IS IT SIN TO BREAK THE 10 COMMANDMENTS? (Yep!)

[Archippus]

No. I don't know that. I don't attend regular churches much. My study of God's Word is my own daily thing over the passed few years. I believe I have been taught by the Spirit many times and not in the wisdom of men and or in the cleverness of their speeches.



You are not answering my questions and you are deflecting. So that is like the kettle calling the pot as being... black.



Jesus says the children are of the Kingdom of God.
Like I said, I do not know what age God considers a person an adult or a child. It could be different based on their age and or experience. I don't know. God's Word does not specifically talk about that. I would tell them the words of Jesus and say they are true. But you are not doing that. You are openly denying what Jesus says in Matthew 5:28-30. Do you even care to explain how Matthew 5:28-30 is true according to your belief? I have heard some in your camp say that it only applied before the cross. But that does not work because we have other sins listed that say that can condemn us after the cross (that are similar); And Paul says if any man speaks contrary to the words of Jesus and the doctrine according to godliness, they are proud and they know nothing (See 1 Timothy 6:3-4).



That is like so not true.
Most churches here in America believe in OSAS and they do not believe in holiness as a requirement for salvation. Most churches are on the wide gate path and seek to justify a sin and still be saved type belief. Obviously the Pharisees believed in a sin and still be saved type belief, too. For Jesus said they ignored the weightier matters of the law like love, faith, justice, and mercy and yet they claimed to be fathers of Abraham. But Jesus called them hypocrites.



In regards to Romans 7:8:

Well, in Romans 7:7-13, Paul is talking as a Jew who received the Law for the first time from Moses. In Romans 7:14-24, Paul is taking from his experience in trying to obey the Law of Moses when he was a Pharisee within the Pharisee religion (that did not include Jesus Christ). For Paul says he was alive without the Law once before. How is that possible unless Paul is a time traveler. So Paul is talking about how the Hebrew was without the Law once before the Law of Moses was given unto them. The point Paul is trying to make is that Paul struggled to keep the Law Alone because he did not have Jesus Christ and a New Covenant yet. Paul needed to by faith first believe in Jesus for salvation and then submit to Jesus so that he could overcome sin. For if you were to read Romans 8 again, you would see that it gives you a solution to overcoming sin.

2 "For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."
(Romans 8:2-4).

"But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof." (Romans 13:14).

"For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live." (Romans 8:13).

You have put up scripture in an effort to deflect what you have plainly been shown. You respond to being given the correct interpretation by saying there is no difference between hating any sin you commit(for none are perfect) and choosing to live a sinfull lifestyle without conscience. This is nonsensical, and you condemn yourself with such a remark.
Paul stating :he was alive without the law once, is in relation to before he made a personal commitment to God. I am afraid your understanding is riddled with error.
Concerning Matt5:28-30, are you seriously saying your eye has never caused you to sin? Did you pluck it out when you did sin? It is easy to write long posts, but please do not expect me to go over them all correcting all your obvious errors

 

[Archippus]

So you have a video camera taping my life and you are God to know my heart and life?



I seek to attack the belief and not the person or individual. You are attacking me personally and you are trying to make it about me instead of just sticking with talking about the belief with Scripture.

I attack the message you preach that you cannot comply with ion your own life. I do this out of love for my neighbour. For any misguided people who believe you yourself practice what you demand of others will be harmed by believing you
Paul plainly stated the law engraved on stone/moral law of the Ten Commandments is the letter that kills. You can try and change that into something other than what is plainly written, but those of us who have spiritual eyes that have been opened know it is the truth

 

[Archippus]

You also said you don't want to talk with me anymore on this matter?
Why the sudden change of heart?
Can you please address the verses I have showed to you before?

I just addressed Rom7:9&Matt5:28&30. Unfortunately all you are able to do is deflect from the truth you have been shown as to which law is the letter that kills and you cannot be declared righteous by obeying.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You have put up scripture in an effort to deflect what you have plainly been shown. You respond to being given the correct interpretation by saying there is no difference between hating any sin you commit and choosing to live a sinfull lifestyle without conscience. This is nonsensical, and you condemn yourself with such a remark.

You have yet to prove you are right by explaining the verses I have put forth to you before that destroys your belief. I am still waiting.

Paul stating :he was alive without the law once, is in relation to before he made a personal commitment to God. I am afraid your understanding is riddled with error.

No. Paul could not be alive without the Law once before even as an unbeliever. Paul was a Pharisee during the time of the Old Covenant (Which was pre-cross). Paul could not technically say he was alive without the Law once before and have that be true for his own life personally. Everyone pre-cross (during the time of Jesus) would be condemned by the Law of Moses (if they disobeyed it). So Paul was not alive without the Law once before. It would be impossible for that to be true for his life. Paul was speaking as the Hebrew living through out history. He was speaking nationally of his people as a whole. He (the Hebrews) was alive once without the Law once before in the fact that they did not have the Law before the Law was given to them with the Law of Moses on Mt. Sinai.

Concerning Matt5:28-30, are you seriously saying your eye has never caused you to sin? Did you pluck it out when you did sin? It is easy to write long posts, but please do not expect me to go over them all correcting all your obvious errors

Wow. You are making the whole thing in Matthew 5:28-30 a metaphor just because there is one brief metaphorical phrase in there? Do you do that in other people's conversations if they use a word or phrase that is slang or metaphorical? For example: If a man named Shocka came to the United States and did not know about our slang and he heard Rick tell Billy Bob that Fred had bought the farm last week and so they should go to Fred's house to give his wife flowers, Shocka could be confused and think that Fred only purchased a farm instead of dying. If you were to be Shocka, and you wanted to disbelieve everything Rick was saying, I suppose you can write off his whole conversation as being slang because it does not make sense to you, right?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You have put up scripture in an effort to deflect what you have plainly been shown. You respond to being given the correct interpretation by saying there is no difference between hating any sin you commit(for none are perfect) and choosing to live a sinfull lifestyle without conscience. This is nonsensical, and you condemn yourself with such a remark.
Paul stating :he was alive without the law once, is in relation to before he made a personal commitment to God. I am afraid your understanding is riddled with error.
Concerning Matt5:28-30, are you seriously saying your eye has never caused you to sin? Did you pluck it out when you did sin? It is easy to write long posts, but please do not expect me to go over them all correcting all your obvious errors

Besides, there is Matthew 6:15, Matthew 12:37, Matthew 25:30, Matthew 25:31-46. Are all those metaphors, too?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I attack the message you preach that you cannot comply with ion your own life. I do this out of love for my neighbour. For any misguided people who believe you yourself practice what you demand of others will be harmed by believing you
Paul plainly stated the law engraved on stone/moral law of the Ten Commandments is the letter that kills. You can try and change that into something other than what is plainly written, but those of us who have spiritual eyes that have been opened know it is the truth

After we are saved by God's grace,
God’s works (done through us) are also required as a part of the Salvation Process:

(Here are a List of Verses):


“Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only." (James 2:24).

"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.” (James 2:17-18).

"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).

"If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing, "(1 Timothy 6:3-4).

"...God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble." (James 4:6).

"What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? (Romans 6:1-2).

"And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him." (Hebrews 5:9).

"Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord" (Hebrews 12:14).

“...God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth” (2 Thessalonians 2:13).

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” (Romans 8:13).

"If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha." (1 Corinthians 16:22).

"If ye love me, keep my commandments." (John 14:15).

“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.” (John 15:10).

"And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me." (Matthew 10:38).

”If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? (Matthew 16:24-26).

"...No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God." (Luke 9:62).

“Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.” (Matthew 5:8).

"Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls." (James 1:21).

"But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: For there is no respect of persons with God." (Romans 2:8-11).

”And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.” (Revelation 22:12-15).

"For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved." (John 3:20).

“For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.” (Romans 11:21-22).

"...but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments." (Matthew 19:17).

“Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12).

“...And having become servants of God, ye have your fruit unto holiness and the end, everlasting life.” (Romans 6:22).

”Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.” (Matthew 25:34-40).

“Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.” (Matthew 25:41-46).

”His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.” (Matthew 25:21).

”And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 25:30).

”Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation [i.e. as the people of Israel did when they rebelled against him in the desert.”] (Hebrews 3:12-15) (Note: The explanation on verse 15 in brackets is taken from the Living Bible Translation (TLB)).

”Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways. So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)” (Hebrews 3:10-11).

”Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief. (Hebrews 4:11).

“In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.” (1 John 3:10).

“He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God” (John 8:47).



Verses on the Error of Christians saying they cannot walk uprightly:

Jesus says,

"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven" (Matthew 5:16).

Jesus also says,

"You give glory to my Father when you produce a lot of fruit and therefore show that you are my disciples." (John 15:8 GW).

And Peter says,

"Be careful to live properly among your unbelieving neighbors. Then even if they accuse you of doing wrong, they will see your honorable behavior, and they will give honor to God when he judges the world." (1 Peter 2:12 NLT).

Paul says,

"That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;" (Philippians 2:15).

 

[Archippus]

You have yet to prove you are right by explaining the verses I have put forth to you before that destroys your belief. I am still waiting.



No. Paul could not be alive without the Law once before even as an unbeliever. Paul was a Pharisee during the time of the Old Covenant (Which was pre-cross). Paul could not technically say he was alive without the Law once before and have that be true for his own life personally. Everyone pre-cross (during the time of Jesus) would be condemned by the Law of Moses (if they disobeyed it). So Paul was not alive without the Law once before. It would be impossible for that to be true for his life. Paul was speaking as the Hebrew living through out history. He was speaking nationally of his people as a whole. He (the Hebrews) was alive once without the Law once before in the fact that they did not have the Law before the Law was given to them with the Law of Moses on Mt. Sinai.



Wow. You are making the whole thing in Matthew 5:28-30 a metaphor just because there is one brief metaphorical phrase in there? Do you do that in other people's conversations if they use a word or phrase that is slang or metaphorical? For example: If a man named Shocka came to the United States and did not know about our slang and he heard Rick tell Billy Bob that Fred had bought the farm last week and so they should go to Fred's house to give his wife flowers, Shocka could be confused and think that Fred only purchased a farm instead of dying. If you were to be Shocka, and you wanted to disbelieve everything Rick was saying, I suppose you can write off his whole conversation as being slang because it does not make sense to you, right?

As I previously told you, I am not going to go over all of your obvious errors. You are only quoting what you are in an attempt to deflect from your inability to defend your belief that the letter that kills and you cannot be declared righteous by obeying is law that could be faultlessly obeyed. I am not going to aid you doing that.
One example of your error. Of course Saul the Pharisee felt alive before he made a personal commitment to God(at the age of thirteen for a young Jewish lad) for there was no condemnation then. He wasn't striving to obey the law to enter heaven.
I myself felt alive before I made a commitment to God, for when I made that commitment I had your views and the law condemned me. I can assure you I am no time traveller

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I attack the message you preach that you cannot comply with ion your own life. I do this out of love for my neighbour. For any misguided people who believe you yourself practice what you demand of others will be harmed by believing you
Paul plainly stated the law engraved on stone/moral law of the Ten Commandments is the letter that kills. You can try and change that into something other than what is plainly written, but those of us who have spiritual eyes that have been opened know it is the truth

Alright. We should probably start another thread if you want to continue this conversation. We are getting waaay off topic here.

May God's love and peace be upon you today.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

As I previously told you, I am not going to go over all of your obvious errors. You are only quoting what you are in an attempt to deflect from your inability to defend your belief that the letter that kills and you cannot be declared righteous by obeying is law that could be faultlessly obeyed. I am not going to aid you doing that.
One example of your error. Of course Saul the Pharisee felt alive before he made a personal commitment to God(at the age of thirteen for a young Jewish lad) for there was no condemnation then. He wasn't striving to obey the law to enter heaven.
I myself felt alive before I made a commitment to God, for when I made that commitment I had your views and the law condemned me. I can assure you I am no time traveller

Okay. If you want to keep replying to me, create a new thread and give me the link. In the mean time, may God's goodness be upon you.

 

[Archippus]

After we are saved by God's grace,
God’s works (done through us) are also required as a part of the Salvation Process:

(Here are a List of Verses):


“Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only." (James 2:24).

"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.” (James 2:17-18).

"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).

"If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing, "(1 Timothy 6:3-4).

"...God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble." (James 4:6).

"What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? (Romans 6:1-2).

"And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him." (Hebrews 5:9).

"Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord" (Hebrews 12:14).

“...God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth” (2 Thessalonians 2:13).

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” (Romans 8:13).

"If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha." (1 Corinthians 16:22).

"If ye love me, keep my commandments." (John 14:15).

“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.” (John 15:10).

"And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me." (Matthew 10:38).

”If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? (Matthew 16:24-26).

"...No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God." (Luke 9:62).

“Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.” (Matthew 5:8).

"Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls." (James 1:21).

"But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: For there is no respect of persons with God." (Romans 2:8-11).

”And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.” (Revelation 22:12-15).

"For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved." (John 3:20).

“For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.” (Romans 11:21-22).

"...but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments." (Matthew 19:17).

“Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12).

“...And having become servants of God, ye have your fruit unto holiness and the end, everlasting life.” (Romans 6:22).

”Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.” (Matthew 25:34-40).

“Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.” (Matthew 25:41-46).

”His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.” (Matthew 25:21).

”And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 25:30).

”Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation [i.e. as the people of Israel did when they rebelled against him in the desert.”] (Hebrews 3:12-15) (Note: The explanation on verse 15 in brackets is taken from the Living Bible Translation (TLB)).

”Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways. So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)” (Hebrews 3:10-11).

”Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief. (Hebrews 4:11).

“In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.” (1 John 3:10).

“He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God” (John 8:47).



Verses on the Error of Christians saying they cannot walk uprightly:

Jesus says,

"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven" (Matthew 5:16).

Jesus also says,

"You give glory to my Father when you produce a lot of fruit and therefore show that you are my disciples." (John 15:8 GW).

And Peter says,

"Be careful to live properly among your unbelieving neighbors. Then even if they accuse you of doing wrong, they will see your honorable behavior, and they will give honor to God when he judges the world." (1 Peter 2:12 NLT).

Paul says,

"That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;" (Philippians 2:15).

But we maintain a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law Rom3:28

You have already been repeatedly shown your understanding of scripture is false on multiple occasions. Simply copy/pasting large chunks when you do not understand the true message proves nothing. Anyone can do that.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

But we maintain a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law Rom3:28

You have already repeatedly shown your understanding of scripture is false on multiple occasions. Simply copy/pasting large chunks when you do not understand the true message proves nothing. Anyone can do that.

Create another thread and post a link. This conversation has gone waaaay off topic from it's intended topic.

 

[Archippus]

After we are saved by God's grace,
God’s works (done through us) are also required as a part of the Salvation Process:

(Here are a List of Verses):


“Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only." (James 2:24).

"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.” (James 2:17-18).

"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).

"If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing, "(1 Timothy 6:3-4).

"...God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble." (James 4:6).

"What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? (Romans 6:1-2).

"And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him." (Hebrews 5:9).

"Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord" (Hebrews 12:14).

“...God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth” (2 Thessalonians 2:13).

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” (Romans 8:13).

"If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha." (1 Corinthians 16:22).

"If ye love me, keep my commandments." (John 14:15).

“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.” (John 15:10).

"And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me." (Matthew 10:38).

”If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? (Matthew 16:24-26).

"...No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God." (Luke 9:62).

“Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.” (Matthew 5:8).

"Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls." (James 1:21).

"But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: For there is no respect of persons with God." (Romans 2:8-11).

”And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.” (Revelation 22:12-15).

"For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved." (John 3:20).

“For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.” (Romans 11:21-22).

"...but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments." (Matthew 19:17).

“Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12).

“...And having become servants of God, ye have your fruit unto holiness and the end, everlasting life.” (Romans 6:22).

”Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.” (Matthew 25:34-40).

“Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.” (Matthew 25:41-46).

”His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.” (Matthew 25:21).

”And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 25:30).

”Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation [i.e. as the people of Israel did when they rebelled against him in the desert.”] (Hebrews 3:12-15) (Note: The explanation on verse 15 in brackets is taken from the Living Bible Translation (TLB)).

”Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways. So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)” (Hebrews 3:10-11).

”Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief. (Hebrews 4:11).

“In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.” (1 John 3:10).

“He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God” (John 8:47).



Verses on the Error of Christians saying they cannot walk uprightly:

Jesus says,

"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven" (Matthew 5:16).

Jesus also says,

"You give glory to my Father when you produce a lot of fruit and therefore show that you are my disciples." (John 15:8 GW).

And Peter says,

"Be careful to live properly among your unbelieving neighbors. Then even if they accuse you of doing wrong, they will see your honorable behavior, and they will give honor to God when he judges the world." (1 Peter 2:12 NLT).

Paul says,

"That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;" (Philippians 2:15).

BTW
If you love me keep my commandments.

Are you claiming you try and obey each and every literal command of Christ? I can post some if you wish. Only if you do not, why are you posting that verse, if you believe we show our love for Christ by obeying his literal commands? Is it not a sin to ask of others what you do not ask of yourself?

 

[Archippus]

Create another thread and post a link. This conversation has gone waaaay off topic from it's intended topic.

I won't create another thread, there would be no point in doing so. I have read the bible at least as much as you have. I once pretty much had your views. I was then preaching a message I could not live up to in my own life. However, my conscience would not let me continue doing so, for as the law was placed in my heart and mind, I could not kid myself I fully obeyed it. It is a mystery to me how anyone can.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I won't create another thread, there would be no point in doing so. I have read the bible at least as much as you have. I once pretty much had your views. I was then preaching a message I could not live up to in my own life. However, my conscience would not let me continue doing so, for as the law was placed in my heart and mind, I could not kid myself I fully obeyed it. It is a mystery to me how anyone can.

Well, I am not going to discuss this with you here because it would be derailing the thread topic. The topic of discussion is whether or not that the breaking of the Sabbath a sin within the New Testament.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Well, I am not going to discuss this with you here because it would be derailing the thread topic. The topic of discussion is whether or not that the breaking of the Sabbath a sin within the New Testament.

Jason, the topic of discussion is whether breaking any of the 10 commandments is sin. As the scriptures say there are 10 commandments in the 10 commandments not 613, 9 or one.

EXODUS 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote on the tables the words of the covenant, the TEN COMMANDMENTS

DEUTERONOMY 4:13 And he declared to you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even TEN COMMANDMENTS; and he wrote them on two tables of stone.

DEUTERONOMY 10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the TEN COMMANDMENTS, which the LORD spoke to you in the mount out of the middle of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them to me.

And if we break anyone of the ten commandments God's Word says it is sin...

ROMANS 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: FOR BY THE LAW IS THE KNOWLEDGE OF SIN.

JAMES 2:8-12 [8], If ye fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, ye do well:[9], But if ye have respect to persons, YOU COMMIT SIN, AND ARE CONVINCED OF THE LAW AS TRANSGRESSORS. [10], For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. [11] For he that said, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, said also, DO NOT KILL. Now if thou commit NO ADULTERY, yet if thou KILL, YOU ARE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF GOD'S LAW

ROMANS 7:7 [7], What shall we say then? is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I HAD NOT KNOWN SIN, BUT BY THE LAW: for I had not known lust, EXCEPT THE LAW HAD SAID YOU SHALL NOT COVET.

1 JOHN 3:4 [4] Whosoever commits SIN transgresses also the law: for SIN is the transgression of the law.

Hope this helps

 

[LoveGodsWord]

You also said you don't want to talk with me anymore on this matter?
Why the sudden change of heart?
Can you please address the verses I have showed to you before?

Jason, just wondering why you expect others to address the scriptures posted to you but you have not responded to a single scripture posted to you from the replies to your posts I have provided?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Jason, the topic of discussion is whether breaking any of the 10 commandments is sin. As the scriptures say there are 10 commandments in the 10 commandments not 613, 9 or one.

EXODUS 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote on the tables the words of the covenant, the TEN COMMANDMENTS

DEUTERONOMY 4:13 And he declared to you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even TEN COMMANDMENTS; and he wrote them on two tables of stone.

DEUTERONOMY 10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the TEN COMMANDMENTS, which the LORD spoke to you in the mount out of the middle of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them to me.

And if we break anyone of the ten commandments God's Word says it is sin...

ROMANS 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: FOR BY THE LAW IS THE KNOWLEDGE OF SIN.

JAMES 2:8-12 [8], If ye fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, ye do well:[9], But if ye have respect to persons, YOU COMMIT SIN, AND ARE CONVINCED OF THE LAW AS TRANSGRESSORS. [10], For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. [11] For he that said, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, said also, DO NOT KILL. Now if thou commit NO ADULTERY, yet if thou KILL, YOU ARE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF GOD'S LAW

ROMANS 7:7 [7], What shall we say then? is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I HAD NOT KNOWN SIN, BUT BY THE LAW: for I had not known lust, EXCEPT THE LAW HAD SAID YOU SHALL NOT COVET.

1 JOHN 3:4 [4] Whosoever commits SIN transgresses also the law: for SIN is the transgression of the law.

Hope this helps

My apologies. You are right on the point about how this discussion is about the 10 Commandments and not just the Sabbath (the 4th Command given Moses in the Old Testament). I suppose I was arguing so much against the Saturday Sabbath here with such great zeal that I lost track of the other 9 commands that I believe are still in effect under the New Testament. So again. My apologies. I will also apologize to our other new friend on the forum here.

As for Romans 3:20:

First, before I address this verse directly, Romans 3 is talking about how you initially get right with God or the baseline foundation of our salvation. Paul says in Romans 3:1,

"What profit is there of circumcision?" (Romans 3:1).

The Jews were trying to convince Christians to be circumcised to be right with God. But Paul is saying that it is not by the deeds of the Law Alone that we are justified in the sight of God but by faith in Jesus Christ. We are initially and ultimately saved by faith in Jesus and seeking His forgiveness and not by Law. Why? Because if a Christian were to sin, do they go out and do a good work to erase that sin? No. They go to Jesus and His grace. For if we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us form all unrighteousness (1 John 1:9). So if a believer stumbles, they can bring themselves back to being right with the Lord by God's grace (Jesus).

How do we know this is true?

10 "As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God."
(Romans 3:10-11).

Now, if you want me to believe that Romans 3:10 applies to the life of every single Christian and their entire walk with God in the fact that it is talking about their present life and walk with the Lord ("There is none righteous"), then you must also apply verse 11 to the Christian believer's present walk with the Lord today. Meaning, if you believe no Christian can be righteous right now in His walk with God by living holy (verse 10), then you must also believe that no Christian in their present walk with God has no understanding in their present walk with God and they also do not seek after God in their present moment with God.

So if you believe Romans 3:10 applies to you as a believer right now in your life, then you must also apply Romans 3:11 to your life in saying that you have no understanding and you do not seek after God. Is that true? I don't believe that. I believe you have some understanding in what God's Word says and I believe you do seek after God.

So this helps us understand what Paul means in Romans 3:20.

Is Paul saying that the word "law" in Romans 3:20 means....

1. The Old Covenant Law?
2. The Commands or Laws given to us by Jesus and His followers?
3. All Law in General?
4. Law Alone?
5. Old Covenant Law and Law Alone?
6. The 10 Commands?

Well, we can definitely rule out the 10 Commandments here in Romans 3:20 because circumcision (Romans 3:1) is not in view of the 10 Commandments.

We can also rule out the Commands or Laws given to us by Jesus and His followers because there are Laws or Commands in the New Testament that we are justified or saved by.

For example:

1. The Commandment to Believe on the Name of Jesus Christ,
and to Love One Another.
Source: "And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment." (1 John 3:23). You need to believe in Jesus order to not perish, and have everlasting life. (John 3:16).

2. The Commandment to Repent.
Source: "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:" (Acts of the Apostles 17:30). You need to repent (seek God's forgiveness) in order to not perish (See Luke 13:3) (Note: The word "repent" is used by Peter to tell Simon as an indicator to pray to God so as to seek forgiveness of his trying to pay for the Spirit - See Acts of the Apostles 8:22).

3. The Law of Faith:
"Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith." (Romans 3:27). We are saved by God's grace through faith. For it is written: "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9). We are saved initially and ultimately by faith in Christ (God's grace) and not by.... "Works Alone" or by "Law Alone" (in regards to leaving out God's grace and or redemption through Jesus). Law Alone in this sense can never save us. Jesus initially and ultimately saves us person.

I believe Paul is speaking of Law in General in Romans 3:20 with respect that his whole argument is about how we are not saved by Law Alone without God's grace and or without faith in Christ. Paul is saying that by the deeds of the Law (i.e. Law in general) shall no man be justified in God's sight because it is not by Law alone a man can be saved initially or ultimately. It is by God's grace. For by the Law (generally speaking) is the knowledge of sin. This applies both in the Old Covenant and the New Covenant.

But does this mean works (Sanctification, i.e. holy living) does not play a part in our salvation after we are saved by God's grace? No.

See the verses here by clicking on the following spoiler button:

Spoiler

After we are saved by God's grace,
God’s works (done through us) are also required as a part of the Salvation Process:

(Here are a List of Verses):


“Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only." (James 2:24).

"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.” (James 2:17-18).

"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).

"If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing, "(1 Timothy 6:3-4).

"...God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble." (James 4:6).

"What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? (Romans 6:1-2).

"And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him." (Hebrews 5:9).

"Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord" (Hebrews 12:14).

“...God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth” (2 Thessalonians 2:13).

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” (Romans 8:13).

"If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha." (1 Corinthians 16:22).

"If ye love me, keep my commandments." (John 14:15).

“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.” (John 15:10).

"And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me." (Matthew 10:38).

”If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? (Matthew 16:24-26).

"...No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God." (Luke 9:62).

“Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.” (Matthew 5:8).

"Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls." (James 1:21).

"But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: For there is no respect of persons with God." (Romans 2:8-11).

”And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.” (Revelation 22:12-15).

"For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved." (John 3:20).

“For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.” (Romans 11:21-22).

"...but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments." (Matthew 19:17).

“Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12).

“...And having become servants of God, ye have your fruit unto holiness and the end, everlasting life.” (Romans 6:22).

”Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.” (Matthew 25:34-40).

“Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.” (Matthew 25:41-46).

”His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.” (Matthew 25:21).

”And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 25:30).

”Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation [i.e. as the people of Israel did when they rebelled against him in the desert.”] (Hebrews 3:12-15) (Note: The explanation on verse 15 in brackets is taken from the Living Bible Translation (TLB)).

”Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways. So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)” (Hebrews 3:10-11).

”Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief. (Hebrews 4:11).

“In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.” (1 John 3:10).

“He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God” (John 8:47).


Verses on the Error of Christians saying they cannot walk uprightly:

Jesus says,

"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven" (Matthew 5:16).

Jesus also says,

"You give glory to my Father when you produce a lot of fruit and therefore show that you are my disciples." (John 15:8 GW).

And Peter says,

"Be careful to live properly among your unbelieving neighbors. Then even if they accuse you of doing wrong, they will see your honorable behavior, and they will give honor to God when he judges the world." (1 Peter 2:12 NLT).

Paul says,

"That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;" (Philippians 2:15).

As for James 2:8-12:
James is talking about the "Law of Liberty" or the "Royal Law."
These are New Covenant Laws. Nowhere is the Old Law ever said to be a law of liberty. Actually, Paul says the Old Law is bondage in Galatians 4:21-31.

Romans 7:7 is talking about the Old Law but Paul is using it as a point about how he cannot keep God's laws without faith in Jesus Christ. Before he tried to obey God as a Pharisee in Romans 7:14-24, but he failed to obey the Lord. Romans 8:2-4 gives us the solution now as to how Paul is able to walk after the Spirit and thus fulfill the "righteousness of the Law" (i.e. that righteous aspect or part of the Old Law - Which is to love your neighbor. For Paul says that loving your neighbor is the fulfilling of the Old Law - See Romans 13:10). For it is by Jesus Christ that we can crucify the affections and lusts (See Romans 13:14). God's grace is not a license for immorality (See Jude 1:4 in the NIV).

1 John 3:4 is also talking about Law in general, as well. But John's teaching here in his 1st epistle is not obedience to the 10 commandments or to the Law of Moses but to the commands given to us by Jesus Christ and His followers under the New Covenant. For love (the second commandment) is the central focus and theme of John's epistle along with seeking God's grace like 1 John 1:9 (cf. with 1 John 2:1).

The context determines the use of the word "Law." It has different meaning based on it's use. You cannot just point to the word "Law" in the Bible and say that it always refers to the 10 Commandments or even the Law of Moses. I would say many times Paul mentions the word "Law" he is referring to the Law of Moses as a whole (the 613 Commands). But I believe other times he refers to the word "Law" as speaking of it in general so as to show that we are not saved by "Law Alone" (without Gods grace through faith in Jesus).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Jason, just wondering why you expect others to address the scriptures posted to you but you have not responded to a single scripture posted to you from the replies to your posts I have provided?

I will be happy to discuss the 9 out of the 10 (Excluding the Sabbath) and I would be happy to discuss the use of the word "Law" in the New Testament.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I won't create another thread, there would be no point in doing so. I have read the bible at least as much as you have. I once pretty much had your views. I was then preaching a message I could not live up to in my own life. However, my conscience would not let me continue doing so, for as the law was placed in my heart and mind, I could not kid myself I fully obeyed it. It is a mystery to me how anyone can.

I truly wish you knew the mystery in obeying God's commands in the New Covenant. I believe if you were to pray for the answer, God would give you that answer. In any event, I do wish to apologize to you about the thread topic. It appears we can talk about the Moral Law because that is in view of 9 out of the 10 Commandments. I suppose I was caught up in my zeal of attacking the Saturday Sabbath as being binding for Christians before that I lost sight of the thread title. My apologies on that one. So if you wish to continue to discuss the Moral Law and how it is binding for the Christian today, I would be happy to do that (if you are willing). Please realize I have no ill will towards you. I just do not like the belief you hold to is all. I see it as turning God's grace into a license for immorality. So do not take it personally against who you are as a person. I am commanded by God to love you and or all individuals (No matter what you might believe).

In either case, whether you agree with me or not, ....
May God's goodness, peace, and love be upon you.

 

[Archippus]

I truly wish you knew the mystery in obeying God's commands in the New Covenant. I believe if you were to pray for the answer, God would give you that answer. In any event, I do wish to apologize to you about the thread topic. It appears we can talk about the Moral Law because that is in view of 9 out of the 10 Commandments. I suppose I was caught up in my zeal of attacking the Saturday Sabbath as being binding for Christians before that I lost sight of the thread title. My apologies on that one. So if you wish to continue to discuss the Moral Law and how it is binding for the Christian today, I would be happy to do that (if you are willing). Please realize I have no ill will towards you. I just do not like the belief you hold to is all. I see it as turning God's grace into a license for immorality. So do not take it personally against who you are as a person. I am commanded by God to love you and or all individuals (No matter what you might believe).

In either case, whether you agree with me or not, ....
May God's goodness, peace, and love be upon you.

.