The Thing Most Sabbath Keepers Do not Talk About.

[BobRyan]

The Sabbath sits right there in the Ten Commandments. In fact, it has become the icon of the Law for many Sabbatarians. It is the punchline of many moralistic arguments and the centerpiece of Sabbatarian doctrine. To them, it is to be kept just as strictly as any of the other nine commandments. Yet the others carry natural, immediate consequences when violated. For example, if I kill someone, I may be killed myself or imprisoned for the rest of my life. If I covet my neighbor’s wife, I may end up in the hospital or the morgue. Sabbath breaking, however, has no such visible consequence. That creates a battleground where Christians often cross swords.

Kind of like that forbidden tree in Eden. It was just fruit. They did not drop dead the moment they ate from it.

It was all about "the Word of God".

"SIN is transgression of the LAW of God". 1 John 3:4

The Word of God matters.

What fascinates me most is how people use the broad platitude “keep the Sabbath,” even to the point of wearing the label “Sabbath Keeper.” It certainly comes with the temptation to look down on those not “discerning enough” to agree with Sabbath keeping

For some, obeying the Word of God is not a "good enough" reason. They need some sort of "other consequence" to motivate them.

Charlie Kirk's recent book "Stop in the name of God" identifies some other reasons to obey God, but in general the fact that it is part of God's Word to humanity in Gen 2:2-3 as stated in Ex 20:11 when "Sabbath was made for mankind, not mankind made for Sabbath". as Christ reminds us in Mark 2:27

But nothing is above the fact that God Himself calls mankind to observe it as we see in Isaiah 66:23

, and it can be an ego boost for those who enjoy a sense of spiritual superiority. Not all are like that, of course. There are many sincere Sabbath keepers who do so with humility and love, considering themselves no better than anyone else.

Yet for most who carry the label, the one thing they rarely address is the specifics of true Sabbath keeping. The moment one asks “How should it actually be practiced?” disagreements erupt. The Sabbath-keeping community is deeply divided over what is appropriate and what is not. It is far easier to remain in the comfort of the broad label than to open the can of worms and define the boundaries. Still, if Sabbath keeping is truly salvific, should the precise observance of it not be extremely important? One would hate to wear the label all their life only to discover they had been doing it wrong.

I could give examples, but for now, I will leave the worms in that can a little longer.

 

[BobRyan]

That certainly is not what the verses in 2Cor are telling us. They are telling us that the Ten were done away, and mankind is now under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

Antinomianism, definition and a Question "is this you"?

Definition for "Antinomianism" AI: Antinomianism is a term used in Christian theology to describe the belief that, because salvation is granted by divine grace through faith, believers are not bound by the moral law of God, including the Ten Commandments. The word itself comes from the Greek...

www.christianforums.com

Apparently you are pretty comfortable with that definition for antinomianism

 

[Mercy Shown]

Kind of like that forbidden tree in Eden. It was just fruit. They did not drop dead the moment they ate from it.

It was all about "the Word of God".

"SIN is transgression of the LAW of God". 1 John 3:4

The Word of God matters.

I agree with you that the Word of God matters deeply. Where I would gently clarify is the meaning of what happened in Eden and how Scripture applies that truth to us in Christ.

Adam and Eve were not condemned to death merely for eating a piece of fruit as an isolated act. The heart of the issue was that they severed themselves from the source of life by choosing autonomy over trust in God’s word (Gen 2:16–17; 3:6–7). Death entered not simply because a rule was broken, but because separation from God—the giver of life—had occurred (Gen 3:22–24; Rom 5:12). Even then, God did not immediately destroy them; instead, He moved toward them in mercy and promise (Gen 3:15, 21).

Importantly, God Himself acted to address their guilt. He clothed them, an early sign that God would provide what they could not (Gen 3:21). From the very beginning, salvation was not achieved by renewed obedience to law, but by God’s gracious intervention.

That is precisely what Christ fulfills on the cross. Scripture does say that “sin is lawlessness” (1 John 3:4), but it also says that the law exposes sin without curing it (Rom 3:20). The solution God provides is not stricter law-keeping, but a Substitute who fulfills the law perfectly on our behalf: “For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do… in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us” (Rom 8:3–4). Jesus did not abolish the law; He satisfied its demands (Matt 5:17; Gal 3:13).

Because of this, believers no longer owe their standing before God to the law, but to Christ alone. Paul says plainly, “You are not under law but under grace” (Rom 6:14), and again, “If righteousness were through the law, then Christ died for no purpose” (Gal 2:21). To return to the law as a basis for life or righteousness—even partially—is to step away from the sufficiency of Christ’s work (Gal 5:1–4).

This does not lead to lawlessness. Paul explains that whatever moral obligation remains is fulfilled by love: “He who loves another has fulfilled the law” (Rom 13:8–10; Gal 5:14). Obedience now flows from union with Christ, not from fear of condemnation (John 15:4–5; 1 John 4:18). Our allegiance has shifted—from the law as a covenant of life to Christ as the source of life (Col 2:6–7).

So yes—the Word of God matters. And that same Word tells us that life is found not in the forbidden tree, not in the law carved in stone, but in the tree on which Christ was crucified for us (1 Pet 2:24). Having been reconciled to God through Him, we now live in grateful obedience—not to earn life, but because we have already received it (Col 2:13–14; 2 Cor 5:21)

 

[Mercy Shown]

For some, obeying the Word of God is not a "good enough" reason. They need some sort of "other consequence" to motivate them.

Charlie Kirk's recent book "Stop in the name of God" identifies some other reasons to obey God, but in general the fact that it is part of God's Word to humanity in Gen 2:2-3 as stated in Ex 20:11 when "Sabbath was made for mankind, not mankind made for Sabbath". as Christ reminds us in Mark 2:27

But nothing is above the fact that God Himself calls mankind to observe it as we see in Isaiah 66:23

I agree that obedience to God’s Word is good and right, and that love for God should be sufficient motivation for a believer (John 14:15). Where I would gently caution is in the implication that those who do not share a particular understanding of obedience are therefore less faithful, less serious, or in need of “extra motivation.” Scripture consistently warns us against drawing that conclusion.

Jesus Himself rebuked religious people not for caring too little about obedience, but for misplacing its weight. “You tithe mint and dill and cumin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faithfulness” (Matt 23:23). Sabbath observance, like many commands, is good—but it was never meant to eclipse the heart of the law or become a measuring stick of spiritual authenticity (Mark 2:27; Matt 12:7).

It’s also important to recognize that sincere Christians differ on what obedience looks like in practice. For example, some churches prohibit women from speaking in church based on 1 Corinthians 14:34–35 and 1 Timothy 2:11–12, while others—appealing to the broader witness of Scripture—understand those passages differently (Acts 18:26; Rom 16:1, 7; Gal 3:28). Both groups are seeking to obey God, yet they reach different conclusions. The same is true for matters like dietary practices (Rom 14:2–3), holy days (Rom 14:5–6), and cultural expressions of worship (1 Cor 9:19–23).

Because of this, Scripture repeatedly tells us not to judge one another in disputable matters: “Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another?” (Rom 14:4). Paul’s concern is not that obedience is unimportant, but that it not be weaponized in a way that divides the body of Christ or shifts our focus from Christ Himself (Col 2:16–19).

Isaiah 66:23 speaks of universal worship of the Lord, but the New Testament makes clear that such worship is ultimately fulfilled in and through Christ, who gathers people from every nation into Himself (John 4:21–24; Heb 12:22–24). The question is not whether God is worthy of obedience—He absolutely is—but whether a specific expression of obedience is being elevated beyond what Scripture requires for Christian unity and fellowship.

In short, obedience matters—but so does humility. When we begin to assume that disagreement equals disobedience, we risk overlooking the very things Jesus said matter most. The call of the gospel is not merely to observe commands, but to “walk in love, as Christ loved us and gave Himself up for us” (Eph 5:2).

 

[SabbathBlessings]

The Bible does not teach obedience to God commandments does not matter.

Here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Revelation 14:12

Jesus never said:

“the Sabbath was not meant to be a measuring stick”​

Jesus said plainly:
Mark 2:27 The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath. The word He used here was universal- mankind.

And already told us why to bless man Isa56:2 and sanctify us Eze20;12 because we can’t do this ourselves Isa66:17, we need God Eze20:20

No where did Jesus say we do not need to keep the Sabbath or that the Sabbath was changed. Let’s not add words that Jesus did not say, but look at what Jesus did say- His Sabbath continues after His Cross Mat24:20 Isa56:6-7 for eternity for worship Isa66:22-23 and this verse does not say

“speaks of universal worship of the Lord, but the New Testament makes clear that such worship is ultimately fulfilled in and through Christ”

This is the Lord speaking of the New Heaven and New Earth, where He plainly says the Sabbath continues for worship. No where in Scripture did He “fufill” worship to mean we no longer need to, same with keeping His name holy, remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy and only worshipping God or not stealing from our neighbor. This is really the key issue is adding our own thoughts into Scripture when we are plainly told not to. Especially when God is speaking directly, He does not need our help in re-defining what He means. Pro3:5.6 Pro30:5-6

 

[BobRyan]

Adam and Eve were not condemned to death merely for eating a piece of fruit as an isolated act. The heart of the issue was that they severed themselves from the source of life by choosing autonomy over trust in God’s word (Gen 2:16–17; 3:6–7).

Each time we choose to oppose God's Word by our actions , we do that very thing. We choose rebellion against the Word of God.

Death entered not simply because a rule was broken, but because separation from God—the giver of life—had occurred

That is what happens when humanity chooses rebellion against God's Word. It is a choice for separation
"IF you LOVE Me, KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15
And so then in Ex 20:6 "Love Me and KEEP My Commandments"
Rev 14:12 'The saints Keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus"
where "The first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:1-2 in that unit of Ten is "Honor your father and mother"

(Gen 3:22–24; Rom 5:12). Even then, God did not immediately destroy them; instead, He moved toward them in mercy and promise (Gen 3:15, 21).

Indeed. God is merciful

Scripture does say that “sin is lawlessness” (1 John 3:4), but it also says that the law exposes sin without curing it (Rom 3:20).

True.

The Law is not the Gospel.

The Gospel, (new Covenant) writes God's Law on the heart Jer 31:31-34, Heb 8. That law where "The first commandment with a promise is -- Honor your father and mother" Eph 6:1

The solution God provides is not stricter law-keeping

Obedience to God's Word is always in His will for us. Jesus makes that clear in Matt 5.
He does not say that this is how we "earn our salvation"

Matt 7 says the born again "good true" produces good fruit.

The person that "hears My Word and DOES it" as Christ said in Matt 7.

The same thing is seen in Rom 2:4-16

, but a Substitute who fulfills the law perfectly on our behalf: “For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do… in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us” (Rom 8:3–4). Jesus did not abolish the law; He satisfied its demands (Matt 5:17; Gal 3:13).

Indeed, Christ obeyed perfectly.

By contrast "all have sinned" Rom 3.

This is not God's way of getting Christians to engage sin. Rather He is showing us the problem and showing us that it is fixed not only forgiving us from sin, but also cleansing us from unrighteousness, Heb 9 and 10 also speak to that truth.

Because of this, believers no longer owe their standing before God to the law, but to Christ alone.

The question of obedience is not "on what do you owe your standing" rather it is the question raised by Christ in Matt 7 "By their fruits you shall know them".

If we continue in rebellion against God's Word we show the lack of New Covenant, New Birth where the "Law of God is written on the heart":

Paul says plainly, “You are not under law but under grace” (Rom 6:14)

And in the same chapter tells us not to sin.

, and again, “If righteousness were through the law, then Christ died for no purpose” (Gal 2:21). To return to the law as a basis for life

Adam and Eve had to obey perfectly to live. That same rule applies after the fall which is why all mankind is doomed without the gospel.

This does not lead to lawlessness. Paul explains that whatever moral obligation remains is fulfilled by love: “He who loves another has fulfilled the law” (Rom 13:8–10; Gal 5:14).

Matt 22 Jesus said that "all the Law AND the prophets" (so then all of scripture) is based squarely on two commandments in the Law of Moses.
"Love God with all your heart" Deut 6:5
"Love your neighbor as yourself" Lev 19:18

Nothing has changed. The gospel begins in Eden outside the gates and continues to this very day "The Gospel was preached to Abraham" Gal 3:8

Obedience now flows from union with Christ,

Just as it ALWAYS did.

"WE have had the Gospel preached to US just as they also" Heb 4:1-2

not from fear of condemnation (John 15:4–5; 1 John 4:18). Our allegiance has shifted—from the law as a covenant of life to Christ

Gal 1:6-9 tells us that what you are describing above is "two gospels" .

The law was never a covenant of life for all lmankind. Only the one and only gospel does that from Adam to this very day.

So yes—the Word of God matters. And that same Word tells us that life is found not in the forbidden tree, not in the law carved in stone, but in the tree on which Christ was crucified for us (1 Pet 2:24).

which enables the New Covenant that then writes that very law on the heart Jer 31:31-34

Having been reconciled to God through Him, we now live in grateful obedience

True. But this discussion has not been a disagreement about being grateful

The good tree (born again believer) produces good fruit Matt 7, Rom 3:31

 

[BobRyan]

Jesus Himself rebuked religious people not for caring too little about obedience, but for misplacing its weight. “You tithe mint and dill and cumin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faithfulness” (Matt 23:23).

Mark 7:7-13 Jesus claims the Jews were in rebellion against the Law.
Matt 5 Jesus does the same thing when He says the Jews would need to surpass the scribes, pharisees etc to enter heaven

Rom 2 Paul says the Jews were condemned for living in rebellion against God's Law.

Sabbath observance, like many commands, is good—but it was never meant to eclipse the heart of the law

True. We don't say "do not take God's name in vain , because that way you will earn salvation by works" nor do we say "do not take God's name in vain because then you can ignore Deut 6:5 telling us to Love God with all our heart"