IS IT SIN TO BREAK THE 10 COMMANDMENTS? (Yep!)

Saint Steven said:

Too bad we can't say that about the posts they reside in.

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Why not if it is God's WORD rightly divided then we should BELIEVE and FOLLOW it over the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God. Sin (breaking God's commandments) will keep all those who knowingly practice it out of God's Kingdom.

Saint Steven said:

Once again, you seem to be claiming that your posts (not just the scriptures in them) are somehow inspired.

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Hmm are you making things up because you have run out of scripture to share in relation to the OP? Now seriously Steve is it sin to break God's Commadments in your view?

DamianWarS said:

Over the course of the bible there are various covenant relationships that have their own make up of laws. Edenic covenant, Adamic covenant, Noahic covenant, Abrahamic covenant etc... all are "God's law" but although there may be overlap or similarities they are specific to a context. Just because Noah was told that "Everything that lives and moves about will be food for you." doesn't mean this is the same for the Mosaic covenant which had very different dietary laws. Both are God's law and both are foreshadows to something greater and to the same end but they are different and are not transferable. Or are you saying that which Adam and Noah were told are not God's law?

We are not under the Mosaic covenant nor are we judged by the Mosaic law, just like we are not judged by the Edenic law to not eat of the tree in the middle of the garden, not because this law is misguided but because it doesn't apply to us. Christ's law is not the Mosaic law and is not the 10 commandments but it's still God's law, it's just happens to be God's law for us now. There's going to be similarities of course because they all point to the same things but God is the giver of the law and he determines what is revealed to us and what is not. Today we follow that which has been revealed to us not that which was revealed long ago to a different context.

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What is the MOSAIC COVENANT in your view that we are not under and what are the SHADOW laws in the OLD COVENANT that point to the new? If we do not know what the OLD COVENANT is how can we understand what the NEW is?

DamianWarS said:

the entire law points to something greater and by definition this makes them all shadows. the 4th commandment is a prime example. the commandment itself was foreshadowed at creation and Christ shows us it's deeper meaning, which one is God's proper law? Of course they all are God's law but they are revealed different ways for different times yet they all point to the same rest of God. Scripture does not show Noah or Abraham observing the Sabbath yet it is clear God's Sabbath predated them so was it less important then?

The Mosaic law was given in darkness without people knowing what they pointed to, today they are revealed and we cannot look back at them as if blind when they are in full light. God's rest has not changed and it was the same for Adam and Moses as it is for us yet God's has contextualised his law so that we may obtain his rest.

The rest of God is central to everything, it is at the core of it all and even is within the big 10. It helps to reveal it all as well as it is undeniably since the beginning right until the end and through it all, revealed differently yet always the same rest. How does this not show us that if it's for the 4th then it must be for all of them?

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Hello Damian, thanks for your post and appreciated your time in putting it together but none of it answered the question that was asked of you.

What is the MOSAIC COVENANT in your view that we are not under and what are the SHADOW laws in the OLD COVENANT that point to the new? If we do not know what the OLD COVENANT is how can we understand what the NEW is?

DamianWarS said:

Let me rephrase to answer your questions directly. The mosaic covenant is the covenant given to Moses for Israel, we are not under any of its laws because we are not Israel 3000 years ago. They are all shadow laws and they all point to something greater. The bible shows us the complete covenants through out the ages but if all we had was the NT it would be enough to know and understand the new covenant. The early gentile Church operated with a lot less with poor knowledge of the OT simply because it was not available and they did not have cradle knowledge of the OT as Jewish believers would have. The OC points to the NC but the NC is complete so although helpful you don't have to know the OC to know the NC.

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Hi again Damian, thanks for the time for your post.

I understand what you are trying to say here but you still have not answered the questions asked of you. Maybe I need to rephrase the question because maybe it is not clear to you the way I have written it.

1. What makes up the MOSAIC COVENANT in your view?
2.What are the shadow laws in the MOSAIC Covenant in your view?

I hope the questions are rephrased and clearer to understand.

May God help you as you seek him through his Word.

DamianWarS said:

That which was ushered through Moses by God to Israel.



All of them


It feels like you're trying to trap me in some semantics. If you understand what I'm saying then what more do you want?

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Hi Damian, There is no trick questions I do not know why you would think there is. If you did not wish to answer the questions just say so. I am happy to answer them for you if you cannot.

DamianWarS said:

It feels like a trap because I have answered the questions yet you refuse to acknowledge that I have. It feels like you're agenda driven here and will continue to refuse any answer until you can agree with it or someone asks you to tell them the answer. If you disagree then fine but don't pretend I didn't even answer them.

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Hi Damian, thanks for your post.

I apologise in advance if you felt the questions I asked, were as you say trap questions. This was never my intention for asking them. The questions were only asked as an introduction to sharing more of God's WORD and to see what the OLD COVENANT was made up of in your view of the scriptures.

I have nothing to hide here and happy to share the scriptures as I see them. I just wanted to know how you saw them before proceeding. You have not answered the questions I asked that is why I thought maybe I did not ask the questions correctly and rephrased them. Hope there is no misunderstanding. We are all brothers in Christ here to share God's WORD or not. No judgment either way. You also do not have to answer the questions if you do not wish to.

May God bless you as you seek him through his Word.

DamianWarS said:

I did answer the questions, as I have already repeated. Is there something you don't recognize as an answer or are you confused with? I invite you to read them over again at post #1171 however I can't help it if you don't like my answers. What is this like the 4th or 5th post where you keep saying I haven't answer the questions? You would do better to engage my response rather than keep on repeating that I didn't answer them. I'm afraid I can no longer tell you that I have answered the question so either choose to engage with me or this will be the last time I repeat myself. Please do not misunderstand my tone, but there comes a point where this type of stagnant back and forth is fruitless and either needs to progress or end.

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Hi Damian, it is ok. I understand what you are trying to say in your posts but no you did not answer the questions I was asking.

Perhaps it may be best if I start off sharing how I see the scriptures then you can see where I am coming from with how the questions are answered.

1. What makes up the MOSAIC COVENANT in your view?
2.What are the shadow laws in the MOSAIC Covenant in your view?

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To answer these questions you first need to define what the OLD COVENANT is. Let’s see what God’s WORD says.

The OLD COVENANT included both God's LAW (10 Commandments [words] * Exodus 34:28), and the Mosaic BOOK of the covenant (Exodus 24:7). Both God's 10 Commandments and the Mosaic book of the covenant held a different purpose in the OLD COVENANT.

1. God's 10 Commandments were to give us a KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN AND RIGHTOUESNESS (Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; James 2:9-11; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172) while the
2. MOSAIC BOOK of the COVENANT held the laws for remission [FORGIVENESS] of sin if God's 10 commandments were broken [Leviticus 1-16]. Both were housed with the ARK of the COVENANT [HOUSE OF THE COVENANT] that collectively made up the OLD COVENANT (Deuteronomy 10:5; Deuteronomy 31:26).

Some try to make up the story that God's 10 Commandments alone are the OLD COVENANT. This is only telling half the story and causes confusion as to what laws are being referred to in the NEW TESTAMENT and why many do not understand what the NEW COVENANT is.

It is the SHADOW laws from the MOSIAC BOOK OF THE COVENANT that are fulfilled in Christ and under the NEW COVENANT there is no more sacrifices for sins required from the MOSAIC BOOK OF THE law/COVENANT for FORGIVENESS. God's LAW (10 Commandments) are now applied in the SPIRIT and unless our righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the Scribes and the Pharisees we will in no wise enter into the KINGDOM of Heaven.

Yep we need a new HEART by being BORN AGAIN to LOVE *HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 13:8-10; 1 JOHN 3:3-10. This is the NEW COVENANT. God's 10 Commandment have the same role they always had and that is the knowledge of SIN if broken and the standard of RIGHTOUESNESS if obeyed *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSLAMS 119:172.

HEBREWS 10:1-19
[1], For the law having a SHADOW of good things to come, and not the very image of the things [WHAT LAW WAS A SHADOW?], can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the ones approaching perfect.
[2], For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because the worshipers once purged should have had no more consciousness of sins.
[3], But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year [Day of Atonement] *Leviticus 23:27-32.
[4], For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
[5], Therefore when he comes into the world, he says, Sacrifice and offering you desired not, but a body have you prepared me:
[6], In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin you have had no pleasure.
[7], Then said I, Lo, I COME IN THE VOLUME OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME, to do your will, O God.

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NOTE: What are the Shadow laws of the OLD COVENANT? IT is those from the MOSAIC BOOK OF THE COVENANT v7 is a reference to...

EXODUS 24:7 [7], And he took the BOOK OF THE COVENANT, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the LORD has said will we do, and be obedient.

DEUTERONOMY 29:21 [21], And the LORD shall separate him to evil out of all the tribes of Israel, according to all the curses of the COVENANT THAT ARE WRITTEN IN THIS BOOK OF THE LAW.

DEUTERONOMY 31:26 [26], Take this BOOK OF THE LAW, and put it in the SIDE OF THE ARK OF THE COVENANT of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against you.

2 KINGS 23:2 [2], And the king went up into the house of the LORD, and all the men of Judah and all the inhabitants of Jerusalem with him, and the priests, and the prophets, and all the people, both small and great: and HE READ IN THEIR EARS ALL THE WORDS OF THE BOOK OF THE COVENANT which was found in the house of the LORD.

2 KINGS 23:3 [3], And the king stood by a pillar, and made a covenant before the LORD, to walk after the LORD, and to keep his commandments and his testimonies and his statutes with all their heart and all their soul, TO PERFORM THE WORDS OF THIS COVENANT THAT WERE WRITTEN IN THIS BOOK. And all the people stood to the covenant.

2 KINGS 23:21 [21], And the king commanded all the people, saying, KEEP THE PASSOVER OF THE LORD your God, AS IT IS WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF THIS COVENANT.

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Continuing..

[8], Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin you desired not, neither had pleasure in them; WHICH ARE OFFERED BY THE LAW; [MOSIAC BOOK OF THE COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7]
[9], Then said he, Lo, I come to do your will, O God. He takes away the first, that he may establish the second.

NOTE: NEW COVENANT NO MORE ANIMAL SACRIFICES from the MOSAIC BOOK OF THE LAW

[10], By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
[11], And every priest stands daily ministering and offering frequently the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins:
[12], But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down on the right hand of God;
[13], From then on waiting till his enemies be made his footstool.
[14], For by one offering he has perfected forever them that are sanctified.
[15], The Holy Spirit also is a witness to us: for after this he had said before,
[16], This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
[17], And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
[18], Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
[19], Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,

NOTE: The NEW COVENANT is NO MORE SHADOW LAWS from the MOSAIC BOOK OF THE COVENANT (Exodus 24:7) God's LAW is to be written in a NEW HEART TO LOVE * ROMANS 13:8-10.

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CONCLUSION: The OLD COVENANT is made up of 1. God’s LAW (10 Commandments) and the Shadow laws from the MOSAIC BOOK OF THE COVENANT. Both laws had a difference purpose under the OLD COVENANT. God’s 10 Commandments have the same role they always had and that is to point out what sin is and the standard of righteousness, while the SHADOW laws from the MOSAIC BOOK OF THE COVENANT pointed to Christ as our true sacrifice for sin and God’s plan of salvation from sin under the NEW COVENANT.

THE OLD COVENANT POINTING TO THE NEW COVENANT

The OLD COVENANT was written on two tables of stone *EXODUS 34:28 and included the MOSAIC BOOK OF THE COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7. The NEW COVENANT is written in the heart to LOVE (Hebrews 8:10-12; Romans 13:8-10; Matthew 22:36-40) God's LAW on stone gives us a knowledge of what sin is and brings us to Chrsit in the NEW COVENANT to LOVE by faith as we walk in the SPIRIT (Galatians 3:22-25; 2 Corinthians 3:3-11; Hebrews 8:10-12; Matthew 22:36-40; Romans 13:8-10; James 2:8-11). No more shadow laws of sin offerings that pointed to Christ and God's plan of salvation under the NEW COVENANT. God's eternal LAW (10 Commandments) however are still the KNOWLEDGE and standard of GOOD AND EVIL and those who CONTINUE to KNOWINGLY BREAK it will not enter God's KINGDOM because they have rejected the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23; HEBREWS 10:26-27; HEBREWS 6:4-8; 1 JOHN 2:1-4