Is the Democratic Party starting to lean more towards socialism than ever before?

[redleghunter]

First fact
Bernie Sanders came close to being elected president.

Second fact
Ocasio-Cortez is in the news a lot lately sharing her socialist views.

Care to add?

M-Bob

She is too young to be President.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

She is too young to be President.

Well it looks like we lucked out on that one.
M-Bob

 

[Mountainmanbob]

The work environment is much different now than it was back then. More and more jobs are temporary contract jobs with little to no benefits and wages have been stagnated for decades, and the problem continues to get worse for the upcoming generations.

Not sure about that my son with no College a few months back landed a job paying $61 an hour with benefits. He is very likeable and a very hard worker. He has been pulling down a lot of overtime and some double shifts. Course Uncle Sam likes that.

They are out there go get them.

M-Bob

 

[bekkilyn]

Not sure about that my son with no College a few months back landed a job paying $61 an hour with benefits. He is very likeable and a very hard worker. He has been pulling down a lot of overtime and some double shifts. Course Uncle Sam likes that.

They are out there go get them.

M-Bob

I am sure you are (rightfully) proud of your son, but that's not the experience of a large number of people in this country, even if they are also likable and hard-working. Many will never come close to seeing $61 per hour, even with multiple advanced degrees.

I live part of the week in an area where the median income is about 21K per year. You aren't going to find anywhere offering anything close to $61 per hour out there for the vast majority of people. They would have to move somewhere else, and many have, which has caused even more economic decline there and in many of our other rural areas experiencing the same issues. However, I will vouch that most of the people I have met out there have been likable and extremely hard-working.

Very different from the other place where I live the other part of the week where the median income is around 75K.

 

[Hank77]

Not sure about that my son with no College a few months back landed a job paying $61 an hour with benefits. He is very likeable and a very hard worker. He has been pulling down a lot of overtime and some double shifts. Course Uncle Sam likes that.

They are out there go get them.

M-Bob

Here I thought that illegals were taking all the good jobs in CA, guess not.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Here I thought that illegals were taking all the good jobs in CA, guess not.

ALL is a big word.
Let's just say PLENTY.
(Illegals) would be a KEY word.
Think that means that they are NOT suppose to be here?
Just think how many more GOOD jobs there would be for Americans?
Millions!

 

[Sparagmos]

First fact
Bernie Sanders came close to being elected president.

Second fact
Ocasio-Cortez is in the news a lot lately sharing her socialist views.

Care to add?

M-Bob

I think people are rejecting the pretty extreme capitalism we’ve found ourselves living under. Just as we did in the 30’s.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

I think people are rejecting the pretty extreme capitalism we’ve found ourselves living under. Just as we did in the 30’s.

The goats have taken a good look around the property here and do not see what they call Extreme Capitalism whatever that is?

Excessive money and jobs possibly?
New businesses starting up everywhere you look?
People with 401k's so large that they will never be able to spend the money when they retire?
Freedom from government control like unseen in most parts of the world?
Leaders in the space race?
Leaders in just about everything..

M-Bob

 

[Yarddog]

First fact
Bernie Sanders came close to being elected president.

Second fact
Ocasio-Cortez is in the news a lot lately sharing her socialist views.

Care to add?

M-Bob

Politics and attitudes are like a pendulum. It swings one way to far and then swings back too far, and on and on. More Democrats are looking at some socialist programs and Republicans fed up with Trump and far right wingers are moving to a more moderate position tipping the scale leftward. If the left gets control, after a few years those moderate Republicans will begin to become more conservative and others will move to the far right.,

 

[Jamsie]

First fact
Bernie Sanders came close to being elected president.
Second fact
Ocasio-Cortez is in the news a lot lately sharing her socialist views.
Care to add? M-Bob

I would only add that you have a myopic view and seemingly a total misunderstanding of Bernie Sanders. He is a Social Democrat not a Socialist... It might also behoove those who unwittingly throw around the mantle of "socialism" to actually understand how the term should appropriately be used. Further, we happen to live in a social democracy within a capitalistic framework...

It seems nobody is that concerned with the fact that we are much more of an oligarchy/plutocracy than a socialist nation.

 

[Albion]

It seems nobody is that concerned with the fact that we are much more of an oligarchy/plutocracy than a socialist nation.

Two answers:

1. In every Socialist society and also in mixed-economy societies, the so-called plutocrats do not disappear; most merely buy their Socialist Party membership cards and go on as before.The governments can hardly do without them.

2. It is true that we are not now a Socialist nation, but that is the nature of "Democratic Socialism"--to gradually convert free societies into Socialist ones. To ignore the danger because the trend has not reached its conclusion yet is illogical. By comparison, the Global Warming nuts are constantly saying that we must substantially reduce our standard of living right now since there is a 1 in 20 chance that some coastal areas will be flooded..by the time the next century gets here!

 

[Albion]

I would only add that you have a myopic view and seemingly a total misunderstanding of Bernie Sanders. He is a Social Democrat not a Socialist.

What evidence can you present to us that would support your contention here?

He has a record of looking like a Socialist, you know, even including running as a candidate of a small Socialist Party.

 

[Jamsie]

2. It is true that we are not now a Socialist nation, but that is the nature of "Democratic Socialism"--to gradually convert free societies into Socialist ones. To ignore the danger because the trend has not reached its conclusion yet is illogical. By comparison, the Global Warming nuts are constantly saying that we must substantially reduce our standard of living right now since there is a 1 in 20 chance that some coastal areas will be flooded..by the time the next century gets here!

You are conflating Democratic Socialism with Social Democrat...there is a distinction. As for Sanders one need only look at his time as Mayor, and also show where he in any way has talked about reconfiguring the means of production. The terms are too loosely used even by Sanders...maybe this will help:
Bernie Sanders Is a Social Democrat, Not a Democratic Socialist - The Atlantic

Further, one only needs to look at the past 40 to 50 years to comprehend how this country has moved considerably to a plutocracy.
Study: US is an oligarchy, not a democracy

 

[Albion]

You are conflating

Ooh, I love that word. A few years ago nobody ever used it and yet today it seems to be everywhere when there is any discussion with opposing sides.

Further, one only needs to look at the past 40 to 50 years to comprehend how this country has moved considerably to a plutocracy.

It's more likely to be the other way around.

 

[Jamsie]

Ooh, I love that word. A few years ago nobody ever used it and yet today it seems to be everywhere when there is any discussion with opposing sides.

OK, you confuse the two terms...is that more to your liking? Essentially,
Democratic socialism has much more of a connection to the socialism so readily thrown about. However, contained within the belief is that change towards socialism would involve movement within a democratic structure...voting. Social democracy may share aspects of the ideology but in fact does not embrace the more "Marxist" aspects...and as noted America is a social democracy within the structure/framework of capitalism. While the former seeks to radically change from a capitalistic to socialistic system, again by democratic means, the latter seeks to maintain the capitalistic structure but work through political means to address the working class.

It's more likely to be the other way around.

How so? What about the link provided do you disagree with or have other research refuting the study?

 

[Mountainmanbob]

I would only add that you have a myopic view and seemingly a total misunderstanding of Bernie Sanders. He is a Social Democrat not a Socialist... It might also behoove those who unwittingly throw around the mantle of "socialism" to actually understand how the term should appropriately be used. Further, we happen to live in a social democracy within a capitalistic framework...

It seems nobody is that concerned with the fact that we are much more of an oligarchy/plutocracy than a socialist nation.

On this one I will take Bernie at his word.
M-Bob

 

[Sparagmos]

On this one I will take Bernie at his word.
M-Bob

Wow, 30 years ago, huh? LOL. Not that I have a problem with Democratic Socialists.

I was inspired by that video to post an excerpt from Wikipedia. My favorite part is where he says the economy does better under Democrats:



Trump speaking at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) in 2015
Trump registered as a Republican in Manhattan in 1987 and since that time has changed his party affiliation five times. In 1999, Trump changed his party affiliation to the Independence Party of New York. In August 2001, Trump changed his party affiliation to Democratic. In September 2009, Trump changed his party affiliation back to the Republican Party. In December 2011, Trump changed to "no party affiliation" (independent). In April 2012, Trump again returned to the Republican Party.[23]

In a 2004 interview, Trump told CNN's Wolf Blitzer: "In many cases, I probably identify more as Democrat," explaining: "It just seems that the economy does better under the Democrats than the Republicans. Now, it shouldn't be that way. But if you go back, I mean it just seems that the economy does better under the Democrats [...] But certainly we had some very good economies under Democrats, as well as Republicans. But we've had some pretty bad disaster under the Republicans."[24] In a July 2015 interview, Trump said that he has a broad range of political positions and that "I identify with some things as a Democrat."[23]

 

[AFC]

I think people are rejecting the pretty extreme capitalism we’ve found ourselves living under. Just as we did in the 30’s.

The nation did well under what was close to pure capitalism during the 20's under Coolidge. Hoover moved to the left, and that had a negative impact on our economy, and led us into the great depression.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Wow, 30 years ago, huh? LOL. Not that I have a problem with Democratic Socialists.

I was inspired by that video to post an excerpt from Wikipedia. My favorite part is where he says the economy does better under Democrats:



Trump speaking at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) in 2015
Trump registered as a Republican in Manhattan in 1987 and since that time has changed his party affiliation five times. In 1999, Trump changed his party affiliation to the Independence Party of New York. In August 2001, Trump changed his party affiliation to Democratic. In September 2009, Trump changed his party affiliation back to the Republican Party. In December 2011, Trump changed to "no party affiliation" (independent). In April 2012, Trump again returned to the Republican Party.[23]

In a 2004 interview, Trump told CNN's Wolf Blitzer: "In many cases, I probably identify more as Democrat," explaining: "It just seems that the economy does better under the Democrats than the Republicans. Now, it shouldn't be that way. But if you go back, I mean it just seems that the economy does better under the Democrats [...] But certainly we had some very good economies under Democrats, as well as Republicans. But we've had some pretty bad disaster under the Republicans."[24] In a July 2015 interview, Trump said that he has a broad range of political positions and that "I identify with some things as a Democrat."[23]

True old Bernie was looking pretty good back then but, it seems his political views have not changed much?

On the other hand Trump has made some changes for the better, always nice to see that.

M-Bob

 

[Gigimo]

First fact
Bernie Sanders came close to being elected president.

Second fact
Ocasio-Cortez is in the news a lot lately sharing her socialist views.

Care to add?

M-Bob

More like a plutocracy.