Where is it said this about Satan? I don't recall it saying that in the Bible at all.
(And if you point to Isaiah 14:12-15 (especially if that's your only evidence), be warned, you WILL get a lecture from me as to why that's wrong.)
Not so. it was based on what you had admitted.Not knowing anything about me or my life, your statement is nothing more than pure speculation. A wildly incorrect speculation.
Thankyou Solomons Porch. With this post, I seemed to be inspired by the Holy Spirit as I wrote. Not always the case, but this time, yes.I don't know how many angels there are but I do know that one-third of them were thrown out of heaven along with their master satan.
This happened because satan wanted to be the top dog and replace God himself. I don't think that for one moment satan stopped wanting to be top dog once he was thrown out so I can only assume that he is still pursuing that agenda.
That means he is not sitting around the campfire toasting marshmallows. He has an army of slaves that he is mustering at every available opportunity to destroy the work of God.
He cannot get at God because Jesus defeated him at Calvary but he can get at his creation...you and me.
The scriptures does not say that we have been set free from sin. It says we have been set free from the power of sin, the author of which is satan as in "sin shall no longer have dominion over you."
Whether it does or not depends on how much you resist satan and all his demons. We are all tempted to sin, but we don't have to. That comes from satan so yes there is a demon or demons in the realm of homosexuality or fornication or murder or stealing or........
There has to be because sin has no power over us unless we succumb to it and the only ones that would want us to succumb are demons.
Because we are all created in God's image it is natural/supernatural for us to want to be like him. That is what sanctification is all about. Being changed daily into his likeness. Along the way, satan and his minions are doing their darndest to queer God's pitch.
He goes about as an angel of light so we have to constantly watch and pray because he could be in the pulpit.
Isa_14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
And I don't listen to lectures from women because it is not scriptural.
I read somewhere there were 177ish sins discussed in the bible. Is it farfetched to assume there is a demon or a legion of demons for every sin trying to get people to commit them?
It also seems our minds are able to connect with the spiritual world and hence why we sometimes get thoughts that are against what the bible says we are to think about. What do you guys think?
A clear reference to an arrogant Babylonian king. So what is the point of your post?
So you dismiss more than half the human race as having a voice not worth listening to?
Isa_14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
And I don't listen to lectures from women because it is not scriptural.
A clear reference to an arrogant Babylonian king. So what is the point of your post?
So you dismiss more than half the human race as having a voice not worth listening to?
Go right ahead and prove it. And God made the rules so you will have to take it up with him.I could prove to you, Scripturally and in a thorough manner, why Lucifer isn't Satan, just as JackRT mentioned.
And wow, sexist much?
Go right ahead and prove it. And God made the rules so you will have to take it up with him.
A statement of the United Church of Canada.....
• Recognizes that truth is embodied in the religious life of Hindu traditions around the world
• Recognizes that God’s saving and liberating grace is at work in the religious life of Hinduism
Jesus said I AM the way the truth and the life......
Jesus said NO ONE comes to the father but by me.....
Seems that the UCC does not pay much attention to what the scripture says so your comments are not at all surprising.
Yes, I would agree with that statement.
The question here is whether those are the words of the historical person of Jesus or the words of the evangelist who never knew or met Jesus, writing decades later.
I have never pretended to be a conventional Christian thinker. So be prepared to not be surprised at what I believe in future posts.
I don't think God would say "women are inferior" if he loves everyone. But to the main point and putting your sexist remark aside...
Isaiah 14:12-15 is the selection of verses that everyone has quoted as a whisper-down-the-lane thing who claim they know what it means because someone told them what it means. It's not about Satan AT ALL. If you actually read the surrounding verses and not just verses 12-15 that are quoted so much and so misinformed that I'm getting tired of having to explain it...
1 For the Lord will have mercy on Jacob, and will yet choose Israel, and set them in their own land: and the strangers shall be joined with them, and they shall cleave to the house of Jacob.
2 And the people shall take them, and bring them to their place: and the house of Israel shall possess them in the land of the Lord for servants and handmaids: and they shall take them captives, whose captives they were; and they shall rule over their oppressors.
3 And it shall come to pass in the day that the Lord shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve,
4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
5 The Lord hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers.
6 He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth.
7 The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing.
8 Yea, the fir trees rejoice at thee, and the cedars of Lebanon, saying, Since thou art laid down, no feller is come up against us.
9 Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.
10 All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?
11 Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee.
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;
17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners?
18 All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house.
19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.
20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.
If you actually read the verses and not just regurgitate the oft-quoted ones, it's clear that it was all a proverb taken up against a Babylonian king ("Morning Star" was used by the way for anyone who had a high position, including Pharaoh and Jesus himself). The king was arrogant and saw him as being greater than everyone else, and mistreated his people, but he would soon be out of power and be seen as no more than the flawed arrogant human that he was.
"Lucifer" is just a proverb-title given to a king of Babylon. Not Satan. Not a fallen angel. Not a rebellious spirit. Nothing supernatural. Nothing more or less than an arrogant king who saw himself as greater than anyone else.
Ok, but I'll bite. So you don't believe St. John ever met Jesus?
Thank you for the reply. There is some question among some about one John especially around the book of Revelation ... but I've never met anyone who didn't believe the Gospel of John was written by St. John the Apostle.That is correct. There were a number of Johns --- John the apostle, John the evangelist and John of Patmos. I will admit that I am not at all sure whether or not John the apostle and John the epistle writer are the same person.
Isaiah 14:12-15 is the selection of verses that everyone has quoted as a whisper-down-the-lane thing who claim they know what it means because someone told them what it means. It's not about Satan AT ALL. If you actually read the surrounding verses and not just verses 12-15 that are quoted so much and so misinformed that I'm getting tired of having to explain it...
4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;
17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners?
18 All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house.
19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.
20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.
If you actually read the verses and not just regurgitate the oft-quoted ones, it's clear that it was all a proverb taken up against a Babylonian king ("Morning Star" was used by the way for anyone who had a high position, including Pharaoh and Jesus himself). The king was arrogant and saw him as being greater than everyone else, and mistreated his people, but he would soon be out of power and be seen as no more than the flawed arrogant human that he was.
"Lucifer" is just a proverb-title given to a king of Babylon. Not Satan. Not a fallen angel. Not a rebellious spirit. Nothing supernatural. Nothing more or less than an arrogant king who saw himself as greater than anyone else.
Thank you for the reply. There is some question among some about one John especially around the book of Revelation ... but I've never met anyone who didn't believe the Gospel of John was written by St. John the Apostle.
Just rather curious at your statement.
Satan – working through others
The passage in Isaiah is directed to the ‘King of Babylon’ and the Ezekiel passage is addressed to the ‘King of Tyre’. But from the descriptions given, it is obvious that no human is addressed. The “I wills” in Isaiah describe a being who was cast to the earth in punishment for wanting to place his throne above the stars of God. The passage in Ezekiel addresses one who is an ‘angelic guardian’ who once moved in Eden and the ‘mountain of God’. This tendency of Satan (or Lucifer) to position himself behind or through someone else is consistent. In the Genesis fall he speaks through the serpent. In Isaiah he rules through the King of Babylon, and in Ezekiel he possesses the King of Tyre.
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