Is the fundamental gap between creationists and non-creationists...

[AV1611VET]

When they make claim of something impossible, and there is zero evidence of their claims and where the Earth itSelf is showing a completely different story, yes, that makes them liars.

Can you show me from the dictionary a definition of "liar" that supports your conclusion?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Can you show me from the dictionary a definition of "liar" that supports your conclusion?

Some of them know better, and yet they still write false articles. That makes them liars. James Tour got caught lying in a lecture where he was calling another scientist a liar. That is not only lying, that is severe projection. He actually made a mealy mouthed apology where he did not really own up to his own lies.

 

[Bradskii]

Can you show me from the dictionary a definition of "liar" that supports your conclusion?

Didn't you see that quote from the guy at the creation lab? He said that if the evidence was shown to prove that he was wrong and he accepted the proof then he would still hold to his position. That is, he was admitting that if he knew the truth he would still lie to people.

I can't see anything more cut and dry than someone admitting that they would lie. Are these the type of people on whom you rely for your arguments?

It might be better to show you the dictionary definition of gullible.

 

[AV1611VET]

I can't see anything more cut and dry than someone admitting that they would lie. Are these the type of people on whom you rely for your arguments?

No. I'm already on record as saying DI and ICR can take a hike, since they espouse Intelligent Design, not Creationism.

But I do think there may be more to the story than meets the eye, and I certainly don't think they are liars.

 

[Bradskii]

No. I'm already on record as saying DI and ICR can take a hike, since they espouse Intelligent Design, not Creationism.

But I do think there may be more to the story than meets the eye, and I certainly don't think they are liars.

Even when they say that they will? If they admit it themselves, what on earth could possibly convince you that they aren't liars.

Do you think Wise lied about the fact that he'd lie? I'm totally bemused...

 

[AV1611VET]

Even when they say that they will? If they admit it themselves, what on earth could possibly convince you that they aren't liars.

Do you think Wise lied about the fact that he'd lie? I'm totally bemused...

I don't know.

I don't give anyone much consideration who espouses ID over Creationism.

ID puts the cart before the horse and tries to convince a person the universe is designed intelligently first, with the hope that they will then accept Who created it.

Creationism starts just the opposite, identifying Who did what, when, why, how, what order, and so on.

There's a difference between IN THE BEGINNING GOD DID THIS AND THAT ... and ... LOOK AT THIS AND THAT IN THE BEGINNING AND CONCLUDE GOD.

In any event, I don't get into what comes out of their organizations much; so I really wouldn't know if any of them lie or not.

I just can't imagine them doing so.

So if someone there did lie, I guess I'd have to research it in-depth, or take your word for it.

 

[Bradskii]

So if someone there did lie, I guess I'd have to research it in-depth, or take your word for it.

Just check the quote. Then come back and report if you like. I'd appreciate your input.

 

[SelfSim]

Just check the quote. Then come back and report if you like. I'd appreciate your input.

Can you show where he may have lied?
Or maybe something on his reasons for joining the Creation Reesearch Center?

 

[Bradskii]

Can you show where he may have lied?
Or maybe something on his reasons for joining the Creation Reesearch Center?

Let's say that I say this:

'I claim that I live in London. But even if SelfSim has undeniable proof that I live in Sydney, and I agree that the evidence he has definitely proves that I do, I will still maintain that I live in London'.

Am I man to be trusted? Am I an honest man? Am I man whose word you could take? Or am I actually admitting that I am a liar?

 

[SelfSim]

Let's say that I say this:

'I claim that I live in London. But even if SelfSim has undeniable proof that I live in Sydney, and I agree that the evidence he has definitely proves that I do, I will still maintain that I live in London'.

Am I man to be trusted? Am I an honest man? Am I man whose word you could take? Or am I actually admitting that I am a liar?

I would be very cautious in dealing with you .. and if I spent my waking day querying most things I hear (and testing them out .. rather than just accepting them because I think people are 'nice') then why should I be so worried about 'trusting' someone, (ie: or whether they're a liar or not)?

 

[Astrid]

Let's say that I say this:

'I claim that I live in London. But even if SelfSim has undeniable proof that I live in Sydney, and I agree that the evidence he has definitely proves that I do, I will still maintain that I live in London'.

Am I man to be trusted? Am I an honest man? Am I man whose word you could take? Or am I actually admitting that I am a liar?

I've seen that defended, even called honest
and admirable, in the the case of Dr. K Wise.

Honest in that he says what he is up front,
admirable for sticking to his Faith in God
and the truth revealed in the bible.

 

[Astrid]

When they make claim of something impossible, and there is zero evidence of their claims and where the Earth itSelf is showing a completely different story, yes, that makes them liars.

Some years ago they wrote an article about the Columbia River Basalt floods that was totally bogus. They were trying to make the claim that the Basalt floods happened so frequently that there was not enough time for soil to develop between events. They were trying to shorten a multi-million year event into a one year or so event, and weren't truthful in the process. They evidentially didn't hear of the Ginkgo Petrified Forest. And I have personally harvested petrified wood from between layers about 20 miles from my home. I've been unable to find that article for several years now.

You've seen the cast of a rhino that was covered
in a basalt flow?

 

[Astrid]

Didn't you see that quote from the guy at the creation lab? He said that if the evidence was shown to prove that he was wrong and he accepted the proof then he would still hold to his position. That is, he was admitting that if he knew the truth he would still lie to people.

I can't see anything more cut and dry than someone admitting that they would lie. Are these the type of people on whom you rely for your arguments?

It might be better to show you the dictionary definition of gullible.

Or maybe consider if such a person is called
to testify as an expert witness against you with
your life at stake.

 

[driewerf]

An evolutionist is that subset of the human race that believes in or supports the theory of evolution.

Nope. That are just people with a basic level of science education.

 

[AV1611VET]

Nope. That are just people with a basic level of science education.

So a fifth grader isn't qualified to be called an evolutionist?

 

[driewerf]

So a fifth grader isn't qualified to be called an evolutionist?

I will clarify for you:
The subset of the human race that believes in or supports the theory of evolution, are the people with a basic level of science education.
But there are no "evolutionists".

 

[AV1611VET]

I will clarify for you:
The subset of the human race that believes in or supports the theory of evolution, are the people with a basic level of science education.
But there are no "evolutionists".

Then what do you call that subset of the human race that believes in or supports the theory of evolution?

 

[driewerf]

Then what do you call that subset of the human race that believes in or supports the theory of evolution?

People with a basic level of science education.

 

[AV1611VET]

People with a basic level of science education.

Occam's Razor can take a hike, can't it?

 

[VirOptimus]

Occam's Razor can take a hike, can't it?

No.