If I'm an Atheist and I am not a bad person, will I go to hell?

[nonbeliever314]

SOMEONE PLEASE RESPOND TO THIS. I'M COPY AND PASTING IT BECAUSE ITS TOO FAR BACK IN THE THREAD NOW. Here is what I wrote earlier...

First off, I have ears to hear, I heard it, and it is absolutely repulsive that if a generally "good hearted" person (not necessarily saying myself) would burn in hell just because they didn't accept Jesus as their savior. A child in a third world country at this very instant is suffering and dying, and "God forbid" they have never even heard of Jesus, because either they are too young, or it's just not a part of their culture. So their whole life is a living hell, and when that one is over, a new eternal hell begins. That sickens my stomach. AND PLEASE DON'T SAY "OH WELL, GOD WOULD TAKE THEM TO HEAVEN ANYWAY". Christianity, Judaism, and Islam to name a few, rule people by fear. You must absolutely love, and absolutely fear at the SAME TIME the God you hold up so high. You're forced to love a God and accept his son as the savior, not because you want to, but because you have no choice but to, because if you don't, you will suffer for all eternity. In the end there is no other conclusion other than that fear is what drives people to believe. Any reason you give as to why you accept Jesus will ultimately point back to the fear of damnation.

Religions in general, way before Christianity were always there to explain something that people didn't understand, and I find that totally reasonable. But when a religion comes along that attempts to induce total fear in people in the most subtle, sinister way imaginable, that's insane. Instead of a benign belief system, that just says "Hey, the bright light in the sky is [insert name here], that god creates the day", etc. You get one that utterly manipulates people into complete control, through fear, and at the same time makes them think that it's their choice, convinces them it's because some infinitely powerful deity actually "loves" a creation that is infinitely less than itself, and if this creation doesn't "love" it back it will "stick them under a magnifying glass and burn them with sunlight" forever. And lastly, it claims to have the meaning to things that don't necessarily have meaning. It tries to overcome nihilism, at the very least in the existential way.

CGL1023 you don't have to pray for me. Your gesture is appreciated, but at the same time I think (not believe) it is not general act of good will towards me, but a reaction to the deeply rooted fear that you need to be what your God expects you to be. Not praying for me to be saved when you're well aware from my previous post that I will definitely not be unless I have some type of realization would reflect poorly on you in the eyes of your God.

 

[GillDouglas]

Yes, most will get defensive when their position is mocked, if that is actually occurring.

In my observations though, some Christians seem to be proactive with the judgment of others, with no mocking necessary.

I'm thinking it's more the beliefs of the other party that appears to be judgmental or offensive.

 

[seekingsolace]

Yes, most will get defensive when their position is mocked, if that is actually occurring.

In my observations though, some Christians seem to be proactive with the judgment of others, with no mocking necessary.

The issue is, a believer and non-believer use a different set of principles. It may seem like judgment, but it's what that person believes. There is no polite way of saying, "if you don't believe, you are not saved".

 

[SillySadie]

This is MY belief: As the Bible states, the ONLY way to the Father (Heaven) is through the Son (Jesus). And, you'll find THAT directive has not changed throughout the various Biblical translations. Therefore, not accepting Christ as the Son of God does prevent you from entering Heaven no matter how "good" you were here on earth. Salvation is NOT an issue of YOUR behavior. Salvation is a gift from God, paid for by the death of Christ on the cross. There is NOTHING a human can do that is beyond the cost of Christ's sacrifice, IF you accept that sacrifice for yourself.

That said, let me explain my view of Heaven. I love Christ and God. I spend a LOT of time in prayer with them. I enjoy that time and wake up every morning wanting more. Heaven, as I see it, is spending eternity with God...worshiping him. That may seem boring to those who don't love him, but FOR ME, it is the most exciting thing I can imagine. (And, frankly, I've had a pretty exciting life here on earth being through my career at the forefront of some amazing scientific discoveries, having traveled the globe, having loved and been loved, having given birth, having taken risks and yes, having sinned.) Some may say sky diving or sex or robbing banks are MORE exciting than spending eternity with God and, without those things and others like them, Heaven would be pretty boring. I can understand that viewpoint, BUT it's not my viewpoint. Non-believer 314 asked for opinions...and this is mine.

I have trouble seeing why an atheist would want to spend eternity with a God they don't believe in. Even more ludicrous would be their wanting to spend eternity worshiping Him. It seems Hell would be more "fun" for those people. And, for the record, my view of Hell is simply the absence of God and the absence of any hope of ever finding/joining Him. Again, at least the idea of an absence of God, is pretty much status quo for an atheist, isn't it?

I know there have been many gods over the eons...and many civilizations who believed and followed them. Frankly, it's none of MY business where those people are spending eternity, nor is it my job to attempt to "turn" a non-believer into a believer. If I am asked about MY beliefs, or as a general response to a question in a forum like this, when a question is asked, I will share what "I" believe, but I have no right, desire nor intent to change YOUR beliefs. That's between you and God, not you and me. I can see the point of discussing it, but not arguing about it or trying to convince others that they should change their beliefs. If you want somebody to convince you you're wrong, talk to God directly about it!

Again, in MY belief, IF you want to enter the Heaven of "the great I am", the ONLY requirement is the acceptance of Jesus Christ as the Son of God...no matter how you "behave" on earth. You could "raise hell" while living on earth and still go to Heaven. ... IF (even with your last breath/thought) you TRULY accept Christ as your Savior. THAT's God's allowing you free will...with everything you do in life EXCEPT that one thing.

Every sin ever committed, in my belief, was piled on Christ on that cross. Therefore, I try to live a "good" life not to buy my way into Heaven, but to prevent someone I love (Jesus) from having to pay for sins I could prevent myself from committing. There are people who say they are Christians, people who make up all sorts of rules and regulations and call that Christianity, people who go to church every Sunday and act holier than thou, people who judge everybody around them. However, those people are sinning. They are NOT following the precepts of the faith any more than an atheist is. That's truly a shame in my mind and those people are NOT "doing right by God". But, just like the ONLY way to enter a Rolling Stones concert is to pay for a ticket, the ONLY way to enter Heaven is to pay (accept) for a ticket (Christ as your Savior). This is just an example...I KNOW somebody could probably sneak in through a side door at a Rolling Stones concert...but there are NO side doors into Heaven.

No, my opinion is not "deep" and I may sound like a simplistic person to some of you who enjoy the debate. It isn't about the debate for me...it's honestly sharing MY personal belief with nonbeliever 314 because he asked.

 

[bhsmte]

I'm thinking it's more the beliefs of the other party that appears to be judgmental or offensive.

When one makes judgments towards others, it is not difficult to spot. And sure, the specific beliefs of some, actually require them to be judgmental of others, and is also part of their psychological need, to judge others, so they feel better about themselves.

 

[GillDouglas]

SOMEONE PLEASE RESPOND TO THIS. I'M COPY AND PASTING IT BECAUSE ITS TOO FAR BACK IN THE THREAD NOW. Here is what I wrote earlier...

First off, I have ears to hear, I heard it, and it is absolutely repulsive that if a generally "good hearted" person (not necessarily saying myself) would burn in hell just because they didn't accept Jesus as their savior. A child in a third world country at this very instant is suffering and dying, and "God forbid" they have never even heard of Jesus, because either they are too young, or it's just not a part of their culture. So their whole life is a living hell, and when that one is over, a new eternal hell begins. That sickens my stomach. AND PLEASE DON'T SAY "OH WELL, GOD WOULD TAKE THEM TO HEAVEN ANYWAY". Christianity, Judaism, and Islam to name a few, rule people by fear. You must absolutely love, and absolutely fear at the SAME TIME the God you hold up so high. You're forced to love a God and accept his son as the savior, not because you want to, but because you have no choice but to, because if you don't, you will suffer for all eternity. In the end there is no other conclusion other than that fear is what drives people to believe. Any reason you give as to why you accept Jesus will ultimately point back to the fear of damnation.

Religions in general, way before Christianity were always there to explain something that people didn't understand, and I find that totally reasonable. But when a religion comes along that attempts to induce total fear in people in the most subtle, sinister way imaginable, that's insane. Instead of a benign belief system, that just says "Hey, the bright light in the sky is [insert name here], that god creates the day", etc. You get one that utterly manipulates people into complete control, through fear, and at the same time makes them think that it's their choice, convinces them it's because some infinitely powerful deity actually "loves" a creation that is infinitely less than itself, and if this creation doesn't "love" it back it will "stick them under a magnifying glass and burn them with sunlight" forever. And lastly, it claims to have the meaning to things that don't necessarily have meaning. It tries to overcome nihilism, at the very least in the existential way.

CGL1023 you don't have to pray for me. Your gesture is appreciated, but at the same time I think (not believe) it is not general act of good will towards me, but a reaction to the deeply rooted fear that you need to be what your God expects you to be. Not praying for me to be saved when you're well aware from my previous post that I will definitely not be unless I have some type of realization would reflect poorly on you in the eyes of your God.

You would assume that a Christian praying for you is self-serving (because it's what a Christian should do) and not because they are genuinely concerned about your salvation?

 

[bhsmte]

The issue is, a believer and non-believer use a different set of principles. It may seem like judgment, but it's what that person believes. There is no polite way of saying, "if you don't believe, you are not saved".

I can understand the "not saved" piece very well. That is part of their belief and is not judging the other person just to judge.

What I am referring to, are other types of judgment like; you reject God because you want to live a life of sin and things of that sort.

That goes beyond simply belief and actually starts to judge the persons character and morality. It also is one of the arrogant examples, of the believer being able to tell the other person, what motivates them better than the person themselves.

 

[seekingsolace]

CGL1023 you don't have to pray for me. Your gesture is appreciated, but at the same time I think (not believe) it is not general act of good will towards me, but a reaction to the deeply rooted fear that you need to be what your God expects you to be. Not praying for me to be saved when you're well aware from my previous post that I will definitely not be unless I have some type of realization would reflect poorly on you in the eyes of your God.

Is it that hard to believe someone actually cares?

 

[GillDouglas]

When one makes judgments towards others, it is not difficult to spot. And sure, the specific beliefs of some, actually require them to be judgmental of others, and is also part of their psychological need, to judge others, so they feel better about themselves.

But not everyone is going to be like that. We make decisions, and we have to stick by those decisions. It's not up to others to tell us we made a bad choice. What's done is done, and who cares what others think. I won't judge you for your tramp stamp of a flower on your back anymore than your choice to change your mind about God. It's just not my place.

 

[GillDouglas]

I can understand the "not saved" piece very well. That is part of their belief and is not judging the other person just to judge.

What I am referring to, are other types of judgment like; you reject God because you want to live a life of sin and things of that sort.

That goes beyond simply belief and actually starts to judge the persons character and morality. It also is one of the arrogant examples, of the believer being able to tell the other person, what motivates them better than the person themselves.

From my perspective it would be more of a "how did you come to this point?" kind of judgement. It's like someone who passes up a really good deal and you're like "Whiskey. Tango. Foxtrot.!? How could you pass that up!?". It comes off as judgmental and arrogant.

 

[Messy]

SOMEONE PLEASE RESPOND TO THIS. I'M COPY AND PASTING IT BECAUSE ITS TOO FAR BACK IN THE THREAD NOW. Here is what I wrote earlier...

First off, I have ears to hear, I heard it, and it is absolutely repulsive that if a generally "good hearted" person (not necessarily saying myself) would burn in hell just because they didn't accept Jesus as their savior. A child in a third world country at this very instant is suffering and dying, and "God forbid" they have never even heard of Jesus, because either they are too young, or it's just not a part of their culture. So their whole life is a living hell, and when that one is over, a new eternal hell begins. That sickens my stomach. AND PLEASE DON'T SAY "OH WELL, GOD WOULD TAKE THEM TO HEAVEN ANYWAY". Christianity, Judaism, and Islam to name a few, rule people by fear. You must absolutely love, and absolutely fear at the SAME TIME the God you hold up so high. You're forced to love a God and accept his son as the savior, not because you want to, but because you have no choice but to, because if you don't, you will suffer for all eternity. In the end there is no other conclusion other than that fear is what drives people to believe. Any reason you give as to why you accept Jesus will ultimately point back to the fear of damnation.

Religions in general, way before Christianity were always there to explain something that people didn't understand, and I find that totally reasonable. But when a religion comes along that attempts to induce total fear in people in the most subtle, sinister way imaginable, that's insane. Instead of a benign belief system, that just says "Hey, the bright light in the sky is [insert name here], that god creates the day", etc. You get one that utterly manipulates people into complete control, through fear, and at the same time makes them think that it's their choice, convinces them it's because some infinitely powerful deity actually "loves" a creation that is infinitely less than itself, and if this creation doesn't "love" it back it will "stick them under a magnifying glass and burn them with sunlight" forever. And lastly, it claims to have the meaning to things that don't necessarily have meaning. It tries to overcome nihilism, at the very least in the existential way.

CGL1023 you don't have to pray for me. Your gesture is appreciated, but at the same time I think (not believe) it is not general act of good will towards me, but a reaction to the deeply rooted fear that you need to be what your God expects you to be. Not praying for me to be saved when you're well aware from my previous post that I will definitely not be unless I have some type of realization would reflect poorly on you in the eyes of your God.

If they never heard from Jesus they get a chance to accept Him and kids: for such is the Kingdom, they all go to heaven. They are not even able to reject Him.

 

[Skavau]

When atheists rail against theists, they are using the same fervor the religious use when making their claims against a secular society. You still believe in something, and you're willing to defend that belief. The entire discourse about religion stems from those who think they know more than the other guy.

Do you understand the difference between Atheism and Anti-Theism?

 

[Skavau]

What does our acceptance have to do with anything? God doesn't need our permission. It is not of the man who wills but of God. Have you had the gospel shared with you? If not would you like to hear it?

Then your doctrine cannot be coherently argued to be moral, but merely based on power.

 

[Skavau]

Which testifies to the fact that atheism is a religion. It's just a religion that doesn't posit the existence of a supreme being, but it's still a religion. It has its sacred texts, its saints, and its dogmas. It defines ultimate reality for the devotees. There even are its heretics, as we can witness whenever atheists get in to spats about exactly how "atheism" is to be defined.

You do not appear to understand the difference between a secular worldview which might contain empiricism, materialism and rationalism. Atheism is a probable element of a secular worldview, not the other way around.

 

[Kirsten]

In my "essay" I didn't mention evil once.

I must have missed your "essay". I only saw a few sentences. Nonetheless, you understood my question but seem quite unwilling to answer it.

 

[Skavau]

So there is never an example that being honest is cruel? Does this dress make me look fat? Yup!

Why would being honest with your own convictions (ie: I don't believe in God) a *thought*, not even expressed be evil?

Do you support the idea of thought-crime?

 

[Kirsten]

Then what is it based on?

His will.

 

[Skavau]

Goodness! It's perfectly obvious. Atheists laud as heroes of their movement various atheist writers and lecturers. They refer certain books to you when the subject comes up in discussion as standard texts that are known among atheists to perfectly "prove" their POV.

If you think Atheistic and Anti-Theistic writers are unanimously regarded as doctrinal or without fault amongst Atheists you haven't been paying attention. There are and have been lots of schisms and disagreements amongst Atheists generally because being an Atheist says nothing about oneself other than that they do not believe in a God(s).

And the de facto dogmas I already referred to. For example, is atheism a rejection of God or does merely not having a commitment one way or the other constitute genuine atheism? Or is it something else. One "atheist" is wrong, wrong, wrong, according to the next one. That's hardly any different from Christians identifying some of their number as heretics.

Atheism would be de facto the rejection of God. You will find that the vast majority of Atheists do not have any disagreement over what Atheism means. Only Theists like you pretend there's some confusion and subjectivity over the definition.

 

[CRUCISDECRISTO]

I deny Jesus as a savior of mankind, but I do think historically speaking, he was a real person. I find it extremely unlikely there is a God of any kind, even more unlikely a god that actually "loves" his creation and for some reason cares so much if people love him back. And to make it clear too, I don't believe in the devil either. I'm an honest and caring person, I've never done an "evil" thing my entire life. With that all said, would I go to hell?

What's sad is that you are looking for vindication from those who have not denied Christ as the savior for mankind. You have an outlook in life that says some people are good and some are bad. You compare yourself to the bad people and think to yourself, "i'm not as bad as them." The problem is that you see the world through the eyes of a sinner who believes they don't sin. In God's eyes, all human beings are sinners. We deserve the punishment our sin deserves and punishment is death. That is the wage all of us must pay for our sinful unrighteous heart. People like yourself ask "why does God let bad things happen to good people?" this is a wrong question because it assumes that people are born good. Instead, we should look at why God allows good things to happen to wretched sinners? It's because of Jesus, His only begotten Son sent to this world to make the payment for sins that none of us are qualified to do. In order to pay for our sins, we would need to be perfect. We would need to be completely righteous and able to follow God's laws without even thinking about it. Jesus did exactly that. He lived a life without sin so that he could take your place and die the death you deserve for your sins. You are evil in that you were born into this world and have so far rejected the one who died and paid the ransom for your soul with His life.

By this rejection, you will spend eternity in hell. At this time, all humanity is under God's grace until Christ returns. We don't know when that will be, but if you have not repented of your sin(s) and received Christ through baptism, you will be judged for your sin of rejecting God's grace through His son. It doesn't matter what good you think you do because your motivation is about pleasing yourself more than loving your neighbor for no other reason than because that's what you should do.

Christ died for you because He loved His father and His Father loved you because he created you. Despite your sin, He sent His Son to give himself as a sacrifice and shed his blood to cover your sins. So you may think you're an honest and caring person who hasn't done anything evil, but by denying Christ's sacrifice you are very evil.

 

[Skavau]

That's the POV of your 'denomination' of atheists. Another one insists that the real definition is something else. We're quite obviously dealing with what amount to doctrine and heresy, and the only reason for denying it is because those are terms that are normally associated with Christianity. But the meaning is the same, and that was the point.

No they don't. Name those Atheists. You're making things up.