticed that Messianics intentionally avoid calling themselves Christians. Several Messianic "Christians" on this forum have said that they do not want to be associated with that term, that they are not Christians. Not all Messianics do this, but a lot of them do.

Scholar,

IN THE LOVE OF GOD TO YOU,....

If anyones life shows the Pattern of God in Christ, this should suffice. They will be sound in Faith and have maintained good works unto The Lord being fruitful. For there is nothing to accuse them of - they are overcoming In His Name. Many Jewish believers are already suffering for Christ' Sake, this is to God's Glory. All should already be well, to you and me, on this point regarding Messianic Jew's.

It's all Jesus plus nothing else, if we add anything else it's all flesh and it's a cursed work - even if I do this as well. So even I would be fallen from God's Grace if I work any other work ~of Jesus~ then adding something else to Him. Even if I try to impose things on my own son, it's a cursed work I would be doing.

So, we are to lay no burden on Jewish believers, or any, if we are thinking they need to call themselves "Christian." If so, it's strife and it's sin. It is. And we are no longer to live in sin if we are growing In Christ.

So any who live in strife, will not enter The Kingdom of God,....just like how Moses didn't enter the Promised Land due to him not believing God by not sanctifying God in the eyes of the Children of Israel. SO GOD'S PATTERN'S OF HIS WORD MUST NOT BE BROKEN,...OR THERE IS MUCH TO LOSE. We err much, I err much not being a 'humble' student of God's Word through His Holy Spirit.

So, to have a Jewish believer call themselves by the name of 'Christain' is not a Commandment of God, so we shouldn't PREACH THIS. Because it is NOT according to GOD'S PATTERN'S.

Speaking tender to Israel,
Connie

 

[Jesus Is Real]

.
GOD BLESS YOU ALL WHO CALL UPON JESUS' NAME OUT OF A PURE HEART!!!

GOOD NIGHT!

 

[Jesus Is Real]

Take care guy!!!

Oh by the way,....we women also love men who are few in words as well at times too!!

 

[visionary]

Connie, you have truly opened up the Way for the Spirit to move upon the heart and there the spark of a new life can grow. The heart hardened can not see or hear, it needs to be broken and contrite first. May you ministry continue and grow. May the gentile patient, long suffering, tolerant Way come forth and shine with the shikinah glory. Bless you and may you continue to walk with the Lord doing His Will.

 

[ethereous]

I believe a country named Israel created by a bunch of Edomites is blaphemous. The Edomites should have their land stripped from them.

 

[Tishri1]

Connie, you have truly opened up the Way for the Spirit to move upon the heart and there the spark of a new life can grow. The heart hardened can not see or hear, it needs to be broken and contrite first. May you ministry continue and grow. May the gentile patient, long suffering, tolerant Way come forth and shine with the shikinah glory. Bless you and may you continue to walk with the Lord doing His Will.

I second that witness! Hugs to you Connie(and Vis )

 

[Tishri1]

I believe a country named Israel created by a bunch of Edomites is blaphemous. The Edomites should have their land stripped from them.

What Edomites are you refering too? The Jews? the palistinians?

 

[ethereous]

What Edomites are you refering too? The Jews? the palistinians?

The Jews ofcourse.

 

[jgonz]

I believe a country named Israel created by a bunch of Edomites is blaphemous. The Edomites should have their land stripped from them.

Well, that may be your personal opinion, but the Fact is that G-d gave the land to the Israelites and it's Theirs.

 

[Tishri1]

I believe a country named Israel created by a bunch of Edomites is blaphemous. The Edomites should have their land stripped from them.

so you think The Jews Created Israel? Where does that put ALL the old Testiment Scriptures then...I believe they tell a different story then you are

Genesis 12:1 Now the LORD said to Abram, "Go forth from your country, And from your relatives And from your father's house, To the land which I will show you; 2 And I will make you a great nation, And I will bless you, And make your name great; And so you shall be a blessing; 3 And I will bless those who bless you, And the one who curses you I will curse. And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed."
Genesis 13:14 And the LORD said to Abram, after Lot had separated from him, "Now lift up your eyes and look from the place where you are, northward and southward and eastward and westward; 15 for all the land which you see, I will give it to you and to your descendants forever.
Genesis 26:2 And the LORD appeared to him and said, "Do not go down to Egypt; stay in the land of which I shall tell you. 3 "Sojourn in this land and I will be with you and bless you, for to you and to your descendants I will give all these lands, and I will establish the oath which I swore to your father Abraham. 4 "And I will multiply your descendants as the stars of heaven, and will give your descendants all these lands; and by your descendants all the nations of the earth shall be blessed; 5 because Abraham obeyed Me and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes and My laws." 6 So Isaac lived in Gerar.
Genesis 28:1 So Isaac called Jacob and blessed him ...3 "And may God Almighty bless you and make you fruitful and multiply you, that you may become a company of peoples. 4 "May He also give you the blessing of Abraham, to you and to your descendants with you; that you may possess the land of your sojournings, which God gave to Abraham."
Genesis 32:24 Then Jacob was left alone, and a man wrestled with him until daybreak. 25 And when he saw that he had not prevailed against him, he touched the socket of his thigh; so the socket of Jacob's thigh was dislocated while he wrestled with him. 26 Then he said, "Let me go, for the dawn is breaking." But he said, "I will not let you go unless you bless me." 27 So he said to him, "What is your name?" And he said, "Jacob." 28 And he said, "Your name shall no longer be Jacob, but Israel; for you have striven with God and with men and have prevailed."
Genesis 35: 10 And God said to him, "Your name is Jacob; You shall no longer be called Jacob, But Israel shall be your name." Thus He called him Israel. 11 God also said to him, "I am God Almighty; Be fruitful and multiply; A nation and a company of nations shall come from you, And kings shall come forth from you. 12 "And the land which I gave to Abraham and Isaac, I will give it to you, And I will give the land to your descendants after you." 13 Then God went up from him in the place where He had spoken with him.

 

[Tishri1]

I felt that some of you may be blessed in following along one Christian (who was a MOD here in CF) as she struggles to defend the Jewish Nation in Israel

http://www.christianforums.com/t189...e-all-love-reloaded.html&page=11#post21910967

 

[GraceInHim]

I felt that some of you may be blessed in following along one Christian (who was a MOD here in CF) as she struggles to defend the Jewish Nation in Israel

http://www.christianforums.com/t1892323-updates-from-a-certain-missionary-we-all-love-reloaded.html&page=11#post21910967

sorry for the judging on this thread.. seems there will always be those who think they know God more then others.. when God is always in control and not MAN..

 

[Tishri1]

sorry for the judging on this thread.. seems there will always be those who think they know God more then others.. when God is always in control and not MAN..

 

[ethereous]

Well, that may be your personal opinion, but the Fact is that G-d gave the land to the Israelites and it's Theirs.

They are not Israelites. They are Edomites usurping the name to steal true Israel's birthright. It is not an opinion, it is a fact.

They admit they aren't Israelites.

Strictly speaking, it is incorrect to call an ancient Israelite a "Jew" or to call a contemporary Jew an "Israelite" or a "Hebrew." - "Identity Crisis," The Jewish Almanac, compiled and edited by Richard Siegel and Carl Rheins (New York, NY: Bantam Books, 1980) p. 3.

They admit they are Edomites.

"Edom is in modern Jewry." The Jewish Encylopedia 1925 Ed., Vol. 5, Pg. 41

They were propheside.

I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Judahites, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan. − Revelation 2:9

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Judahites, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. − Revelations 3:9

It is told in history.

Josephus Antiquities Book 13, Chapter 9

CHAPTER 9.

HOW, AFTER THE DEATH OF ANTIOCHUS, HYRCANUS MADE AN EXPEDITION AGAINST SYRIA, AND MADE A LEAGUE WITH THE ROMANS. CONCERNING THE DEATH OF KING DEMETRIUS AND ALEXANDER.

1. BUT when Hyrcanus heard of the death of Antiochus, he presently made an expedition against the cities of Syria, hoping to find them destitute of fighting men, and of such as were able to defend them. However, it was not till the sixth month that he took Medaba, and that not without the greatest distress of his army. After this he took Samega, and the neighboring places; and besides these, Shechem and Gerizzim, and the nation of the Cutheans, who dwelt at the temple which resembled that temple which was at Jerusalem, and which Alexander permitted Sanballat, the general of his army, to build for the sake of Manasseh, who was son-in-law to Jaddua the high priest, as we have formerly related; which temple was now deserted two hundred years after it was built. Hyrcanus took also Dora and Marissa, cities of Idumea, and subdued all the Idumeans; and permitted them to stay in that country, if they would circumcise their genitals, and make use of the laws of the Jews; and they were so desirous of living in the country of their forefathers, that they submitted to the use of circumcision, (25) and of the rest of the Jewish ways of living; at which time therefore this befell them, that they were hereafter no other than Jews.

This is only a tiny sample of the information out there.

so you think The Jews Created Israel? Where does that put ALL the old Testiment Scriptures then...I believe they tell a different story then you are

Israel is a nation aka a people. Not a country before it was formed by the Edomites.