Israel's future and Pat: Your view

[Melethiel]

In the 1970's and 1980's there was a mass exodus of Russian Jews out of Communist Russia. In 1999 the Associated Press reported a dramatic increase in the number of Jewish immigrants from Russia, bringing the largest number of Russian Jews to Israel since the early 1990's.

Heehee...and many of them found themselves considered second-class citizens there, so they took the welfare given to them by the state of Israel and moved back to Russia to start businesses, where they are now quite wealthy.

 

[Edial]

Ed,

We are all one in Christ Jesus, do you think Gal. 3:28 contradicts 1 Tim. 2:12?

Quote

Gal 3:28
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.KJV

Gal 4:6
6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.KJV

1 Tim 2:12
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
KJV

1 Tim 2:11-15
11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.

12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.

14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

15 Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.KJV

So,...a man in Christ is THE difference.
And so a women in Christ is THE difference, Ed. JUDGE THE CAKE BATTER INGREDIENCE!


______________________

Ed, If someone gave you a cake batter but this cake batter didn't have salt in it and it was pretty empty and bland inside, others would warn you to not make this cake for it will taste very bad.

But if in time another New Cake Batter (unlike any other cake batters in the world) was given to you, that had all the ingrediences inside of it which gave you health, it would be well for you to go ahead and make up this New Cake Batter - for all to eat in your house as a blessing to all.
__________________

You decide!

But - YES- those who are unlearned are to be silence, Ed. Those who are still in deception. So the Women - out side of Christ (THE FIRST CAKE BATTER), first and for most - like Eve who wasn't in Christ (THE FIRST CAKE BATTER) and gave 'bad fruit' to Adam for she was deceived, needs to learn at home by her Believing Husband - YES.

In other words, a deceived women (which was Eve - THE FIRST CAKE BATTER) is not to teach. Notice Paul the Jew points at DECEIVED Eve in making THIS VERY POINT. This is a Spiritual Word as well just like the harlot in Revelation is a Spiritual Word. In other words, if we are not in the Love of God, God calls us an Adulterous harlot. Read the whole Context of this Word in 1 Tim. 2:12.

Again, notice 'this woman' in 1 Tim 2:12 is likened to EVE who was deceived by The Devil and gave Adam WRONG MEAT TO EAT - WHICH WAS FORBIDDEN FRUIT BY GOD. She gave Him 'the world' - the Lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh and the boastful pride of life. EVE WAS DECEIVED AND GAVE ADAM SATAN'S WRONG DOCTRINE.

God's Word being fed through any is not forbidden for any to speak, as long as they have waited on their calling. The Lord will just have to communicate this to you.

When you read 1 Tim. 2:12 about 'women', in the Love of Christ, things will change for you but mostly the better for others who are around you. The Lord will just have to communicate this to you.

Is this what the lady Minister is teaching or this is what you personally understand the text to mean?

I take it you don't receive any edification from Joyce Meyer - let's say then, eh? Pitty - She, being a Spiritual son of God, can teach many a thing or 2 where as God is blessing many. The Lord will just have to communicate this to you.

So you are not benefited at all from Joyce Meyer? Well many, even one woman filled with the Spirit of God - in Meekness and in The Love of God might touch your life some day where you will say, "FATHER YOU BLESSED ME THROUGH THIS WOMEN." As we women are also blessed by many a great men of God filled with His Spirit. The Lord will just have to communicate this to you.

I do not think I ever heard her speak.
Yet I know of her name.
She is one of the "Faith Movement" teachers that believe that it was not finished at the cross, but that he also went to hell to suffer for us.

There are other things also concerning salvation itself.

It appears that these are the women that appeal to your spiritual needs.

So, No.
I will not accept the prayer that you offered - "FATHER YOU BLESSED ME THROUGH THIS WOMEN." ...
since you probably mean a certain type of women.

Since your not looking for a blessing from me, though still I'll say this: God works through my lady Minister in equipping the saints. She teaches many through the Holy Spirit - God is not offened by her, you shouldn't either. She is not pressured to teach, it's a joy to her to the equipping the saints in God's Word. She is a eunuch of God unto the Body - the Lord has told her. I don't expect, you to understand, if you have never heard her. But I do expect your humility and so does God's Word. The Lord will just have to communicate this to you.

God told her that she is "a eunich of God unto the Body"? And people believe her? Apparently so.
Back to Meyers, since you appear to be edified by a certain "type" of preaching.
According to CRI ... " Moreover, in her 1991 booklet, Meyer asserts that salvation is impossible without believing Jesus suffered in hell as the believer’s substitute. Meyer writes, “There is no hope of anyone going to heaven unless they believe this truth I am presenting. You cannot go to heaven unless you believe with all your heart that Jesus took your place in hell".

Then she removed word "hell" in the 1996 edition obviously after people began complaining.

It appears that Joyce Meyers appears to say whatever she want and she attributes her "wants" and promptings to God.

When I pray for you - receive it. But if you don't, then don't.

Please do not pray for me publically, Connie.
It might turn out for the worst for either of us.

If we were speaking face to face, that would be one thing,...and after I speak with you I would pray for you - you are troubled about many things and so you are attacking many people. You have been hurt Sir. We pray for you and we are carrying your burdens though you don't want to be transparent with me or others. Regarding your hurts I'm just stating the obvious. I don't laught at you,....and you are hurt. Hey, we all have hurts and wounds that are still being healed.

Connie, I told you before that people did not hurt me and your evaluation is incorrect.
Yet you refuse the believe me.
You believe your own perception.
Since I know what is going on in my life I stated that your perception is not your gift from God.
In your imagination (that's all I can call it now) you develop that I willingly refuse to acknowledge that your perception concerning me is correct.

Connie, you should not deceive yourself in such a fashion.

But what you do with others you are showing your resistance to the very Love of God and toward His Body, for your own healing. But By Christ' stripes you are healed - but you must believe. And there is healing balm in Christ' body. The Lord will just have to communicate this to you.

CHRIST MAKES ALL THE DIFFERNCE, ED.


Wait on The Lord, as I too have to.
Be Healed,
Connie

Connie what I'm doing now is what I said I would not know how to answer in the previous post.
Then you openly were praying for me invoking the Father's name. I felt quite uncomfortable about this, stated this to you, yet did not know what to do.

Throughout this post you also stated and underlined that "The Lord will just have to communicate this to you."

Connie, He did.

Please, do not pray for me in such a fashion.

Thanks,
Ed

 

[GraceInHim]

Heehee...and many of them found themselves considered second-class citizens there, so they took the welfare given to them by the state of Israel and moved back to Russia to start businesses, where they are now quite wealthy.
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and Luther's background is not quite snow white is it? people are forgiven though for past mistakes.. stones keep being thrown when no one is without sin to throw them..

 

[Melethiel]

and Luther's background is not quite snow white is it? people are forgiven though for past mistakes.. stones keep being thrown when no one is without sin to throw them..

What does this have to do with my post? I was just pointing out that there is no point in posting figures of "mass immigrations" or the like. So what if there were? What bearing does that have on anything?

 

[GraceInHim]

What does this have to do with my post? I was just pointing out that there is no point in posting figures of "mass immigrations" or the like. So what if there were? What bearing does that have on anything?

why is there no point, becuz you say so? sorry, this came from the statistics and not just a rumor mill.. and if someone cheated the system and received welfare.. that is not the whole people.. are you denying there were mass immigrations? do not get it, focus on the worse then the good

 

[Melethiel]

why is there no point, becuz you say so? sorry, this came from the statistics and not just a rumor mill.. and if someone cheated the system and received welfare.. that is not the whole people.. are you denying there were mass immigrations? do not get it, focus on the worse then the good

I'm asking, SO WHAT IF THERE WERE mass immigrations? What point are you trying to make? Also, I'm not denying there were mass immigrations. I'm pointing out that they were often short lived, and many people left later.

 

[GraceInHim]

I'm asking, SO WHAT IF THERE WERE mass immigrations? What point are you trying to make? Also, I'm not denying there were mass immigrations. I'm pointing out that they were often short lived, and many people left later.

so what? this thread is about Israel .. short lived, yes by devils themself..

 

[Melethiel]

What point were you trying to make by posting immigration statistics?

 

[GraceInHim]

What point were you trying to make by posting immigration statistics?

becuz the Prophets wrote about this.. placed many verses for this..

 

[OnTheWay]

You better be very careful which side you are on. For God is not forgiving of traitors and those who twist his Word. The enemies of Israel have been leveling their attacks against them since the fall of Jerusalem in 70 AD. The largest blow was the manipulation of Scripture with the Masoretic Texts. Ofcourse who is suprised that so many of you do not see the truth. There will only be 144,000 elect of Israel at the end time. So you can continue to filibuster with long passages that have no bearing to the arguement at hand or you could read God's word and stop taking him for a liar because it says what it says whether you believe it or not.

If that view were accurate it means literally 144,000 Jewish male virigins in heaven, according to Revelation. So people like St. Peter (not a virgin) the Mother of God Mary (not a man) and many other chief figures in Christianity (not Jews) will not be heaven. Maybe it's time to stop reading an account of a vision in the form of a dream literally. It's a good idea.

 

[Edial]

If that view were accurate it means literally 144,000 Jewish male virigins in heaven, according to Revelation. So people like St. Peter (not a virgin) the Mother of God Mary (not a man) and many other chief figures in Christianity (not Jews) will not be heaven. Maybe it's time to stop reading an account of a vision in the form of a dream literally. It's a good idea.

The argument that Mary and Peter are bypassed due to his presentation are not applicable in this case.
He presents it as a futuristic event.

I presume you do not believe that the tribulation is in the future. That is your opinion.
In any case, his view does not contradict Mary's and Peter's salvation.

Thanks,
Ed

 

[Edial]

I'm sorry Connie. I probably hurt you.
I really do not want to hurt people personally.
Please do not take the post above personally. I edited my tone slightly, yet I am not taking the post back.

Can we just talk?

Thanks,
Ed

 

[ethereous]

If that view were accurate it means literally 144,000 Jewish male virigins in heaven, according to Revelation. So people like St. Peter (not a virgin) the Mother of God Mary (not a man) and many other chief figures in Christianity (not Jews) will not be heaven. Maybe it's time to stop reading an account of a vision in the form of a dream literally. It's a good idea.

I said nothing about only 144,000 in heaven. To be elect means your are special, or chosen. I already addressed the "Jews" and I am confused where you are getting male virgins from. I believe you can't take anything that literally from Revelations. If you do you will be really confused about the end times.

I read it as there will be 144,000 elect of Israel (Christians) chosen to teach the rest of Israel the true path.

Revelations is encrypted. It is why peoples heads spin when trying to understand it.

I also think people will be really suprised to find out some things. Such as the fact that Jesus isn't a long haired hippy teaching two-fingered peace among all the people on the earth.

 

[GraceInHim]

I read it as there will be 144,000 elect of Israel (Christian Israelites) chosen to teach the rest of Israel the true path.

 

[Gwenyfur]

I read it as there will be 144,000 elect of Israel (Christian Israelites) chosen to teach the rest of Israel the true path.
...
I also think people will be really suprised to find out some things. Such as the fact that Jesus isn't a long haired hippy teaching two-fingered peace among all the people on the earth.

 

[ethereous]

Now we can discuss again who I think the Israelites are. I know many of you won't agree with me. Notice nowhere did I ever use the term Jews. For even Revelations warns of those that claim to be Judahites and are not.

I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Judahites, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan. Revelations 2:9

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Judahites, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. Revelations 3:9

Signs to Identify Israel:

David had the promise of a future appointed place for Israel. (2 Samuel 7: 10)

This appointed place was to be in the Isles afar off from Palestine. (Isaiah 41: 1 Jeremiah 31: 10)

Israel’s name was to be “Great”. (Genesis 12: 2)

Israel was to be exceedingly fruitful. (Genesis 28: 14, Genesis 49: 22-26, Numbers 23: 10, Isaiah 27: 6, Hosea 1: 10, Zechariah 10: 8)

Israel was to spread abroad to the west, east, north and south. (Genesis 28: 14, Isaiah 43: 5-6)

Israel was to have a new home. (2 Samuel 7: 10, 1 Chronicles 17: 9)

Israel’s home north west of Palestine. (Isaiah 49: 12, Jeremiah 3: 18)

Israel to be undefeatable, defended by God. (Numbers 24: 8, 9, Isaiah 54: 15-17, Micah 5: 8)

Israel to have control of the seas and be the Great Naval Power of the World. (Numbers 24: 7, Deuteronomy 33: 19, Psalm 89: 25, Isaiah 60: 5)

Israel to be envied and feared by all nations. (Deuteronomy 2: 25 & 4: 8 28:10 Isaiah 43: 4 & 60: 10, 12, Micah 7: 16-17, Jeremiah 33: 9)

Israel to lose a colony, and then increase demanding more room. (Isaiah 49: 20)

Israel to lend to other nations, borrowing from none. (Deuteronomy 15: 6 & 28: 12)

Israel to reign over many nations, be reigned over by none. (Deuteronomy 15: 6)

Israel was to have a new name. 9Isaiah 62: 2 & 65: 1-15, Hosea 2: 17)

Israel was to have a new religion. (Jeremiah 31: 34-34, Hebrew 8: 13 & 9: 17 show the New Covenant brought in, Luke 1: 77, Galatians 3: 13, John 11; 49-52)

Israel was to lose all trace of her linage. (Hosea 2: 6, Hosea 1: 9-10, Hosea 2: 17, Isaiah 42: 16)

Israel was to be a people glorying in Christ. (Isaiah 41: 16, Acts 5: 31, Romans 11: 26, Luke 2: 32

Israel was to carry the Gospel to the entire world. (Genesis 28: 14, Isaiah 43: 21, Micah 5: 7, Witnesses: Isaiah 43: 10-12, not church, see verse 14)

Israel is to punish Edom in the last days. (Ezekiel 25: 14, Obadiah 18, Isaiah 11: 14, Amos 9: 12)

Israel must be as sand for multitudes. (Hosea 1: 10)

Israel was to retain the Israel system of weights and measures. (Leviticus 19: 36, 37)

Israel to have immense Colonies. (Isaiah 54: 3)

Israel the wealthiest nation. (Deuteronomy 8: 18, Isaiah 60: 11)

The national heraldry must be the Lion and the Unicorn. (Numbers 24: 8, 9)

 

[Edial]

Now we can discuss again who I think the Israelites are. I know many of you won't agree with me. Notice nowhere did I ever use the term Jews. For even Revelations warns of those that claim to be Judahites and are not.

I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Judahites, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan. Revelations 2:9

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Judahites, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. Revelations 3:9

Signs to Identify Israel:

David had the promise of a future appointed place for Israel. (2 Samuel 7: 10)

This appointed place was to be in the Isles afar off from Palestine. (Isaiah 41: 1 Jeremiah 31: 10)

Israel’s name was to be “Great”. (Genesis 12: 2)

Israel was to be exceedingly fruitful. (Genesis 28: 14, Genesis 49: 22-26, Numbers 23: 10, Isaiah 27: 6, Hosea 1: 10, Zechariah 10: 8)

Israel was to spread abroad to the west, east, north and south. (Genesis 28: 14, Isaiah 43: 5-6)

Israel was to have a new home. (2 Samuel 7: 10, 1 Chronicles 17: 9)

Israel’s home north west of Palestine. (Isaiah 49: 12, Jeremiah 3: 18)

Israel to be undefeatable, defended by God. (Numbers 24: 8, 9, Isaiah 54: 15-17, Micah 5: 8)

Israel to have control of the seas and be the Great Naval Power of the World. (Numbers 24: 7, Deuteronomy 33: 19, Psalm 89: 25, Isaiah 60: 5)

Israel to be envied and feared by all nations. (Deuteronomy 2: 25 & 4: 8 28:10 Isaiah 43: 4 & 60: 10, 12, Micah 7: 16-17, Jeremiah 33: 9)

Israel to lose a colony, and then increase demanding more room. (Isaiah 49: 20)

Israel to lend to other nations, borrowing from none. (Deuteronomy 15: 6 & 28: 12)

Israel to reign over many nations, be reigned over by none. (Deuteronomy 15: 6)

Israel was to have a new name. 9Isaiah 62: 2 & 65: 1-15, Hosea 2: 17)

Israel was to have a new religion. (Jeremiah 31: 34-34, Hebrew 8: 13 & 9: 17 show the New Covenant brought in, Luke 1: 77, Galatians 3: 13, John 11; 49-52)

Israel was to lose all trace of her linage. (Hosea 2: 6, Hosea 1: 9-10, Hosea 2: 17, Isaiah 42: 16)

Israel was to be a people glorying in Christ. (Isaiah 41: 16, Acts 5: 31, Romans 11: 26, Luke 2: 32

Israel was to carry the Gospel to the entire world. (Genesis 28: 14, Isaiah 43: 21, Micah 5: 7, Witnesses: Isaiah 43: 10-12, not church, see verse 14)

Israel is to punish Edom in the last days. (Ezekiel 25: 14, Obadiah 18, Isaiah 11: 14, Amos 9: 12)

Israel must be as sand for multitudes. (Hosea 1: 10)

Israel was to retain the Israel system of weights and measures. (Leviticus 19: 36, 37)

Israel to have immense Colonies. (Isaiah 54: 3)

Israel the wealthiest nation. (Deuteronomy 8: 18, Isaiah 60: 11)

The national heraldry must be the Lion and the Unicorn. (Numbers 24: 8, 9)

Except for very few lines U.S. appears to fit the definition. Odd.

Thanks,
Ed

 

[OnTheWay]

I said nothing about only 144,000 in heaven. To be elect means your are special, or chosen. I already addressed the "Jews"

It rather seems all you have done is promote British Israelism, a half baked heresy from the 19th century. No one has ever taken it seriously.

 

[ethereous]

Double post.

 

[ethereous]

Found a bug reguarding post editing.