Impossible to be saved like the thief on the cross!

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eldermike

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Bible,

Is is not wrong to obey God. It is a blessing and a joy to obey God.
It is wrong to believe that you are saved by obediance. Jesus said:

JN 8:33 They answered him, "We are Abraham's descendants and have never been slaves of anyone. How can you say that we shall be set free?"

JN 8:34 Jesus replied, "I tell you the truth, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. 35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. 36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.

By His death on a cross I can become a Son and by no other way can I become a Son.

To obey God to salvation is a system that no longer exists. He made that clear.

Obey God, yes, always but do it as a Son of God, saved by His grace.

Blessings
 
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Originally posted by eldermike
Bible,

Is is not wrong to obey God. It is a blessing and a joy to obey God.
[It is wrong to believe that you are saved by obediance. Jesus said:]

To obey God to salvation is a system that no longer exists. He made that clear.


Blessings

You must show Scripture for your statement: What book, chapter, verse did you find your statement?
 
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Originally posted by sola fide
TBIR, are you an advocate of baptismal regeneration? Do you believe that it is the actual act and process of baptism that saves a person? Just curious.

Hearing the word of God, believing the word of God, repenting of one sins, confessing the name of Jesus Christ and being baptized for the remission of sins is what saves a person, and you must have all of these together, and you cannot leave out any one of these elements, if you do, you are not following God's plan. 
 
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Sean R. Sherman

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Be Ye Doers Of The Word

JAMES 1

22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.
25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
26 If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.
27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Salvation is Peace in life.
Romans 5
1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Salvation comes from sacrifice.
John 3
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Isaiah 55
7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.
Mark 8
34 And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

Salvation is given to us by Jesus.
John 10
10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
Romans 4
24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;
25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.
We are at first dead.
Genesis 2
17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.
1 Corinthians 15
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

When Adam ate of the tree of knowledge a gap was created between us and God. We’re always trying to close that gap. Even people who don’t know of Jesus are trying to do something in thier life to fill an emptiness to have ultimate happiness. They notice a link is missing from them but they dont know where to find it to place it into there lives. So everyone is trying all different ways to fill that gap between us and the real answer , God. But there is only one way and so all others are false. Jesus is the only way. He is the way the truth and life. John 14:6
This one and only way is Jesus.


Proverbs 14
12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

Salvation is like a trip we take. It’s like when your on vacation. Your relaxed and comfortable but you have that small feeling of homesickness, that feeling that you don’t belong. And so Salvation is the trip back home to where you do belong. If we follow every word from Jesus (The word of God, The Bible) then we will have our instructions and we will know where to turn. But if we dont follow the word of God or if we follow only some of the word of God then we may go in a general direction but we will end up lost.

So we must follow every word of God to receive Salvation. The words in the bible hold powerfull meanings. It is clearly stated that the written words of the scriptures are pure, true, and powerfull.
Ex: Jesus got baptised. Went into wilderness for 40 days. Was tempted by Devil. Every counter phrase Jesus spoke back against the devil was of his own words but also they where already written. Jesus said in:
Matthew 3
4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.
7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.
10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.

And this gave them power and in being written they became powerfull boundries by which the devil couldn’t pass.
So lets look on the written and living word of God and see what we have to do to receive salvation from Jesus.

First of all believe...

That Jesus is God in Flesh.
1 Timothy 2
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
1 john 2:1
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
That Jesus came to save us from our prison of sins.
1 Peter 3
18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
That no matter what we did before, Jesus died to erase that.
Romans 5
7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.
8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
John 1
12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
So by just believing you receive power to become a child of God.
But now as you are a child you should come unto the lord as a child because thats what he asks. So we’ve established that the written word has power and that by just believe you become a child of God.
Ok now just because your his child doesn’t mean your saved. If your the presidents child do you not go to prison for making wrong choices. So just because your Gods child doesn’t mean that no matter what, you’ll make it into heaven. We now need to God back to the word of God.

So after the first process of just believe we find that there is more to being saved. Because the Devil also believes God exists, the Devil knows that Jesus was God, The Devil knows that Jesus died to give us life. And so now as children of God we have to have more than just belief to be saved because I dont know if you noticed but I dont think the Devil’s making it into heaven. So our next step is to listen:
To become hearers of the word and learn the word. And in turn learn of Jesus.
John 5
39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
The scriptures testify of Jesus.
The next step is repenting. Ask God for forgiveness for all that you’ve done. Turn from your ways and say “Jesus you’ve done all that for me. And look what I’ve done against you in return. Forgive me Father.” And then realize that God forgave you.
God gave peter the keys to heaven, the keys to salvation. And so peter was given the knowledge of how to get salvation and Jesus told him that whoever peter showed this to and helped save then they will be saved in heaven,
Matthew 16
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

And so what peter says to do is after repentance we need to get baptized in Jesus’ name.

Jesus says to get baptized in his name:
Matthew 28
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Peter says
Acts 2
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Jesus tells Nicodemus in John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Well whats born again?

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Born of water and spirit in what name?
Acts 4:12
Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

But first of all Repent . To repent is to feel and know you are guilty

Rom 1:20
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

We are without excuse. Just look at the sky and tell me God didn’t make that. This non-intelligent nature just didn’t create it’s self and what a copout it would be to think it was just here forever. And so the only reasonable answer To come up with is that a Divine High Power Created it. God.
This is to whom we repent.

Isaiah 55
7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

But then a man must be born of water and of spirit to enter God’s Kingdom.
Baptism of water (Submersion because that’s the actual translation of the word baptize.) and the baptism of the Holy spirit which is a promise given to all people.
 
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livingforJesus-Shaun

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Originally posted by LouisBooth
Yup, and all those things are all about sanctification. Salvation is by faith alone. Believe and you are saved.

Thats what Paul spent his entire life preaching that faith alone is enough. How easy is that to know your saved just by believing. We serve an awesome God!!! :bow: :D
 
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Originally posted by livingforJesus-Shaun
Thats what Paul spent his entire life preaching that faith alone is enough. How easy is that to know your saved just by believing. We serve an awesome God!!! :bow: :D

&nbsp;<!--StartFragment --> <B>Matthew 7</B>
<SUP>24</SUP>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
<SUP>25</SUP>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not:
for it was founded upon a rock.
<SUP>26</SUP>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
<SUP>27</SUP>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.


&nbsp;

If you stop and think, Jesus never taught that faith alone was all one needed to do to be saved.

When he gave the commission to the apostles he never said that faith alone was all that was needed.&nbsp; Look at Matt.28:18-20!

Look at Mark 16:15-16!

Look at Luke 24:47&nbsp; This is exactly what Peter preached on the day of Pentecost Acts 2:38.

This faith alone came from men teaching false doctrine, and many have believed men over what the word of God teaches.

I want you all to take a close look at 1 Samuel 15:22.
 
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eldermike

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The Bible is Right,

That is not what you really believe, at least not in total. By reading this and another thread that was closed one can gather that you believe that one also must be baptized into the Church of Christ denomination. So my question is, isn't all this other stuff just dishonost on your part? Point being; even if we agreed with you on doctrine but remained baptist or whatever else, we are still not saved until we join the Chrurch of Christ and are baptized by them, right?
 
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Originally posted by livingforJesus-Shaun
so what your saying is Paul waisted his life teaching fals things

  • Paul never taught anything that was false, people just&nbsp;misunderstood what Paul taught.

&nbsp;

  • Paul never taught that baptism in water was a work, therefore not necessary for salvation.

&nbsp;

  • Paul never taught that we are saved by "faith alone".

&nbsp;

  • Paul never taught that one church is as good as another (denominational churches) because there were no denominational churches when he was alive, nor did he ever condone them.

&nbsp;

  • Paul never taught anyone to say the sinners prayer.

&nbsp;

  • Paul never taught that men&nbsp;can use instrumental music in worship.

&nbsp;

  • Paul never taught once saved aways saved.

&nbsp;
 
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Originally posted by eldermike
The Bible is Right,

That is not what you really believe, at least not in total. By reading this and another thread that was closed one can gather that you believe that one also must be baptized into the Church of Christ denomination. So my question is, isn't all this other stuff just dishonost on your part? Point being; even if we agreed with you on doctrine but remained baptist or whatever else, we are still not saved until we join the Chrurch of Christ and are baptized by them, right?

The bible teaches that there is only one body the church. Eph. 1:22-23; 4:4-7.

The church is not a denomination.

All men must be baptized in water, and the Lord adds them to the church. Acts 2:38, 47.

You cannot join the Lord's church, the Lord adds us to his church. Acts 2:47.

&nbsp;
 
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eldermike

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I agree, there are no denominations, all saved believers are in the same Body of Christ no matter what denomination they attend, don't you agree?

But you can relax, you don't need to dunk em in water as soon as they profess Christ. The only reason they know Christ is beacuse their Father in heaven told them. And He already gave them a full baptisim. The water will feel good and we should obey our Father in Heaven, but they will be saved going in and coming out.
 
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http://www.mun.ca/rels/restmov/texts/acampbell/DOC-ERK.HTM

If anyone want to know why we believe what we believe you can go to the above site, and you would find a wealth of information.

It tells why denominationalism is not right in God's sight, and why we should seek to restore new testament christianity like the first century church, and how important it is to abide in the apostles doctrine and fellowship, and call bible things by bible names, and have no creed but the bible.
 
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